• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Halo |OT3| Remember Reach?

Overdoziz

Banned
I did.

Unfortunately after I realized vhfive is probably an MLG Pro in Trials I gave up trying to beat him. Gotta say though, the hard mode tracks are a pain in the ass. No longer much fun either. Became less about huge jumps and more about small but difficult obstacles.
I had that too at first in HD but once you master harder tracks they're so much more fun than the beginner, easy and medium ones.
 

kylej

Banned
You know what would make GAF better? If usernames hovered directly in the middle of my screen. That way I would know which post belongs to which poster without looking over the left side of my screen. Would save me a lot of time and be way more intuitive.
 
You know what would make GAF better? If usernames hovered directly in the middle of my screen. That way I would know which post belongs to which poster without looking over the left side of my screen. Would save me a lot of time and be way more intuitive.

You mean signatures bro?
 
God I hate ignorant complaints. Complaining about the code that comprises the synchronous networking in Halo 3/ODST/Reach is like complaining about how your car sucks when you run out of gas. Its performance is a direct result of the latency between clients.

Complaining about the use of a synchronous network model is more appropriate, but you also don't have the slightest fucking idea on how feasible it is to implement an alternative model.

It's clear that Bungie understands that input lag is the worst fucking thing you can to players in an action game, and yet they did these modes anyway. Try to fucking extrapolate here...
 

Tashi

343i Lead Esports Producer
You know what would make GAF better? If usernames hovered directly in the middle of my screen. That way I would know which post belongs to which poster without looking over the left side of my screen. Would save me a lot of time and be way more intuitive.
4/10
 

Karl2177

Member

OHMAYGAWD, TASHI CEILING MEANS YOU CAN'T VOTE A FOUR. JUST A THREE.

God I hate ignorant complaints. Complaining about the code that comprises the synchronous networking in Halo 3/ODST/Reach is like complaining about how your car sucks when you run out of gas. Its performance is a direct result of the latency between clients.

Complaining about the use of a synchronous network model is more appropriate, but you also don't have the slightest fucking idea on how feasible it is to implement an alternative model.

It's clear that Bungie understands that input lag is the worst fucking thing you can to players in an action game, and yet they did these modes anyway. Try to fucking extrapolate here...

I think more of the complaints are directed at the "Prefer Good Connection" buttons, because of what you said. There's no real way to improve the connection aside from upgrading everyone to FiOS.
 

zap

Member
God I hate ignorant complaints. Complaining about the code that comprises the synchronous networking in Halo 3/ODST/Reach is like complaining about how your car sucks when you run out of gas. Its performance is a direct result of the latency between clients.

Complaining about the use of a synchronous network model is more appropriate, but you also don't have the slightest fucking idea on how feasible it is to implement an alternative model.

It's clear that Bungie understands that input lag is the worst fucking thing you can to players in an action game, and yet they did these modes anyway. Try to fucking extrapolate here...

Serious question, but when Bungie optimised the networking code to be 40% more efficient (and made Reach multiplayer amazing compared to Halo 3), did that apply to the Campaign and Firefight modes?

I swear if there are any differences I feel like Halo 3 and ODST were the least frustrating with regard to co-op play :/
 

Tawpgun

Member
God I hate ignorant complaints. Complaining about the code that comprises the synchronous networking in Halo 3/ODST/Reach is like complaining about how your car sucks when you run out of gas. Its performance is a direct result of the latency between clients.

Complaining about the use of a synchronous network model is more appropriate, but you also don't have the slightest fucking idea on how feasible it is to implement an alternative model.

It's clear that Bungie understands that input lag is the worst fucking thing you can to players in an action game, and yet they did these modes anyway. Try to fucking extrapolate here...

Are Halo's systems/engines/AI/physics that complex that we can't go asynchronous?

Halo is literally the only game I have played where co-op has input lag.
 

Karl2177

Member
Are Halo's systems/engines/AI/physics that complex that we can't go asynchronous?

Halo is literally the only game I have played where co-op has input lag.

AI primarily. If I remember correctly, the AI is too dynamic to have it be recreated on each box the same exact way and reported back to the host for what it is doing. Couple that with the amount of AI on the screen at any given time and asynchronous would just dumb down the experience.


Serious question, but when Bungie optimised the networking code to be 40% more efficient (and made Reach multiplayer amazing compared to Halo 3), did that apply to the Campaign and Firefight modes?

I swear if there are any differences I feel like Halo 3 and ODST were the least frustrating with regard to co-op play :/
In my experiences, it is because Halo 3 and ODST tried their best not to drop you. But with Reach, they incorporated Matchmaking into it. As a player just wanting to hop into a Firefight match online, I want to drop who ever is lagging me behind. Since ODST and 3 were limited to custom experiences, it was intended that you were going to try and stick together.
 
I'm sure Fyrewulf has a way-too-fucking-long technical post explaining in exact detail why Halo Reach's co-op netcode is as shitty and full of button lag as it is. That way HiredNoobs can feel fulfilled about our complaints. Everybody wins!
 

Ramirez

Member
God I hate ignorant complaints. Complaining about the code that comprises the synchronous networking in Halo 3/ODST/Reach is like complaining about how your car sucks when you run out of gas. Its performance is a direct result of the latency between clients.

Complaining about the use of a synchronous network model is more appropriate, but you also don't have the slightest fucking idea on how feasible it is to implement an alternative model.

It's clear that Bungie understands that input lag is the worst fucking thing you can to players in an action game, and yet they did these modes anyway. Try to fucking extrapolate here...

Nice, I was waiting on my monthly Noobs meltdown.
 

Overdoziz

Banned
God I hate ignorant complaints. Complaining about the code that comprises the synchronous networking in Halo 3/ODST/Reach is like complaining about how your car sucks when you run out of gas. Its performance is a direct result of the latency between clients.

Complaining about the use of a synchronous network model is more appropriate, but you also don't have the slightest fucking idea on how feasible it is to implement an alternative model.

It's clear that Bungie understands that input lag is the worst fucking thing you can to players in an action game, and yet they did these modes anyway. Try to fucking extrapolate here...
Did they break the Commendations again or something? Jesus Christ Almighty, you're salty.


You can play Spartan Ops solo via Mr. Ellis over in the Halo 4 "November 6, 2012" thread.
Excellent.
 

Tashi

343i Lead Esports Producer
Good matchmaking really makes a huge difference. I think we lost some of that with Reach. I mean, the insane win streaks and percentages I see are results.
 

zap

Member
Good matchmaking really makes a huge difference. I think we lost some of that with Reach. I mean, the insane win streaks and percentages I see are results.

Combine the way Trueskill is implemented in with people not caring about winning as much (no number to increase) and add in the fact that we can't see what another person's rank is to see whether the match should be close or not...

Reach.
 

Tashi

343i Lead Esports Producer
Combine the way Trueskill is implemented in with people not caring about winning as much (no number to increase) and add in the fact that we can't see what another person's rank is to see whether the match should be close or not...

Reach.
It's more than that. It's loose. I can match against anyone. Just the biggest scrubs. Needs to be made tighter in H4.
 

Fracas

#fuckonami
Signatures normally go below the post. I want it up a little bit, just a pinch above where my eyes are focused for maximum ease of use.

Hmm. I like this idea. Intuitive and helpful. You always know who said what. MONSTERFRACAS
AwOlr.png

I'm somewhat ok with the words in the middle, but just have them appear for a second, not the lengths we've seen.
 

Computron

Member
From that new footage it looks like they are doing something similar to UE3 for shadows.
It still looks like they baking static shadow maps (Some parts are still low res and they are getting GI),
but now they might have shadow masks (Players inside of shadows aren't double shadowing).

So hopefully that means forge pieces will cast shadows.
 

Tawpgun

Member
AI primarily. If I remember correctly, the AI is too dynamic to have it be recreated on each box the same exact way and reported back to the host for what it is doing. Couple that with the amount of AI on the screen at any given time and asynchronous would just dumb down the experience.

k.

Serious proposition.

I would be all for dumbing down the AI in online co-op scenarios. Or even better, having it as an option.
 
I would be all for dumbing down the AI in online co-op scenarios. Or even better, having it as an option.
The AI is the best part though.

But, a part of me thinks that one of the reasons 343 is taking a more objective approach to Spartan Ops so that they can tune the AI encounters to minimize some of the networking problems in Firefight. They can see what conditions exacerbate connection issues and try to avoid them by careful scripting. Dunno, but it does present an opportunity.

And yeah, I have to chime in and hope the name of the mode changes before release. Its a story based mode after all - give it something with more Halo character.
 
K

kittens

Unconfirmed Member
Just watched part of this. As soon as they started talking about being innovative i turned it off. Everyone has to be innovative these days... Just make a good game, dangit.

Yeah, innovation is an overused buzzword, and unnecessary in some cases, but give the video a shot. It definitely raised hype levels around here.
 
Top Bottom