I gotta call BS, through my years of being park of teenage punk, club scene, slight goth, even skater -- I rarely (and by rare I mean the situations I can think of are 2000 era Road Trip movies about Michelle Trachtenberg or maybe someone calling Avril Lavigne dude in a music video) heard people call women dudes or a single woman dude.
I've never heard anyone call a woman "dude" or even go "Hey dude" to them. Who are these people that call women dudes?
"You guys" is trans-exclusionary. You should say something else.
As an exclamation its cool. You dont call a woman a dude but you call them dude, you know? Like "Dude! Did you just see that?"I've never heard anyone call a woman "dude" or even go "Hey dude" to them. Who are these people that call women dudes?
I gotta call BS, through my years of being park of teenage punk, club scene, slight goth, even skater -- I rarely (and by rare I mean the situations I can think of are 2000 era Road Trip movies about Michelle Trachtenberg or maybe someone calling Avril Lavigne dude in a music video) heard people call women dudes or a single woman dude.
AAs an exclamation its cool. You dont call a woman a dude but you call them dude you, know? Like "Dude! Did you just see that?"
Both are fairly casual though, especially dude
Fascinating.
Call BS all you like, it's not that out of the ordinary.
I bet "you know" and "like" are literally the three mostly commonly said words on the West Coast. Like, I would bet actual money on that.
You know, like, dude, YOU GUYS!. Yes, we actually fucking talk like that.
Well, I gotta, it's a really big claim. I'm trying really hard to think of / find material in media where women are called dudes. Like an abundance of this to make it common or ordinary. Maybe in Dudeism or surfer culture? But even then I can't place media doing this, so it's hard for me to believe it's that much different.
It's mostly casual talk. You won't see it much in media, because we sound really dumb when we do it and movies shamed "valley speak" pretty hard for a while. It slips out a lot of if you watch people who stream from the West Coast though. Like, EZA has even made note of it on several occasions that they have to make a concentrated effort to not slip into valley speak. Some of the guys even have podcast goals to not say "you know".
Dude, like, you know, you guys. People will string combinations together of that over and over here in casual conversation. Especially Like and You know.
I get the whole "like" and "you know" bit but your claim was people call women dudes and it's a casual, ordinary thing. I get folks say "you guys" but a singular dude or dudes for a group seems quite rare, well really rare.
I get the whole "like" and "you know" bit but your claim was people call women dudes and it's a casual, ordinary thing. I get folks say "you guys" but a singular dude or dudes for a group seems quite rare, well really rare.
it assumes men to be the default.
Colloquially it doesn't.
I gotta call BS, through my years of being park of teenage punk, club scene, slight goth, even skater -- I rarely (and by rare I mean the situations I can think of are 2000 era Road Trip movies about Michelle Trachtenberg or maybe someone calling Avril Lavigne dude in a music video) heard people call women dudes or a single woman dude.
What if i told you one of the founders of gafs favorite burger joint 5 Guys, is a gal.
I get the whole "like" and "you know" bit but your claim was people call women dudes and it's a casual, ordinary thing. I get folks say "you guys" but a singular dude or dudes for a group seems quite rare, well really rare.
When did I say I didn't know it wasn't gender neutral? Or the idea that I didn't know people find it gender neutral?In this thread we've learned you didn't know you guys was gender neutral and now we're learning you've never heard a woman being called dude before. Fascinating.
When did I say I didn't know it wasn't gender neutral?
I'll be waiting.
it's not gender neutral. it never was. the word "guy" refers to males. i'm sure there are plenty of people who dislike the phrase hence why you see "Hey all", "Hey everyone" "Hey folks" etc. because they know it's exclusionary and keeps the status quo. Just men all around would make a stink if they were asked to use something else.
See you missed the point. I know people find it gender neutral but in reality it isn't.Here you it isn't.
I mean, you had to be told it WAS gender neutral and now you're having to be told dude can also be gender neutral. It's a real head scratcher how these are things that need to be explained.
Wonderful title change
PS I say "dude" all the time regardless of gender :\
See you missed the point. I know people find it gender neutral but in reality it isn't.
That's, like, the point.
So English is wrong and you're right? Man, what a point.
I've never heard anyone call a woman "dude" or even go "Hey dude" to them. Who are these people that call women dudes?
Naw, just means I've thought past the "what did the dictionary say?"
Like, the phrase is "you guys". Guy singular refers to male and everyone seems to agree but "guys" refers to both female and male and can be used if it's a group of women and one guy. It suggests a standard or a default and it's male. Plenty of words do this: freshman, grandfathered (why not grandmothered?), etc.
Your idea that "English" is wrong is really awful. English is an evolving language that takes bits and pieces from multiple languages. We learn more about by thinking and trying to understand the meaning of each word and applying them. That's how a lot of slang comes about cause it's a word that matches the action, thought, or idea being presented.
To say it's gender-neutral only means that, well, women don't seem to mind but you haven't gone past that. Just because women say something doesn't automatically mean it's gender-neutral in all regards.
Naw, just means I've thought past the "what did the dictionary say?"
Like, the phrase is "you guys". Guy singular refers to male and everyone seems to agree but "guys" refers to both female and male and can be used if it's a group of women and one guy. It suggests a standard or a default and it's male. Plenty of words do this: freshman, grandfathered (why not grandmothered?), etc.
Your idea that "English" is wrong is really awful. English is an evolving language that takes bits and pieces from multiple languages. We learn more about by thinking and trying to understand the meaning of each word and applying them. That's how a lot of slang comes about cause it's a word that matches the action, thought, or idea being presented.
To say it's gender-neutral only means that, well, women don't seem to mind but you haven't gone past that. Just because women say something doesn't automatically mean it's gender-neutral in all regards.
Prescriptivism is objectively idiotic, so.
"You all" has a very very different implication from "ya'll" honestly.The person was an asshole, for sure, but this thread IS making me consider starting to use "you all." I can't say "y'all" but like someone else mentioned, "you all" is delightfully quaint.
Yeah, I know a lot of women who use dude to refer to either men or women.It's not rare here at all in casual conversation. Even women addressing other women in a group will go "guys!".
And "you guys" evolved to be commonly known to be gender neutral and will continue to be as long as it is commonly seen as such. This isn't a case of you seeing past the dictionary, this is a case with you disagreeing with where English evolved and wanting it to evolve into something else.
As long as it is commonly seen as gender neutral, it will continue to be gender neutral, because that's how language works.
I know some women who call other women "dude". It's just part of some people's vocabulary.I've never heard anyone call a woman "dude" or even go "Hey dude" to them. Who are these people that call women dudes?