Bornstellar
Member
And Azure IS the cloud. Which is why it has it's own datacenters, unlike Gaikai, who rents out server space from datacenters (which means it's not really a cloud, but a service run on the cloud).
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Xbox boss says hardware analysis between consoles is meaningless
- Thread starter Elginer
- Start date
And Azure IS the cloud. Which is why it has it's own datacenters, unlike Gaikai, who rents out server space from datacenters (which means it's not really a cloud, but a service run on the cloud).
amstradcpc
Member
And the datacenters have Geforces to give the Gaikai service?.
How do you know Sony hasn't invested in more servers? How do you know they don't have a datacenter? Do you work for Gaikai?
I asked for a source. Unless you've got one, you're really in no position to comment on Gaikai's capacity.
Gemüsepizza
Member
You did not answer his question. What is preventing Sony from renting the same amount of servers? And you do realize that Microsoft's Azure cloud doesn't feature GPU computing?
True, it's so easy for Sony to do similar things that this really isn't an "advantage" for Microsoft over the competition.
The one I work at does. Muahaha.
Lol love how you state this as fact w/out knowing jack shit about the actual capacity of either Azure or Gaikai most likely.
Yellowflashdude
Member
Lol, all we saw was a CG trailer. Until we see some gameplay, that is still up for judgement.
Dictator93
Member
You know this how?
Gemüsepizza
Member
First of all, no gameplay was seen. Second, nobody denies that the Xbox One will produce nice visuals. But the Xbox One does not exist in a vacuum. It will be compared to the PS4, and we have very nice ways/tools to do this today. If the PS4 has better smoke, lighting, particle effects or other advantages in many games, people will notice it. And it will hurt the Xbox. They will also notice that the PS4 is available for $100 less. Halo won't be enough to prevent people from changing sides imo.
Quantum Break at the MS conference looked like in-engine. Real time is not out of the question for those visuals.
He doesn't know. *
Have a look at Gaikai's massive client list (copy/pasted from Wiki)
June 17, 2010: Electronic Arts[31]
July 20, 2010: Intel[32]
July 20, 2010: Limelight Networks[32]
March 8, 2011: Video Games Blogger[33]
April 5, 2011: Bigfoot Networks[34]
June 2, 2011: The Escapist[35]
June 8, 2011: Gamer4Eva
June 8, 2011: Eurogamer[36]
June 21, 2011: Walmart[37]
July 5, 2011: Capcom[38]
August 22, 2011: CD Projekt[39]
October 11, 2011: Level 3 Communications[40]
October 20, 2011: YouTube[41]
January 4, 2012: Best Buy[41]
January 4, 2012: Ubisoft[41]
January 10, 2012: LG Electronics[42]
January 12, 2012: Green Man Gaming[43]
March 2, 2012: GAME[44]
March 8, 2012: Warner Bros.[45]
April 30, 2012: Gamesload[46]
May 2, 2012: WikiPad[47]
May 15, 2012: Nvidia[48]
May 15, 2012: Meteor Entertainment[49]
May 22, 2012: Autodesk[50]
June 4, 2012: En Masse[51]
June 5, 2012: Samsung[52]
June 6, 2012: Machinima[53]
I find it hard to believe Sony could afford to set up a similar network. Microsoft is apparently spending over 1 billion on the new Xbox Live network - which includes new data centres in many new countries. Sony doesn't really have that kind of cash lying around - almost every division is in serious trouble at the company. They're not consolidating because they're smart - they're consolidating because divisions are breaking down due to poor-selling, overpriced products. They don't need the best cloud network to compete and they already have Gaikai....which is probably good enough.
What you find hard to believe based on third hand information, and what are facts are not the same. When one of you MS stooges got a source, feel free to comment on their capacities.
Gaikai was purchased quite recently in the company's history. And that was for a tangible product that I was using in 2010 and 2011.
The question isn't whether or not they could (they demonstrated to pay money for stuff that they think will help them), but whether or not it would be wise for Sony to build data centers if all they are offering are various entertainment things.
In addition to that there was Joystiq interview with Dave Perry (I think back in 2009 or '10) with a dream network he was envisioning and Sony is currently bankrolling that.
Bornstellar
Member
Alternatively, give a source that states that Sony HAS cloud infrastructure and does not rent out from those who do?
Unfortunately, the big providers don't really provide numbers. Point is, whether you like it or not, Azure is owned and operated by MS, and is a lot bigger than everything that's not AWS or Google's own cloud.
wasn't the sorcery footage 'in engine'? usually in engine = expect a downgrade in game doesn't it?
The Dark Sorcerer is a real time demo that was actually interactive on the show floor.
Oh for sure. It was a non-interactive in-engine part. The actual game will be downgraded, as it's not necessary to use for example these high LOD models for the gameplay. If it's downgraded beyond the obvious downgrade that you just do to not be wasteful is just speculation at this point.
The difference between it and The Dark Sorcerer demo was that The Dark Sorcerer was just a tech demo that was interactive (they played around with the light sources and such at their booth) and isn't going to be a game.
cool, I didn't realise that
gaikai used to rent server and continue to do it
are 300 server all in rent
google is there to search for it
Yoshida talking PS4 clouds in an article from Polygon..
http://www.polygon.com/2013/6/12/4424022/sony-shuhei-yoshida-says-ps4-cloud-computing-calculations
http://www.polygon.com/2013/6/12/4424022/sony-shuhei-yoshida-says-ps4-cloud-computing-calculations
I wonder if multiplatform devs can use Azure for PS4 titles too? I don't see why not.
MS can buy a $billion in datacenters and servers, Sony can let others buy datacenters and servers and rent cloud service, scaling as needed and probably spend a lot less doing it. One has to buy the real estate and the other does not. MS will have to pay to keep servers current, Sony may not as the host probably would.
Where's the advantage? Commercial Real Estate holdings and used equipment sales?
Where's the advantage? Commercial Real Estate holdings and used equipment sales?
Burgess_101
Member
I mean they would say that wouldn't they?
ghost of oldergamer returns
They could but probably won't get the discount.
You also have to look at QD's track record when it comes to tech demos vs. real games. They did a similar "casting" tech demo for PS3 before PS3's launch and they have long since surpassed that. There's no reason to think there'd be a noticeable downgrade in whatever their actual PS4 game is (or a downgrade at all, maybe even an upgrade as they work on the platform longer)
hooijdonk17
Member
Advantage: What non-gaming data gets mined by the servers, and what you do with it.
There's a reason why Kinect is mandatory, and that's certainly not scanning barcodes.
Thanks for yet another informative post on the subject. I'm glad to know it may at least have some impact, given the right conditions, because it is important to me as the gen goes on that more developers try to target 60fps if possible.
dragonelite
Member
I would bet the memory bus and bandwidth has more to do with it then the memory space. 256 bits on 680 and 384 bit on 7950.
A 4k deferred renderer would need like 127MB for a the minimal 4 rendertargets at 4k resolution
680GTX = 192 GB/sec
7950 = 240GB/sec
The 7950 has 25% more bandwidth at those resolution you need to move data around quickly not store more data.
Because of the 25% higher bandwidth the 7950 probably also has that 25% fps advantage 12fps for the 680 vs the 15 fps of the 7950.
I remembered that Dirt 3 uses Forward+.
AMD used it to demo the LEO demo.
It doesn't need that many rendertarget so less data to shuffle around.
Maybe that is why it can reach such high fps count on 4k resolution.
Zok310
Banned
If the ps4 proves anything, it's that Sony don't need a billion dollars to make a better product or service.
id love for someone to ask a MS rep why they couldn't of offloaded the apps and secondary OS to the cloud and have atleast 7 of their 8 gigs of ram availible to just games like the PS4. rather than the other way around..
would love to see the PR from behind the camera shut down that interview
would love to see the PR from behind the camera shut down that interview
dragonelite
Member
adamsappel
Member
Gemüsepizza;67644596 said:
The XB1 could end up in the same role as Nintendo: with a console people buy for the exclusives, but get all the multi-plats on the higher-tech competition. And I'd put the Gamepad above the Kinect in added value.
This angle was quite common at the end of last year, except people were saying Sony were in no position, financially, to produce a more powerful piece of hardware than MS. See how that turned out.
Don't forget also, that Sony fronted up just under $400m for Gaikai, which doesn't take into account any expansion/development. Hardly a small inverstment and that's before you consider the investment in first party games.
And I'm sure MS said that $1b was for X1 game development - not just the network.
Neither product is out yet. How do you which is better?
There isn't a big enough technology gap between the systems for this to happen.
Kung Fu Grip
Banned
Upgraded specs are being talked about again on B3D. When is everyone going to learn to let this go? I thought we were past that stage? It's getting desperate now.
Do people really think MS can make such drastic changes this late? I see 12GB RAM and higher clock speeds mentioned. :lol.
Do people really think MS can make such drastic changes this late? I see 12GB RAM and higher clock speeds mentioned. :lol.
Yeah just seen it. As much as I would love this to be true, it's VERY unrealistic.
lastflowers
Banned
lol, what a shame. I had high hopes for the site's technical ability.
Obviously someone has multiple independent and good sources for this over there. A slight upclock might be in the realm of possibility but no way they are upping to 12 GB of RAM.
hydrophilic attack
Member
There is ZERO added value in getting 12 GB of RAM, unless you put in a GPU with double the power there. They could -I don't know whether they started manufacturing or not- increase memory, but that would serve marketing purposes, if anything. Now, an upclock is feasible...
But MS should be careful here, a RROD like situation and Sony is gonna walk over their corpse Machette style...
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
They're going to rebadge a bunch of PS4s and hope for the best.
lastflowers
Banned
lol, that's why the xbox is bigger than the ps4. They just put it in the xbox, shell and all, and hook up everything
hydrophilic attack
Member
Explains the higher price too!
True, but if xbone is supposed to only be ~4x the 360 isn't that about the weakest power bumper ever, especially after 8 years? If their effort is a bit half-assed it doesn't seem that unbelievable that Sony can put something out that is more powerful.
and the supply issues - holy fuck!
I don't understand why people can't just accept that the X1 is what it is. If the PS4 being more powerful is driving you crazy then build a PC and be done with it.
8 years / 4x the power
as excited as I am for both consoles, that is pretty fucking disappointing. a lot of the games do look impressive, but doesn't change anything.
Dude just google Azure, I can't believe your trying to debate this point. Gaikai is a good service, but no where near the capacity/quality Azure has.
You do realise that Gaikai is actually a selection of patented browser plugins for low latency video encoding/decoding?
It actually has nothing to do with Servers or graphics cards or whatnot.
That was just one thing that the patents can deliver, the purchase of Gaikai is more than likely going to be used to stream Sony games to Sony TVs.
This is an interesting point I'd like to ask about. With regards to RAM/GPU .. does anyone know what the performance is how much of the RAM each GPU could use up? Or is this information too specific until release at least?