Cerebral Assassin
Member
But then how would they show their terrible journalistic skills?
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Hideki Kamiya shits all over Kotaku
- Thread starter jett
- Start date
But then how would they show their terrible journalistic skills?
after he made that racist twit I am never again buying any of his games. It's funny how most of you are defending him. If some westerner said something like that you would be all over his balls.
It was completly unnecessary to say something like that.
and to use his logic, why did he say forigners? Is Luke representing all forigners? Shadow racism is the best, but knowing Japan that is no surprise.
It was completly unnecessary to say something like that.
and to use his logic, why did he say forigners? Is Luke representing all forigners? Shadow racism is the best, but knowing Japan that is no surprise.
Flachmatuch
Member
Errr...what's wrong with the "stupid idiot foreigners" stuff? I mean, the original Kotaku article established that frame: it was an explicit "foreigner's" view on how "the Japanese" view gaming. This is a hard feat, but Kotaku managed to make a "stupid foreigners" quote completely relevant and accurate.
D
Deleted member 20920
Unconfirmed Member
Kotaku'a article uses his tweet to justify the direction of their article. Rather than attempt to get a more indepth opinion about why he isn't interested they proceed to write make make it seem like Kamiya and the rest of the Japanese developers have no idea what's going on outside of Japan. Which isn't true. Platinum Games' Inaba was spotted at Valve and he has said that they're very interested in working with them and publishing their action games on Steam. Another Gamasutra article posted in the thread talked about how Steam is not that viable because Steam's presence is too small and they don't have any support staff that knows Japanese. Kotaku's article did mention that Japan's Steam page is in English and not catered to the Japanese in any way. Shouldn't they try to ask Valve why isn't more done to attract Japanese gamers and Japanese publishers to make use of Steam more?Rather than find out why Japanese developers don't attempt to widen their PC market share and why Steam seems to be giving minimal support, it became a "Japan is just weird" article. It became a "Japan should be more like the west" article.
Of course his tweets are public information. But shouldn't Kotaku at least make a better attempt at trying to answer questions by being more indepth in their investigation and not rely on 2 tweets and some off hand information to make a dig at Japan being more behind than the Western world?
This guy is a trailblazer. He was hating on Nate Silver 4 years in advance.
Gucci Messiah
Banned
Very surprised that people in this thread are calling Kamiya a "god" and supporting this type of behavior. Yes, that Kotaku article was out of line and the "Do you eat shit?" reply was funny but come on, this is a grown man behaving like a child. In addition to posting racist tweets, the man treats his own fans like shit when they ask him questions. I'm sure he gets bugged about PC ports all the time but there is absolutely no reason to tell a fan to "Fuck Off" just because you're tired of repeated questions.
This guy is a joke and the people is this thread posting "LOL KAMIYA AM GOD" make me sick.
This guy is a joke and the people is this thread posting "LOL KAMIYA AM GOD" make me sick.
No surprise that the crazy texan blogger gets to shit on an industry figure when he gets the chance to.
Better use of disruption in his stuffs than journalits usually do...
That's telling to the level of research they usually do...
If you can't tell the difference between a douche running his mouth in public and a site trolling someone...
I make a post as a joke on GAF which contains false information. Kotaku takes that post and makes it into an article. Is it my fault that the information is false in their article while it's Kotaku's job to verifying it before it's published?
It doesn't if it's Twitter or Kamiya. It's Kotaku's job to verify the "public information" they based the whole article on.
Kotaku apparently doesn't know how journalism works either. Kamiya displayed personal disinterest and kotaku sensationalized it and made a blanket judgement which in turn displeased him greatly. We're going in circles in this thread on who's right and who's wrong...
"Local NeoGAF user finds Kotaku to be a great site because he's defending us"
Apparently you don't know how NeoGAF works because these posts are available for anybody and everybody to read.
JordanLMiller
Member
As a fellow foreigner, I think you are overreacting. Do you normally research the views of every member of a game development staff to see if you have any objections to what they've ever said before playing a game? Try not being quite so delicate.
MachoSuave
Neo Member
No, they generalised the attitudes of an entire country on an offhand comment made by one man on his personal twitter, despite the company he works for being a leading party in pushing a completely opposite attitude towards PC gaming. They then provided no further proof beyond the author's personal anecdotes and shipped straight out for click-baiting. The evidence is unsubstantial, the conclusion is unfounded, this is the kind of article one expects from a shameless tabloid newspaper and should be treated with contempt.
Would you say you know Japanese culture (you're an expert)?
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
A classic example of a below average NeoGAF'r not realising how stupid they are with a timeframe of about 5 typed words. Applause.
All the attempts to blow the gaijin comments out of proportion is super dumb. Kamiya uses a derogatory term for the thousands of terms swooping in on his Twitter account all while happily answer nice and intellectual tweets from other "foreigners". Man sure is racist!
Gucci Messiah
Banned
Overreacting to racism? Wow GAF, now we've hit an all-time low.
Sir_Crocodile
Member
Kotaku has deleted every article on the site ?????
Flachmatuch
Member
Kamiya calling people who are completely ignorant about Japanese culture "stupid foreigners" is pretty accurate. And btw, Americans do very, very often act in different cultures like "stupid foreigners". Comes with the empire, I guess. Stating this is not "racist" but "xenophobic", and considering the history of relationships between civilisations, xenophoby is completely rational and, at least for Japan, it worked. If they weren't as "xenophobic" as they were against the "Western barbarians", they'd be just another exploited, poor-ass ex-colony.
Anyone thinking that somehow xenophoby towards Western civilisation is not justified has to be completely ignorant about its history.
Anyone thinking that somehow xenophoby towards Western civilisation is not justified has to be completely ignorant about its history.
I can understand him being pissed off, but this is pretty unprofessional from any perspective.
TBH the xenophobia is directed mostly at America but hits the whole western world just the same.
TBH the xenophobia is directed mostly at America but hits the whole western world just the same.
D
Deleted member 20920
Unconfirmed Member
teruterubozu
Member
Kamiya=all Japanese
Kotaku=all Gaijin
Classy all around.
Kotaku=all Gaijin
Classy all around.
Cerebral Assassin
Member
I hope English isn't your first language( you can accuse him of xenophobia but not racism), & given your last comment that can apply to you too.
Zoe
Member
Cause there were more people than just Luke acting like stupid foreigners towards his account?
RedNumberFive
Banned
You guys already know the story. Don't encourage Kotaku by giving them any more clicks.
This is the first thing I thought of too. What an asshole.
FlashbladeGAF
Member
calling someone a "gaijin" isnt racist
some may feel it has a negative connotation, but it isnt the equivalent of N*ga or J*p
the people who are defending him are the same people who are tired of the shitty game journalists and Wonderful101 haters/bayo disk breakers out there who love to push Kamiya's buttons
robotzombie
Member
Why does anything Kamiya says matter to you in the least bit? The only interaction between you and him should be "he makes game, I decide whether or not game is interesting to me and buy or not buy game"
Gucci Messiah
Banned
Uh, from my understanding "gaijin" means "outsider" and is used to describe foreigners in a negative context. It's not a polite word and clearly has racial overtones.
Interrobang
Member
Not sure what the current rules are about linking to Kotaku, but a quick google search of "kotaku kamiya valve" pulled it up.
I'm looking at it right now? Unless this is a joke I don't get.
I just saw Jason Schreier post in another thread about 5 minutes ago. They're definitely actively reading this thread and they have to realize how wrong they are. Where is the editor's note? Sucks that they only address problems where they have the upper hand.
grimshawish
Banned
Pretty much. Its always been the case that its okay to be racist against Japan.
Its the most constant thing in game discussion.
Some of its casual, but a lot of it is pure 'JAPAN' type bigotry and 'expert' bollocks.
That's the problem right there, and I think a lot of you are forgetting.
Kotaku isn't journalistic in any way, they are a blog site. A blog site designed to get hits in any way possible. They run intentionally idiotic articles in order to get as many hits as possible.
As soon as we start ignoring them, the better. I think we should make some GAF rules.
1. If you link to an article, copy-paste it into the op or post it at a hosting site.
2. Never click on their site.
Simple as that.
Flachmatuch
Member
"Professional" means you're acting like a robot. Really hate it.
Nahh, historically, it's westerners. (And Americans are not even the worst, by far. In fact, individually, they're considered to be some of the nicest people according to some poll I can't find the reference to now.)
Look at Japan's history and compare it to, say, that of China. Or North American First Nations fwiw (who were, as far as I know, not xenophobic and actually tried to reason with Western invaders - look where that got them). Whether you like xenophoby or not (I don't), it was, in Japan's case, completely justified historically and it also worked.
Not "racial" but xenophobic. That's what I was talking about actually, if you care to read my post. As for racism, it's not simply some kind of dislike for outwardly different people, it's much deeper.
BurritoBushido
Member
I found this interesting because that double standard is totally there. As far as my own view goes, I totally would be appalled if a western developer made a comment like that, but I'm not batting an eye at Kamiya saying it, and I thought that was strange. I think the problem is we're all viewing this from a Western perspective. Kamiya is born and immersed in a culture where a comment like that is pretty much acceptable. Eastern culture is just inherently more xenophobic. Racism isn't really an issue if you're not encountering other races on a regular basis. While the world is a much smaller place with modern technology, the faces he sees every day are pretty much Japanese. I'm not really trying to excuse him, just analyzing the phenomenon. Ultimately I prefer to divorce a creator's personal issues from their work.
Zoe
Member
MachoSuave
Neo Member
"Being foreign" isn't even moderately racist, if he'd called him a stupid white-pig, you might have a point.
Also I typed out a lot of shit about this notion of "professional behaviour" doing the rounds, but:
sums it up nicely.
Looking through my window in to the world (Gaf), it seems like nigga has shook off most of its negative connotations in casual use, mostly due to context and intent (two very important things in discussion).
Gucci Messiah
Banned
I'm sorry but that's a stupid train of thought. If I as a consumer am going to buy your product, I expect you to treat me, the person who you rely on to make money, like a decent human being.
If Bill Gates got on twitter and made a blanket statement saying that he hated " fucking J*ps" just because some idiot blogger wrote an insignificant article about him, I wouldn't buy his shit either.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Really, people are putting fingers on their ears and closing their eyes when people show reasons how Kamiya's reaction is different from Phil Fish. I'm baffled. Are people really incapable of seeing context and just see "Oh yea well both screamed!"
Nope, but when someone flat out says something like that for no reason, he doesn't deserve my money. Stupid forigners buy his games in the first place.
obviously you are. You have that avatar as a proof...
Ok Mr. "Superiour" arrogance.
It's okey. Funny reading some of these posts.
Gucci Messiah
Banned
Just because I don't agree with what you said doesn't mean I didn't read your post
But you disregard the condescending racist shit in Kotaku's article that even prompted the response, funny that. But Kotaku worded their shit different instead on just coming out and saying it straight up. the way Kamiya did.
Oh God, it's the guy who said Sword Art Online is the smartest anime of all time. This explains everything.
Did you miss the "
"? He's clearly just being a bit cheeky.Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
Theres been a mightily weird groundswell of it, often unconsciously, in the western games media at large this generation though. Maybe its because games journalists began to reap the benefits of having western buddies in game dev they can easily chat to and get favours from in the past decade as compared to the confusing disconnected situation of having to eat out of translators hands when Japan was the indisputable centre of the hottest videogames. Just referring to Kamiya as "bayonetta guy" is almost entirely a symptom of that.
Flachmatuch
Member
In this case you just don't understand the difference between "racism" and "xenophoby".
Gucci Messiah
Banned
I'll just leave this here, sums up my thoughts nicely:
"The truth is that if a word is racial and it offends people, it’s a slur. The person who says the word doesn’t get to decide whether it’s offensive or not; it’s the group to which they refer. Otherwise, you could justify using any racial slur whatsoever by just saying you didn’t mean it that way. Any smart redneck closet racist will tell you that he doesn’t mean ‘n****r’ in a bad way; it’s just what he calls black people, so why get so upset? (I’m not comparing ‘n***er’ to ‘gaijin’; it’s just meant as an analogy).
Whether it’s harmless or nasty, it perpetuates an ‘us and them’ worldview that’s harmful to Japan as a whole. This worldview makes it okay for people to discriminate against those who look differently than them."
EDIT: And it's "xenophobia", don't treat me like a child
who gives a shit about kotaku. Where did I defend Kotaku? I don't visit that crap blog, they don't get my support for who they are.
Same goes for Kamiya now. I didn't like his comment, hence I won't give him support. I am sure he will menage without me, since most of you can't get enough of his Godness and brilliance
Cerebral Assassin
Member
It's probably not a great idea to try and redefine meanings of words on the internet.
diffusionx
Gold Member
Luke Plunkett isn't very bright. When I read Kotaku regularly, he was easily the worst writer of the lot... which is saying something.
My go-to example is his Civilization V review, that says nothing about the game I couldn't read on the back of the box and fails to place the game in context. There are worse though.
My go-to example is his Civilization V review, that says nothing about the game I couldn't read on the back of the box and fails to place the game in context. There are worse though.
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