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[Msamy]

You think DS2 will be 4K? no chance.

I am pretty sure , given that it's gonna release alongside ps5 pro in other hand hellblade 2 black bars will remain in xbox half generation upgrade

 

[yamaci17]

Yes it is, I get it, they look nice, especially from top dogs with a high budget, but people need to separate them somehow from actual gameplay when talking about graphics, 90% of the time there is such a huge gap between when you play and watch a cutscene.

kojima and naughty dog use cutscenes in a way to a point one can always consider they're close to pre-rendering in logic. look at something like god of war, which has more natural cutscene transitions from game to cutscene and do not enter into full "we're in now cutscenes!" mode. as a result it does not look as impressive as dstranding or last of us 2. it is not santa monica's incompetence. it is just a choice.

there's nothing wrong pushing graphics with cutscenes. but it does not make a game nextgen by itself. the game clearly does not look as CGI as it did in actual gameplay scenarios. this was the case with the 1st game too. won't change in the 2nd.

how can I say "oh wow, this game is pushing graphics!"

when it goes from this

to this in mere minutes

I mean come on. it is just what it is.

im sure people here fanboying all over graphics in ds2 will be deeply disappointed once they start actually moving their characters and understand those specifically handpicked gameplay shots are best case scenarios. but of course you will have people sharing cutscene shots and saying

"10 tflops! Kojima was able to build this in a cave! With a box of scraps!"

 

[Msamy]

kojima and naughty dog use cutscenes in a way to a point one can always consider they're close to pre-rendering in logic. look at something like god of war, which has more natural cutscene transitions from game to cutscene and do not enter into full "we're in now cutscenes!" mode. as a result it does not look as impressive as dstranding or last of us 2. it is not santa monica's incompetence. it is just a choice.

there's nothing wrong pushing graphics with cutscenes. but it does not make a game nextgen by itself. the game clearly does not look as CGI as it did in actual gameplay scenarios. this was the case with the 1st game too. won't change in the 2nd.

how can I say "oh wow, this game is pushing graphics!"

when it goes from this

to this in mere minutes

I mean come on. it is just what it is.

when you compare something try to compare same thing , actually death stranding gameplay character models are very close to its cutscene models as you can see in the video above.

 

[yamaci17]

when you compare something try to compare same thing , actually death stranding gameplay character models are very close to its cutscene models as you can see in the video above.

i've played the game for 150 hrs and made a %100 completion at native 4K. you probably think i didn't play the game or something and make these remarks without any knowledge or experience

i dont need to watch anything. and dont send me small room rendering when sam rests in facilities. it is also fake + entire budget being pushed into a character model there. i just cant accept these as a benchmark of graphics. it is just me. i trekked for 100 hrs. i have seen sam and his in game model in open world for upwards of 100 hrs. lemme have my own opinions please

 

[TheRedRiders]

I've seen people claim that Decima now has its own Nanite and I was just shaking my head. The tech they're using is more detailed than last gen, but it's still way behind Nanite. Remedy also could not match Nanite, not even close. Right now UE5 is in its own league with tech advancement, we just yet to see big projects come out that use it. I'm sure in time others will catch up with UE5, but right now nothing comes close.

UE5 titles are running like crap because beyond geometry, rendering characters with full animations, physics, visual effects are also GPU heavy on the GPU. Most UE5 titles to date aren't exactly mind blowing either in terms of visuals. We should be judging the game as a full package, rather than falling back onto tech demos.

i've played the game for 150 hrs and made a %100 completion at native 4K. you probably think i didn't play the game or something and make these remarks without any knowledge or experience

i dont need to watch anything. and dont send me small room rendering when sam rests in facilities. it is also fake + entire budget being pushed into a character model there. i just cant accept these as a benchmark of graphics. it is just me. i trekked for 100 hrs. i have seen sam and his in game model in open world for upwards of 100 hrs. lemme have my own opinions please

Sure but the facial details and animations don't exactly fall apart during gameplay, you just tend to notice it lest given the distance of the camera, the games facial animation and character rendering are ahead of its geometry and textures. which can be seen in the screenshot you posted. I'm mostly nit-picking here though, overall it's still an incredibly good looking game for something built to run on hardware from 2013.

 

[Edder1]

UE5 titles are running like crap because beyond geometry, rendering characters with full animations, physics, visual effects are also GPU heavy on the GPU. Most UE5 titles to date aren't exactly mind blowing either in terms of visuals. We should be judging the game as a full package, rather than falling back onto tech demos.

Name me one AAA game by a well known developer that uses UE5 and all of its new features. When we have one then we'll talk. It's not the fault of Epic Games that AAA games that use UE5 haven't come out. They gave people the tools, but everyone is still releasing cross gen games or games that use UE4.

 

[Msamy]

i've played the game for 150 hrs and made a %100 completion at native 4K. you probably think i didn't play the game or something and make these remarks without any knowledge or experience

i dont need to watch anything. and dont send me small room rendering when sam rests in facilities. it is also fake + entire budget being pushed into a character model there. i just cant accept these as a benchmark of graphics. it is just me. i trekked for 100 hrs. i have seen sam and his in game model in open world for upwards of 100 hrs. lemme have my own opinions please

It's your opinion and l respect it also I have different opinion given that I played that game for many hours

 

[Msamy]

Name me one AAA game by a well known developer that uses UE5 and all of its new features. When we have one then we'll talk. It's not the fault of Epic Games that AAA games that use UE5 haven't come out. They gave people the tools, but everyone is still releasing cross gen games or games that use UE4.

Immortal of aveum is actually a big budget UE5 next gen exclusive with more than 100 developers (you can search it) and it looks worse than some cross gen titles

 

[Edder1]

Immortal of aveum is actually a big budget UE5 next gen exclusive with more than 100 developers (you can search it) and it looks worse than some cross gen titles

Big budget from a team that never made a game before. Give me one well known developer. There hasn't been one.

 

[Msamy]

Big budget from a team that never made a game before. Give me one well known developer.

Most of big developers use their own engine and some of them lately transformed to ue 5 like cdpr and crystal dynamics, and their games are still far away , and other big budget ue5 will come from new studios ex(that's no moon) only current well known by your standard is the coalition so in your opinion we must wait until next gears trailer to see whatever ue5 is good or not in full scale next gen game,.also I like ue5 but I think it have many problems need to be solved in full scale game

 

[Snake29]

DS2 is just the total package which looks much much more impressive then Hellblade 2.

 

[Edder1]

Most of big developers use their own engine and some of them lately transformed to ue 5 like cdpr and crystal dynamics, and their games are still far away , and other big budget ue5 will come from new studios ex(that's no moon) only current well known by your standard is the coalition so in your opinion we must wait until next gears trailer to see whatever ue5 is good or not in full scale next gen game,.also I like ue5 but I think it have many problems need to be solved in full scale game

Well, DS2 is only coming out next year so it seems like you're fine with waiting.

But In case you forgot, Hellblade 2 is coming out in few months. I'm not sure if you've seen The First Descendant, but that game looks bonkers for an unknown studio. There's also Stalker 2 that looks impressive for a game by AA team. There's also Avowed that looks solid but not really AAA quality. All these games are slated for this year and probably more will be announced. I'm sure in 2025 by the time DS2 launches there will be even more impressive UE5 games on larger scale.

 

[Msamy]

Well, DS2 is only coming out next year so it seems like you're fine with waiting.

But In case you forgot, Hellblade 2 is coming out in few months. I'm not sure if you've seen The First Descendant, but that game looks bonkers for an unknown studio. There's also Stalker 2 that looks impressive for a game by AA team. There's also Avowed that looks solid but not really AAA quality. All these games are slated for this year and probably more will be announced. I'm sure in 2025 by the time DS2 launches there will be even more impressive UE5 games on larger scale.

Well let's wait and see but I am pretty sure that ds2 , gta 6 and star wars outlow will have no competition in terms of graphics by the time of their releases whatever its ue5 games or not

 

[Edder1]

Well let's wait and see but I am pretty sure that ds2 , gta 6 and star wars outlow will have no competition in terms of graphics by the time of their releases whatever its ue5 games or not

Going by the users here it seems like many people think Hellblade 2 looks as good and maybe even better, and that game is coming out at least a year before DS2.

 

[Msamy]

Going by the users here it seems like many people think Hellblade 2 looks as good and maybe even better, and that game is coming out at least a year before DS2.

I don't put hellblade 2 in same category due to black pars also I like it's graphics

 

[Edder1]

I don't put hellblade 2 in same category due to black pars also I like it's graphics

Never seen people have a problem with Order 1886 with it's black borders, it's always mentioned as one of the best looking last gen games on this forum or elsewhere. Plus for a PC gamer like me there's no such things as black borders.

 

[Schmendrick]

Are you guys circlejerking about cutscenes again? Because besides those DS2 may look very good, but I don't see "groundbreaking" anywhere, especially with how little is going on in the scenery.

 

[Msamy]

Never seen people have a problem with Order 1886 with it's black borders, it's always mentioned as one of the best looking last gen games. Plus for a PC gamer like me there's no such things as black borders.

I saw many peoples including me don't like it's black pars , for pc gamers like you we will see how hellblade 2 will look but currently their are no pc footage

 

[GymWolf]

First ds had a lot of goofy ass physics and animations (this video doens't even cover all of them and some of them are ok, strange compilation )



The first example is extremely telling for a game where walking physics was the gameplay novelty.

Rdr2 or even this thing have better interactions while walking (when the euphoria doens't glitch sometimes, no game is perfect)



This looks silly (kinda the purpose) but it's completely procedural and physics based, you put your foot in the wrong place or the wrong way and you fall.

Of course it would not be funny to play like that in an action-stealth but let's not act like ds walking physics was realistic, it was pretty arcadey.

The type of gameplay scream for a more realistic skeletal system or something like euphoria engine, that would add another dimension to the traversal than just looking at the colored ground sensor to decide a route.

 

[Edder1]

I saw many peoples including me don't like it's black pars , for pc gamers like you we will see how hellblade 2 will look but currently their are no pc footage

Well, you best bet it will look better on PC. Black bars maybe a way of cheating to get more fidelity from consoles, but at this point I don't see how that's a big deal since console games use fake resolution anyway.

Btw, I don't think Hellblade 2 is pushing UE5 to the max at all, I think we'll see that with Coalition game, the next Tomb Raider and games from CDPR, etc. Ninja theory is still a AA studio so I'm sure soon there'll be much better looking games made on UE5.

 

[RaduN]

First ds had a lot of goofy ass physics and animations (this video doens't even cover all of them and some of them are ok, strange compilation )

Some scenes seem to be put to double speed or edited in some manner. I personally never encountered these animation glitches in my 3 playthroughs.
The first water one however, yes, many times...it's a comical moment, always made me chuckle

 

[GymWolf]

Some scenes seem to be put to double speed or edited in some manner. I personally never encountered these animation glitches in my 3 playthroughs.
The first water one however, yes, many times...it's a comical moment, always made me chuckle

I played the game for 40 hours and it was full of goofy animations and funny physics, maybe we just have different standard or you don't mind more arcadey animations\weight feeling.

I love heavy ass games with weighty animations and let's just say that except for very few exceptions, japanese devs have been always a miss for me in this particular aspect, different taste and all of that.

Capcom is the one that gets heavy feeling closer to my taste.

 

[ckstine]

Has the whole world gone crazy? DS2 looks mediocre visually, and using the great retardo (john linneman) as proof otherwise is daft. "NFS Unbound is pretty photorealistic" the guy is a fucking stooge. Kojima hasn't impressed since 2008. DS1 was ugly outside of cutscenes, and Hellblade 2 will kick its ass. And that is coming from a sony 'fanboy'.

 

[ckstine]

I played the game for 40 hours and it was full of goofy animations and funny physics, maybe we just have different standard or you don't mind more arcadey animations\weight feeling.

I love heavy ass games with weighty animations and let's just say that except for very few exceptions, japanese devs have been always a miss for me in this particular aspect, different taste and all of that.

Capcom is the one that gets heavy feeling closer to my taste.

its probably because us americans are heavier lmfao

 

[GymWolf]

its probably because us americans are heavier lmfao

This is unironically a genius take

 

[ckstine]

This is unironically a genius take

I mean even the ripped people here are like 240 lbs and 2% bodyfat... something in the water ig. MKUltra feels. I wonder what's in john linneman's water ...

 

[Audiophile]

I really hate YouTube compression, completely wipes out any fine detail in the sand/ground in the shots below and the motion in some other shots are complete sludge on a big display...

Would it really be so much to ask for a high quality download to be made available or for them to hand a trailer off to sites like gamersyde?

The KojiPro upload is 6mbps and the PlayStation upload is 9mbps; ...for 4K!? They don't even pad the 30fps up to 60fps so the encoder affords it more bits. Even better -- in addition to that -- would be a HDR/10-Bit/BT.2020 upload. It's not like these are tiny companies lacking the resources to do this.




They should at least make available an SDR 4K/60 HEVC 10-Bit/BT.2020 encode @ ~40Mbps (even if it's just a download link hidden away at the end of the blog post or in some dark corner of their site).

I recall around the early PS4 days there was a trailer repository on one of Sony's sites where you could source higher quality encodes. Does anyone know if this is still going?

 

[DanielG165]

Wait until downgrades

Until

Rockstar don’t do downgrades. The final build of RDR2 looked the same if not better than it did in the trailers.

 

[SlimySnake]

Rockstar don’t do downgrades. The final build of RDR2 looked the same if not better than it did in the trailers.

They dont but they downgraded the game AFTER launch lmao.

Vick has posted a lot about it. Apparently it was done for RDR2 online, but the base version has much better effects, shaders and textures.

 

[ckstine]

They dont but they downgraded the game AFTER launch lmao.

Vick has posted a lot about it. Apparently it was done for RDR2 online, but the base version has much better effects, shaders and textures.

Yeah but modders made a restoration. That's kinda the thing with rockstar games that is good is when they do something fucking dumb and take two pisses everywhere, the fans fix it. Death Stranding, on the other hand, only has fucking reshades and model swaps. I'm excited to see what fans can do with gta 6, especially when you see something like natural vision for gta

 

[arkhamguy123]

2 heaviest hitters we know about for next year so far.

IDGAF about different art styles, which one looks better to you guys?

GTA 6 eats it alive. GTA 6 will end as one of the best looking games of the gen

 

[analog_future]

Kojima just shared this screenshot:

Looking quite impressive

 

[SlimySnake]

GTA 6 eats it alive. GTA 6 will end as THE best looking games of the gen

Fixed. Nothing will top GTA6 in terms of scope. It's 3,000 devs vs 100 kojipro devs, 300 ND devs, 400 GG devs, 500 CDPR devs.

 

[Represent.]

Kojima just shared this screenshot:

Looking quite impressive

 

[analog_future]

Both look great, but I'm taking the IQ that comes with DS2 for now. Will be interesting to compare them when they're both out.

 

[rofif]

kojima and naughty dog use cutscenes in a way to a point one can always consider they're close to pre-rendering in logic. look at something like god of war, which has more natural cutscene transitions from game to cutscene and do not enter into full "we're in now cutscenes!" mode. as a result it does not look as impressive as dstranding or last of us 2. it is not santa monica's incompetence. it is just a choice.

there's nothing wrong pushing graphics with cutscenes. but it does not make a game nextgen by itself. the game clearly does not look as CGI as it did in actual gameplay scenarios. this was the case with the 1st game too. won't change in the 2nd.

how can I say "oh wow, this game is pushing graphics!"

when it goes from this

to this in mere minutes

I mean come on. it is just what it is.

im sure people here fanboying all over graphics in ds2 will be deeply disappointed once they start actually moving their characters and understand those specifically handpicked gameplay shots are best case scenarios. but of course you will have people sharing cutscene shots and saying

"10 tflops! Kojima was able to build this in a cave! With a box of scraps!"

I mean... I think the game looks breathtaking in gameplay.

ps5 shots:

And ps4 1080p shots. One I have is even in the same spot.

 

[Balducci30]

And some people here says this gameplay sections in the trailer looks cross gen lol

I’m not seeing what’s so graphically impressive in these shots? The road he’s running through looks like an empty cyberpunk road and there’s a big moon while he stands on a bunch of rocks - the rocks look good but not better than the UE5 rocks.

The most impressive part imo is it seems like there’s a degree of water simulation going on when he’s fighting that hand thing

GTA6 still looks above anything by quite a margin for what it’s doing. HB2 looks the closest to photo real but does not look compelling gameplay wise

 

[SlimySnake]

Has the whole world gone crazy? DS2 looks mediocre visually, and using the great retardo (john linneman) as proof otherwise is daft. "NFS Unbound is pretty photorealistic" the guy is a fucking stooge. Kojima hasn't impressed since 2008. DS1 was ugly outside of cutscenes, and Hellblade 2 will kick its ass. And that is coming from a sony 'fanboy'.

I hate that John likes it because it makes me rethink my life's choices.

But DS1 was not ugly outside of cutscenes lmao. Its a gorgeous game, one of the best. Came out after RDR2 and didnt feel dated, and had its own strengths. I remember John and Alex fighting over DS1 and Metro for best graphics of 2019 because no one else even came close.

 

[setoman]

The lighting was the biggest improvement to me. It was the first thing I noticed because of the GI light bounce in almost every area. It doesnt feel like the light hits the rocks or mountains and gets absorbed in, it feels like it bounces off of it. You can see it in the mountain collapse gif when you compare it to the rocks in Horizon Forbidden west. It's the environments that feel PS4.5 to me, but that could be the youtube compression hiding the texture detail. Still, its a generational leap over DS1 and HFW in lighting, asset quality and character models.

You need to go back and play DS1 again because that is what PS4 era lighting looks like.

I guess we are seeing it differently, to me its clear that it looked PS4.5 in the lighting department during gameplay. I wouldn't compare this strictly to HFW as each game uses a different lighting technique with different pros/cons and fall under certain scale.

Just compare it to the lighting in AVATAR and AW2, the difference is clear as day. Not just in lighting but the object variance and density. DS2 looks to have nice big rocks with questionable texture quality and hit and miss finer details (aka micro detail). Compared to Avatar, UE5 demos, etc.

Even you pointed out the variety and density in Avatar. Can you say the same about DS2?

This is much closer to the Unreal Engine 4 Rebirth demo that came out in 2019. especially the cloudy parts and that shot in the rain.

With all due respect its not even in the same universe. Its NOT even close.
You need to rewatch the Rebirth Video in 4k and not just compare GIFs (which butchers all details).

I am not really sure what UE5 games you are looking at, but this looks better than Immortals, Lords of the Fallen and Robocop. Hellblade 2 looks better but its a smaller game while this is open world. Still, id put these character models up there with hellblade 2's.

I'm looking at HB2 and AW2 (during gameplay).
Its quite clear that HB2 character looks exactly identical in cutscene as it does in gameplay (AW2 is also similar like that).

DS2 is clearly not, there's a huge gap between the cutscene character and the gameplay character based on what they showed.
So no i won't put it in a lineup with HB2 character. Because not only does HB2 look more photorealistic (sometimes even tricking your brain), It holds that same look in gameplay. DS2 loses on both accounts.

 

[Masterofchapter]

Lol no red dead redemption 2 got downloaded image quality, lighting character models go check the first gameplay trailer

Rockstar don’t do downgrades. The final build of RDR2 looked the same if not better than it did in the trailers.

 

[Balducci30]

2 heaviest hitters we know about for next year so far.

IDGAF about different art styles, which one looks better to you guys?

GTA6 by a country mile. The moon shot I don’t get what’s impressive at all - because the moon is big? It looks starfield level or worse right there

 

[SlimySnake]

I guess we are seeing it differently, to me its clear that it looked PS4.5 in the lighting department during gameplay. I wouldn't compare this strictly to HFW as each game uses a different lighting technique with different pros/cons and fall under certain scale.

Just compare it to the lighting in AVATAR and AW2, the difference is clear as day. Not just in lighting but the object variance and density. DS2 looks to have nice big rocks with questionable texture quality and hit and miss finer details (aka micro detail). Compared to Avatar, UE5 demos, etc.

Even you pointed out the variety and density in Avatar. Can you say the same about DS2?


With all due respect its not even in the same universe. Its NOT even close.
You need to rewatch the Rebirth Video in 4k and not just compare GIFs (which butchers all details).



I'm looking at HB2 and AW2 (during gameplay).
Its quite clear that HB2 character looks exactly identical in cutscene as it does in gameplay (AW2 is also similar like that).

DS2 is clearly not, there's a huge gap between the cutscene character and the gameplay character based on what they showed.
So no i won't put it in a lineup with HB2 character. Because not only does HB2 look more photorealistic (sometimes even tricking your brain), It holds that same look in gameplay. DS2 loses on both accounts.

I mean Avatar has dense forests and jungles. How can you even compare it to DS which is set in flat plains. The plains area in Avatar doesnt look as good as this. The rocks and mountains dont look as good in the plains and the lighting looks on par there. The only thing Id add to the lighting in DS2 is more volumetric effects but that requires adding fog and other post processing effects which might not be what they want in a game where draw distance is being prioritized.

AW2 isnt UE5, and im playing it right now, it looks very comparable to what im seeing here in DS2. Cutscenes look better so the game should look better too. That leaves us with HB2 which is a very closed off linear games. I agree it looks slightly better but its the expected difference you get when comparing linear games like The Order to open world games like RDR2.

I have literally studied the rebirth demo for years. i know exactly what it looks like. DS comes very close. Its not there in terms of asset quality, but considering the fact that the rebirth demo is a cutscene trailer which didnt exactly hold up when they showed us the gameplay bits, id say DS2's gameplay is very comparable. Saying its 'NOT Even close' is too harsh. DS2 is very close to the rebirth demo and HB2. it surpasses in some areas, and lags behind in others. But its very comparable.

 

[yamaci17]

I mean... I think the game looks breathtaking in gameplay.

ps5 shots:



And ps4 1080p shots. One I have is even in the same spot.

Friend, you're missing the point. i never imply game looks bad in gameplay. I say that the cutscene fidelity, the CGI-offline look to it, does not happen in actual game. IT IS ADMIRABLE that they achieve it while rendering in real time in cutscenes. never say it is not. but PEOPLE act like it is what they see all the time in the game and take that as a metric for how the game looks overall, THAT is the line where I stop.

And your screenshots prove that too. Also delet PS4 shots, foliage looks muddy and unrecognizable. Only way these games were possible on PS4 was TAA and TAA is just a muddy-crap filter at 1080p. It only ever looks good if you look at it from enough long distance or if 1080p taa output is all you've seen in your entire life. once you see 1440p and higher output with taa I can never see 1080p taa in good light. even without seeing last of us part 2's 1440p or 4k modes while playing on base ps4 I yawned whenever I saw muddy foliage at 1080p (it also looks semi decentish IF you stop and give taa time to reconstruct it becomes, again, FAKE FIDELITY;

Imgsli

this is why i hate whenever someone says "1.8 tflops! ps4!" it doesn't do anything for me. cutscenes are places where you give TAA time to reconstruct details perfectly and much more pixel samples, so even a PS4 looks "oh my, they did this on a PS4" feel. if not for TAA to make these games COHERENT while making them incredibly MUDDY, these games would run or look horrible. they only look okayish if you stand still and illusion breaks apart the second you move the camera. it is just what it is. there's no magic involved with 1.8 tflops of PS4.

I just want to see the day when it looks/holds the same detail level, crispiness and FEEL in actual gameplay when moving the camera.

assuming the picture where u carry the body is taken while standing still and it still looks muddy and horrible, I don't even want to imagine how it looks in actual movement. i launched death stranding directors cut at 1080p and I was shocked how horrible it looked and quickly ran away to 4K output and game looked like how it should look like. if game had realistic graphics like it did in cutscenes, it would practically look like a CGI movie captured in real time. but look at your screenshots. don't tell me they hold the same "offline CGI look" to them compared to the cutscenes in the game. cutscenes scream "MOVIE, LIFE LIKE", and other screenshots scream "GAME". and there's nothing really wrong with that. and don't hit me with the "why u want games to look like CGI! they're games, they must look gamey". so don't tell me that because then it would be pointless to admire how life like and CGI-like cutscenes look. so I hope we're on the same page there.

again and again, I never say DS looked bad or something. It was still one of the best of the lastgen. but cutscenes simply didn't match the overall feel of the graphics. it is just my opinion. god of war is more consistent where cutscene to gameplay transition is more transparent. as a result you don't get people swooning over god of war cutscenes. and no one remembers god of war having great graphics. I personally think gow 2018 ambient graphics can go to 1 on 1 with death stranding ambient graphics. but cutscene wise DS took the ball and ran away with it. and there's nothing wrong with that. last of us did the same too. and RDR2 didn't, as its cutscenes are organic and always happen while the entirety of an open world background is kept being rendered. so it is actually even more impressive. if RDR2 went the TLOU2 way, it would probably be something monstrous and this thread would be full of it.

DS cutscenes were above standard and extraordinary, DS regular gameplay graphics were just like other games really. and of course rdr 2 from 2018 easily clears it. but that's another topic

reason I'm liking alan wake 2 is THIS. the game transitions from cutscene to gameplay and illusion doesn't break. yet at the same time both is breath taking. I'm not particularly saying DS or DS2 breaks the illusion. DS has unique a structure where cutscenes happen in isolated places that you don't see in actual gameplay (mostly). this is why the illusion doesn't break apart much. the outside world and cutscene world is separated by an invisible wall. but in a trailer like this is it is jarring from seeing CGI-like Fragile to 1440p or something meh rock textures. like you can render Fragile like CGI but rocks looks like meh? it is just the limitation of hardware. let's not act like it is something else. it needs more memory. it can render rocks like CGI too. it just needs more memory. there simply isn't memory or maybe hardware grunt for that now. at least in the case of open worlds

 

[Masterofchapter]

Cutscenes are pre rendered gameplay not so much

Friend, you're missing the point. i never imply game looks bad in gameplay. I say that the cutscene fidelity, the CGI-offline look to it, does not happen in actual game. IT IS ADMIRABLE that they achieve it while rendering in real time in cutscenes. never say it is not. but PEOPLE act like it is what they see all the time in the game and take that as a metric for how the game looks overall, THAT is the line where I stop.

And your screenshots prove that too. Also delet PS4 shots, foliage looks muddy and unrecognizable. Only way these games were possible on PS4 was TAA and TAA is just a muddy-crap filter at 1080p. It only ever looks good if you look at it from enough long distance or if 1080p taa output is all you've seen in your entire life. once you see 1440p and higher output with taa I can never see 1080p taa in good light. even without seeing last of us part 2's 1440p or 4k modes while playing on base ps4 I yawned whenever I saw muddy foliage at 1080p (it also looks semi decentish IF you stop and give taa time to reconstruct it becomes, again, FAKE FIDELITY;

Imgsli

this is why i hate whenever someone says "1.8 tflops! ps4!" it doesn't do anything for me. cutscenes are places where you give TAA time to reconstruct details perfectly and much more pixel samples, so even a PS4 looks "oh my, they did this on a PS4" feel. if not for TAA to make these games COHERENT while making them incredibly MUDDY, these games would run or look horrible. they only look okayish if you stand still and illusion breaks apart the second you move the camera. it is just what it is. there's no magic involved with 1.8 tflops of PS4.

I just want to see the day when it looks/holds the same detail level, crispiness and FEEL in actual gameplay when moving the camera.

assuming the picture where u carry the body is taken while standing still and it still looks muddy and horrible, I don't even want to imagine how it looks in actual movement. i launched death stranding directors cut at 1080p and I was shocked how horrible it looked and quickly ran away to 4K output and game looked like how it should look like. if game had realistic graphics like it did in cutscenes, it would practically look like a CGI movie captured in real time. but look at your screenshots. don't tell me they hold the same "offline CGI look" to them compared to the cutscenes in the game. cutscenes scream "MOVIE, LIFE LIKE", and other screenshots scream "GAME". and there's nothing really wrong with that. and don't hit me with the "why u want games to look like CGI! they're games, they must look gamey". so don't tell me that because then it would be pointless to admire how life like and CGI-like cutscenes look. so I hope we're on the same page there.

again and again, I never say DS looked bad or something. It was still one of the best of the lastgen. but cutscenes simply didn't match the overall feel of the graphics. it is just my opinion. god of war is more consistent where cutscene to gameplay transition is more transparent. as a result you don't get people swooning over god of war cutscenes. and no one remembers god of war having great graphics. I personally think gow 2018 ambient graphics can go to 1 on 1 with death stranding ambient graphics. but cutscene wise DS took the ball and ran away with it. and there's nothing wrong with that. last of us did the same too. and RDR2 didn't, as its cutscenes are organic and always happen while the entirety of an open world background is kept being rendered. so it is actually even more impressive. if RDR2 went the TLOU2 way, it would probably be something monstrous and this thread would be full of it.

DS cutscenes were above standard and extraordinary, DS regular gameplay graphics were just like other games really. and of course rdr 2 from 2018 easily clears it. but that's another topic

 

[SlimySnake]

I really hate YouTube compression, completely wipes out any fine detail in the sand/ground in the shots below and the motion in some other shots are complete sludge on a big display...

Would it really be so much to ask for a high quality download to be made available or for them to hand a trailer off to sites like gamersyde?

The KojiPro upload is 6mbps and the PlayStation upload is 9mbps; ...for 4K!? They don't even pad the 30fps up to 60fps so the encoder affords it more bits. Even better -- in addition to that -- would be a HDR/10-Bit/BT.2020 upload. It's not like these are tiny companies lacking the resources to do this.




They should at least make available an SDR 4K/60 HEVC 10-Bit/BT.2020 encode @ ~40Mbps (even if it's just a download link hidden away at the end of the blog post or in some dark corner of their site).

I recall around the early PS4 days there was a trailer repository on one of Sony's sites where you could source higher quality encodes. Does anyone know if this is still going?

Whats funny is that Sony's video streaming service for Bravia has 100 mbps streaming for their 4k movies. No one else even goes over 30 Mbps which is basically Bluray quality. I think Apple might be doing around 40 but i dont use apple tv to say for sure.

That said, the detail in the UE5 demos on youtube came across just fine despite the bitrate. DS2 is clearly not at that level, but its way better than anything we've seen from actual UE5 games.

 

[arkhamguy123]

Friend, you're missing the point. i never imply game looks bad in gameplay. I say that the cutscene fidelity, the CGI-offline look to it, does not happen in actual game. IT IS ADMIRABLE that they achieve it while rendering in real time in cutscenes. never say it is not. but PEOPLE act like it is what they see all the time in the game and take that as a metric for how the game looks overall, THAT is the line where I stop.

And your screenshots prove that too. Also delet PS4 shots, foliage looks muddy and unrecognizable. Only way these games were possible on PS4 was TAA and TAA is just a muddy-crap filter at 1080p. It only ever looks good if you look at it from enough long distance or if 1080p taa output is all you've seen in your entire life. once you see 1440p and higher output with taa I can never see 1080p taa in good light. even without seeing last of us part 2's 1440p or 4k modes while playing on base ps4 I yawned whenever I saw muddy foliage at 1080p (it also looks semi decentish IF you stop and give taa time to reconstruct it becomes, again, FAKE FIDELITY;

Imgsli

this is why i hate whenever someone says "1.8 tflops! ps4!" it doesn't do anything for me. cutscenes are places where you give TAA time to reconstruct details perfectly and much more pixel samples, so even a PS4 looks "oh my, they did this on a PS4" feel. if not for TAA to make these games COHERENT while making them incredibly MUDDY, these games would run or look horrible. they only look okayish if you stand still and illusion breaks apart the second you move the camera. it is just what it is. there's no magic involved with 1.8 tflops of PS4.

I just want to see the day when it looks/holds the same detail level, crispiness and FEEL in actual gameplay when moving the camera.

assuming the picture where u carry the body is taken while standing still and it still looks muddy and horrible, I don't even want to imagine how it looks in actual movement. i launched death stranding directors cut at 1080p and I was shocked how horrible it looked and quickly ran away to 4K output and game looked like how it should look like. if game had realistic graphics like it did in cutscenes, it would practically look like a CGI movie captured in real time. but look at your screenshots. don't tell me they hold the same "offline CGI look" to them compared to the cutscenes in the game. cutscenes scream "MOVIE, LIFE LIKE", and other screenshots scream "GAME". and there's nothing really wrong with that. and don't hit me with the "why u want games to look like CGI! they're games, they must look gamey". so don't tell me that because then it would be pointless to admire how life like and CGI-like cutscenes look. so I hope we're on the same page there.

again and again, I never say DS looked bad or something. It was still one of the best of the lastgen. but cutscenes simply didn't match the overall feel of the graphics. it is just my opinion. god of war is more consistent where cutscene to gameplay transition is more transparent. as a result you don't get people swooning over god of war cutscenes. and no one remembers god of war having great graphics. I personally think gow 2018 ambient graphics can go to 1 on 1 with death stranding ambient graphics. but cutscene wise DS took the ball and ran away with it. and there's nothing wrong with that. last of us did the same too. and RDR2 didn't, as its cutscenes are organic and always happen while the entirety of an open world background is kept being rendered. so it is actually even more impressive. if RDR2 went the TLOU2 way, it would probably be something monstrous and this thread would be full of it.

DS cutscenes were above standard and extraordinary, DS regular gameplay graphics were just like other games really. and of course rdr 2 from 2018 easily clears it. but that's another topic

reason I'm liking alan wake 2 is THIS. the game transitions from cutscene to gameplay and illusion doesn't break. yet at the same time both is breath taking. I'm not particularly saying DS or DS2 breaks the illusion. DS2 has unique structure where cutscenes happen in isolated places that you don't see in actual gameplay. this is why the illusion doesn't break apart much. the outside world and cutscene world is seperated by a wall. but in a trailer like this is it is jarring from seeing CGI-like Fragile to 1440p or something meh rock textures. like you can render Fragile like CGI but rocks looks like meh? it is just the limitation of hardware. let's not act like it is something else. it needs more memory. it can render rocks like CGI too. it just needs more memory. there simply isn't memory or maybe hardware grunt for that now. at least in the case of open worlds

This whole cutscene can gameplay controversy is really not at all a big enigma. People are impressed by visuals running real time on the hardware. Both gameplay AND cutscene.

So when people say “wow they did X on 1.8tflops” they’re right. They got whatever visuals they’re praising running real time on said hardware. It’s pretty simple to me

 

[setoman]

Well let's wait and see but I am pretty sure that ds2 , gta 6 and star wars outlow will have no competition in terms of graphics by the time of their releases whatever its ue5 games or not

Please never put DS2 in the same category as GTA6 ever again. Its not even in the same dimension. It should be a crime to say things like that.

when you compare something try to compare same thing , actually death stranding gameplay character models are very close to its cutscene models as you can see in the video above.

What.. the gameplay character looks nothing like the cutscene? They look like completely different characters. This is the usual gap between gameplay characters and cutscene. You are calling the usual gap "close"? are you being serious? If you want close look at AW2, if you want identical look at HB2.
Heck the character in AW2 in gameplay looks better than the character in DS2 in gameplay, from the hair, face, clothes, all the way down to the shoes.

Are you guys circlejerking about cutscenes again? Because besides those DS2 may look very good, but I don't see "groundbreaking" anywhere, especially with how little is going on in the scenery.

Yeah I'm shocked by the responses.
The environment and lighting clearly look worse than Avatar.

 

[Negotiator101]

Please never put DS2 in the same category as GTA6 ever again. Its not even in the same dimension. It should be a crime to say things like that.

What.. the gameplay character looks nothing like the cutscene? They look like completely different characters. This is the usual gap between gameplay characters and cutscene. You are calling the usual gap "close"? are you being serious? If you want close look at AW2, if you want identical look at HB2.
Heck the character in AW2 in gameplay looks better than the character in DS2 in gameplay, from the hair all the way down to the shoes.


Yeah I'm shocked by the responses.
The environment and lighting clearly look worse than Avatar.

It doesn't help when the trailer is 90% cutscenes and that's as we know Kojima's thing. It looked superb no question but not a new visual benchmark like some are peddling.

 

[SlimySnake]

This whole cutscene can gameplay controversy is really not at all a big enigma. People are impressed by visuals running real time on the hardware. Both gameplay AND cutscene.

So when people say “wow they did X on 1.8tflops” they’re right. They got whatever visuals they’re praising running real time on said hardware. It’s pretty simple to me

Whats funny is that GTA6 is ALL cutscenes, and likely not even realtime or running on a PS5 like DS2. Its fine to compare but lets compare cutscene to cutscene, gameplay to gameplay.

 

[sankt-Antonio]

Hellblade II is a blurry mess most of the time, DSII looks miles better as a package.