I said Forza because they both have Horizon in the title.
I wasn't born this funny in case you were wondering, took years of practice.
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Would Guerrilla/Sony let the Decima engine on Xbox?
- Thread starter Thornton Reed
- Start date
I said Forza because they both have Horizon in the title.
I wasn't born this funny in case you were wondering, took years of practice.
omnislayer
Member
What's with all the strange Sony related sorta-but-not-really-port begging lately?
What's next, maybe- "Do you think Guerrilla's next game will be multiplatform?".
What's next, maybe- "Do you think Guerrilla's next game will be multiplatform?".
I got an insider tip. It gonna be on sony platform...watch and see. Quote me on it
Booker Dewitt
Member
I mean, if the cost of setting up support to help the studios develop on the engine work out in a way that's a good return, they totally should. But that would be a lot of work potentially while not being sure if third parties will bite.
They'd be making money with a demographic that they weren't before.
They'd be making money with a demographic that they weren't before.
Mass_Pincup
Banned
That was before they saw PC has their main competitor though.
The landscape of multiplatform engine changed a lot since then, there's no need for a PhyreEngine coming from them at this time. Unity and UE4 are basically free and offers a lot of documentation.
I don't see it happening.
humansarehorses
Member
They could use a new middleware engine to attract smaller developers just like the PhyreEngine. Although, with UE4 being so popular, it's probably not worth it.
I guess they could get some money by licensing it out, but I imagine having it as an exclusive is somewhat an advantage for Playstation since it looks so great so they'll keep it on Playstation.
Would it even work properly and at its best on an Xbox console? I know they're architecturally similar, but would power differences and differences in memory bandwidth throw a wrench in the possibility of it even working well enough on Xbox?
Would it even work properly and at its best on an Xbox console? I know they're architecturally similar, but would power differences and differences in memory bandwidth throw a wrench in the possibility of it even working well enough on Xbox?
Their camera sensors are used on their competitors phones though
Sony hasn't been competitive* in the mobile phone space for years.
Chobel
Member
Cool phone but I'm pretty sure Noobcraft is talking about market share.
I could see it becoming Sony's second party engine, but unlikely anyone who wants to have their games on Xbox too would go for it.
I think they refer to PS4, PS3 or Vita only games as "Only on PlayStation" or "PlayStation exclusive."
I think they refer to PS4, PS3 or Vita only games as "Only on PlayStation" or "PlayStation exclusive."
LiquidSolid
Member
TroicaBlur
Member
Sony should make it free like Unity atleast.
He was talking about being competitive..I am pretty sure if you bring out a phone like that, you definitely are competitive in the market.
phantasmic_glaive
Member
Sigh.. it don't work like that. They are colleagues, not mortal enemies that have to fight to the death with every product.
When Sony were making laptops, it ran windows.
Bloodborne runs on phyregine and that uses havok, which MS owns. There's a ton of Sony movies on xbl, etc. messy stuff, but just because they beef it out in this industry don't mean they can't share common ground elsewhere.
That being said, it's just certain things for in house companies only. Why? Cause it'll be harmful it the game they made games that ran bad under MS' watch or embarrassing if they made better games with it.
It'll be interesting to see what happens to minecraft 2.
Malcolm9
Member
Why would they do that?
LiquidSolid
Member
You think Sony's charging KojiPro to use it? It already is free (for the 2-3 studios using it).
If ms first party was delivering you wouldn't see threads like this, as a multi console owner I can see why those with only an Xbox must be looking over at the games dropped already this year on ps4 and want titles of that caliber on Xbox. As a day one og Xbox importer cost me £500 and £70 for halo ms first party is struggling right now, I hope Phil is held to his word about first party being vital to Scorpio, I want more excitement about owning an Xbox platform wise.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
No it wouldn't be nice. All their attention should be focused in-house where it belongs. We have gone from port begging to studio and game engine begging. Astounding.
This can't be serious. Yeah let's hand out some of your best tech for free. I doubt they would even consider licensing Decima for a price any one would be willing to pay.
SirNinja
Member
If you have an ace in the hole, you don't go around freely sharing it with your competitors.
Sure it would be nice... but both studios are owned by Sony. They are internal studios, part of SIE WWS. So it would be kind of difficult to release on other systems if their studio is owned by a platform holder... even they wanted to. Lol :/
Bloodborne and Dark Souls 3 run on the same engine Dark Souls 2 uses which isn't Phyre. Durante confirmed this a while back as well as DS2s director. Demons Souls and Dark Souls run on Phyre though.Sigh.. it don't work like that. They are colleagues, not mortal enemies that have to fight to the death with every product.
When Sony were making laptops, it ran windows.
Bloodborne runs on phyregine and that uses havok, which MS owns. There's a ton of Sony movies on xbl, etc. messy stuff, but just because they beef it out in this industry don't mean they can't share common ground elsewhere.
That being said, it's just certain things for in house companies only. Why? Cause it'll be harmful it the game they made games that ran bad under MS' watch or embarrassing if they made better games with it.
It'll be interesting to see what happens to minecraft 2.
And no, this is simply a matter of legal things and licences. Decima was chosen by Kojima to realise the game he had in mind, Sony aquired the rights for this in exchange and funds a majority of the development.
phantasmic_glaive
Member
Was kinda iffy about using that as an example, but thanks for that.
Not sure what the point would be, unless you mean mobile. Even then I'd rather have them focus on PS4 titles instead.
You dont spend millions on R&D for the engine and then hand it out for free. This isnt a charity.
thekiddfran
Member
Why give other studios your competitive advantage?
Sometimes I think GAF just doesn't think about these things from a business perspective.
Sometimes I think GAF just doesn't think about these things from a business perspective.
thekiddfran
Member
its the Xbox buyers remorse
SenjutsuSage
Banned
This doesn't even make any sense. No matter how beautiful the game looks, it doesn't mean that it will fit another studio's development style. There may be aspects of it that create all kinds of problems for a team more use to doing things a certain way.
This reminds me of all the people who said Crytek's engine should be used for more and more games, but it became obvious that the engine was much more suited to Crytek's development style.
This reminds me of all the people who said Crytek's engine should be used for more and more games, but it became obvious that the engine was much more suited to Crytek's development style.
Triggerhappytel
Member
Kojima is obviously investing a lot in Decima which suggests he will be using it for more than one game. I suspect that Death Stranding will be a trilogy, but he may be allowed to bring the game to PC down the line. I don't really see Decima ever coming to competing consoles.
Kojima Productions are probably going to keep with Decima in the future - which nulls an Xbox release. However - I think an Xbox release for any Kojima game in the future is slim. Kojima is friends with Platinum, who Microsoft fucked over with the cancellation of Scalebound. So even if Microsoft came to him with a hat made of money, I'm sure he'd turn around and say "You cancelled their project, you could do the same to us" and refuse.
CamHostage
Member
Right, it's not impossible to conceive of it, as it has happened before.
If Sony was interested in its relationship with Kojima but Kojima got signed elsewhere for a different project and wanted to use a familiar engine, I'm not sure if Sony would be so protective of just the engine itself (which is just one small part of making amazing games) that they'd forbid it and lose him. Sort of like if Bloodborne happened to be proprietary (it isn't, but go with me) and FromSoft wanted to use it for Dark Souls IV while also working on an even feistier Bloodborne 2, it wouldn't be good business for Sony to lose out on these sequels simply because it only controls one of the brands.
That being said ... I don't know that we'll ever again see the market conditions that'd allow to happen what happened with PhyreEngine? (Microsoft did sort of similar things with XNA/MonoGame, BTW.) That was a booming time for the industry and for engine technology, where every design studio asked if there was an extra buck in licensing out its tech, and when these two companies wanted publishers and independent developers to see their platform as a target without taking the possibility of other platforms off the table. Everybody tried to get a piece of everybody else's pie. Also, publisher power was still strong, so even though indies were a part of these engine license plans, Sony and Microsoft still had eyes on publisher investment (which would be additive, as publishers were at the time who picked up or contracted out the games indies made,) as the long con. Get an in with Codemasters and you have tech powering the best racers of the time running on the engine you're providing to them that you've optimized for your platform. Now, Unity and Unreal are ubiquitous, and no one indie adds up to the dominant market angle that publishers used to pitch into the game. And now, games take too long to make. The idea that Sony would have such an open, long-term relationship with a developer that it'd put the time into making its technology play on other platforms already feels like the concept of a bygone era...
There's little chance that Kojima Productions would get big enough to have a killer PS exclusive franchise and also contract with a 3rd Party publisher to make a different IP at the same time. I just don't see a scenario where it'd be up for debate.
miller.skippins
Banned
There's alot of 'passive aggressive' portbegging threads and posts these past few weeks in regards to sony games, engines and developers...
what's next? "Will Sony sold the playstation division to Microsoft/Valve? It make alot of sense, don't you think?"
Some of you guys need to get hold of yourselves at some of the ridiculous proposition you are making.
what's next? "Will Sony sold the playstation division to Microsoft/Valve? It make alot of sense, don't you think?"
Some of you guys need to get hold of yourselves at some of the ridiculous proposition you are making.
I guess it depends on the nature of the deal they have i would guess more than likely Sony would have a say in their next project due to the heavy investment they seem to be putting in atm.
So it's likely he would need to look at a different engine in the event of adding Xbox as a platform as Guerrilla/Sony probably wouldn't license it to him because of their investment in the project and the fact they wouldn't be giving support to add and maintain the platform.
So it's likely he would need to look at a different engine in the event of adding Xbox as a platform as Guerrilla/Sony probably wouldn't license it to him because of their investment in the project and the fact they wouldn't be giving support to add and maintain the platform.
??? You know death stranding is using this engine right? there is nothing being changed.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
Decima isn't like PhyreEngine where Sony had intentionally made a multiplatform engine (partly to help with awkward PS3 development) and made it available. Decima is an in-house engine being used by Guerrilla and Kojima. Kojima went around various Sony developers to choose an engine to get development up and running as quickly as possible and the gifting from Guerrilla to Kojima was a symbolic gesture. Decima won't be licenced and, unlike your Unity or UE4, there isn't going to be documentation or user support to help with development. KojiPro a special case where they'll probably have a direct line to someone in Guerrilla to offer help and support.
Triggerhappytel
Member
You're right, but Kojima specifically chose Guerrilla's engine for Death Stranding. Which means one of three things as far as I can tell:
1) He's going to be making multiple Death Stranding games and will be using Decima for all of them.
2) He will be making something else after Death Stranding and will be allowed to use Decima for his next project.
3) He will be making something else after Death Stranding but will switch to a new engine.
Option 3 seems extremely unlikely given that he's set up a Kojima Productions studio in Amsterdam to work with Guerrilla and co-develop the engine. Option 1 is quite likely because Sony tends to sign devs up for 3 game contracts. Option 2 is so-so in my opinion, although given his prominence in the industry he may have been able to negotiate a unique deal whereby he can use Decima on other platforms after DS. There's also the fact that this was at one point supposed to be coming to PC which means this may not be too unlikely.
miller.skippins
Banned
i expect a new thread tomorrow with the title "Sony should develop games for the Xbox because it will make so much sense."
Does Mod-Bot work Sundays?
Triggerhappytel
Member
In what way do lines of code not fit with another studio's "development style"? You know that Decima in its various forms has been used by three studios so far (Guerrilla's stuff, Until Dawn, Death Stranding)?
Also, I'm pretty sure that CryEngine was not widely adopted because of poor documentation and that it was out-manoeuvred by Unreal Engine and Unity. It was still used in plenty of very impressive games, and as far as I know was nothing to do with a studio's "development style" - unless you have links to back that up?!
tbh the Decima is way beyond everything MS have in house lol