Haunted
Member
The first "people" being your readers and the second "people" being the publishers having their marketing plans messed with..
Decide who you want to serve and write for, GI.
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MS confirms indie program for XB1, was a big GamesCom surprise, angry at GI for leak
- Thread starter chubigans
- Start date
Decide who you want to serve and write for, GI.
Arkam
Member
miDnIghtEr20C
Banned
So you think that... I don't.
Who's right? We don't know, but I'd imagine that all business decisions made are because of word of mouth being bad, and money.
dragonbane
Member
Then why is this feature not ready for launch and Whitten said it is only "the vision" for now? This can only mean they started working on it rather recently, otherwise it would be a bit more concrete than just a vision. Also why hold it back and not announce it at E3? They sure as hell needed it there after all the backlash.
I'm pretty sure this a reaction to both Sony and Indie pressure in general. Same with the 180 and pre-order numbers pressure.
Kenshin001
Member
They changed their policy on DRM.
They changed their policy on patching fees after Sony did.
Indies can not self publish on XBLA at this moment. They have to find a publisher, they have to see if a publisher has an open slot available. On PSN devs can and do self publish. How is it not changing their policy?
Future PhaZe
Member
They are doing a good job
Really frustrating that they couldn't have come out the gate with this kind of mindset
Better than taking as long as it took for Sony to wake up with Ps3 I guess, but I hope it's not too late for them.
Really frustrating that they couldn't have come out the gate with this kind of mindset
Better than taking as long as it took for Sony to wake up with Ps3 I guess, but I hope it's not too late for them.
WrenchNinja
Member
Have you actually looked through his history?
Speaking of Kinect, I'm kind of reminded of all those hobbyist kinect developers with crazy kinect apps that went viral a while back. I bet giving everyone access to kinect with a good API would lead to a lot of interesting kinect related indie apps on xbox one. Like these, http://www.kinecthacks.com/top-10-best-kinect-hacks/
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
When you compare their tactic of obfuscation, attempted fuckery, and double talk with Sony's recent policy of being relatively open and straightforward while implementing policies from day one that were both forward-thinking and consumer-focused, you might start to see why people aren't quite ready to forgive and forget Microsoft, and why people seem more warm and fuzzy toward Sony.
Hell, we don't even have many confirmed details regarding the Xbone's innards, for fuck's sake.
yeah thanks though
No probs
I guess. But if this proposition proves to be stronger than Sony's, which right now, it definitely does, then who knows what'll happen.
This is pretty obviously a reactionary move after the luke-warm response the X1 has been getting. I wish everything coming out of Microsoft wasn't so cryptic (and often deceitful).
Eagerly awaiting further details on this "every console is a dev kit" because it's clearly not as simple as that.
Eagerly awaiting further details on this "every console is a dev kit" because it's clearly not as simple as that.
boredandlazy
Member
How so?No probs
I guess. But if this proposition proves to be stronger than Sony's, which right now, it definitely does, then who knows what'll happen.
Fox Mulder
Member
Good.
I still hate the forced kinect, but it's nice to see them change features before launch. It took Sony awhile to turn the ps3 around after it launched.
I still hate the forced kinect, but it's nice to see them change features before launch. It took Sony awhile to turn the ps3 around after it launched.
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
Why is it stronger than Sony's?No probs
I guess. But if this proposition proves to be stronger than Sony's, which right now, it definitely does, then who knows what'll happen.
Kenshin001
Member
You can use the console itself as a devkit.
miDnIghtEr20C
Banned
probably because they're still adjusting them. sony hit them hard with that 8 gig ddr5.
I don't know man.. I guess put me on the team that thinks both consoles are going to be awesome this next gen. I can't wait for both.
Delusibeta
Banned
Presumably a reference to "every console is a dev kit" which blatantly has a catch Microsoft hasn't mentioned. Plus, he's also assuming this isn't XBLIGv2.
No probs
I guess. But if this proposition proves to be stronger than Sony's, which right now, it definitely does, then who knows what'll happen.
How is it stronger than Sony's. Or Nintendo for that matter. It's just self publishing. Prettly much all of this is in line with what Sony has been doing for the past few years regarding indies.
The biggest news is the Xb1 being a devkit. Either way both features aren't even ready for launch.
Being able to use regular xbones is an advantage, and if cert/selling works like the windows store that again would be an advantage over the Sony setup.
They're not adjusting anything. The specs are set in stone but they're not outlining them in detail because they're substantially weaker than the PS4.
It's not stronger, at least not right now, but it's a good start. Sony has just been giving full PS4 dev kits out to indies like candy. Depending on what the requirements are for the XBO development it could have a significant impact but it won't be felt for a while. Who knows how long it'll take to get it up and running and if Microsoft can repair their burnt bridges.
boredandlazy
Member
While that does sound cool in theory, I'd wait for details before championing that feature too much.
People have pointed out that Sony's been giving dev kits for free, so it's not really much of one.
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
If they're still tweaking, they aren't launching until 2014. It takes time to manufacture, box, and ship these things.
The only hints we've got is members of their team saying the purposely designed the console to not be the most powerful and saying that numbers don't matter. And there was that Reddit AMA with someone who claimed (and was confirmed by Reddit) to be a member of the Xbone team who said the PS4 is more powerful. But we want details, and I think we deserve them if they expect us to throw half a grand at their machine.
dragonbane
Member
The only clear advantage I can currently see is the devkit thing? Is there something else Sony doesn't do? Because while this feature is pretty awesome, we will have to see all the details on that first before celebrating as multiple people already noted that retail units are not capable of replacing devkit units completely. Also Sony gives out real devkits for free if your work shows any kind of promise, so while MS's strategy seems to be wider reaching, I don't think Sony will fall behind.
So everyone that wants to develop for PS4 gets a free dev kit? Where do I sign up?
Because every Xbox One is a devkit. And every PlayStation 4 isn't.
Sony's not going to be giving free devkits to every single one of their users who wants to develop games for its platform.
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
Members of Sony's team have pointed out it starts for many indies by simply shooting them a tweet.
Good luck!
Cancelling my Amazon pre-order as we speak.
Well, you're not going to wanna buy games by every one of them, either.
I love how this has been used as a negative of late. Weeks before E3: Bender.gif and "Yeah but how many are Kinect game shit?"
After E3: So where was Kinect Microsoft? We are so interested in seeing Kinect games now.
The internet's response to Kinect in general is the reason why Kinect Sports Rivals, Zoo Tycoon, Fantasia, and any inclusion in 1st party games were shoved to the side for later. Personally I'm happy to see less Kinect Kinect Kinect garbage infesting threads of late.
Kinect Instinct...ugh.
and yet this feature isn't available at launch. Plus I'm taking a wait and see approach with this. MS is promising a lot with this we have to wait and see how it's implemented. I don't see a lot of indies going batshit crazy about all of this either.
Free PS4s for everyone. This is great.
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
And you honestly think Microsoft will host every single one of the garbage games average bozos come up with on their Xbones?
And an Xbone dev kit is meaningless if many of their backward policies are still in place regarding things like slots and forced exclusivity. Devs will just take their games elsewhere.
While this is a step forward and another good move by Microsoft, I just can't shake the rubbish they tried to force upon me. I mean, this is why I will stick with my PS4. Sony have been honest, open and looks to have developed an amazing console. Even with this great news, I jut have a feeling deep down that its only because they have to, and not because the want to. I had this feeling with Sony back in 05-06 and that's why I went 360. Now I feel the tables have turned.
Much better tools would be one.
Delusibeta
Banned
Oh, this old chestnut again. Leaving aside hardware restrictions and app store ghettos etc, the problem is that the number of people who wants to develop games for a platform is far greater than the number of people who have to ability to develop games people want to play or buy for said platform. For everyone else, there's Kongregate.
phosphor112
Banned
So this every console is a devkit thing kind of confirms the limitations that they are putting on the console. You can't have the libraries loaded and use the console to the maximum capacity.
If it passes some kind of basic cert process I don't see why not.
infiniteheteroskdasticity
Member
Not really a surprise. There have been some heavy hints in this direction for some time. Slightly off topic but as someone that followed the last transition closely I find the fact that Microsoft have had a lot of their big announcements leaked ahead of time surprising. Even more surprising is that Sony appear to be running an extremely tight ship with few consequential leaks of their own so far. This is a complete turnaround and somewhat emblematic of the larger apparent role reversal between the two.
Beautifully Shaped Monsters
Member
Wasn't every XBox 360 touted as a devkit since you could run unsigned code on it if you signed up for the developer program, XNA or something like that?
I remember getting a spiel while I was at uni.
I remember getting a spiel while I was at uni.
I think they will, for better or worse. I think it'll be similar to the Windows 8 store. As long as you have a dev license and your app passes a few basic tests, it goes on the store.
iceatcs
Junior Member
Yeah, it is quite telling.
At least it is great for anyone cannot afford another thousand just for debug.
dragonbane
Member
Let's wait for the details first, because I somehow doubt a retail unit will be able to replace a much more expansive devkit.
If the work of your team shows promise, contact the Sony dudes on twitter. You have a very high chance of getting one. Otherwise they will probably still allow you to publish to PSM, similar to Vita.
Oh no, I know that. You can only play so many games of 'Try Not To Fart'.
Gaikai isn't available at launch either. It's not unusual. I think this will bring in a new generation of indie developers who've found a home on smartphone platforms, who can now move into the living room onto a massive ecosystem like Xbox LIVE.
It's an uncurated system I think, isn't it? I guess the only reason they'd block a game's sale is if it violated certain content restrictions. And no, those policies seem to be on the way out of this approach.
Oh yeah, that's true. But it's lowering the barrier to entry for everyone, which is undoubtedly a good thing.
Marc Whitten seems to think it can. But I guess he would.
The Apple App store does. So does the Windows 8 app store. And the Windows Phone 8 app store, and Google Play.
So did XBox Live Indie Games.
The market is full of examples of this happening, including Microsoft's own products. What on earth makes you think that they won't do it on their next console, too?
Yes, I've done it. Not sure it was "unsigned code", though. Pretty sure it got signed and would only work on your console until it got published.
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
Maybe you're seeing different responses from different users around the web.
I've always been down on the whole Kinect thing. Because even if Microsoft spins themselves dizzy with these 180s that are basically only putting them on somewhat even ground with PS4, until they drop the price, spike the console's power, and drop that shitty camera in favor of focusing on more accurate, 1:1 input methods (i.e. controllers), I'm not interested in what they're selling.
Different strokes for different folks.
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