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[Gestault]

as supposed to what racing game that has full VR experience? PC2? Forza? Which one?

1.) If TIME ATTACK isn't included as a VR mode, you have terrible VR implementation. Full stop. 100%.

2.) Project Cars 2 has across-the-board support, afaik.

 

[muteki]

Agreed. Not only is the tech still in its infancy, but there's the age old catch 22 regarding growing platforms and the financial risk of developing dedicated software.

That said, I think PD failed to implement low cost and frankly obvious options that would have worked within the limits of the hardware while significantly expanding replayability. I mean, for a lot of racers the meat of racing games is just learning the track, alone, working to improve lap times. They could have stuck that in there effortlessly! In fact performance could even be improved by removing the extra car with its shitty AI! Ugh, so dumb. Ok done ranting.

Not putting modes in that should be effortless has been a PD/GT problem before. Drag race, create an event, etc.

 

[Majima Everywhere System]

Giant Bomb with that GameSpot special guest really tore into this game. I can see where they are coming from, but I don't think they will ever get what they want.

At this point, I have bought into online progress as a game mechanic in other genres. I would compare playing a racing campaign to playing through an entire season of MLB against the comp. It's a meaningless waste of time compared to slightly more meaningful wastes of time out there. PCars 1 drove the analogy home with the calendar, and it killed racing games for me.

At least this offers the promise of something. Whether or not that promise pans out and becomes more than turn 1 wrecks, I guess that will be seen. I also don't even know if I will like what it's selling, but it's worth a shot to find out.

 

[Synth]

as supposed to what racing game that has full VR experience? PC2? Forza? Which one?

Dirt Rally (PS4 and PC)
Driveclub VR (PS4)
Project Cars 1 & 2 (PC)
Redout (PC)
maybe Assetto Corsa (PC)? I haven't gotten around to trying it yet.

It's not even a "racing game" issue. There's far too much stitching a weak separate VR mode onto games, rather than the core game itself being playable entirely in VR. Capcom basically showed everyone how its done with RE7, but there's very few comparable examples, and it really does harm the platform, basically solidifying its reputation as a gimmick.

 

[Unknown?]

Or all the high scoring reviews? Bias goes both ways.

Sure but no one was doing that here at least not since I quoted that guy.

 

[TheMan]

as supposed to what racing game that has full VR experience? PC2? Forza? Which one?

The other games didn't advertise VR features, GTS did, so I'm criticizing their shitty implementation. The other games are not relevant in regards to PSVR.

But since you brought it up, fuck SMS for saying they'd support PSVR with PC1 and then dropping it.

 

[spwolf]

Every activity in this game -- whether single- or multiplayer -- now centers around a single persistent driver profile that is socially shared (via the online network), but the breadth of activities that existed in other GT games is still largely present, it's just not accounted for in the same "Career" structure that's been familiar to fans for a long time. Where this gets even more hazy is in small places like how your DR/SR -- two of the most important aspects of your driver profile -- aren't affected by your single player activity, which makes the lack of a Career structure stand out a bit since it still shows some discrimination in priority over what activities the game deems more important than others, running counter to this universal/social notion it seems to be built on.

this is well said - career is you! Thats the whole point now. Both "offline" as in alone and online as in racing with others are going towards your driving profile and basically priming you for championships next month.

 

[spwolf]

The other games didn't advertise VR features, GTS did, so I'm criticizing their shitty implementation. The other games are not relevant in regards to PSVR.

But since you brought it up, fuck SMS for saying they'd support PSVR with PC1 and then dropping it.

so GTS has a feature that nobody else has but thats a minus for GTS only, not for those games that dont have it? yeah

 

[Kill3r7]

Giant Bomb with that GameSpot special guest really tore into this game. I can see where they are coming from, but I don't think they will ever get what they want.

At this point, I have bought into online progress as a game mechanic in other genres. I would compare playing a racing campaign to playing through an entire season of MLB against the comp. It's a meaningless waste of time compared to slightly more meaningful wastes of time out there. PCars 1 drove the analogy home with the calendar, and it killed racing games for me.

At least this offers the promise of something. Whether or not that promise pans out and becomes more than turn 1 wrecks, I guess that will be seen. I also don't even know if I will like what it's selling, but it's worth a shot to find out.

I think it is worth noting that the Giantbomb conversation mentioned that GTS is not what they want out of a racing sim. They, and most casuals, are not the crowd this game was made for, which is a problem in and of itself considering the game is titled GT. I would not give Jeff’s opinion much credence unless you are a casual racing fan, which I am.

Another interesting point, the GS reviewer said that he might not issue a score due to the required time commitment to experience the game in its entirety.

 

[Yautja_Warrior]

PSU (75) and Areajugones (85) have pushed it back up to 77 on MC now, so it's going the right way at least.

 

[Rodelero]

2.) Project Cars 2 has across-the-board support, afaik.

Across the board (but not on console at all).

 

[Gestault]

so GTS has a feature that nobody else has but thats a minus for GTS only, not for those games that dont have it? yeah

Many games in the genre, starting from years back, have a full-featured VR mode. GTS has a mode so limited and with so little thought put into the implementation, it doesn't even include what would be the single easiest (and most rewarding) mode to implement.

Time Trial should have been the first mode the PSVR support was built around. I hope they change that, because without it, it's trash.

 

[c0de]

Across the board (but not on console at all).

Which is hardly the game's fault. To make PC2 run on console, it *has* to be downgraded substantially to maintain a 60fps target. I guess that's where PC2 devs said "nope".

 

[Mr. PlayStation]

what do you guys think about the 7.5 score from PSU?

 

[GoldenCrow]

so GTS has a feature that nobody else has but thats a minus for GTS only, not for those games that dont have it? yeah

Most modern racers have VR implementation so you can directly compare and contrast.

GT:S in VR simply lacks options, this is something more important to VR than anything else as it is this that makes people be able to become comfortable and feel as natural as possible. In the sport racing cars VR feels great and some of the tracks are superb in VR but it could still be so much more if they incorporated basic features and that is without expanding upon the content itself. Having spent a long time in VR racers I know what I can do to make it a more enjoyable experience and GT:S lacks any of these. Flesh out the VR options and add in more diversity for the VR gameplay like AI difficulty, time trails, online racing and you have a top quality product, the competition have all managed to do this.

 

[c0de]

But does this count as a real review?

We have to wait for actual reviews, it will only go up from there.

 

[BBQ_of_DOOM]

what do you guys think about the 7.5 score from PSU?

Not sure the words they wrote fully support it, but at the end of the day, not surprised?

 

[Kurdel]

1.) If TIME ATTACK isn't included as a VR mode, you have terrible VR implementation. Full stop. 100%.

Yeah, this is a mind blowing omission.

How hard could it be?

 

[Synth]

Most modern racers have VR implementation so you can directly compare and contrast.

GT:S in VR simply lacks options, this is something more important to VR than anything else as it is this that makes people be able to become comfortable and feel as natural as possible. In the sport racing cars VR feels great and some of the tracks are superb in VR but it could still be so much more if they incorporated basic features and that is without expanding upon the content itself. Having spent a long time in VR racers I know what I can do to make it a more enjoyable experience and GT:S lacks any of these. Flesh out the VR options and add in more diversity for the VR gameplay like AI difficulty, time trails, online racing and you have a top quality product, the competition have all managed to do this.

We're definitely not at a "most modern racers have VR implementation" point yet. Forza Motorsport 7 doesn't (annoyingly, considering they've just launched their Windows 10 mixed reality headsets), Dirt 4 doesn't despite Dirt Rally having it, Need for Speed and The Crew don't have VR either, and neither does F1 2017.

However, amongst those that do have VR implementations, you'd struggle to find any as barebones as GTS' is. The only similar/worse case that comes to mind would be Trackmania Turbo.

 

[KORNdoggy]

Most modern racers have VR implementation so you can directly compare and contrast.

i really wish this was true for consoles. Project cars 2 should have definitely had it. but alas, nothing

 

[dugdug]

Woof, the Giant Bomb discussion is...

Well, they’re entitled to their opinion. But, going off on all then museum stuff as if it’s bad...like, that’s why many of us buy Gran Turismo, my dudes. For the love of the sport.

“They’re trying to be the country club of cars!” I mean...yeah? They always went for that.

 

[BBQ_of_DOOM]

Woof, the Giant Bomb discussion is...

Well, they’re entitled to their opinion. But, going off on all then museum stuff as if it’s bad...like, that’s why many of us buy Gran Turismo, my dudes. For the love of the sport.

"This game is no longer about the cars!!"

 

[wumster3000]

what do you guys think about the 7.5 score from PSU?

I didn't like that much. I don't care about the score, but the lack of content. Seems like they forgot about gameplay to focus on graphics.

They didn't talk about actual gameplay - how the cars feel, track improvements, physics or lack thereof. You know, the things that make a racing game. He talked a little about motion controls, which was not that good either.

Also this:
"Another franchise staple is how wonderful the game's sounds are."

Now, I might be crazy, but GT has always been lacking in the sound department compared to other racers. GTS has since changed this. I wish that the reviewer went into more detail about the sound improvements. They really should be commended on this.

It seemed like a rushed review to me.

 

[KHlover]

so GTS has a feature that nobody else has but thats a minus for GTS only, not for those games that dont have it? yeah

If it's badly implemented? Absolutely.

 

[Rodelero]

Woof, the Giant Bomb discussion is...

Well, they’re entitled to their opinion. But, going off on all then museum stuff as if it’s bad...like, that’s why many of us buy Gran Turismo, my dudes. For the love of the sport.

“They’re trying to be the country club of cars!” I mean...yeah? They always went for that.

It is (even more than usual) a pity that Drew left because he'd be the one to actually point out the advantages of this game. I don't really see why they talk about this type of game in general (same as when they occasionally cover things like FIFA). If you don't care or understand motorsport, why are you trying to review a motorsport game?

 

[KORNdoggy]

If it's badly implemented? Absolutely.

except it is well implemented, its probably the best VR in a racer to date on PS4...it just lacks content. but i'd honestly take something similar from project cars (a 1v1 race) over nothing at all, sadly we got the latter from them.

 

[CrayToes]

It is (even more than usual) a pity that Drew left because he'd be the one to actually point out the advantages of this game. I don't really see why they talk about this type of game in general (same as when they occasionally cover things like FIFA). If you don't care or understand motorsport, why are you trying to review a motorsport game?

Reviews from people who aren't heavily in to motorsports may not be useful to you or me but they are for likeminded people. I don't subscribe to the notion that only fans of the game/sport/genre should review them.

 

[bombshell]

Gamereactor Denmark - 9/10

Gamereactor Sweden - 7/10 (Petter gave same score to Forza 7)

Gamereactor Norway - 7/10

 

[TylerDurden4321]

It is (even more than usual) a pity that Drew left because he'd be the one to actually point out the advantages of this game. I don't really see why they talk about this type of game in general (same as when they occasionally cover things like FIFA). If you don't care or understand motorsport, why are you trying to review a motorsport game?

No Drew would not have. He would have pointed out that Gran Turismo is too big to play "iRacing", which has 60,000 subscribers.

 

[Yautja_Warrior]

I think the Top Gear review is my favourite review.

If you’ll excuse us for getting all philosophical in a review of a videogame about racing cars, Gran Turismo Sport offers a singular vision that’s just as clear and coherent as it ever was. It’s just that it happens to be a different vision from the previous six games.

We do miss hoarding cars in GT Mode, and scudding around in a heavily modified early 90s Supra for the first couple of hours, but ultimately do you play racing games to stare at your cars slowly rotating in a menu or do you play to hustle them on track? If the answer’s the latter then you’ll still find plenty to love in GT Sport.

Pretty much how I feel about the game. I've done the car collecting thing in every GT (aswell as other racing games) so it's refreshing to focus on the racing now. The demo had me hooked with the challenging / addictive Campaign mode, awesome photo mode, great online and superb car handling on the track.

 

[Rodelero]

Reviews from people who aren't heavily in to motorsports may not be useful to you or me but they are for likeminded people. I don't subscribe to the notion that only fans of the game/sport/genre should review them.

I suppose to be more specific I don't mind that such people review the games, I mind that they very often don't make it clear where they're coming from. For sim games, be they flying, racing, trucking or football, the majority of reviews seem to come from a very casual place, and while that is useful, it tends to mean there is a very low correlation between the quality of a game (to its core audience) and the reviews. This is something far more noticeable with this type of game than any other genre. It's pefectly useful and valid for anyone to give their impressions, but reviewers should take a step back at times and question whether what they're criticising is actually something wrong or something that simply isn't for them.

No Drew would not have. He would have pointed out that Gran Turismo is too big to play "iRacing", which has 60,000 subscribers.

I don't really want to get into an argument about what Drew would or wouldn't have said, but I'm sure he would at least have pointed out the value of the Sport Mode, something so, so many reviewers/journalists seem to have completely missed (almost certainly because they don't play online racing games). I guess that's what ultimately is so frustrating. This is a racing game focused around online and its being reviewed by people who neither have any history of playing racing games online nor have actually put any real time into the Sport mode.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

I don't really want to get into an argument about what Drew would or wouldn't have said, but I'm sure he would at least have pointed out the value of the Sport Mode, something so, so many reviewers/journalists seem to have completely missed (almost certainly because they don't play online racing games). I guess that's what ultimately is so frustrating. This is a racing game focused around online and its being reviewed by people who neither have any history of playing racing games online nor have actually put any real time into the Sport mode.

I agree that he would have said good thing about what they are trying to do and if you're the kind of person a little more serious about racing, that this could be fantastic for you, yes.

I'm still listening to ALT+F1 (or SHIFT+F1 now), maybe he'll talk about there. I'll post his opinion in here then.

 

[chrominance]

And this is just a personal take, certainly not one I think will apply to or interest all long-running GT fans, but the multiplayer genuinely addresses most of the aspects of online multiplayer racing that intimidated me before, and now it's enjoyable, an entirely new approach to "casual sims" that I never really ever paid any attention to before. It doesn't make me immune to making embarrassing mistakes, and it doesn't necessarily make it so that I can completely avoid bad driving practices and poor sportsmanship online, but the safeguards in place literally feel like every effort to play fair-but-competitively is honored and rewarded at most times -- a remarkable majority of the time, even. I'm actually glad that these considerations seem to have been the focus of the development of Sport after all, because it's actually making me interact with GT in a way I always felt too intimidated to as a casual player, and making GT feel perhaps far more fresh and exciting than just getting yet another predictably structured career mode has.

Setting aside for the moment my opinions on locking the single-player campaign behind an online connection, I am really hoping your experience is also mine. Though I do worry about the long-term viability of the game once the servers go down, I'm not intrinsically against the idea of online competition; it's just that I don't really want to have to practice for hours and grind races constantly just to be able to progress in the game like I would in career.

I'm not the best racer, I'm probably not even a very good racer, and losing races constantly is not my thing. Beyond a certain point, I usually hit a skill ceiling, and if I can't succeed at that point I usually bail. If GT Sport really does make it so someone like me can really get into online racing, I'll consider that a major victory on their part.

 

[thelastword]

What's all the uproar, it's only 7 reviews....If reviewer's are taking their time, it's a good thing innit?

 

[Tomeru]

No Drew would not have. He would have pointed out that Gran Turismo is too big to play "iRacing", which has 60,000 subscribers.

Why too big for it?

 

[Yautja_Warrior]

What's all the uproar, it's only 7 reviews....If reviewer's are taking their time, it's a good thing innit?

Indeed it is. It gives them chance to really play it now the servers are live.

 

[mckmas8808]

7.5ish is a good score. Reviewers seem to be falling for less hype these days on most games so review scores are lower for everything.

Not for a Gran Turismo game it's not.

 

[STEaMkb]

nm

 

[Chaser324]

Why too big for it?

Gran Turismo is a big franchise that Sony invests a lot of time and money into that typically appeals to a broad audience and sells 10+ million copies.

So, trying to pivot the focus of GT to something that's likely to appeal to a much smaller specific niche seems like an odd direction that's going to leave a lot of fans of the older entries out in the cold.

 

[Seganomics]

What's all the uproar, it's only 7 reviews....If reviewer's are taking their time, it's a good thing innit?

What uproar? The game is scoring mediocre overall. Just as expected.

 

[Majima Everywhere System]

I think it is worth noting that the Giantbomb conversation mentioned that GTS is not what they want out of a racing sim. They, and most casuals, are not the crowd this game was made for, which is a problem in and of itself considering the game is titled GT. I would not give Jeff’s opinion much credence unless you are a casual racing fan, which I am.

Another interesting point, the GS reviewer said that he might not issue a score due to the required time commitment to experience the game in its entirety.

True, but I am no more hardcore than they are. I hopped on at Forza 2 (after not understanding GT2) and experienced the same curve. I struggle to think what would bring me back into the genre. I guess I would give more leeway for trying something different, especially in the online space which has been a non-feature for me since I started playing sims. As I saw people shoot past me on the nurburgring grass in a tuned up '77 Chevy whatever, I thought to myself: maybe a level playing field is what the genre needs.

I also think the country club thing is somewhat absurd and endearing rather than a put off.

I mean, Forza 7 has some STUPID looking driver costumes, that really only exist so they had something to shove in a loot box.I barfed.

 

[Bitch Pudding]

I think that when you have 6 numbered installments that seem rooted in a Career Mode with ever-growing features, it becomes pretty difficult to communicate a shift like Sport.

I mean, right off the bat, using the title "Sport" instead of a number seems like a pretty obvious symbolic choice, and revealing the game with an outline on a persistent multiplayer experience did draw some negative backlash.

Calling it Sport is actually more than just a symbolic choice. GT has always been an excellent driving simulator. But it really sucked at racing - off- and online. GT races have almost always been dominated by stupid "chase the rabbit" events which made overtaking as unchallenging as possible, including a stupid rubber band AI. In GTS you can at least deactivate the last one. No idea yet how races against AI opponents are setup.

 

[Kill3r7]

True, but I am no more hardcore than they are. I hopped on at Forza 2 (after not understanding GT2) and experienced the same curve. I struggle to think what would bring me back into the genre. I guess I would give more leeway for trying something different, especially in the online space which has been a non-feature for me since I started playing sims. As I saw people shoot past me on the nurburgring grass in a tuned up '77 Chevy whatever, I thought to myself: maybe a level playing field is what the genre needs.

I also think the country club thing is somewhat absurd and endearing rather than a put off.

I mean, Forza 7 has some STUPID looking driver costumes, that really only exist so they had something to shove in a loot box.I barfed.

I will say that GTS has the chance to create the greatest competitive online racing game, at least on consoles. We will see if casuals agree. I will have to find some time to dig in.

 

[wumster3000]

What's all the uproar, it's only 7 reviews....If reviewer's are taking their time, it's a good thing innit?

13 for OpenCritic @ 76. It is a good thing that they are taking their time, but I have to wonder why PD and Sony took so long to open the servers for a proper early review. They had 4 years.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

Why too big for it?

Because a Gran Turismo game after a 4 year (felt "more than 4 years" because GT6 was out on PS3 after the enthusiast had moved to PS4 already) break has proven to be able to attract over 10 million people. But there are not 10 million people who care about racing online and learning the tracks to be competetive and also confident enough in their skill to not bump into people and lower their sportsmanship rating over and over.

I mean look at Jeff Gerstmann and Drew and Alex drive racing games. They'd suck at GTS online and they wouldn't want to spend the time to get good at it. And it's representative of many racing game players. If you're only attractive to the more serious motorsport gamers, you'll be looking at sales numbers of Project CARS 1, not sales numbers of GT5 (and certainly not GT3).

 

[Unknown?]

What uproar? The game is scoring mediocre overall. Just as expected.

No it’s not. Lol, you are what his post addresses.

 

[Yautja_Warrior]

13 for OpenCritic @ 76. It is a good thing that they are taking their time, but I have to wonder why PD and Sony took so long to open the servers for a proper early review. They had 4 years.

I'm sure I read or heard that Sony gave them a work around to try a lot of the game early (think it was Push Square) but some are probably waiting to play the main online on the real servers, to properly test it out.

 

[thelastword]

What uproar? The game is scoring mediocre overall. Just as expected.

77 Meta with 7 reviews is not mediocre....Perhaps these 7 reviewers rushed their reviews as well, looking at the current picture...There's so much campaign content in this game and the online is the best in all the racers released this season. So if the other reviewers take their time to go through the paces, accept the real challenges that the missions provide in campaign instead of taking a stock car, put all the best parts in it and blitz past all the vitz at the starting line and lap them at that....What a thrill that would have been in the 7th iteration Eh! ;(...I guess people hate change, but I hope the pending reviewers give GTS it's fair shake...I have a feeling this will take off as a new approach, for professional Esports racers etc..., whether it's embraced by reviewers or not....



OTOH...

Why I'm I not hearing much more of how fast this game loads, Just booted GTS...This is super fast for an online focused game, it's insane. As one going for all golds on licenses and challenges etc...I'm so happy how quick it is to retry trials and change them too...Notwithstanding that UI, the music on the main menu are all ace and everything is snappy. I think the cohesiveness and presentation in this game is simply unmatched....It encourages you to stay in the game and keep playing.....Kudos to PD on that.....awesome work here...

 

[Unknown?]

Because a Gran Turismo game after a 4 year (felt "more than 4 years" because GT6 was out on PS3 after the enthusiast had moved to PS4 already) break has proven to be able to attract over 10 million people. But there are not 10 million people who care about racing online and learning the tracks to be competetive and also confident enough in their skill to not bump into people and lower their sportsmanship rating over and over.

I mean look at Jeff Gerstmann and Drew and Alex drive racing games. They'd suck at GTS online and they wouldn't want to spend the time to get good at it. And it's representative of many racing game players. If you're only attractive to the more serious motorsport gamers, you'll be looking at sales numbers of Project CARS 1, not sales numbers of GT5 (and certainly not GT3).

Well why do you care so much if Polyphony/Sony want to target a different audience? Maybe they don’t want to be stuck making the same thing over and over like Kojima at Konami.

As a creator I’d want to create something that is better rather than being stagnant. The online in GT5/6 sucked and it sucks in all console sim racers. This is the first online racing game for consoles I feel actually does it right. I miss the content but I don’t miss the cups and championships which were always terribly balanced. A traditional campaign with strict strict rules so you can’t cheese through it would be awesome though.

 

[Seganomics]

77 Meta with 7 reviews is not mediocre...

Sure. I guess what I mean is 'mediocre for what is expected from Gran Turismo'.

As for your other points.....

The quick load times could boost the Metascore a bit I guess?