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[ApharmdX]

I might be nitpicking but I have spotted a couple of vertical bands on my sony xe90 that are particularly noticeable during panning shots and even worse at an angle.

I don't know what to do with it. I already had to return a previous oled with a similar issue.

Is there such a thing as perfect screen uniformity on modern leds? Is minor banding acceptable? The problem is now I have spotted it I can't "unsee" it.

Your xe90 is a FALD-lit LCD that will show the backlighting structure on brighter screens/panning. It's a weakness inherent to the technology, similar to how OLED shows banding on above-black.

Both TV technologies now (LCD and OLED) have uniformity problems.

 

[Macaco84]

The xe90 isn't an OLED TV unless I'm confused. I'm not sure if banding is something that happens on LEDs outside of backlight issues.

Banding on actual OLED panels is still not a completely solved problem though an acceptable panel shouldn't show them in most actual content.

I mean my last tv was an oled but had some vertical banding so was returned. I then got an xe90.

On the xe90 I have this faint vertical line almost dead centre in the screen that shows up with panning.

 

[Marmelade]

I might be nitpicking but I have spotted a couple of vertical bands on my sony xe90 that are particularly noticeable during panning shots and even worse at an angle.

I don't know what to do with it. I already had to return a previous oled with a similar issue.

Is there such a thing as perfect screen uniformity on modern leds? Is minor banding acceptable? The problem is now I have spotted it I can't "unsee" it.

I wouldn't call it minor if it's dead center and particularly noticeable during panning shots (which is when things like banding or DSE are really problematic)
I would personally return the TV if possible

There's no such thing as perfect uniformity on modern TVs (or you'd have to be really lucky), especially on LCD (OLED fares better despite your experience)

 

[Felix Lighter]

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01G3STJTK/?tag=neogaf0e-20

I'll give it a look, thanks!

 

[Colbert]

I went to avs forum and it's a firmware update for 2016 models, not 2017.

http://www.lg.com/us/support-product/lg-OLED65C6P

5.30.02 firmware number, for C6 and E6 only I believe.

Thanks. Looks like the firmware update that enables HLG HDR on those models. I assume as a B6 user will be updated last (and hopefully without those issues) because of the different SOC in the model.

 

[BumRush]

Was just in Bestbuy with my 3 year old and asked her to pick her favorite tv. 65" A1E. Such good taste!

 

[DangerMouse]

This is why I am likely to stick with Sony for my next TV.
As far as I am aware, they are still the only manufacturer that has debanding processing built into the display.

It's really nice.

When it comes to aspect ratio, always use Just Scam, right? And for gaming and most movies I choose Original, correct?

However just now I had this movie and it had a black border on the top of the screen. When I chose 16:9 it was full screen and proper. But in most other cases Original is the way to go?

OLED B6.

"Just Scan" should be your 1:1 mode so it should show everything directly as intended with no overscan and no zoom.

Was that movie where you had just the black border on top via broadcast like cable, satellite, etc.?
One of the posters in this thread mentioned that he'd also encountered the black border on just the top thing that way. Probably a broadcast error and not your TV setting.
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=210981

Someone here mentioned this "Original" mode though they didn't get any answers:
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=247312

 

[J-Rzez]

Fascinating.

For as prevalent as it seems like banding is, esp in this transitional period where not everything is yet in HDR, you'd think that would be a more standard feauture.

So debanding is on the A1E?

Yes, and most of their high end sets. "Smooth gradient" is so awesome, because seeing bands from gradients is one of my major hates. Sometimes these are in the source material from mastering, it removes them. Its a selling point for Sony if you hate seeing that stuff as much as me.

 

[Macaco84]

I wouldn't call it minor if it's dead center and particularly noticeable during panning shots (which is when things like banding or DSE are really problematic)
I would personally return the TV if possible

There's no such thing as perfect uniformity on modern TVs (or you'd have to be really lucky), especially on LCD (OLED fares better despite your experience)

It's a difficult one. I am a picky person by nature but I really can't decide if I should live with it or not. Guaranteed 90 percent of people probably wouldn't notice this problem and this can make it a tough sell when trying to explain why I want to return it. I mean, the set isn't really "faulty" as such. It works fine aside from this one annoyance.

But damn it is ruining my fifa football sessions. As my eye is trained on it.

I might give the store a call but pretty sure I'm going to come across as "one of those customers" that just finds a fault in everything.

 

[Cmerrill]

Nice, strongly considering the 55".

Have you tried any gaming? Is the input lag noticeable to you (if you're the kind of person who usually notices that)?

I do notice a difference from the Samsung ku6300, which was like 19ms. The picture quality certainly makes up for it though.

If you're not used to gaming monitor input response, then you'll be okay.

 

[Marmelade]

It's a difficult one. I am a picky person by nature but I really can't decide if I should live with it or not. Guaranteed 90 percent of people probably wouldn't notice this problem and this can make it a tough sell when trying to explain why I want to return it. I mean, the set isn't really "faulty" as such. It works fine aside from this one annoyance.

But damn it is ruining my fifa football sessions. As my eye is trained on it.

I might give the store a call but pretty sure I'm going to come across as "one of those customers" that just finds a fault in everything.

I could overlook some faults but banding is a tough one to get over
I don't play a lot of Fifa but I do watch a lot of football so banding (or DSE for that matter) is a big no for me
As you said, once you see it you can't unsee it and you'll even look for it

 

[Paragon]

Fascinating.
For as prevalent as it seems like banding is, esp in this transitional period where not everything is yet in HDR, you'd think that would be a more standard feauture.
So debanding is on the A1E?

I believe all of Sony's high-end TVs have had a debanding feature for several years now.
It may be called something like "smooth gradation" or "super bit-mapping" rather than "debanding" though.

The images I posted were run through a video player on PC (MPC-HC) using the "madVR" video renderer which can do debanding processing on your GPU.
But obviously that can't apply to things like streaming services or games which suffer from banding - which is why you would want it built into the display.
I can do interpolation on my CPU with SVP to smooth out video playback on my G-Sync monitor too, but honestly my current Sony TV does a better job of it, and it doesn't use up CPU resources to do it.
As with debanding, having it built into the display means it can apply to streaming video sources, while I have to download YouTube videos if I want that same smoothness on my monitor, and can't use it with services like Netflix.

Now debanding is not necessarily a solution to all banding problems - for one thing, TVs often have limited control over features like that, but OLED displays in general seem to have difficulty with gradation near black.
They make compression more obvious than other displays near black because they don't seem to have as fine control over the brightness level when it gets that low. That seems to be a problem for most emissive displays.
They've been getting better every year though. If I recall correctly, the older OLEDs were dropping to about 6-bit when you got near black.
OLED does black very well, but has a lot of problems near-black that still need improvement.

While it's not going to compete in terms of absolute black, those 1000-nit 1,000,000:1 contrast IPS displays from Panasonic have the potential to be serious competition for OLED.
Response time will be worse, but they have the potential to be better in many other aspects of image quality.

 

[ss_lemonade]

Yes, and most of their high end sets. "Smooth gradient" is so awesome, because seeing bands from gradients is one of my major hates. Sometimes these are in the source material from mastering, it removes them. Its a selling point for Sony if you hate seeing that stuff as much as me.

It is such an awesome feature. If you've ever played and beaten FF 15, the smooth gradation option is capable of cleaning up that awful looking final campfire scene. That specific scene looked like garbage on my ks9000, but looks perfectly normal on my w900a with Smooth Gradations even at low (compared by watching the scene through youtube)

Smooth Gradations off

Smooth Gradations set to low

 

[ascii42]

What impact does that have on lag?

 

[ss_lemonade]

What impact does that have on lag?

Smooth gradations? 0 as far as I can tell with my TV. Not sure about newer TVs

 

[Paragon]

It is such an awesome feature. If you've ever played and beaten FF 15, the smooth gradation option is capable of cleaning up that awful looking final campfire scene. That specific scene looked like garbage on my ks9000, but looks perfectly normal on my w900a with Smooth Gradations even at low (compared by watching the scene through youtube)
Smooth Gradations off
Smooth Gradations set to low

Great example. Games are often quite bad for this.
Unfortunately they introduced the feature the year after I bought my current Sony TV, but I always wondered if it was something that Game Mode would disable, or if enabling it would add latency.
Though I don't have the option in any of my current displays, it's an essential feature for a high-end TV to have in my opinion.
I think some of Sony's Blu-ray players also have the feature built in, though it's better to be built into the display.

 

[ss_lemonade]

Great example. Games are often quite bad for this.
Unfortunately they introduced the feature the year after I bought my current Sony TV, but I always wondered if it was something that Game Mode would disable, or if enabling it would add latency.

Sony was smart enough to keep it available for game mode on the w900a. Unrelated but I also like how they still allow you to use Impulse Motionflow (black frame insertion) under game mode here, which I think is pretty useful for 60fps games if you can deal with possible flickering and the brightness drop.

 

[Pasedo]

Hey guys. Quick one. Are images sharper on lcd/led screens vs oled? Im starting to realise that what i like about Sammy qled is that the images seem alot sharper. Even when i compare it to the flagship sony lcd which to me looks kind of like its been smoothed out. Is there something about pixel tech or dpi etc between manufacturers that can influence this?

 

[Jigolo]

Lol I'm done. Ignore list it is

 

[Kyoufu]

Found a list of some sizes here:

http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=277330

Wow, those are bigger than I expected.

 

[zeeaykay]

Lol I'm done. Ignore list it is

I'd follow that action but it's kind of incredible to witness.

 

[Stiler]

Anyone here with the TCL P605/607 can you tell me, when you are watching youtube does your FALD turn off between videos loading? Cause when I see the little loading icon in the middle of the screen I notice a lot of flashlighting going on.

I still can't for the life of me get ME: A to play in hdr. I've tried everything. Windows HDR on/off, nvidia color settings 10b/422/444, etc. On the newest nvidia drivers (that I thought were supposed to fix HDR).

Also when I have windows hdr on the desktop and everything is freaking DIM and dull as heck, completely saps all the color out of everything. Turning it off makes it look normal though.

They really need to fix hdr on windows/pc.

 

[Hoho for breakfast]

Damn I see the p607 used to be $600 on Amazon for the first few weeks it was available but now it's been sitting at $650 for a month or so.

If they drop it back down to $600 I'll probably impulse buy it...

 

[Stiler]

Damn I see the p607 used to be $600 on Amazon for the first few weeks it was available but now it's been sitting at $650 for a month or so.

If they drop it back down to $600 I'll probably impulse buy it...

Best buy has the p605 (same tv except the remote is different) for $599,
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/tcl-55-...c-range-roku-tv-black/5878705.p?skuId=5878705

 

[ChazGW7]

I've been offered an LG OLED 65E6V at a heavily discounted price through a different forum, but the catch is its been brought to the UK from the US. Are there any issues I will face with using a US TV in UK?0

Will all the apps work correctly? What about power? Im tempted to jump on it, but I don't want to plug it in just for it to blow up. Anyone with experience help me out here?

 

[BumRush]

Did anyone here replace a perfectly good plasma with OLED "just because"?

I was watching Black Sails last night and my panny has such incredible blacks. I can't justify upgrading when the picture looks this good.

Wondering what people in a similar situation think.

 

[RoadHazard]

I do notice a difference from the Samsung ku6300, which was like 19ms. The picture quality certainly makes up for it though.

If you're not used to gaming monitor input response, then you'll be okay.

Unfortunately I am used to the Bravia 40W4000, which has ridiculously good input lag for an LCD TV (around 10ms), so I'm a bit worried that it will be noticeable to me. Main thing that's making me hesitate a bit on this TV.

I wonder if Sony could improve it through a firmware update, or if it's set in stone at 30+ ms.

 

[Solid Shammy]

I might be nitpicking but I have spotted a couple of vertical bands on my sony xe90 that are particularly noticeable during panning shots and even worse at an angle.

I don't know what to do with it. I already had to return a previous oled with a similar issue.

Is there such a thing as perfect screen uniformity on modern leds? Is minor banding acceptable? The problem is now I have spotted it I can't "unsee" it.

The vertical banding on my OLED is really the only thing that disappoints me. I'm rather OCD (genuinely OCD here) and once I notice a uniformity flaw like that, I'm always looking for it. Also, for people saying the vertical banding is only noticeable at near blacks, I wish, I've gone through two OLED's that have had a really annoying band literally in the centre of the screen that is most notable on pure whites. I swear, when I upgrade in a couple of years to a new OLED (HDMI 2.1 and all that), and I still get that centre band, I'm just gonna give up and stick with books.

 

[III-V]

The vertical banding on my OLED is really the only thing that disappoints me. I'm rather OCD (genuinely OCD here) and once I notice a uniformity flaw like that, I'm always looking for it. Also, for people saying the vertical banding is only noticeable at near blacks, I wish, I've gone through two OLED's that have had a really annoying band literally in the centre of the screen that is most notable on pure whites. I swear, when I upgrade in a couple of years to a new OLED (HDMI 2.1 and all that), and I still get that centre band, I'm just gonna give up and stick with books.

watch out: every book has vertical band. I have checked each page - same thing.

 

[RedlineRonin]

Holy shit.

How have I never played resogun til now? I mean I was way LTTP on ps4 since I didn't buy til pro but man is this fun.

The hdr looks great too with all the neon. And I'm not sure what res it runs at, but the voxels look awesome.

 

[III-V]

Holy shit.

How have I never played resogun til now? I mean I was way LTTP on ps4 since I didn't buy til pro but man is this fun.

The hdr looks great too with all the neon. And I'm not sure what res it runs at, but the voxels look awesome.

Yep, Resogun is fun. I purchased PS4 at launch and it was all I had to play lol. No ragrets.

2160 Geometry.

Here is a thread that will answer all of these types of Q's.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1324251

 

[BumRush]

Holy shit.

How have I never played resogun til now? I mean I was way LTTP on ps4 since I didn't buy til pro but man is this fun.

The hdr looks great too with all the neon. And I'm not sure what res it runs at, but the voxels look awesome.

Yeah it's fun and beautiful...completely agree

 

[RedlineRonin]

Yep, Resogun is fun. I purchased PS4 at launch and it was all I had to play lol. No ragrets.

2160 Geometry.

Here is a thread that will answer all of these types of Q's.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1324251

It is really good. Picked it up for $4 in the last psn sale. Worth getting the expansions?

I'm subbed to that thread, just didn't look =)

 

[Hoho for breakfast]

Best buy has the p605 (same tv except the remote is different) for $599,
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/tcl-55-...c-range-roku-tv-black/5878705.p?skuId=5878705

Yeah I saw that but I have a bunch of Amazon Gift Card. I just hate that they have such a good TV for a low price but then charge an extra $50 for a slightly better remote control.

Holy shit.

How have I never played resogun til now? I mean I was way LTTP on ps4 since I didn't buy til pro but man is this fun.

The hdr looks great too with all the neon. And I'm not sure what res it runs at, but the voxels look awesome.

After that try Nex Machina if you haven't.

 

[III-V]

It is really good. Picked it up for $4 in the last psn sale. Worth getting the expansions?

I'm subbed to that thread, just didn't look =)

I never purchased them, but I still pick the game up and play it once and again. So many other games to play right now it hurts.

 

[RedlineRonin]

I never purchased them, but I still pick the game up and play it once and again. So many other games to play right now it hurts.

So true. So much stuff I haven't played yet. And from last year too.

After that try Nex Machina if you haven't.

Actually picked that up on PC but have only dabbled. This makes me want to spend more time with it.

 

[Solid Shammy]

watch out: every book has vertical band. I have checked each page - same thing.

Audiobooks then, I'll just close my eyes and envision a beautiful uniform image.

 

[III-V]

Audiobooks then, I'll just close my eyes and envision a beautiful uniform image.

Audiobooks: perfect uncompressed pixels and frame rate every time.

 

[Yappadappadu]

I still can't for the life of me get ME: A to play in hdr. I've tried everything. Windows HDR on/off, nvidia color settings 10b/422/444, etc. On the newest nvidia drivers (that I thought were supposed to fix HDR).

Also when I have windows hdr on the desktop and everything is freaking DIM and dull as heck, completely saps all the color out of everything. Turning it off makes it look normal though.

They really need to fix hdr on windows/pc.

Regarding ME: Andromeda PC, I think only Dolby Vision works right now.

EDIT:

Ok, apparently HDR10 is supposed to work after installing the latest 1.09 FW update?

 

[Macaco84]

The vertical banding on my OLED is really the only thing that disappoints me. I'm rather OCD (genuinely OCD here) and once I notice a uniformity flaw like that, I'm always looking for it. Also, for people saying the vertical banding is only noticeable at near blacks, I wish, I've gone through two OLED's that have had a really annoying band literally in the centre of the screen that is most notable on pure whites. I swear, when I upgrade in a couple of years to a new OLED (HDMI 2.1 and all that), and I still get that centre band, I'm just gonna give up and stick with books.

The other problem with banding is that most people probably consider it a minor issue and this can make it difficult returning the set. Luckily I bought it from a store that is pretty good with returns but nonetheless, it is a bit awkward when they want to see 'evidence' and all they see is a faint line noticeable mostly on panning shots when viewing the TV from an angle...

I don't know, I might just live with it. The TV is brilliant in almost every other way.

 

[RedlineRonin]

Anyone mess around with hdr on pc for nex machina?

Seems like a really poor implementation

 

[Macaco84]

Following on from my previous post (above) just want to gauge with fellow neogaf members whether this level of vertical banding (on my sony xe90) is worth a return? This mostly rears its ugly head on panning shots and it is worse when viewed at an angle.

This brand is dead centre on the screen and although it looks like it disappears halfway up the screen it does actually go the whole way up.

 

[TheBoss1]

Lol I'm done. Ignore list it is

I'd follow that action but it's kind of incredible to witness.

Lool this is ridiculous.

 

[Topias]

Following on from my previous post (above) just want to gauge with fellow neogaf members whether this level of vertical banding (on my sony xe90) is worth a return? This mostly rears its ugly head on panning shots and it is worse when viewed at an angle.

This brand is dead centre on the screen and although it looks like it disappears halfway up the screen it does actually go the whole way up.

Jesus, return that shit ASAP.

 

[Stiler]

Regarding ME: Andromeda PC, I think only Dolby Vision works right now.

EDIT:

Ok, apparently HDR10 is supposed to work after installing the latest 1.09 FW update?

On Nvidia apparently it's still broken, that's what I could gather:

https://forums.geforce.com/default/...hread-released-6-29-17-/post/5184844/#5184844

We are working with Microsoft but also investigating a possible driver solution. This requires a lot of work though so it won't be released as part of this driver branch.

 

[Insane Metal]

Hey guys. Quick one. Are images sharper on lcd/led screens vs oled? Im starting to realise that what i like about Sammy qled is that the images seem alot sharper. Even when i compare it to the flagship sony lcd which to me looks kind of like its been smoothed out. Is there something about pixel tech or dpi etc between manufacturers that can influence this?

I don't remember exactly which video review I watched where the reviewer said exactly that. Yes overall he preferred the OLED picture for obvious reasons, but he did say the QLED had the sharpest image he'd ever seen.

 

[TheBoss1]

I don't remember exactly which video review I watched where the reviewer said exactly that. Yes overall he preferred the OLED picture for obvious reasons, but he did say the QLED had the sharpest image he'd ever seen.

Probably the Digital Trends comparison between the LG and Samsung.

 

[Macaco84]

Jesus, return that shit ASAP.

Good to know its not just me then!

With these things you never know if its me being pedantic or an actual problem.

I will call the store tomorrow.

Im thinking, cos this is already a replacement for a previous 65 inch 4k panel that had similar banding issues, maybe i am just cursed. I wish there was a way to check the panel for issues like this before they are delivered as it is a real ball ache getting these monsters picked up and replaced. I had already flat packed the box so i gotta somehow fix that up before the pickup guys arrive.

Expensive, complicated tvs. Just wish their damn qa would better pick up on these issues!

 

[chromatic9]

Wow that's some huge banding. Return without any hesitation.

 

[ApharmdX]

The vertical banding on my OLED is really the only thing that disappoints me. I'm rather OCD (genuinely OCD here) and once I notice a uniformity flaw like that, I'm always looking for it. Also, for people saying the vertical banding is only noticeable at near blacks, I wish, I've gone through two OLED's that have had a really annoying band literally in the centre of the screen that is most notable on pure whites. I swear, when I upgrade in a couple of years to a new OLED (HDMI 2.1 and all that), and I still get that centre band, I'm just gonna give up and stick with books.

I think your problem is more rare with regards to banding on white screens? I've seen a few examples on AVS of differing color temperature bands which are evident on white but that doesn't seem common, whereas all LG OLED panels will show at least some banding on near black.

Would be nice to have perfect uniformity on all OLED panels but we aren't nearly there yet, /sigh.

Did anyone here replace a perfectly good plasma with OLED "just because"?

I was watching Black Sails last night and my panny has such incredible blacks. I can't justify upgrading when the picture looks this good.

Wondering what people in a similar situation think.

I replaced my Pioneer 500M with an OLED (first with two different LCDs because of $$$). Image retention on plasma was my main motivation. I still have a Panasonic and Hitachi plasma for gaming- far better motion performance and uniformity even compared to OLED. Also, I went from 50" to 55" to 60" to 65" in two years. I'm pleased with my OLED in comparison to my Kuro; it's an upgrade though not a huge one. The biggest draw is HDR... if you don't care about HDR I'd stick with your plasma.