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Xbox going OEM route for next-gen? 3rd party consoles in the making?

Bond007

Member
Ms would like a word with you. I was enjoying my first party Sony games at $40. Ms rose high-def to $60. Why do you guys keep trying to rewrite history to paint Sony as being the first to raise prices?


Agree- we also forget the inception of XBL and how Sony held off on charging for some time.
I always say- microsoft generally kicks off the shit that fucks us over in the long run. Digital games is the current one. Its all fine and dandy until its not.
 

icerock

Member
Very true.

I also completely agree with the internal struggle thing. The irony, which many still can't see, is that it is the ABK acquisition that so many cheered for is expediting Xbox's downfall.

Before the ABK acquisition, it was "Xbox". After the ABK acquisition closed, it became "Microsoft Gaming." Now, the gaming-related decisions are being made at the Microsoft level, not the previous Xbox level. And Microsoft is demanding more money and profits.

There is every bit of chance that Hi-Fi Rush and/or Sea of Thieves is announced for PlayStation and Nintendo before ABK games are announced for Game Pass lol.

Like I said earlier, ABK acquisition brought the division under microscope. Just look at latest revenue figures, ABK brought in more revenue last quarter than Windows. I don't think folks truly ever realized how massive a buyout of this scale is. And, with it, it has brought certain changes within the company. Phil Spencer is very much a part of old guard, traditionalist in a sense, that he believes platform holders stand to make a lot more money than a publisher. But, his last ditch attempt to buy some goodwill with an uptick in hardware/subs fell flat despite heavy discounts during holiday period. There are higher powers who are driving these decisions, and don't shoot the messenger but there have been few rumblings about his position being made untenable over last few weeks. There's also a lot of traction in regards to multi-plat announcement, with many thinking it is imminent.

I've been sceptical of CoD day 1 on gamepass since the beginning too. I don't think it makes sense and I got a lot of flack in the past for suggesting they wouldn't add it straight away when the deal closes.

What I'm referring to though is Gamepass Core, which doesn't even include some of the newer less successful games from MS like Hifi rush, Starfield, or even Redfall yet, let alone new CoDs. If they ever go third party, much like EA Play, I can see them adding older stuff to a sub on other platforms without sacrificing those sales. No reason not to have a smaller catalog of games that aren't selling much anymore or aren't about game sales in a sub on other platforms, for example say Elder scrolls online, Fallout 76, SoT, Spyro, THPS, etc. Just copy EA Play and Ubi+ with the Gamepass Core branding.

Again, they stand to make a lot more by just porting those games, instead of bundling them altogether for a sub. Besides, Sony would still be hesitant to have a competitors sub service on their platform, even if it is specifically curated.
 

DosGamer

Member
Microsoft needs to bow out of the console race. They gave it a valiant effort, but the red ring of death took their biggest moment and fumbled it. At that point they lost a lot of the "hard working, save my money to buy your product" group. People wanted quality. Couple that with one of the dumbest naming debacles ever and you saw consumers buying the wrong consoles for their kids at Christmas. Mistake after mistake and both Sony and Nintendo know how to weather these storms. MS apparently doesn't at the moment so they are grasping at straws.

The smartest thing they could do is do away with the consoles and focus on games for all systems..... while at the same time pushing the PC front for high end gamers. 3 consoles is every gamers dream because it gives us options, but its every developers nightmare as there is never a 3 way tie for the best and something is not going to sell well.

They have great licenses and it would be a shame not to capitalize on them. Look what it has done for Sega and they were in much worse shape.
 
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I don't get the OEM thing honestly. No one wants to buy your hardware but you think they'll buy some Xbox OEM device? Why?

Because it wouldn't really be a "console" anymore, for starters; it'd be more like a gaming-optimized NUC (or laptop, or tablet etc.) that can run a (customizable) Xbox frontend and also run regular Windows. And depending on form factor & OEM customizations, allow for a range of upgradability in parts like certain desktop PCs, laptops, NUCs etc.

Exclusive content for PS and Switch too! I bet it'll support DualSense as well.

nice wow wow wee wow GIF

The Steam version already got an update for DualSense support I think, or at least mentions of DualSense were listed in the updated copyright information.

Exactly what I was thinking, however I think 3DO would have had a better shot at the 32-bit generation if they had not gone with their business model that they went for, under the hood it was a capable piece of kit compared to the competition in 1993- Sega CD, Jag, upcoming 32x..and early on it could hold its own against the PSX and Saturn...

The 3DO didn't stand a chance. 3D tech was too much in its infancy, and evolving too quickly, for a single company to dictate the development of the market in terms of APIs and the such. The concept was too soon.

Valve had a better shot with Steam Machines, but was very sloppy with how they actually executed it. Hence that died off. Graphics tech is at a point now where things are relatively mature outside of some stuff like pathtracing or "fully agreed-upon" upscaling methods, and some various AI-related things. The market for APIs is relatively mature, and 3D is a well-understood commodity in gaming.

Microsoft may have failed with Xbox in being an attractive console brand, but they do still have years of experience in making console hardware that could be leveraged even if changing the Xbox hardware business model from the typical console one to a PC gaming-centric one. And they understand scalability with hardware in the PC space thanks to the Surface devices. That's where Xbox's future is in hardware.

Granted, if Microsoft want to even continue making hardware, which I think they still do. Kinda why the OEM rumors only make half-sense to me; I'd see Xbox more like Surface devices but optimized for low-end and mid-range PC gaming (going by GPU standards of low-end and mid-range cards....I think). So they'd have an Xbox frontend for their "Big Picture Mode", and probably some type of spec that OEMs can license out and make changes to (and make changes to the stock frontend too, to better fit their own branding). And all these devices would be able to run regular Windows with an optional desktop, tablet etc. environment (depending on the device form factor).

All of these would cost more than a console providing equivalent performance, but could still be competitive in price/performance in the NUC, laptop etc. markets for gaming-centric devices that aren't targeting the high-end (that could also be an option of course). The profit margins would be a lot better than on the Xbox consoles currently; they'd actually exist, for starters.

Again this is all if Microsoft are still looking to continue Xbox gaming hardware beyond the typical peripherals, which I think they are. But unlike this rumor's suggesting, it'd still involve Microsoft central on the hardware side, just with specifications that could be licensed out to OEMs (perhaps MS handling aspects of wafer production and manufacturing for OEM orders), alongside the Xbox frontend and Windows, so they can build their own variants (maybe with additional stuff like more Thunderbolt ports, or somewhat higher-clocked CPUs, maybe more system RAM etc.). Although one thing OEMs wouldn't be able to change I'd assume, is the motherboard controller, and maybe certain things pertaining to the BIOS/UEFI.
So customization options would be limited to what the motherboard itself is flexible enough to support (this is probably where the console experience would come in on engineering side, the motherboard would probably be more a custom design than a typical PC motherboard despite compatibility with all typical PC components).
 

DJ12

Member
How? They’d have nothing to fight for. All those amazing games you play are because competition exists. They needed a competitive edge for the price of their hardware.
Rofl, please remind me again which company needs to beg to daddy to subsidise the console price.
 
Nah, it needs to be someone who knows gaming inside and out, MS and Valve doing a combined thing would be perfection. Steam Deck is close to perfection already but the hardware is too weak for a docked device and too much fiddling to access Gamepass.

I doubt Valve would be wanting to do something hardware-related with Microsoft if it involves Windows over Steam OS. That's part of the entire point of Steam Deck and any future Valve hardware: to siphon PC gamers away from Windows and over to Linux (via Steam OS), and of course keep them locked in the Steam ecosystem.

If MS want to add something Game Pass-related to Steam, I can see Valve maybe entertaining that idea, but not without some type of revenue sharing model. Like Valve getting a 15% cut on each active subscriber for the month through Steam, while Microsoft gets the other 85%. I think that'd be more than fair.

However, Microsoft's push for mobile has been trying to sidestep the platform owners and set up shop without paying them a cut whatsoever, something they might have to give up on and play by the platform holder's rules, at least on stuff like iOS. No sane company is really going to want to let other massive companies in that space set up shop on their own systems and not somehow pay them a cut, it's always been a ridiculous notion. Valve wouldn't be any different for something like Game Pass because ultimately, that's a sub which could mean less B2P software revenue through Steam. They have to cover their pockets some way on that.

Did you see how cocky and overpriced Sony was trying to be during the PS3 days? They’ve gotten better. But give them free rein and games will be $90 while consoles are $700. Don’t give them that.

$600 PS3 wasn't about cockiness; that was ambition biting Sony in the ass with costs. Even at $599 they were losing $200 per PS3 sold; cocky would've meant they sold the system at an even higher price to not lose as much upfront.

It's funny I never see these same arguments for PC gaming with Steam, when that launcher basically owns the space for gaming on that platform, yet no one goes "cocky/arrogant Valve". Almost as if having a monopoly doesn't inherently mean cockiness or arrogance, or maybe Valve has fans who turn a blind eye to their flaws but exaggerate Sony's during the PS3 era 🤔?


So about this: the 360 originally wasn't even aiming to beat PS3 to market, it's just that Sony delayed the PS3 by a year due to costs and I guess chip production shortages, so 360 got a free year in there. Even so, the first year was "solid" in terms of sales, but nothing mind-blowing. I guess you could say, if you compared it to Genesis/Megadrive, 360's first year was more like that system's pre-Sonic years: solid, but not crazy amazing.

It wasn't really until Gears of War, combined with the lackluster PS3 launch lineup, that 360 sales really started picking up pace. Once Halo 3 and Mass Effect dropped, the floodgates started to open. So honestly, MS could've delayed 360 by a year and still seen similar trajectory in sales or just skipped the early "slower" sales period and hit with the momentum of Gears of War and other games, and probably still end up with a lead over PS3 in US & UK by the time of Halo 3, albeit maybe a smaller one. They also would've avoided a lot of the early problems with RROD; not that it would've gone away, but hardware failures would've been a lot less, closer to the YLOD rates with PS3 (MS would've had more time to assess the problem and redesign the cooling in launch units).

Anyway WRT what MS could do for the next Xbox: if they're suicidal with the brand and want to Dreamcast it, yeah launch another flat-out console in 2026. It's mainly only going to have multiplats that are also cross-gen titles with PS5, PS5 Pro, Series X, Series S, and Switch 2. They don't really have any massive exclusive coming out from their teams in the next two years; TES VI is still far away likely beyond 2026, and I don't think IP like DOOM or Wolfenstein have that type of pull. So what else is there? ESO, COD, Overwatch...they're all service games and multiplat (consoles & PC). Tango's rumored JRPG? It'll likely be quite good (if it exists), but even if it's exclusive to the next Xbox console that won't be much of a draw. I highly doubt MS try locking down a huge 3P exclusive considering the purchase of Zenimax & ABK was in part to avoid that type of strategy going forward.

So from 2026 to 2028 you've mainly got a more powerful 10th-gen Xbox console that is simply playing the new multiplats with very little in the way of big exclusive draws. "Play your current multiplats but prettier!" won't do much because of PS5 Pro and "Play your last-gen Xbox games but prettier!" won't work because Xbox Series X tried that in 2020 and that clearly hasn't done much for the Series consoles to this day in sales growth.

The only way a new traditional Xbox console could even possibly work is if Microsoft reneged on their PC Day 1 strategy and also reneged on at least a couple of the games they promised to regulators would remain multiplat, the latter of which could get very messy or very costly (or both). Either that, or rush Bethesda to have TES VI ready by launch, which is probably not a great idea because that studio's reputation is blemished and one more Starfield-like disappointment could ruin it altogether.

People just have to give up the idea Microsoft are going to give the console battle another shot with a 10th-gen Xbox console launching 1 or even 2 years ahead of the next PlayStation. There's just no path where that works long-term. Sure maybe they get some initial strong sales because of the newness factor, but that luster will quickly subside and then actual demand (or lack thereof) will show itself, and they'll be in an even worst spot than what the Series consoles are currently at.

If there's any future for Xbox gaming hardware, it's by moving from the traditional console business model altogether and taking on a much more PC-centric hardware business model while carrying over their experience in R&D'ing & manufacturing console hardware. That's why the OEM rumors actually make some sense, IMO. Tho again, I think MS very much will still be making hardware themselves, and develop a standardized spec they'll build systems from and license out to OEMs to build customized variants of, with some amount of incentives in it for them (Xbox frontend UI licensing w/ customizations, Windows licensing, facilitating some amount of wafer orders/board assembly/distribution/etc. themselves rather than having OEMs do all of that on their own, so on and so forth).
 

DosGamer

Member
Sometimes the biggest win is when you accept that you lost. MS has actual aces up the sleeve, but the model they choose is all wrong.
Game Pass is attractive to the average gamer that cant afford to buy games like these companies want or expect... But you cant tell me its been a success for them. I dont buy it in the least. I have friends that literally dont own a single xbox game on a 500 dollar system.
Game pass was created because MS couldnt move their product.
So do companies get money for how many times their game was downloaded? Imagine creating a game over the span of 5-8 years only to see it hit gamepass and sell underwhelming volume... Sounds like a nightmare for devs. to be honest.
This really all started last generation with MS and now its a clusterfuck really.
 
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Fredrik

Member
I doubt Valve would be wanting to do something hardware-related with Microsoft if it involves Windows over Steam OS. That's part of the entire point of Steam Deck and any future Valve hardware: to siphon PC gamers away from Windows and over to Linux (via Steam OS), and of course keep them locked in the Steam ecosystem.
It’s not realistic to think anyone can move people away from Windows to Linux at this point but Steam works great on Windows so all that is needed is MS focusing on a living room scenario. A serie of well-designed and silent Windows Boxes with a polished and well-optimized big screen mode. Perfect.
 
$600 PS3 wasn't about cockiness; that was ambition biting Sony in the ass with costs. Even at $599 they were losing $200 per PS3 sold; cocky would've meant they sold the system at an even higher price to not lose as much upfront.

It's funny I never see these same arguments for PC gaming with Steam, when that launcher basically owns the space for gaming on that platform, yet no one goes "cocky/arrogant Valve". Almost as if having a monopoly doesn't inherently mean cockiness or arrogance, or maybe Valve has fans who turn a blind eye to their flaws but exaggerate Sony's during the PS3 era 🤔?

How could anyone talk shit about valve when they have sales all the time and you can buy all kinds of games from them for a fraction of the cost? More companies need to be like them. Also, the only hardware Valve sells is a VR headset and a Portable Game Console both at a decent price. Not to mention their 1st part games are stellar. Valve is literally a better Nintendo for the PC world.
 
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It’s not realistic to think anyone can move people away from Windows to Linux at this point but Steam works great on Windows so all that is needed is MS focusing on a living room scenario. A serie of well-designed and silent Windows Boxes with a polished and well-optimized big screen mode. Perfect.

Hmm...it's possible. Valve could "hedge their bets", so to speak, and do a reiteration of their own Steam Machines with the lessons learned from Steam Deck (and runs on Linux with Steam OS), and simultaneously build out their own "Xbox" branded device based on some spec Microsoft sets (customizations aside), running Windows.

Valve would have more freedom of hardware scalability with the Steam Machine 2, but could cover audience preference for Windows with the Xbox and possibly also keep pricing down in some areas through licensing agreements with Microsoft. Then they can just prioritize which of the two on their end customers end up preferring.

How could anyone talk shit about valve when they have sales all the time and you can buy all kinds of games from them for a fraction of the cost? More companies need to be like them. Also, the only hardware Valve sells is a VR headset and a Portable Game Console both at a decent price. Not to mention their 1st part games are stellar. Valve is literally a better Nintendo for the PC world.

WHAT 1P games? 🤣 The last completely new one was Half-Life:Alyx. Counterstrike got an update but besides those two that's been it over the last...five years? Valve are in an Apple position with Steam, where there's so many games on their platform and they make so much just taking cuts from everyone else, they really don't have to bother pushing their own 1P software.

And in any case, your fears about Sony having a monopoly on console with no Xbox around, should still hold true for any other platform with a strong presence in a market like Steam with PC storefronts/launchers. The foundation of that worry should be centered on simply amalgamating that much market share to a singular entity alone; even if things go well for customers, that consolidation of market share naturally creates a potential risk with lack of innovation by the platform holder. That should be your main reasoning for wanting competition in general, not selectively saying Sony needs Xbox to compete to stay "honest" but meanwhile Microsoft has no genuine competition in PC OSes for market share, and Valve has no genuine competition in PC launcher/storefront markets for market share and somehow you're perfectly with both of those scenarios.

Either all "monopolies" are inherently neutral in fairness, or none are. And like other people ITT have said, actual competition calls for winners and losers. Sometimes the price for losing is exiting the market, or significantly changing your presence in that market. What you're asking for is the theatrics of competition, without any of the consequences (the stuff that makes real competition meaningful).

Also not all monopolies are inherently bad: PlayStation and Steam earned their market share dominance by appealing to end customers and addressing the needs of the industry better than their competitors. Windows...well, didn't earn its monopoly the same way, but you already probably know this. And this isn't the topic to discuss that.
 

HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member

I said it in this very thread they were doubling down and people wanting Xbox out of the hardware business were going to be disappointed

I knew it was safe to say that because I knew the marching orders were coming for the parrots

Xbox lies so often that it becomes meaningless.

I will believe there is a Nextbox when I see it.
The nextbox stats will leak right before the Ps5 Pro launches and will be around 2x the power launching much sooner than the PS6
 
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Shut0wen

Member
Why would they did this when they now have there fingers in blizzard and mobile games? Seems dumb af, i think ms will give another go at hardware then they would go straight cloud base which would practically make them not lose on any console
 

Papa_Wisdom

Member
I like Xbox and it’s ecosystem, as long as it’s a traditional console experience and physical is supported im in, I have no doubt another Xbox is coming, Didn’t nadella (sp?) say that they got out of the windows phone market too soon and they regretted it, Using it as a metaphor for they won’t make the same mistake again.

If it’s some hybrid cloud/stream box type of device that relies on that technology then I’m not sure I’d be down for that and would prob just switch to pc.
 

splattered

Member
I said it in this very thread they were doubling down and people wanting Xbox out of the hardware business were going to be disappointed

I knew it was safe to say that because I knew the marching orders were coming for the parrots


The nextbox stats will leak right before the Ps5 Pro launches and will be around 2x the power launching much sooner than the PS6
I would absolutely love this. I just wish they would figure out some sort or VR support even if it's through select 3rd party partner(s)
 
I said it in this very thread they were doubling down and people wanting Xbox out of the hardware business were going to be disappointed

I knew it was safe to say that because I knew the marching orders were coming for the parrots


The nextbox stats will leak right before the Ps5 Pro launches and will be around 2x the power launching much sooner than the PS6
SEGA doubled down too back in the day. A bad business plan is still bad even if you doubled down.

Frankly even if the Nextbox is given away for free with the power of a gaming PC, as long as it is still a Console by being a closed garden it would still fail. There is nothing wrong with Series X, so making a more powerful box fixed nothing.

it's like, you have a car with a fine engine but no tires. You try to fix it by adding nitro to the engine. The fact that you still have no tires doesn't change. The hardware is not the problem that needed fixing.
 

IDappa

Member
I always just assumed if Microsoft were to bring games to PlayStation it would be select games and atleast 12-24 months later from initial release. Maybe even time them before sequels of said games to drive interest in the ip. Would make sense. Never understood the fapping over a competitor bowing out on here, it’s like people want to get bent over by the sole player.
 

reinking

Gold Member
Did you see how cocky and overpriced Sony was trying to be during the PS3 days? They’ve gotten better. But give them free rein and games will be $90 while consoles are $700. Don’t give them that.

Wait, your argument is about Sony without Xbox, but your example is a generation in which Sony was competing with Xbox? If anything, your example shows that Sony overreacted to compete with Microsoft. I will say it again, both Sony and Nintendo were innovative and price conscious long before Xbox came to be.
 

bitbydeath

Member
I said it in this very thread they were doubling down and people wanting Xbox out of the hardware business were going to be disappointed

I knew it was safe to say that because I knew the marching orders were coming for the parrots


The nextbox stats will leak right before the Ps5 Pro launches and will be around 2x the power launching much sooner than the PS6
I thought we knew this already?
The question is will any of them support digital games or will they all be streaming devices as per the leak.
 

hlm666

Member
Agree- we also forget the inception of XBL and how Sony held off on charging for some time.
I always say- microsoft generally kicks off the shit that fucks us over in the long run. Digital games is the current one. Its all fine and dandy until its not.
Here's the thing, MS tried to push the sub shit on pc with gfwl. The userbase didn't have any of it. During the ps3 era part of the wars was always haha we don't have pay blah blah, instead of making a stand like pc and saying no it was just oh well we get free games it's not bad. Sony users had a chance to push back but didn't so here we are.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
I said it in this very thread they were doubling down and people wanting Xbox out of the hardware business were going to be disappointed

I knew it was safe to say that because I knew the marching orders were coming for the parrots


The nextbox stats will leak right before the Ps5 Pro launches and will be around 2x the power launching much sooner than the PS6
Sweet.

All I know is I hope the new system has a 4k drive. I got a slew of 4k movies, always trade in/sell my system, and I dont want to buy a dedicated 4k player which are all stubbornly around $250-300 CDN!
 

demigod

Member
The nextbox stats will leak right before the Ps5 Pro launches and will be around 2x the power launching much sooner than the PS6
What a terrible idea, then again its phil spencer. Nothing shocks me. Basically cannibalizing any sales they have left of the series. Have you heard if there will be physical drive? I think it’ll be all digital with the ways Europe and now Walmart killing xbox physicals.

2x power of the ps5 pro? Sorry i don’t buy this. I don’t see that huge of a power gap with an APU so soon. It’ll be very costly and power is not their issue. Making a new console so soon will just tell their customers that they have no faith in supporting their current hardware. Nothing is pushing the xbox.
 

HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
What a terrible idea, then again its phil spencer. Nothing shocks me. Basically cannibalizing any sales they have left of the series. Have you heard if there will be physical drive? I think it’ll be all digital with the ways Europe and now Walmart killing xbox physicals.

2x power of the ps5 pro? Sorry i don’t buy this. I don’t see that huge of a power gap with an APU so soon. It’ll be very costly and power is not their issue. Making a new console so soon will just tell their customers that they have no faith in supporting their current hardware. Nothing is pushing the xbox.
I have not heard 100% but would bet it’s digital

The problem with the power jump is the Pro is not going to be as strong as some hope
 

Bond007

Member
Here's the thing, MS tried to push the sub shit on pc with gfwl. The userbase didn't have any of it. During the ps3 era part of the wars was always haha we don't have pay blah blah, instead of making a stand like pc and saying no it was just oh well we get free games it's not bad. Sony users had a chance to push back but didn't so here we are.
What ive noticed with us gamers. We rarely push back and usually get boned.
Incomplete games, day one updates, digital only, online memberships, collectors editions.
People usually have a justification to these perceived values thrown at us.
Its not till years later do people open their eyes.

When people realize they dont own their games, cant borrow, rent, trade, minimal sales- nothing to show for that $70 game- over convenience of swapping discs- its gonna bite us in the ass.

To me- this is the current get boned topic of 2024. All spearheaded by you know who
 
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StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
What ive noticed with us gamers. We rarely push back and usually get boned.
Incomplete games, day one updates, digital only, online memberships, collectors editions.
People usually have a justification to these perceived values thrown at us.
Its not till years later do people open their eyes.

When people realize they dont own their games, cant borrow, rent, trade, minimal sales- nothing to show for that $70 game- over convenience of swapping discs- its gonna bite us in the ass.

To me- this is the current get boned topic of 2024. All spearheaded by you know who
Yup.

There's been discussion about this on gaf many times. It pops up here and there when any company has some kind of anti-consumer thing. It's 2024 and gamers eat it up. Loud on forums, but as long as game companies stick with it, they always cave in and go with the flow.

All the hoopla 10 years ago (the kind of stuff you listed), as well as recent stuff like $70 games, discs not even having all the content needing a download, heck even gamers requiring bigger HDD because now games require installs like a PC game when PS4/X1 launched (ie. buy an external HDD) etc... all got thrown out the wind when low and behold........ gamers got accustomed to saving 12 seconds putting a disc in by buying digital. That convenience overruled every counterpoint to digital gaming ever written. Go figure.
 
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Daneel Elijah

Gold Member
I have not heard 100% but would bet it’s digital

The problem with the power jump is the Pro is not going to be as strong as some hope
But if the Ps5 Pro is a 4070 in real life comparison 2x that is not that good in a long term point of view? Unless they also add more RAM, way better CPU etc?
This has been my problem with a early Xbox next gen console since we learned that there will be no pro console for Xbox. As long as the Series S exist and is supported by Microsoft their new console will not be pushed to it's full potential, and by the time we go to a PS6, AND the cross gen period that will follow whatever hardware was available from AMD for 2025 will be considered weak. To use some example I replayed Resident Evil 2 remake recently and used the PS5 edition. I liked it, but the jump with Resident Evil 4 remake was obvious. IF Microsoft have a way to have more hardware go to consumers, and I mean by that another console not long after the PS6 is out, then maybe I can see that work. But doing this would mean having a Pro version, and if they refused to do it this gen, doing it next gen when they will enter it in a worse position than they were in 2020 IMHO is weird to me. Unless they looked hard at it and consider that not having a Pro this gen is a mistake and are trying to fix that with this next gen console.
The Pro being "weak" is not that big of a deal because this is a niche product in a sense. It will hopefully sell, and sell well, but the real console this gen is still the PS5. If you want a PS5 Pro, great. If not, you either already have a PS5, will have it when it get cheaper, or are not interested no matter what. This next gen from Xbox will naturally make the Series S/X harder to sell, and as we are not seeing hints of a redesign they are still on a older node and will be incapable to get cheap enough to be competitive long term with a potential superslim PS5 that I think will happen. Sorry for the big wall of text but I am quite curious of this as Xbox is in a hard position and as they have the numbers and predictions on desk I can't understand how they believed that Sony would not have a PS5 Pro to the point of not having any plans themselves just in case.
 
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DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
Completely random post but does anyone know why the Samsung keyboard is shit and keeps typing my posts wrong 😆

I'm fed up with having to edit posts because the auto spell is spooning out.
 

Daneel Elijah

Gold Member
Completely random post but does anyone know why the Samsung keyboard is shit and keeps typing my posts wrong 😆

I'm fed up with having to edit posts because the auto spell is spooning out.
No idea, but I don't use it because it never want to understand when I use some words. At least yours is in english so it don't get crazy when you switch languages like I do.
 

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
What a terrible idea, then again its phil spencer. Nothing shocks me. Basically cannibalizing any sales they have left of the series. Have you heard if there will be physical drive? I think it’ll be all digital with the ways Europe and now Walmart killing xbox physicals.

2x power of the ps5 pro? Sorry i don’t buy this. I don’t see that huge of a power gap with an APU so soon. It’ll be very costly and power is not their issue. Making a new console so soon will just tell their customers that they have no faith in supporting their current hardware. Nothing is pushing the xbox.
I'll say this: yeah current sales of the Series consoles will basically die. If they have no exclusives games for that Xbox it will basically be a mid gen refresh. And they still have the Series S to deal with for cross gen.

It will almost be a repeat of the PS4 Pro vs One X. That's whatever. The oem/handheld thing is what's interesting. This is their Wii U to Switch scenario... All I will say is good luck MS.

But if the Ps5 Pro is a 4070 in real life comparison 2x that is not that good in a long term point of view? Unless they also add more RAM, way better CPU etc?
This has been my problem with a early Xbox next gen console since we learned that there will be no pro console for Xbox. As long as the Series S exist and is supported by Microsoft their new console will not be pushed to it's full potential, and by the time we go to a PS6, AND the cross gen period that will follow whatever hardware was available from AMD for 2025 will be considered weak. To use some example I replayed Resident Evil 2 remake recently and used the PS5 edition. I liked it, but the jump with Resident Evil 4 remake was obvious. IF Microsoft have a way to have more hardware go to consumers, and I mean by that another console not long after the PS6 is out, then maybe I can see that work. But doing this would mean having a Pro version, and if they refused to do it this gen, doing it next gen when they will enter it in a worse position than they were in 2020 IMHO is weird to me. Unless they looked hard at it and consider that not having a Pro this gen is a mistake and are trying to fix that with this next gen console.
The Pro being "weak" is not that big of a deal because this is a niche product in a sense. It will hopefully sell, and sell well, but the real console this gen is still the PS5. If you want a PS5 Pro, great. If not, you either already have a PS5, will have it when it get cheaper, or are not interested no matter what. This next gen from Xbox will naturally make the Series S/X harder to sell, and as we are not seeing hints of a redesign they are still on a older node and will be incapable to get cheap enough to be competitive long term with a potential superslim PS5 that I think will happen. Sorry for the big wall of text but I am quite curious of this as Xbox is in a hard position and as they have the numbers and predictions on desk I can't understand how they believed that Sony would not have a PS5 Pro to the point of not having any plans themselves just in case.
Agree. Going early or off schedule from Sony when they both use the AMD will just mean each company will always be ahead at certain times with tech advances. One is doing it for a mid gen refresh and more normal time frame for a next gen console. The other is doing it to get a head start on next gen.

The PS6 will have the advantage of 2+ years of tech advancements. MS is trying to get that by launching early. MS still thinks their problem was power....they will never learn.

Interesting times ahead.
 
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HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
But if the Ps5 Pro is a 4070 in real life comparison 2x that is not that good in a long term point of view? Unless they also add more RAM, way better CPU etc?
This has been my problem with a early Xbox next gen console since we learned that there will be no pro console for Xbox. As long as the Series S exist and is supported by Microsoft their new console will not be pushed to it's full potential, and by the time we go to a PS6, AND the cross gen period that will follow whatever hardware was available from AMD for 2025 will be considered weak. To use some example I replayed Resident Evil 2 remake recently and used the PS5 edition. I liked it, but the jump with Resident Evil 4 remake was obvious. IF Microsoft have a way to have more hardware go to consumers, and I mean by that another console not long after the PS6 is out, then maybe I can see that work. But doing this would mean having a Pro version, and if they refused to do it this gen, doing it next gen when they will enter it in a worse position than they were in 2020 IMHO is weird to me. Unless they looked hard at it and consider that not having a Pro this gen is a mistake and are trying to fix that with this next gen console.
The Pro being "weak" is not that big of a deal because this is a niche product in a sense. It will hopefully sell, and sell well, but the real console this gen is still the PS5. If you want a PS5 Pro, great. If not, you either already have a PS5, will have it when it get cheaper, or are not interested no matter what. This next gen from Xbox will naturally make the Series S/X harder to sell, and as we are not seeing hints of a redesign they are still on a older node and will be incapable to get cheap enough to be competitive long term with a potential superslim PS5 that I think will happen. Sorry for the big wall of text but I am quite curious of this as Xbox is in a hard position and as they have the numbers and predictions on desk I can't understand how they believed that Sony would not have a PS5 Pro to the point of not having any plans themselves just in case.
I was going back through some of my chat logs to make sure I was going to get this date right

MS first got wind of the PS5 Pro in Nov of 2019 and yes that date is right

MS did not chase the Pro idea because the powers that be did in fact think the Series X was going to win every VS game comparison against the PS5 that Sony had to make the Pro in order to match the current Series X

Its likely why Spencer said early on the Series X was their Pro console.

Remember the Series S was going to match the PS5 FUD?

Those were what is called marching orders from HQ.
 

DJ12

Member
I was going back through some of my chat logs to make sure I was going to get this date right

MS first got wind of the PS5 Pro in Nov of 2019 and yes that date is right

MS did not chase the Pro idea because the powers that be did in fact think the Series X was going to win every VS game comparison against the PS5 that Sony had to make the Pro in order to match the current Series X

Its likely why Spencer said early on the Series X was their Pro console.

Remember the Series S was going to match the PS5 FUD?

Those were what is called marching orders from HQ.
It beggars belief that fans of the brand want them to continue.

They seem devoid of an actual clue about the business, got lucky when PS3 was released with another agenda and even then still finished 3rd.
 

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
I was going back through some of my chat logs to make sure I was going to get this date right

MS first got wind of the PS5 Pro in Nov of 2019 and yes that date is right

MS did not chase the Pro idea because the powers that be did in fact think the Series X was going to win every VS game comparison against the PS5 that Sony had to make the Pro in order to match the current Series X

Its likely why Spencer said early on the Series X was their Pro console.

Remember the Series S was going to match the PS5 FUD?

Those were what is called marching orders from HQ.
Wow, MS really does focus too much on the power crown. And like I said above ...they still haven't learned ....because that was never the issue. The One X and XSX literally proves that...unless they want to be vastly more powerful than a PlayStation console.

Omg, lol. 2013 really broke some brains. Its mind boggling that it broke some execs brains too.
 

HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
Wow, MS really does focus too much on the power crown. And like I said above ...they still haven't learned ....because that was never the issue. The One X and XSX literally proves that...unless they want to be vastly more powerful than a PlayStation console.

Omg, lol. 2013 really broke some brains. Its mind boggling that it broke some execs brains too.
Someday if I ever stop gaming and don't really care who I piss off I might write a book filled with stories and statements that would really make some people scratch their heads
 

Daneel Elijah

Gold Member
I was going back through some of my chat logs to make sure I was going to get this date right

MS first got wind of the PS5 Pro in Nov of 2019 and yes that date is right

MS did not chase the Pro idea because the powers that be did in fact think the Series X was going to win every VS game comparison against the PS5 that Sony had to make the Pro in order to match the current Series X

Its likely why Spencer said early on the Series X was their Pro console.

Remember the Series S was going to match the PS5 FUD?

Those were what is called marching orders from HQ.
Thanks you very much for your answer. I hope that it will not put you in trouble with your sources of info.

I have no real knowledge of hardware manufacturing so I will not say dates but as I at least know that years are needed to plan and put to retail a console. I am curious about how far Xbox would be in their next one, and how can they make it future proof. We know that Xbox had to be motivated by Epic to put 1GB of RAM in their 360, Sony and Microsoft wanted 4 GB for the Xbox One and PS4 at some point and they managed both to have 8GB at retail. Even the Series X weird RAM disposition is probably the result of them making compromises. As they managed to create the One X after the Xbox one, and most people seems to be very happy about it, I hope that they manage to do the same this time. I consider that like the One X the added power won't be worth the time lost, but if they put something great like (stupid example) HBM memory instead of GDDR it could lead to them having at least one or two games that will push hard and give some of us dreams. I loved the PS3 marketing and believed on the power of the Cell. Even in retrospect I don't consider what Sony told us as lies and games like GTA 5 and TLOU are proof that the PS3 had a huge potential. I hope that at least Xbox next gen console can give us that. I don't ask for info, just putting my thoughts on this.
Still, how can Xbox not understand that with the same vendor, and AMD having a better relationship with Sony that they would not let themselves get beat too much in terms of power? And how much will this mistake follow them? That and their failure to see the PS5 Digital edition, because it hurt their plans pretty hard from the start too IMHO.
As for this thread, Xbox going OEM can go two ways in my mind. Option one is just them using other companies to reduce their exposure and reduce costs. I can see them going to companies like Dell and saying together we can buy more RAM and other stuff and we cna make a deal win/win that way. And behind the scenes pay for having a low cost console still be viable by making sure that the price is not to high. A little like what they did for the SSD storage options on Series S/X.
Option 2 would be some alliance. Xbox going to Tencent or Steam and telling them that together they can be more than they are alone. I could imagine Xbox offering part of their cut in the Xbox ecosystem in exchange of whatever expertise the company would give them. Time will tell, but this year will be critical for Xbox.
 

Killjoy-NL

Member
I said it in this very thread they were doubling down and people wanting Xbox out of the hardware business were going to be disappointed

I knew it was safe to say that because I knew the marching orders were coming for the parrots


The nextbox stats will leak right before the Ps5 Pro launches and will be around 2x the power launching much sooner than the PS6
This would be an extremely dumb and futile idea, tbh.

What kind of hardware will they release? Would most likely be digital-only, as they're starting to quit physical releases.
So they'd have to try and sell a Ouya-like system with practically no retail presence at a time where they're irrelevant.

Would make no sense at all. Then again, it's MS we're talking about.
 

HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
This would be an extremely dumb and futile idea, tbh.

What kind of hardware will they release? Would most likely be digital-only, as they're starting to quit physical releases.
So they'd have to try and sell a Ouya-like system with practically no retail presence at a time where they're irrelevant.

Would make no sense at all. Then again, it's MS we're talking about.
I have no idea what kind of hardware this would be and yeah I agree most likely all digital

Nothing surprises me especially coming from MS

Some likely will remember in the epic next gen thread there were very few of us standing by the Xbox would be more powerful than the PS5 and pretty sure I was saying 15-20% more powerful

What I left out (because its above my pay grade knowledge wise) is MS powers that be thought the way they designed the Seres X it would have a 50% performance boost over PS5

I have said this several times here while watching the Road to PS5 video I remember Ybarra laughing at, and as he put it, so much resources wasted on the PS5 SSD that will have no real world performance boost

So it feels like MS got caught with their pants down and see the writing on the wall that they launch their redesigned Series X at $499 in the same window Sony launches a PS5 Pro

The blood bath would only get worse

Now I wouldn't bet the farm on nextbox coming in '25 or '26 I just know they spent a lot of money investigating the possibility

But I would bet a lot of money they approved this approach
 

Braag

Member
I`d understand MS giving up on the closed hardware ecosystem for good at this point, but I personally hope they just pull through because for us consumers direct competition is always the best.
Would be nice for Sony. $699 digital and $799 disk drive. Pay up or buy whatever Nintendo is doing.
We are experiencing lack of proper competition in GPU market. While AMD has decent cards, their RTX and AI tech isn't as good as Nvidia so NV cards are twice the price they were 6 years ago.
 
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