But you don't find inner peace, and instead go insane, and space harrier kills you.
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Is there a weirder game than Ecco The Dolphin? both in content and context
- Thread starter Salsa
- Start date
But you don't find inner peace, and instead go insane, and space harrier kills you.
I only could beat the Dreamcast version. I remember renting Ecco 1 on Mega Drive various times but it was simply too hard.
Went far enough, but not onto the creppy stuff, so imagine when I finally gave up and uses level codes. I was liek WTF is going on!
Amazing games, DC version especially is such a gem.
Went far enough, but not onto the creppy stuff, so imagine when I finally gave up and uses level codes. I was liek WTF is going on!
Amazing games, DC version especially is such a gem.
FonkyByNature
Member
This. I loved Ecco the Dolphin games but never finished any of them. The soundtrack is indeed amazing, scary and mysterious at the same time and this thread is also amazing, i never knew any of that. Crazy !!
ichtyander
Member
Never really had much contact with the Ecco games back in the day, although I always found them to be interesting and beautiful. I had no idea about all this, fascinating stuff, so thanks for that OP!
Also didn't know that Novotrade/Appaloosa were a Hungarian team, responsible for developing the much earlier Impossible Mission II.
Also didn't know that Novotrade/Appaloosa were a Hungarian team, responsible for developing the much earlier Impossible Mission II.
I instantly want to play this game now
Part of me is sad that this thread is spoiling the game's big twist into insanity, but the more rational part of me realizes that if people haven't played it by now (or pushed past the first 10-15 levels) they likely never were going to.
It seriously stands as one of the best journeys a video game has ever taken me on.
It seriously stands as one of the best journeys a video game has ever taken me on.
When I got my Sega CD, it came with Sewer Shark and Sonic CD. The back of the Sonic CD manual advertised Ecco the Dolphin, so that was the first game I bought for my Sega CD. Went into it completely blind except for that ad on the back of the Sonic CD manual.
Stuck with it and beat it and experienced the mindfuck twist without any spoilers. Probably one of my favorite games of all time.
Although I feel like Tides of time is entirely a better game, both mechanically and (on the Sega CD) in terms of music.
Poor Opa-Opa
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8KazxeVTuw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=St90ylSsWjQ
The entire story done in early 90's CGI, with no dialog. It was included in Ecco PC and Ecco: The Tides of Time CD. Really awesome and surprisingly entertaining. It'll probably give people flashbacks to Reboot though.
EDIT: The Sega CD actually had a bunch of really awesome CGI intros back in those days. People got burnt out of them in the later 90's, but the early 90's were awesome with these videos. Eternal Champions: Challenge from the Darkside is another game with really long, really epic CGI:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diB6w1mUuQw
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
This is something more people need in general, not just kids. Nintendo is a last bastion of this, but just one particular flavor. For my palette I still miss Sega's more eccentric flavor when it came to trying games like this.
But it is what it is :/
Ah, good ol' EA. Never got to play this game sadly, but I loved Haunting Starring Polterguy. So many hours spent on that one.Thanks, OP. I always knew something was fishy about this game, it was one of my favorites in college.
You're right. I remember playing this around that time.
Yeah that's about the gist of it. It's a good deal easier than Ecco 1 and 2 and the objectives are made much more clear/less obfuscated. Some of the swimming controls felt a bit tighter as well. At least from the little of it I played.
People new to the series should probably start with that one if they're worried about the others being too difficult (tho Ecco 2 is a bit easier than 1).
I had a similar experience, just with the Genesis version myself. Played the Sega CD version at a family member's house probably close to the game's release (I was like 10 or 11 or something) and fell in love with the game. Got the Genesis version for my birthday and went in not knowing a thing other than "it's a dolphin on a rescue mission". The gradual way the game peels back its layers until you're in the thick of it made for a really unique and engaging experience.
It gets a lot of hate for the difficulty. And I don't know that the criticism is wrong. The game really makes you earn it. It took me a year to get to the final stage, then a year to actually get through that level and to the final boss. I honestly don't know if I ever would have beat it if I didn't learn there's a code to skip right to the final boss, since dying makes you do the WHOLE LEVEL AGAIN. That level is so frustrating but what a memorable experience it was to finally get through and come face to face with... well, you know.
One thing I see people mention a lot is the sense of fear and dread the game creates when talking in threads, but the game is rarely lauded for this by critics or on lists. It's seriously one of the most horrifying games, especially in the later levels (and it's something The Tides of Time manages to dial up even further).
It's such an underrated game.
I think LSD Dream Emulator takes the cake as the weirdest game of all time. It's a companion piece
(along with a music album) to a dream journal kept for a decade by one of the developers. It's a procedurally-generated PS1 "game." It's supposed to simulate the developer's dreams. It's psychedelic as shit.
Noby Noby Boy is up there, too!
(along with a music album) to a dream journal kept for a decade by one of the developers. It's a procedurally-generated PS1 "game." It's supposed to simulate the developer's dreams. It's psychedelic as shit.
Noby Noby Boy is up there, too!
So I guess to expand on Salsa and Het nkik's synopsis, a few things to note:
-The vortex actually devours the entire ocean every 500 years, not just dolphin. You find this out from an ancient blue whale who had the knowledge passed down to him.
-The helix being you meet is called the Asterite. What it exactly is, is never explained, but it seems to act as a god of sort for Earth. when you first meet the Asterite deep in the middle of the ocean, he is weakened and dying because one of his globes is missing. Later, when you time travel at atlantis and meet a younger, more immature asterite, you attack it and steal it's globe, creating a time paradox. The asterite in the present is weakened, because you stole it's globe in the past.
-The Asterite grants Ecco the ability to live without breathing. He no longer has to take breaths of air under water and can survive in space thanks to this. From this point on in the game, you no longer have an air meter.
-Ecco goes back to atlantis and uses the time machine to go back to the very beginning of the game, when he jumped out of the water and missed the vortex spout. He stays under water while this happens this time, and manages to follow the spout through space thanks to the power granted by the asterite.
-Also, while humans are never referenced in-game in either Ecco the Dolphin or Tides of Time, the Sega CD version's manual opens with a small bit of dialog from mankind. It hints that Ecco the Dolphin actually takes place far into the future, when mankind has abandoned Earth. It sounds like they understood about the Vortex queen and were leaving the planet for safety, and is framed around some sort of planetary council arguing the merit of leaving the planet. One side argues that if they leave the planet, then all the remaining life on the planet would be doomed, while the other side argues that mankind should leave behind bits of technology to aid what will become the new dominant species on the planet (given their intelligence) - dolphins. This sort of hints what the glyphs in the game are supposed to be. This bit of backstory isn't in the genesis manual.
Salsa's recount of Ecco: The Tides of Time actually confuses parts of Ecco: Defender of the Future. The recollecting the ocean's consciousness stuff is from defender of the future. Rather, in tides of time, you merely spend a bit of time in each timeline - one thanks to a time traveling dolphin, and one thanks to being kidnapped by vortex spawn. This happens to let ecco know that he must change the future to one or the other by defeating the Vortex Queen, who traveled back to earth.
Ecco: The Tides of Time also ends on a cliffhanger and had hooks for a third game. Midway through the game you were given a useless password - it was supposed to be entered at the beginning of the third game to continue some progress and slight choice changes you made in Tides of Time. Tides of Time ends with ecco chasing the vortex queen to the time machine in atlantis as they do battle. The queen escapes to the past as Salsa said and gets trapped there and evolves into crustaceans over eons, but more interesting is Ecco himself. He gets forever lost in the tides of time and is never seen again. Ecco 3 would have picked up the story and explained what happened to him.
-The vortex actually devours the entire ocean every 500 years, not just dolphin. You find this out from an ancient blue whale who had the knowledge passed down to him.
-The helix being you meet is called the Asterite. What it exactly is, is never explained, but it seems to act as a god of sort for Earth. when you first meet the Asterite deep in the middle of the ocean, he is weakened and dying because one of his globes is missing. Later, when you time travel at atlantis and meet a younger, more immature asterite, you attack it and steal it's globe, creating a time paradox. The asterite in the present is weakened, because you stole it's globe in the past.
-The Asterite grants Ecco the ability to live without breathing. He no longer has to take breaths of air under water and can survive in space thanks to this. From this point on in the game, you no longer have an air meter.
-Ecco goes back to atlantis and uses the time machine to go back to the very beginning of the game, when he jumped out of the water and missed the vortex spout. He stays under water while this happens this time, and manages to follow the spout through space thanks to the power granted by the asterite.
-Also, while humans are never referenced in-game in either Ecco the Dolphin or Tides of Time, the Sega CD version's manual opens with a small bit of dialog from mankind. It hints that Ecco the Dolphin actually takes place far into the future, when mankind has abandoned Earth. It sounds like they understood about the Vortex queen and were leaving the planet for safety, and is framed around some sort of planetary council arguing the merit of leaving the planet. One side argues that if they leave the planet, then all the remaining life on the planet would be doomed, while the other side argues that mankind should leave behind bits of technology to aid what will become the new dominant species on the planet (given their intelligence) - dolphins. This sort of hints what the glyphs in the game are supposed to be. This bit of backstory isn't in the genesis manual.
Salsa's recount of Ecco: The Tides of Time actually confuses parts of Ecco: Defender of the Future. The recollecting the ocean's consciousness stuff is from defender of the future. Rather, in tides of time, you merely spend a bit of time in each timeline - one thanks to a time traveling dolphin, and one thanks to being kidnapped by vortex spawn. This happens to let ecco know that he must change the future to one or the other by defeating the Vortex Queen, who traveled back to earth.
Ecco: The Tides of Time also ends on a cliffhanger and had hooks for a third game. Midway through the game you were given a useless password - it was supposed to be entered at the beginning of the third game to continue some progress and slight choice changes you made in Tides of Time. Tides of Time ends with ecco chasing the vortex queen to the time machine in atlantis as they do battle. The queen escapes to the past as Salsa said and gets trapped there and evolves into crustaceans over eons, but more interesting is Ecco himself. He gets forever lost in the tides of time and is never seen again. Ecco 3 would have picked up the story and explained what happened to him.
My very first game that came to mind
I never had a problem with either games difficulty because I played them on the Sega CD. The Genesis version is indeed pretty hard, but the japanese version added in level checkpoints, and the sega CD version kept the checkpoints and further tweaked the levels until it was roughly the same difficulty as Tides of Time. I don't think the Genesis games are monstrously hard, but I do feel they're largely unrefined and rough around the edges in the same way a lot of early genesis software was. Tides of time and the Sega CD versions of Ecco the Dolphin feel much better designed and more forgiving.
I like the music of the Genesis version, but the Sega CD version's music is ingrained into me. The christmas I got my Sega CD, my brother also got a stereo system with enormous speakers, and we shared a bedroom. So we hooked my Sega CD up to his stereo (which he loved, because he could use it like a CD player). Thus, the first time I heard Ecco the Dolphin on the Sega CD, it was through enormous and at-the-time powerful speakers. Phenomenal soundtrack for me.
My favorite song in the series is St Gabriel's Mask from The Tides of Time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuNwZ9GqBFU
I played and beat Ecco Jr back in the day on Sega Channel. It has no larger overarching story, nor does it get trippy and weird. It's just a game about being a dolphin (or orca) doing underwater adventure things and solving puzzles. It's actually much closer to what people think Ecco is than the actual ecco games.
Not really worth playing, IMO.
Armoured Priest
Member
Back in the 90s when 1-800/1-900 number tip lines were a thing, when you called Sega's tip line (Theirs was an 800 number...they weren't cheap skates) the hold music was from the Sega CD version of Ecco the Dolphin. Ever since I've had massive respect for Spencer Nilsen. Its a shame he didn't do much after the Sega CD era. I know he's done a couple indie movies and that's about it. Nilsen's solo album "Architects of Change" is pretty good.
I knew the Japanese release was, but I didn't realize the Sega CD version was more forgiving. That's pretty neat to learn. Knowing this, someday I may go and play through the game on Sega CD.
As for the OST, I think preference largely depends on which one you experienced as a kid (as illustrated by your story). I think the Sega CD one is beautiful, but my connection is definitely to the Genesis OST. The compositions coming out of my TV were unlike anything I'd ever heard before this.
That we'll never see Ecco 3 conclude the story is a great disappointment.
Well, the Sega CD version is also missing the exclusive level in the Japanese version of Ecco 1: The Stomach. That is a bizarre level that kind of feels unfinished. It's weird given the release schedule too:
Genesis/EU Ecco -> JPN Megadrive Ecco -> World Sega CD release
That means they added a level after the Genesis/EU release of ecco, then removed it again for the world sega CD release. But in it's place, lots of other levels got small tweaks and 6 extra levels not in the other versions.
The Sega PC version of Ecco the Dolphin 1 is the ultimate release, however. It has everything the Sega CD version has, plus some of the graphics were redrawn, it has extra use of color, and the game itself uses the superior Ecco the Tides of Time sprite:
Genesis/Sega CD sprites
Ecco PC
it also has the videos from Ecco: The Tides of Time CD, but they use 256 color.
I had no idea he put out an album, I'm actually gonna go look for that right now. I love everything he did on the Sega CD, both ecco soundtracks, Sonic CD, and Batman Returns are all awesome.
MrCunningham
Member
Ecco for the Sega CD was the first game in the series that I have played. I got my copy as a pack in game with the Sega CD itself, and this is the version that I was the most familiar with. back then I always assumed that the Sega Genesis version was the exact same game but without the CD quality soundtrack and missing a few additional cut scenes. It wasn't until a couple years ago when I played Ecco on the Steam Genesis/ Mega Drive collection where I discovered how different the Genesis version was. The Genesis game is harder, it doesn't have the mid level checkpoints and it is missing levels from the Sega CD version. The game feels a little less polished overall in its original state.
Also, Sega really needs to embrace GOG and release a lot of their old Windows 95 games on their store front. What would Sega have to lose by doing this? They have a lot of old games from the Windows 9x era that they could release on GOG.
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
True; I didn't finish it myself on the collection disc but part of that was due to just getting pulled in by the Shinobi and Ristar games in the same collection. But something about Ecco Jr. felt a bit "preschool"-esque to me at the time.
From what I'm hearing the Sega CD versions would make for a much better point for those new to the series to jump in. I'll have to give them a try myself some time.
Version 3.0
Member
Lots of video games are weird. Ecco was inspired by real life weirdness, that's all. It's interesting, but I don't know if that puts it on another level.
Yeah, real life weirdness like space monsters and time travel
RockTurtle
Member
the dreamcast ecco game was one of me favorite games I never beat. I literally would spend whole afternoons after school just doing flips and shit in the same beach level
http://image.jeuxvideo.com/images/p3/k/u/kung-fu-rider-playstation-3-ps3-021.jpg
also weird as; kung fu rider
Yo I saw this in the used section of my local Gamestop one time during bargain hunting. Game was 2 dollars. I'm still sad to this day I never bought it and discovered the magic within.
IMO it's the hardest of the 3, because it plays very faithfully to the originals only in 3D. Some of the levels are extremely difficult. But it has a really cool story that feels very inspired by the originals. Overall, Tides of Time is my favorite, though.
AWizardDidIt
Member
I cannot say enough how good the music of the Sega CD version of these games is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upJ_1Q1WJy0
One of my all time favorite mellow out tracks.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upJ_1Q1WJy0
One of my all time favorite mellow out tracks.
The level that accompanies that track is awesome, too. The soundtrack and icy visuals give this haunting, isolated feeling.
KevMan1815
Member
I started reading the book Console Wars and just got to a part where the developer is pitching Ecco. Weird coincidence this topic popped up in GAF at the same time... Or is it?
This is the worst part. We never knew what happened to poor Ecco (I take the DoF Ecco is someone else).
The 8-bit ports of these games were really good too, all things considered. They may have looked incredibly ugly, but they played very faithfully and had the level layouts intact.
BTW:
That's a cool collection you got there.
DoF is entirely different, yeah. It's not connected at all to the other games.
Version 3.0
Member
Ha ha, well yeah. But seriously, real life weirdness like an acid trip.
AWizardDidIt
Member
In this era of kickstarters, who knows? Maybe some day Ecco 3 will be a thing. Count me in the camp that is profoundly sad we didn't get a conclusion to that story.
Although I remember there was that kickstarter a while back that was trying to revive Ecco but then it turned out to be a "spiritual successor" to Ecco and not Ecco itself and then it also turned out to not look all that great and bombed.
Oh well.
Although I remember there was that kickstarter a while back that was trying to revive Ecco but then it turned out to be a "spiritual successor" to Ecco and not Ecco itself and then it also turned out to not look all that great and bombed.
Oh well.
MrCunningham
Member
Yeah, there was a Kickstarter campaign for it back in 2013: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/annunziata/the-next-ecco-the-dolphin-adventure-game. But it failed to gain any interest or get off the ground.
Also, There were a game based on the movie Jaws that was developed by Appaloosa Interactive. I'm pretty sure the game used the same engine as Ecco the Dolphin: Defender of the Future.
this is really nice!
If you have the Steam Megadrive pack, there is a mod for Ecco II that turns it into the beta, which is full of weird shit like this:
fffffffuck I was hoping on this
Green Mamba
Member
I rented Ecco quite a few times as a kid because I desperately wanted to get it, but never really got it and got stuck really early on. Interesting to read how it came about.
There were a few choke points, that's for sure. I remember The Lagoon being a particularly difficult stage early on. I think one of the stages in the Arctic was fairly difficult as well. Might have been Hard Water Zone. Then there's that giant leap you have to make in Atlantis that seems nearly impossible. I'm sure there's a choke point I'm not remembering in the prehistoric stages, then, Welcome to the Machine is a real ass kicking.
The Scrivener
Member
Crazy funny story OP. As a 90s kid, I always thought the game was just a platformer to raise awareness about the environment. Never before has the meme "mind blown" been more appropriate!
Bloodporne
Member
Mr. Buzzkill over here, damn.
This game was weird as shit back then especially because the title and advertisement lead us to believe it was some cute animal platformer or something.
Really dig these stories actually and I didn't realize just weird this game was just knew it was atmospheric and went a bit crazy later on.