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[DY_nasty]

I mean just go the neighbors house.

Why?

 

[Zoe]

So do you believe the 20 year sentence was fair then?

No, I never said that. I just don't believe doing what she did should be automatically excused.

 

[commedieu]

No, I never said that. I just don't believe doing what she did should be automatically excused.

Who said it should be automatically excused?

This is a sad turn of events. 20 years for causing no harm, only potential, is a misstep in justice. In a state where you just have to say you feared for your life, to MURDER someone, the same should be applied here. Unfortunately, she didn't have a jury of her peers. She would have literally, and legally, been better of shooting him in the face.

 

[The Faceless Master]

So kill the guy?

There's a difference between a warning shot and aiming for the knee.

she doesn't have to kill him, she just has to shoot him and stop the threat.

 

[Xenon]

It's not like the prosecutor made up the law. And it's also not as though the prosecutor was the one who found her guilty (that was the jury's job.) I don't see why the prosecutor is getting attacked. If there was no case there a judge would have put the kibosh on it before it even went to trial.

If the prosecutor was willing to plea down, why not go for that in the first place? He/she has discretion on what charge is brought on the person, not the judge. Now I don't have all the facts but it does not seem that she meant to hurt anyone, as reckless as she was. Still they went ahead with charges that would carry the mandatory 20 year sentence. While they have a legal grounds for doing so it is still excessive for what the lady did.


edit: The problem here is mandatory sentencing, not race. For all those saying she should have shot him and everything would be fine seem to be overlooking the fact that she went back after getting a gun. Had she shot him she would have and should have been charged with murder.

 

[DY_nasty]

she doesn't have to kill him, she just has to shoot him and stop the threat.

I didn't get that in my mandatory self-defense classes in high school. Is that a part if the new curriculum or was self-defense 101 tossed in the budget cuts?

 

[KHarvey16]

Warning shots are slightly worse than shooting to wound. With the latter at least you're aiming at something that has a reasonable chance of dissipating some amount of the bullets energy. A warning shot goes off into who knows where.

Any discharge of a firearm is dangerous and needs to be justified. Warning or wounding certainly does not qualify.

And all that said, 20 years is silly, which sentencing minimums usually are.

 

[commedieu]

"Alexander tried to invoke Florida's controversial stand your ground law in her defense, but that was rejected."

Hahahah oh fuck you Florida.

This kinda shit goes down in FL, and is ok..

On Jan. 25, Roteta had apparently been trying to steal the radio from a truck owned by Greyston Garcia, parked outside his apartment in southwest Miami. Truck burglary’s a crime of course, but not a capital case. Not before 2005.

Garcia grabbed a large knife and chased the 26-year-old Roteta down the block. He caught up with Roteta, who was unarmed except for an unopened pocketknife in his pocket, and stabbed him to death. The confrontation was captured on a surveillance video.
Miami police were not nearly as cautious as the cops in Sanford. Garcia was arrested and charged with second-degree murder. But under the peculiarities of the stand-your-ground statute, the case never went to trial. Judge Bloom decided Wednesday that Garcia was immune from prosecution.

 

[samus i am]

She should have just gotten hit with discharging her firearm and that's it.

 

[Kettch]

What's the standard sentence for a first time DUI? I would expect that to be more likely to harm someone and there's rarely any possible justification for it, so seems a good ceiling for what the punishment should be here. Replace any driver's license restrictions with gun license restrictions.

 

[commedieu]

What's the standard sentence for a first time DUI? I would expect that to be more likely to harm someone and there's rarely any possible justification for it, so seems a good ceiling for what the punishment should be here. Replace any driver's license restrictions with gun license restrictions.

depends, in CA.. its a slap on the wrist and 6months-1yr in prison. I agree. But its a stupid law in florida. 10to20. Not sure why they couldn't go for the 10. But apparently in Florida, discharging a weapon is a mandatory 20 years in prison.

Shooting someone in the face is no jail time though.

 

[Frankenstrat]

Florida.
Why is it always florida?

I'm surprised the obligatory .gif hasn't been posted yet.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Sounds like our beef should be with the mandatory sentence in the Florida books, rather than the specific conviction.

Honestly, it sounds like Aggrivated Assault is the appropriate sentence. I have to agree that she shouldn't have gone back in the house with her gun when she realized she didn't have her car keys. She should have walked to a neighbor's house or something. Anything. Anything but walking back in and shooting a gun. She fucked up her self-defense claim by going back in in the same way Zimmerman fucked up his self-defense claim by pursuing Trayvon Martin.

That said, a mandatory 20 fucking years is ridiculous. Perposterous.

Discharging firearms is serious shit and should be penalized as such. Maybe 2 or 3 years with early parole (I think that's what Plaxico Burress the NFL player got, though his was accidental). 20 years is embarrassing.

 

[DY_nasty]

Warning shots are slightly worse than shooting to wound. With the latter at least you're aiming at something that has a reasonable chance of dissipating some amount of the bullets energy. A warning shot goes off into who knows where.

Any discharge of a firearm is dangerous and needs to be justified. Warning or wounding certainly does not qualify.

And all that said, 20 years is silly, which sentencing minimums usually are.

self-defense isn't justified?

She didn't handle things like a trained professional or even a concealed carry holder. She handled things the best way she knew how - anything thrown at her is simply out of fuckyouism and ignores context completely.

 

[Kinyou]

"Alexander tried to invoke Florida's controversial stand your ground law in her defense, but that was rejected."

Hahahah oh fuck you Florida.

This kinda shit goes down in FL, and is ok..

Now that's a guy who's a threat to society. Not the woman who fired a warning shot.

 

[kehs]

So I was looking through the site that's asking for her support, this is her account of the events:

April 3, 2012

Dear Supporters:

On August 1 2010, my premature baby girl, born nine days earlier, was in the Baptist South N.I.C.U. fighting for her life and I would too be fighting for my life in my own home against an attack from my husband.

My name is Marissa Alexander, I am a mother of three children, but at the present time, I am not able to be with them due to the following circumstances. I am currently sitting in the Pretrial Detention Facility in Jacksonville FL, Duval County awaiting a sentence for three counts of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon with no intent to harm. Before my life changed drastically on that August afternoon, I was in the perilous position of leaving an abusive relationship with my husband who has history of violence and documented domestic abuse towards women. Our history included one which required me to place an injunction for protection against violence and was active during the month of August 2010.

In an unprovoked jealous rage, my husband violently confronted me while using the restroom. He assaulted me, shoving, strangling and holding me against my will, preventing me from fleeing all while I begged for him to leave. After a minute or two of trying to escape, I was able to make it to the garage where my truck was parked, but in my haste to leave I realized my keys were missing. I tried to open the garage but there was a mechanical failure. I was unable to leave, trapped in the dark with no way out. For protection against further assault I retrieved my weapon; which is registered and I have a concealed weapon permit. Trapped, no phone, I entered back into my home to either leave through another exit or obtain my cell phone.

He and my two stepsons were supposed to be exiting the house thru the front door, but he didn’t leave. Instead he came into the kitchen that leads to the garage and realized I was unable to leave. Instead of leaving thru the front door where his vehicle was parked outside of the garage, he came into the kitchen by himself. I was terrified from the first encounter and feared he came to do as he had threatened. The weapon was in my right hand down by my side and he yelled, “Bitch I will kill you!”, and charged toward me. In fear and desperate attempt, I lifted my weapon up, turned away and discharged a single shot in the wall up in the ceiling. As I stood my ground it prevented him from doing what he threatened and he ran out of the home. Outside of the home, he contacted the police and falsely reported that I shot at him and his sons. The police arrived and I was taken into custody.

I was devastated and would continue to be for months following the incident. I had to appear in court all the way up until trial as I plead not guilty and know that I acted in self-defense. I believe my actions saved my life or prevented further harm, but preserved that of my husband who was completely irrational, extremely violent, and unpredictable that day.

Florida has a self-defense law and it includes the right to stand your ground. Below are the facts of my concern with the incorrect way the law was applied and ultimately the injustice in my case.

· The alleged victim, my husband, under sworn statement in November 2010, admitted he was the aggressor, threatened my life and was so enraged he didn’t know what he would do.
· The alleged victim, my husband, was arrested for domestic violence two times, once for abuse against me. The attack against me was so violent; I ended up in the hospital.
· Prior to my arrest, I told the office I was in fear for my life due to the prior violence against me. I also told the officer there was a domestic injunction in place to protect me against abuse from the alleged victim. This information was written in detail by the officer in my arrest report, but ignored for some unknown reason.
· In July of 2011, a hearing was held, where I along with the alleged victims testified as it relates to the stand your ground law and its immunity from prosecution.
· After the hearing, Judge Elizabeth Senterfitt denied my motion, citing that I could have exited the house thru the master bedroom window, front door, and/or sliding glass back door. The law specifically states: No duty to retreat.
· My attorney entered a standing objection on the record to the ruling and we proceeded to trial.
· During that time, Angela Corey, our State Attorney met with the alleged victims. I also along with my attorney met with Angela Corey, John Guy, and then prosecutor Christen Luikart. I justified my actions to them and the truth as I have told it has remained the same.
· Knowing our prior domestic abuse history, Angela Corey was hard pressed for the minimum mandatory, which provisions allow for prosecution to wave those stipulations. I was not guilty, nor did I believe that was fair and just under the circumstances. She also allowed for those same provisions in the State vs. Vonda Parker, same charges different circumstances which did not include self-defense.
· Florida uses a law commonly known as 10-20-life as a sentencing guideline when a felony takes place with the use of a weapon. Under this statute, my felony charge of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon without intent to harm carries a twenty year mandatory sentence.
· Stand your ground law has been applied in multiple recent incidents, the following is just a couple of incidents. Carl Kroppman Jr was allowed to use this law to avoid being arrested/charged during a road rage incident on the Buckman Bridge in Jacksonville, FL in August of 2011. Marqualle Woolbright of Ocala, FL avoided murder charges due to the stand your ground law when he shoot and killed someone.
I am a law abiding citizen and I take great pride in my liberty, rights, and privileges as one. I have vehemently proclaimed my innocence and my actions that day. The enigma I face since that fateful day I was charged through trial, does the law cover and apply to me too?

A step further and more importantly is in light of recent news, is justice for all include everyone, regardless of gender, race or aristocratic dichotomies. I simply want my story heard, reviewed and the egregious way in which my case was handled from start to finish serve as an eye opener for all and especially those responsible for upholding judicial affairs.

The threat that day was very real, imminent, and the battery on me occurred minutes before the decision I made to protect myself. That decision was a last resort, necessary and a reaction to the continued threat on my life. I am a believer that grace allowed for my response to be carried out in a non-lethal manner. This prevented the imminent threat and harm a non-fatal tactic, but not against an unknown attacker, rather my very own husband. That was by far the most difficult position to be in nine days after giving birth to a six week premature infant. My heart goes out for my two stepsons and always has had a hurt and sincere empathy for them being subjected innocently to that trauma.

The law states that I was justified in standing my ground and meeting force with force up to including deadly force, but political views and concerns states otherwise in the 4th circuit court.

So my last questions and valid concerns are what was I supposed to do that day and the stand your ground law who is it for?

http://justiceformarissa.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2012-04-24T11:27:00-07:00&max-results=7

 

[KHarvey16]

self-defense isn't justified?

She didn't handle things like a trained professional or even a concealed carry holder. She handled things the best way she knew how - anything thrown at her is simply out of fuckyouism and ignores context completely.

No, warning shots or shooting to wound in an act of self defense is not justified. Those who own guns or keep them close by should be held to a high standard regarding when and how they are used. Would the penalty for an errant shot striking someone be any less severe if it were fired as a warning shot?

 

[DY_nasty]

No, warning shots or shooting to wound in an act of self defense is not justified. Those who own guns or keep them close by should be held to a high standard regarding when and how they are used. Would the penalty for an errant shot striking someone be any less severe if it were fired as a warning shot?

Its self-defense from the untrained

Why treat her like she's blackwater firing warning shots across an intersection?

 

[KHarvey16]

Its self-defense from the untrained

Why treat her like she's blackwater firing warning shots across an intersection?

Because her bullets aren't less deadly.

 

[commedieu]

Gray had been twice arrested for domestic battery in previous relationships in 2006 and 2009. In the former case the charges were dropped, in the later he received probation. Alexander had an order of protection filed against Gray.

Marissa is not portraying herself as she is, I was begging for my life while my kids were holding on to my side, the gun was pointed at me.

I got my kids out of the house through the front door. We ran down the street. My son called the police on his cell phone and I called the police on my phone.

Marissa didn’t come out of the house until 30 minutes later after SWAT had to be called out. SWAT had to get in touch with one of Marissa’s family members and SWAT had to tell Marissa if she didn’t come out in five minutes they were coming in there to get her. It wasn’t like she came out when the police got there.

She’s just using the stand-your-ground because of the Trayvon incident. I feel sorry for her but at the same time I thought I was going to die that day in front of my kids.

- Gray's side of the story.

 

[Deified Data]

Guns kill people, even when they don't. Everyone who owns a gun should be sentenced to marry their gun and then shoot it to death with another gun.

 

[dojokun]

Why?

To put walls behind you and your attacker and so you can call the police uninterrupted.

 

[DY_nasty]

Because her bullets aren't less deadly.

Its still self-defense from someone not acting rational.

Go ahead and press charges against the mother who cut and ran to leave her kid alone with a burglar for child endangering too while we're at it.

 

[Kinyou]

Gray had been twice arrested for domestic battery in previous relationships in 2006 and 2009. In the former case the charges were dropped, in the later he received probation. Alexander had an order of protection filed against Gray.

- Gray's side of the story.

It's hard to believe someone who was already convicted of domestic battery suddenly turned all soft. I think that the 911 calls and statements of the kids would lighten things up a little

 

[Jenga]

if she was white the sentence would have been 20 days and she'd still get a slot on nancy grace talking how ridiculous a 20 day punishment is for self-defense

 

[KHarvey16]

Its still self-defense from someone not acting rational.

How exactly does that make the act any safer?

Go ahead and press charges against the mother who cut and ran to leave her kid alone with a burglar for child endangering too while we're at it.

Huh?

 

[DY_nasty]

To put walls behind you and your attacker and so you can call the police uninterrupted.

Not every person runs to the neighbors for help. Especially not in situations like these.

Also, going next door with a gun after a spouse just threatened to kill - plenty of people aren't opening that door.

How exactly does that make the act any safer?



Huh?

You're excusing human element again huh? Ignore.

 

[dojokun]

Not every person runs to the neighbors for help. Especially not in situations like these.

Also, going next door with a gun after a spouse just threatened to kill - plenty of people aren't opening that door.

You're excusing human element again huh? Ignore.

According to the article, she didnt grab the gun until after realizing she didnt have keys. And simply saying "Well I dont go to my neighbors for this type of thing" isnt an excuse to escalate things with a gun. There's no reason not to go the neighbors instead of grabbing abgun and going back into the house.

 

[Binabik15]

It shouldn`t be self-defense because she willingly and knowingly put herself into a situation that posed a threat to her and even armed herself to face that possible threat instead of trying to get away from said threat.

If he had come for her, self-defense. Coming to him and put yourself in danger? Stupid. Coming to him, creating a situation where harm might be inflicted upon her and responding to that threat by shooting inside a house with kids nearby? Negligent at best, but probably criminal depending on where you live.

Now mandatory minimum sentences are stupid and 20 years are to much for what she did, but she is, IMO, not an innocent person. Depending on her state of mind she might not be responsible for her actions due to stress and fear, though, but what she did is not the reasonable choice.

 

[KHarvey16]

You're excusing human element again huh? Ignore.

I'll take that to mean you agree it doesn't make it any safer.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

WTF...

Why is Florida's penal code so out of sync with common sense?

 

[GungHo]

She didn't handle things like a trained professional or even a concealed carry holder. She handled things the best way she knew how - anything thrown at her is simply out of fuckyouism and ignores context completely.

If you don't know how or when you should use a gun, you really shouldn't pick one up. I'm not talking about knowing Jack Bauer shit. But, knowing that you don't shoot into the walls of your own damn house because you don't know where your kids are?

Why treat her like she's blackwater firing warning shots across an intersection?

Because the consequences could be the same? Drywall doesn't stop bullets. Barely even deflects them. And, no one is saying that the penalty is reasonable.

 

[The Faceless Master]

I didn't get that in my mandatory self-defense classes in high school. Is that a part if the new curriculum or was self-defense 101 tossed in the budget cuts?

you're shooting the attacker to defend yourself (or others). killing the attacker is just a possible (but not guaranteed) outcome.

 

[commedieu]

She had a concealed & carry permit. And it was a registered weapon.

Stand Your Ground has several instances of chasing and murdering people, and still getting off with it. As cited in posts above. According to her boyfriend, he had the children by his side. So, her warning shot possibly killing them as they slept isn't an issue.

Biggest mistake was going to a jury of her peers. Can't do that in Florida if you're a gun owner I guess...

 

[Onemic]

I'll take that to mean you agree it doesn't make it any safer.

He means you're hopelessly misguided as you always put things in black amd white situations without taking any type of human element of a situation into account. Literally like if a machine handed out verdicts. What would you have done now that we have the womans side of the story?

 

[DY_nasty]

I'll take that to mean you agree it doesn't make it any safer.

You want to ignore the fact that someone who is scared and just had their life threatened isnt thinking rationally then cool.

 

[KHarvey16]

He means you're hopelessly misguided as you always put things in black amd white situations without taking any type of human element of a situation into account. Literally like if a machine handed out verdicts. What would you have done now that we have the womans side of the story?

Firing a bullet into nothing is incredibly dangerous and it should be illegal because it is dangerous, not because the person should know better. It doesn't become less dangerous because she felt the need to do it. The argument doesn't make any sense to me at all. I mean, we all understand this right? She put people in danger. That bullet is going to keep traveling and she has no ability to prevent it hitting something she can't see. There is never sufficient justification for taking this risk, there is literally no need for it. It's an improper use of a firearm and some are essentially arguing ignorance is an acceptable excuse. Nonsense.

20 years is not appropriate. Mandatory sentencing is dumb in nearly every instance. That does not mean she acted properly or even legally.

 

[Chumly]

I love that people will defend Zimmerman to death and now come in this thread and condem this women for not shooting to kill.

 

[kehs]

You want to ignore the fact that someone who is scared and just had their life threatened isnt thinking rationally then cool.

Here's the thing about here state of mind, and this is all by her own words, she was acting rather rational. She tried to escape, realized she had no keys/phone/etc and was trapped in the garage. She was hoping the aggressor had left the house by then, so she returned to the house. Because she didn't want to harm the guy she opted to take a warning shot instead.

All of that speaks to me as someone who wasn't completely irrational from the incident, considering the amount of time that all took place.

 

[Sanjay]

She would have got less for killing him.

if she was white the sentence would have been 20 days and she'd still get a slot on nancy grace talking how ridiculous a 20 day punishment is for self-defense

Yep, what was she thinking? the self-defense thing only works for white folk.

According to the article, she didnt grab the gun until after realizing she didnt have keys. And simply saying "Well I dont go to my neighbors for this type of thing" isnt an excuse to escalate things with a gun. There's no reason not to go the neighbors instead of grabbing abgun and going back into the house.

So what your saying is she got 20 years for being stupid for having lack of experience in life or death situations.

 

[Kettch]

According to the article, she didnt grab the gun until after realizing she didnt have keys. And simply saying "Well I dont go to my neighbors for this type of thing" isnt an excuse to escalate things with a gun. There's no reason not to go the neighbors instead of grabbing abgun and going back into the house.

Apparently she never left the house, unless you don't consider the garage a part of it. Garage door failing to open sounds fishy, but I assume that must've come up in the trial.

 

[Onemic]

Firing a bullet into nothing is incredibly dangerous and it should be illegal because it is dangerous, not because the person should know better. It doesn't become less dangerous because she felt the need to do it. The argument doesn't make any sense to me at all. I mean, we all understand this right? She put people in danger. That bullet is going to keep traveling and she has no ability to prevent it hitting something she can't see. There is never sufficient justification for taking this risk, there is literally no need for it. It's an improper use of a firearm and some are essentially arguing ignorance is an acceptable excuse. Nonsense.

20 years is not appropriate. Mandatory sentencing is dumb in nearly every instance. That does not mean she acted properly or even legally.

I don't disagree , but my problem is that you and many others seem rather fixated on her irrational use of a firearm that hurt no one instead of the fact that her life is now over due to this 20 year sentencing.

 

[soundahfekz]

Every black Injustice thread it's the same characters playing the same tired ass role.

Yet if it's consoles we were talking about and the same patterns existed people would be on vacation by now.

I love being on gaf but I don't understand this shit

 

[Reuenthal]

Utterly disgusting.

 

[Alligatorjandro]

The problem is the 10-20-life law.

 

[KHarvey16]

I don't disagree , but my problem is that you and many others seem rather fixated on her irrational use of a firearm that hurt no one instead of the fact that her life is now over due to this 20 year sentencing.

Fixated? That was the issue being discussed. Everyone agrees mandatory sentencing applied in cases like this is stupid. There's little to discuss.

 

[commedieu]

Every black Injustice thread it's the same characters playing the same tired ass role.

Yet if it's consoles we were talking about and the same patterns existed people would be on vacation by now.

I love being on gaf but I don't understand this shit

Hahah. Yeah, same shit different thread. The only 1 thing that stays the same, no matter how ridiculous the events before us, is that they are black. When Stand your ground applies to a man chasing another one down, and stabbing him to death. It should apply here, especially for a concealed carry permit & licensed gun owner who didn't murder anyone. But fuck my mind, even that doesn't make a difference.

I love that people will defend Zimmerman to death and now come in this thread and condem this women for not shooting to kill.

Firing guns, and having NOTHING happen to anyone, is severely dangerous my friend... more dangerous that murdering someone, clearly.

 

[wsoxfan1214]

Can we just let Florida be its own country now?

 

[Xenon]

Every black Injustice thread it's the same characters playing the same tired ass role.

Yet if it's consoles we were talking about and the same patterns existed people would be on vacation by now.

I love being on gaf but I don't understand this shit

I hope you're including yourself in that group. Because you keep spouting this tired line in every thread. It's also no surprise you seem to always fall on the same side of every argument as well.

 

[commedieu]

I hope you're including yourself in that group. Because you keep spouting this tired line in every thread. It's also no surprise you seem to always fall on the same side of every argument as well.

Heres a BS flag, his stance stays the same regardless of flip-flopping opinions self defense, depending on race.

I'm glad to be part of that side that is able to see that shooting no one, and not being protected by stand your ground, when chasing someone down and stabbing them to death is, is another sad case of shouldnta-done-it-while-black.

Black Injustice threads always find a way to blame the victim. Even when hes standing still and getting racial slurs thrown at him as he is being beanbagged, tazed, and shot to death, the same people will still fault the black for something. Oh, and yes, they find a way to make it not race related. While racial slurs are being yelled at him. Because Racism is over you see.


Its a trend.