It's clearly not an alien movie. It's a Prometheus/David movie with some aliens added in it to sell more.
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Alien: Covenant |SPOILER THREAD| With more Christian subtext than BvS
- Thread starter Toa TAK
- Start date
Even if David killed all Engineers in that tiny colony, what about Engineers in other parts of the planet? Or, that is the only colony they had which is impossible considering how technologically advanced they were.
Also, they had no automated defense mechanism againt the goo which should have been activated upon their release?
Also, they had no automated defense mechanism againt the goo which should have been activated upon their release?
David is the smartest thing in the universe. It all makes sense if you just swallow that.
It's incredible that they stayed alive for at least 3.5 billion years.
Also, why didn't they secure the cryo pods? They where rattling around every time the space ship hit a bump.
ClosingADoor
Member
I still don't get the black goo. They try to "explain" all this stuff about how the aliens are made, but it only confuses you more. So first it was this black mud or something. But now it is airborne. And apparently it has a mind of its own also, because it just goes into your ear and such. And then afterwards you pop out a random alien.
But then... what are facehuggers. Are they made from being popped out of a creature. And why are they in those eggs. If the alien didn't exist yet, who laid the eggs? And if you need a facehugger to make an alien, then why doesn't the black goo/dust need one.
If you are going to explain shit, at least have it make some sense.
But then... what are facehuggers. Are they made from being popped out of a creature. And why are they in those eggs. If the alien didn't exist yet, who laid the eggs? And if you need a facehugger to make an alien, then why doesn't the black goo/dust need one.
If you are going to explain shit, at least have it make some sense.
Jmanunknown
Member
Why are the characters in Alien Covenant written to be so smart they could traverse space looking for the creators and planning on colonizing other planets yet do the dumbest things imaginable. Why would Shaw put David back together especially after what happened in Prometheus?
freefornow
Gold Member
People "lol fail" at the slipping on the blood.
It's not just blood though. Creature is in some sort of embryonic sac which looked somewhat mucous. There was more than just blood on the floor.
It's not just blood though. Creature is in some sort of embryonic sac which looked somewhat mucous. There was more than just blood on the floor.
Well someone has to handle the ship while she sleeps in her cryopod for years.
The problem with the goo was that it is not that scary. It's not a monster that grabs your leg under the bed. It's just goo that creates that monster which everyone is scared of. And overexplaining things is what makes the scary go away. Focus of Covenant was more on explaining and philosophy/religion narrative (with huge gaps in the explanation parts) and little on horror aspects so anyone (me included) expecting anything else got fuck all. It is for a different audience, different genre. I thought Ridley would go back to the roots but he chose to continue on with expanding and ultimately ruining what Dan O'Bannon gave him in a script. Dan could have done a hood job I think but unfortunately he passed away and is rolling in his grave. I wonder if Cameron could create something nice but after Avatar shitfest I am not sure if even Cameron is sane anymore.
ClosingADoor
Member
The thing for me is, I get that Ridley Scott is going for this universe building thing and trying to expand and explain some stuff. I don't really have any problem with that. But the explanations are so all over the place and don't make any sense. We now have multiple ways aliens are born, and none are explained. So why even bother with making these movies about explaining stuff, if they don't even do that.
If he wants to make David the source of the alien, he can. But the whole journey to get there makes zero sense.
Watched this over two nights. The first night I stopped just over half way through and honestly it was alright. My only complaint up to that point was the lack of character building as there's a fair number of crew. Tonight I watched the back half.... its like having a pencil pushed up your nose slowly. I don't understand why its so hard to make a smart alien film. Do they not proof read the scripts, like wtf. The movie wasn't awful but much like Prometheus some tweaking, rewrites and cleanup was needed.
Sucks that shaws character got fucked over and seemingly everyone else in this movie. Ridley really has a raging fassboner going on.
Sucks that shaws character got fucked over and seemingly everyone else in this movie. Ridley really has a raging fassboner going on.
Mister Wilhelm
Member
This is 100% accurate.
Watched this last, thoroughly enjoyed it because I had to turn my brain off and stop questioning things in Ridley's Alien universe. Good tense moments and very pretty to look at. Came in expecting another stupid ass crew, so it didn't bother me as much.
My pet peeve in these movies is how inconsistent in how long these damn xenomorphs seem to grow. In some movies it took days for them to be fully sized, in this movie is took minutes. One moment they are coming out the idiot "man baby let me stick my face in here because the evil robot says so" captain and its a little small 1 foot xeno baby dancing with its evil robot daddy, just minutes later its a giant ass fully grown xeno chasing down the rescue ship.
Ridley, step off this franchise, your doing almost as bad as George Lucas.
My pet peeve in these movies is how inconsistent in how long these damn xenomorphs seem to grow. In some movies it took days for them to be fully sized, in this movie is took minutes. One moment they are coming out the idiot "man baby let me stick my face in here because the evil robot says so" captain and its a little small 1 foot xeno baby dancing with its evil robot daddy, just minutes later its a giant ass fully grown xeno chasing down the rescue ship.
Ridley, step off this franchise, your doing almost as bad as George Lucas.
Watched it last night. Not a big fan of an android with a god complex being the creator of the xenomorphs, and I always thought Scott would try to re-establish the original idea he had for the eggs (you decompose into them) that was cut from Alien. But no, he just speeds things up in this case, and the chest burster in this is fucking huge in no time at all by comparison. Everyone but Daniels and Walter seemed dumb as a bag of hammers - par for the course in modern sci-fi really, but annoying here.
Was this not suppose to be the Engineer's home planet or was it just the nearest outpost for them? Seems weird they'd have no defenses and live as wiz kid monks for no reason.
That being said, I am curious how we go from this to Alien. I do... sadly, hope he makes that last film (or however many left that there are) where those 2000 colonists become eggs we see in the crashed Engineer ship that Kane stumbles across.
I just wish he'd have left well enough alone though. Scott is a good director, but not when he's laser focused on fulfilling his own head canon on previous works. I'm weary of BR2049 for this reason.
Was this not suppose to be the Engineer's home planet or was it just the nearest outpost for them? Seems weird they'd have no defenses and live as wiz kid monks for no reason.
That being said, I am curious how we go from this to Alien. I do... sadly, hope he makes that last film (or however many left that there are) where those 2000 colonists become eggs we see in the crashed Engineer ship that Kane stumbles across.
I just wish he'd have left well enough alone though. Scott is a good director, but not when he's laser focused on fulfilling his own head canon on previous works. I'm weary of BR2049 for this reason.
Stallion Dan
Member
Something that annoys me since I think Alien 4, the facehugger/gestation/growing time has been reduced to nothing.
Facehuggers now are on victims for minutes (
Covenant), the chest burst is near instant after that, then they full grown in minutes.
The process should take several days, weeks in some cases.
Facehuggers now are on victims for minutes (
seconds in
The process should take several days, weeks in some cases.
Agreed. Prometheus was far better paced and more enjoyable than this turd.
Dash_Riprock
Member
He's WORSE at this point.
Lucas at least had the good sense to sell his franchise when he realized people didn't want the shit he was peddling.
Scott came back to the franchise after decades and made a crap film no one really wanted, then promised to do better and somehow made an even-worse sequel.
KarneeKarnay
Member
I think one of the problems with this and Prometheus is that they are neglecting the first and most important thing about an alien film.
Be scary. Instead with these two I often find the film trying to be smarter than it is. It tries to raise these philosophical issues and alien one and two both raised their own. However for the most part, these came from audience interpretation. The smarter thing to do would have been to just leave it up to the audience.
Alien was about truckers in space who find a hostile life form. Aliens was marines in space fight off a horde of alien lifeforms as they try to survive and infested planet. Prometheus is about explorers looking for god and unleashing the devil. Covenant is about colonists looking for a new home and finding hell.
All this god crap is too ambiguous and takes up way too much time trying to be explained. It would be better if they didn't focus on it at all, hints at most and leave that up to the audience.
A better take for the last two would have been. Explorers find destroyed alien civilization and accidentally unleash hostile alien lifeforms. Colonists find habitat planet, but discover that hostile life has beaten them there.
Be scary. Instead with these two I often find the film trying to be smarter than it is. It tries to raise these philosophical issues and alien one and two both raised their own. However for the most part, these came from audience interpretation. The smarter thing to do would have been to just leave it up to the audience.
Alien was about truckers in space who find a hostile life form. Aliens was marines in space fight off a horde of alien lifeforms as they try to survive and infested planet. Prometheus is about explorers looking for god and unleashing the devil. Covenant is about colonists looking for a new home and finding hell.
All this god crap is too ambiguous and takes up way too much time trying to be explained. It would be better if they didn't focus on it at all, hints at most and leave that up to the audience.
A better take for the last two would have been. Explorers find destroyed alien civilization and accidentally unleash hostile alien lifeforms. Colonists find habitat planet, but discover that hostile life has beaten them there.
This...
I miss the good old times when the alien might have been this ancient menace from the deep reaches of space. They might have been made by the engineers, or were found and just used as weapons and in the end turned against them, showing that they just couldn't be controlled. They might have even destroyed countless civilizations as far as we know.
Yeah no they were made 20 years ago by a frustrated android from earth, why were you even hyped, pffffffrtttt. Thanks Ridley!
Yeah no they were made 20 years ago by a frustrated android from earth, why were you even hyped, pffffffrtttt. Thanks Ridley!
Winterblink
Member
Isn't this just a description of the two films as they currently are?
Watched this last night. Fell asleep three different times for a second or two or more (don't think it really mattered in the end).
Oh boy where to start? Oh, how about that boring beginning that I thought was going to be a thoughtful discussion on the meaning of life and creation? Nah, it's plain boring.
Absolutely awful. Crudup was ridiculous as the captain. The grouping up was silly (yes I know it's about populating a planet and all that) and whenever one character was worried about their spouse, I didn't feel anything because I wasn't sure who they were attached to.
The alien was lame. So at some point in the future, it takes longer for the alien to gestate?! Why?
Why did they go to the obviously creepy sacrificial spot and maybe think to themselves they shouldn't be there? Why were they so trusting of Fassbender#2? Why were those spores also able to make an alien baby inside of a person? Why did that person look into the facehugger eggsac?
Facehugger has acid blood, regular alien has acid blood, but baby alien doesn't have acid blood.
Didn't bother reading rest of this long thread, so if I'm just beating a dead horse, my apologies. I'm just mad at myself I wasted two hours of my time.
eta- lol, looks like just from the three previous pages, every one of my concerns has been addressed. what a crap show.
Oh boy where to start? Oh, how about that boring beginning that I thought was going to be a thoughtful discussion on the meaning of life and creation? Nah, it's plain boring.
Absolutely awful. Crudup was ridiculous as the captain. The grouping up was silly (yes I know it's about populating a planet and all that) and whenever one character was worried about their spouse, I didn't feel anything because I wasn't sure who they were attached to.
The alien was lame. So at some point in the future, it takes longer for the alien to gestate?! Why?
Why did they go to the obviously creepy sacrificial spot and maybe think to themselves they shouldn't be there? Why were they so trusting of Fassbender#2? Why were those spores also able to make an alien baby inside of a person? Why did that person look into the facehugger eggsac?
Facehugger has acid blood, regular alien has acid blood, but baby alien doesn't have acid blood.
Didn't bother reading rest of this long thread, so if I'm just beating a dead horse, my apologies. I'm just mad at myself I wasted two hours of my time.
eta- lol, looks like just from the three previous pages, every one of my concerns has been addressed. what a crap show.
ronaldthump
Member
I think Ridley thought he was making a good movie too. :/
I liked looking at the aliens and some of the action was neat.
but holy shit is it annoying when people in movies do dumb shit that makes no sense, especially the bridge crew of a spaceship who should be like the smartest people ever.
why not wear helmets on the planet? they could have probably avoided the plot of the movie if they just wore helmets like any sane person would.
why did billy crudup go and look at the egg the creepy robot who he just saw was completely enamored with the aliens told him to? Like use your fucking brain you fucking idiot.
I want to see competent people get killed by aliens, not people who are so implausibly dumb that it yanks me out of the movie
but holy shit is it annoying when people in movies do dumb shit that makes no sense, especially the bridge crew of a spaceship who should be like the smartest people ever.
why not wear helmets on the planet? they could have probably avoided the plot of the movie if they just wore helmets like any sane person would.
why did billy crudup go and look at the egg the creepy robot who he just saw was completely enamored with the aliens told him to? Like use your fucking brain you fucking idiot.
I want to see competent people get killed by aliens, not people who are so implausibly dumb that it yanks me out of the movie
CaviarMeths
Member
It's clearly an Alien movie whether you like it or not. Prometheus was also by far the highest grossing film in the franchise too, so not sure why you would think that adding Alien branding would make it sell more.
It is funny though that Covenant didn't even top the original Alien's domestic gross even with 38 years of ticket inflation in its favour.
Btw the pale aliens are neomorphs not xenos,it's a different mutation of the virus,just saying.
Maybe gestating faster has it downsides,neomorphs seem to be a lot weaker compared to a regular xeno.
Also,maybe being infected by the black goo/spores is far more effective than being inpregnated by a facehugger.
Some have speculated that it depends how much of a dosis of the virus has infected you,obviously david ran out of vases with the pure unalterated virus and had to find another means for infection even if they are less effective.
Maybe gestating faster has it downsides,neomorphs seem to be a lot weaker compared to a regular xeno.
Also,maybe being infected by the black goo/spores is far more effective than being inpregnated by a facehugger.
Some have speculated that it depends how much of a dosis of the virus has infected you,obviously david ran out of vases with the pure unalterated virus and had to find another means for infection even if they are less effective.
Commander Jameson
Member
Why were the crew made up of couples?
well, I assume that those colonisation-expeditions are either one-way trips or at least, take a long time. So if you're in a relationship it might make sense to be able to bring your partner. But it was done so hamfisted; it made me laugh.
Also, not sure if posted already but Honest Trailers was pretty spot on:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njlXBc8Q7o4
SolidChamp
Banned
Yep!
CaviarMeths
Member
It's a one-way colonization journey. Doesn't explain why there's a LGBT couple, but whatevs.
Commander Jameson
Member
I can see the idea of it because it was a one-way trip. I would have thought their partners would be with the other colonists though.
ronaldthump
Member
maybe they were just really good at their job and there's plenty of people to reproduce anyhow so why is 2 people an issue?
SkylineRKR
Member
Since my anger has cooled down, I think this is my favourite scene now. Its so fucking stupid lol.
"Hey, you, piece of shit, you killed my Alien buddy and I fucking hate you.... but perhaps wanna look at some eggs I have in my basement? You're gonna love it"
"Sure, bro"
Its so dumb, its like those kid pranks where you convince another to smell at a piece of strawberry cake and then you shove it in his face. Its the exact same.
Conkersbadfurday
Member
It's not that blood is slippery or she slipped once but that she slipped multiple times. Once is a bad accident that builds tension; twice or more is slapstick.
The moment went from "oh shit!" to "fuckin' really?" in the span of a few seconds, and then the dumbass blew herself up. So now she looks clumsy AND stupid instead of scared.
It's like how in David's creepy land of creeps after the neomorph got its first kill, the camera kept panning to the head in the pool of blood. Cool the first time, ridiculous the next two.
I'm watching the movie right now but just had to stop at the point where their ship blows. The characters here are dumber than the ones in Prometheus (and this is coming from someone who liked Prometheus). These movies have some top notch production quality behind them and Fassbender is amazing as the androids but all that feels wasted on such poor B movie scripts.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
That's what Alien movies are now, Jin.
It's an Alien movie.
I really do feel like these characters aren't any dumber than Prometheus'. In fact, they react to their respective situations in a more understandable way.
People's frustrations and disappointments with Prometheus seem to be visited upon Covenant.
As I said, I quite like Prometheus but it is true that the previous entries and the characters' actions in them do inform and effect the viewer's opinion here. There's only so many times you can watch the whole 'land on alien planet, not follow obvious protocols, get infected, let monster(s) wreak havoc' cycle play out before it stretches your patience and suspension of disbelief.
The question I have is, how do you make them scary again.
Good horror movies relay on the unknown. The original Alien is so good because, we, the audience (just like the characters on screen), know nothing about this creature. We're learning with them what the fuck is going on. Once the audience learns the details about what's scaring them, it's not really that scary anymore.
After Aliens came around, everything about the Xenomorph was known. It had a name, how it reproduced, it's life-cycle, that they have a queen, etc.
The fear factor around the species, for the audience, was gone, and once something like that is gone, you can't get it back.
I'm not saying Prometheus and Covenant are perfect movies, they're far from it. My point is that once you expand the lore of something (it's one of the problems that hurt the Star Wars prequels as well), it removes the unknown and does more harm then good.
Fassbender as the mad scientist is so fantastic. I love that tinge of sadness in his performance which makes you sympathise with him despite his actions. Really, these two films could have excised the link to Alien and may have turned out better for it. As it stands, they're quite unremarkable films outside of him and the visuals.
Strange that there's not a single mention of the original movie during the dinner scene.
All those quarantine procedures to keep Kane out of the ship but when he wakes up they totally forget about it,no tests,no quarantine,nothing..let's go eat dinner together yay!
A2 had a few moments like that too,like leaving the backdoor open to the only working shuttle in lv426 knowing full well that there're hostile lifeforms prowling around.
Oram was an idiot indeed,"i've seen the devil when i was a child but i'll trust this obviously evil android by putting my face inside this alien egg",that scene ruined his character which was totally ok up to that point.
I just think Faris reacted like 90% of us would do if we were in her situation,she had no combat experience,all of a sudden a virus broke out and has no idea if it's airborne,bloodborne(heh) etc...she was alone,stressed and scared as fuck.
Edit:Covenant wasn't scary but with the exception of the original movie,i could say that about the other movies too.
There was a jump scare that got me good though.
http://imgur.com/a/UHf4V
All those quarantine procedures to keep Kane out of the ship but when he wakes up they totally forget about it,no tests,no quarantine,nothing..let's go eat dinner together yay!
A2 had a few moments like that too,like leaving the backdoor open to the only working shuttle in lv426 knowing full well that there're hostile lifeforms prowling around.
Oram was an idiot indeed,"i've seen the devil when i was a child but i'll trust this obviously evil android by putting my face inside this alien egg",that scene ruined his character which was totally ok up to that point.
I just think Faris reacted like 90% of us would do if we were in her situation,she had no combat experience,all of a sudden a virus broke out and has no idea if it's airborne,bloodborne(heh) etc...she was alone,stressed and scared as fuck.
Edit:Covenant wasn't scary but with the exception of the original movie,i could say that about the other movies too.
There was a jump scare that got me good though.
http://imgur.com/a/UHf4V
.la1n
Member
I went into this with an open mind and low expectations. It still manages to feel like a completely wasted experience. I have no idea where they take the franchise from here. It's sad because I feel the IP still has juice in it despite numerous failings. Ridley seems determined to destroy what he created; perhaps that was his plan all along. Scorched earth.
Inceptional
Member
What? You do realize Ridley Scott is 80 and doesn't give a fuck if his movies are universally liked. He's making movies he wants to make before he kicks the bucket. I wish more directors were like him to be honest.
Also, just like Prometheus, this film will gain a strong cult following. I mean, look at how often this thread gets bumped. Whatever you think of the film, people cant stop thinking about it, just like Prometheus. Scott must've done something right.
I'll take movies like Prometheus and Covenant over most other sci-fi garbage we've been getting lately.
Or something very wrong. These are his Star Wars prequels.
As the director of Alien he's every right to make shit new entries, but it doesn't protect them from criticism.