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Analyst: If Xbox One Tanks, It Could Be Microsoft's Last Console

Consoles felt more like proprietary boxes that felt like they offered their own unique flavor compared with pc gaming. MS's "consoles" felt like more straightforward pc boxes. Not to mention they brought genres normally more prédominent on pc's to consoles.

Instead of having two different, unique options, both platforms became more like each other and things feel more redundant as a result.

There wasn't really a choice back then tho. PC technology just did not have the brute power to provide satisfying gaming experiences, and there was no universal OS worth a shit like Windows at the time (95 was buggy as hell). Industry standards weren't as widespread either b/c the technology pool was so vast, out of necessity.

But I'm constantly impressed with what was done given those circumstances. I've read some interesting stories on devs using the Saturn's sound chip for graphics rendering and stuff like that can be appreciated even if you aren't an engineer. But since the industry's at a point where PC technology can more or less achieve the grandest visions and OS overhead can cover most hard low-level functions, it just makes more business sense to get "pedestrian".

I don't like it any more than you do but that's what it is. It'll be very fun seeing the PS3 homebrew scene down the line tho.

Your issue sounds more of something to chuck at Western devs, not MS. They definitely rode the Xbox tide to get beyond the PC market, but if they wanted to follow Japanese design they could've done so. They just don't want to. I don't think MS went "Okay, and we'll put the Every-Game-Is-PC-Game chip on the main bus here." or something like that.
 
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Caronte

Member
this will be the last generation of consoles for all these trashy companies and their unsustainable business models


handhelds are already burried, and now the console days are numbered, count them one by one

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Just because mobile gaming makes more money doesn't mean that traditional gaming is dead. They don't have the same audience. As long as traditional gaming is profitable it will continue to exist.
 

Finalizer

Member

neo_whoa_1.png


EDIT:

Just to make sure, jokes regarding the cloud and Titanfall are ban worthy now?
See:
While these memes do little to contribute to intelligent discussion, and now they set a distinctly negative tone to essentially every thread they are used in, it is the fact that they were the 1st and 2nd responses to a new thread is what got the users banned. I equate that to shouting "FIRST" in reply to a new topic. They are not banned phrases per se, but tossing them out as a kneejerk response to anything MS related has run its course.
 
I hope everyone rooting for Xbox ones demise remembers that without the 360 there would be no PS4 as you know it.

Competition only serves the consumer.
 
I hope everyone rooting for Xbox ones demise remembers that without the 360 there would be no PS4 as you know it.

Competition only serves the consumer.
While true, the Xbox success is also why multiplayer is locked behind a paywall on the PS4. Its not so black and white.
 
Why on earth do people keep saying this? Who introduced paid p2p online gaming? Who tried to force always online? Who attempted to disable used games being playable? Who keeps basic things like web browsing behind a paywall?

Competition is usually good for the consumer, but MS doesn't keep anyone in check with their anti-consumer policies

This is what Microsoft was trying to do while having competition. If Microsoft had no competition then who knows what sort of things they would do?

People also say how great Microsoft has helped online gaming. Now only PC and Wii U will have free online this generation. Thank you based Microsoft for advances in pay to play online.
 
I hope everyone rooting for Xbox ones demise remembers that without the 360 there would be no PS4 as you know it.

.

You're right , we wouldn't have to pay to play online.

Competition is good, but when one player in the market just drags standards down for everyone else you wonder if it doesn't do more harm than good.

Wether ms stays in the console business or not, everyone loses, monopoly or anti consumer corporate AAA garbage , pick your poison.
 

Replicant

Member
MS is my least favorite company. Never had a pleasant experience with any of their non-gaming products (IE, Word, XP, etc) or their customer service. Their anti-consumer policy for gamers may have been aborted for now but to me that just shows how little they respect their customers until their profit line is in danger. I won't shed a tear if they leave the video game industry and while I'm at it, the browser business as well.

There will always be a new player coming. Xbox as a brand probably won't die. I'd be more than happy to support it if another company takes it over.
 

Sushen

Member
Someone will take Microsoft's spot. It's ridiculous to think that Microsoft leaving the game would lead to an industry-wide crash.

(Also, it's really not necessary to capitalize every word.)
Someone has, aka mobile gaming: iOS and android. I'm sure gaming industry will be fine without MS, although I'll miss them.
 
I hope everyone rooting for Xbox ones demise remembers that without the 360 there would be no PS4 as you know it.

Competition only serves the consumer.
Eh, this just feels like a boilerplate response at this point. Like things are actually that black and white.
 

CoG

Member
I hope everyone rooting for Xbox ones demise remembers that without the 360 there would be no PS4 as you know it.

Competition only serves the consumer.

If Microsoft bellies up someone else will take their place just like when Sega jumped ship. Hopefully it would be a company that truly tries to innovate, not one that sits on its lazy ass and moneyhats for timed exclusive DLC for the big dudebro titles.
 
I hope it is their last. It was fantastic for gamers when there was just 1 dominant console (NES, SNES, PS2 eras).

Microsoft needs to sell off the Xbox division and get back to making Windows great.
 
While these memes do little to contribute to intelligent discussion, and now they set a distinctly negative tone to essentially every thread they are used in, it is the fact that they were the 1st and 2nd responses to a new thread is what got the users banned. I equate that to shouting "FIRST" in reply to a new topic. They are not banned phrases per se, but tossing them out as a kneejerk response to anything MS related has run its course.

This is nothing new or MS specific: those comments are kind of run of the mill as far as "first posts" go.

I hope it is their last. It was fantastic for gamers when there was just 1 dominant console (NES, SNES, PS2 eras).

Microsoft needs to sell off the Xbox division and get back to making Windows great.

SNES wasn't really dominant: it "won", but Genesis was kinda always right behind it.

When was it ever great?!

XP, 7
 
If looking just at the losses over time of Sony and MS they are both at risk of loosing their gaming divisions

Looking a Nintendo's profits over time it is the most financially stable in comparison
 

"D"

I'm extremely insecure with how much f2p mobile games are encroaching on Nintendo
Honestly I feel like Microsoft leaving the industry would be a good and a bad thing. A good thing cause with them attempting their now 180'd policies, Nintendo and Sony seen from their mistake and know that the consumer has more of a voice than they probably expected, so any type of stuff MS might've pushed....they know it won't fly if they try the same. Also since MS seems to cater heavily to the dudebro and typical American consumer, it would allow companies a chance to be more innovative and put more of a variety of games out, instead of hopelessly chasing CoD/Halo/Gears type numbers or whomever is in the top spot for sales. Bad because maybe it will affect competition, but I don't think it will be catastrophic like most people believe. We were fine when it was just Nintendo and Sony for a bit. We had VARIETY. Online wasn't what it is now, but at least Sony had a foot in the door with their network adapter.

I don't see why people think Sony will just lose their minds and go on some Machiavellian rule when at the end of the day it still kinda IS up to us what is gonna sell if we buy it or not. There's still other avenues for video gaming, although I can imagine while people wouldn't want to be faced with just Nintendo and PC. We seem to forget that Sony has to be aware of the climate of market and economy and things like that, so making another overpriced monster isn't gonna fly and making crappy games that aren't that good won't bring home the bacon either.
 
I actually wonder if this would not only be good for the gaming industry, but MS themselves. Microsoft is a software company! It's what they are good at. Their hardware ventures have been largely disaster. IMO MS would be much better suited staying in the games industry as a publisher, like EA. leave the hardware to people who know this stuff?

Anyone else agree?
 

Godslay

Banned
I actually wonder if this would not only be good for the gaming industry, but MS themselves. Microsoft is a software company! It's what they are good at. Their hardware ventures have been largely disaster. IMO MS would be much better suited staying in the games industry as a publisher, like EA. leave the hardware to people who know this stuff?

Anyone else agree?

Why would it be good for the gaming industry? Less hardware options for devs to have their software on. That sounds great.

As far as MS being a software company does the converse apply? Sony is a hardware company, they should just pump out hardware and let someone else create the software to run it. Come on, doesn't make sense when it's on the other foot, does it?

If it's not apparent that MS wants at least some control over the hardware they put their software on, you are clearly missing the point. The more hardware platforms they can publish to, the better for them. They are a very good software company, but that doesn't mean that they can't continue to improve in the hardware area. Their console hardware has been very good. Xbox was a beast, 360 was a nice piece of kit when it released (yes aside from the rrod, purely hardware potential), and we won't know what the X1 is capable of until we have head to head comparisons.

But yeah, MS should just give up.
 

"D"

I'm extremely insecure with how much f2p mobile games are encroaching on Nintendo
I'm just trying to understand what the major attachment to Xbox is besides Live. I know that Halo and Forza and such may be good games but I don't think a literally less than a handful of games can justify an entire console. Nintendo and Sony stomps MS in the dirt many times over in first party games, with Nintendo reigning over all three in sheer amount of first party IPs. Live is good, but eventually Sony was going to catch up. Now, other that the entertainment features and a few exclusives, what does Xbox really have to offer?

Having TV is fine but in my opinion its a dying media. Most people I know, including myself, literally live off of Netflix and Hulu. Its no secret that the tv cable companies were trying to make deals with whomever they could get in bed with, hell I used to work for Verizon and WE even had a partnership with Time Warner (our local cable provider) for home cable services with internet. The internet side of things is doing fine but regular cable/digital cable isn't. Most hit shows can be streamed from the channel's website or has a streaming contract with Netflix or Hulu anyway. All thats left is a console with 3-6 maybe current exclusives before the next gen really starts to take off, and the bulk of the rest of their sales coming from forcing Live on folks to really enjoy their console, and multiplatform games you can get anywhere else.
 

Godslay

Banned
I'm just trying to understand what the major attachment to Xbox is besides Live. I know that Halo and Forza and such may be good games but I don't think a literally less than a handful of games can justify an entire console. Nintendo and Sony stomps MS in the dirt many times over in first party games, with Nintendo reigning over all three in sheer amount of first party IPs. Live is good, but eventually Sony was going to catch up. Now, other that the entertainment features and a few exclusives, what does Xbox really have to offer?

Having TV is fine but in my opinion its a dying media. Most people I know, including myself, literally live off of Netflix and Hulu. Its no secret that the tv cable companies were trying to make deals with whomever they could get in bed with, hell I used to work for Verizon and WE even had a partnership with Time Warner (our local cable provider) for home cable services with internet. The internet side of things is doing fine but regular cable/digital cable isn't. Most hit shows can be streamed from the channel's website or has a streaming contract with Netflix or Hulu anyway. All thats left is a console with 3-6 maybe current exclusives before the next gen really starts to take off, and the bulk of the rest of their sales coming from forcing Live on folks to really enjoy their console, and multiplatform games you can get anywhere else.

If you lump Sony and Nintendo together, then yeah the first party offerings are going to make Microsoft look paltry in comparison. Nintendo first party offerings make Sony's offerings look weak in comparison too.

Microsoft's IPs and Sony's IPs are very comparable. What they have together is that 3rd parties want to publish on both of their platforms to reach both audiences. I think you are missing that there is somewhat of a parity between the two platforms, both in 1st and 3rd parties offerings. I'd give the slight edge to Sony, but they've had more time to establish franchises, so of course they are going to have more to offer at this point in time.

It's not a given that Sony catches up on the online side. They are trying but given what we've seen MS is still growing their online infrastructure. Dedicated servers, additional media capabilities, and budding partnerships (NFL) are going to put additional distance between the two.

As to the TV as a dying medium, maybe so in the long run, as it stands right now TV isn't going anywhere.
 

Valente

Neo Member
I hope everyone rooting for Xbox ones demise remembers that without the 360 there would be no PS4 as you know it.

Competition only serves the consumer.

This man speaks truth. Imagine if Microsoft had never gotten into the console business what online console gaming would be like today. Even though they have shit the bed with The One, they have done a lot right in the past. No one stays top dog or the fan favorite forever.
 
I'm just trying to understand what the major attachment to Xbox is besides Live. I know that Halo and Forza and such may be good games but I don't think a literally less than a handful of games can justify an entire console. Nintendo and Sony stomps MS in the dirt many times over in first party games, with Nintendo reigning over all three in sheer amount of first party IPs. Live is good, but eventually Sony was going to catch up. Now, other that the entertainment features and a few exclusives, what does Xbox really have to offer?
Been thinking about this lately, and when you consider games like Gears of War, Halo, and even Crackdown you see at minimum a strong focus on co-op campaigns in addition to co-op modes, which I love.

Here we are with launch coming up and where are the big exclusive co-op games? And where are the PS3 exclusive co-op games?

Basically, what I'm saying is co-op. It was nice to see the attempt in Ascension though.
 

Phreak47

Member
Boy... memes rise, crash, and burn all when I'm not looking nowadays.

In my day, it was "All your base" this and "I've got balls of steel" that. And people rejoiced and were happy with this simple and carefree life.
 
Name a better OS than XP or 7.

Windows 8, which whether people want to admit it or not is just an improved version of Windows 7 that runs much better and has some take it or leave it extra features :p

Linux and MacOS are much more stable.

Being the ONLY choice (which is what 7 and XP were) does NOT make them GREAT.

What does stable mean? Virus free? Optimized? MacOS is rather limited in terms of what you can control and any perceived stability comes from Apple's stranglehold over the hardware given they're the only ones to make macs. And which linux? There are many, many variations.

Windows in general is approachable, visually attractive, and is very customizable. What has been bested so definitely by competitors?
 

cornerman

Member
This man speaks truth. Imagine if Microsoft had never gotten into the console business what online console gaming would be like today. Even though they have shit the bed with The One, they have done a lot right in the past. No one stays top dog or the fan favorite forever.

There's no doubt that Xbox Live has had some impact on the direction of PSN. But we have no way of knowing how things would have evolved without it. There are all sorts of variables that we know and don't know of that influence business decisions. We have no idea what could have been, but we have a better chance at determining things through hindsight.

Its no doubt that MS's ascension provided Sony some lessons:
  • The value and danger of 3rd party reliability
  • The downside of extravagant hardware architecture
  • The importance of community
  • The realities of being a year behind

I think a lot of the services were an inevitability. A number of Sony's strategic weaknesses were exposed by having competition. I think it was less of MS being this big innovative beast, but more of them representing the power of the basics. They mirrored a lot of Sony's early tactics, but K.I.S.S.'d them. While these are all companies out to make a profit (nothing wrong with that), they always seem to keep that money-first/customer second vibe in the forefront.

When I look at MS, the big question to me is how much do they plan to invest in the industry...and I don't mean financially. They always seem to be focused on the masses, on what's trending, on what's proven with relation to games. They sheltered a lot of studios at the beginning of the current gen; studios that could have matured greatly by now. They've got a new untested batch, and I wonder how vested they are in them. They are reaching in areas outside of games, and I'm ok with that; but I prefer the market leader in the games industry to be game-centric. The industry together covers the continuum...Nintendo is like the link to our heritage, guardians of nostalgia, Sony takes a little bit of everything while ever-pushing for new experiences, and MS plays for the masses giving competition to Sony, bettering them in the process. That's how I see it anyway.

But with regards to the topic...a friend has this debate (well more of a discussion) with me often. He says that MS makes money off of Live and basically the Xbox, but not enough to outpace its investment. So in other words you can tout bringing $2.1 billion in revenue, but if you spent $3 billion, then its still a loss. His claim was that this is story of Xbox, and the reason why some feel it doesn't justify its existence. According to him, the 360 has been mostly a loss...and this is likely at its apex of popularity. It won't enjoy the benefits of a year long lead and thus was guaranteed erosion. Given that fact, we surmised that MS assumed they would lose some folks to competition. And if they weren't making enough at the apex, then they'd need to make more money off the folks that they did have...which is where we believed the DRM fiasco and TV wide net casual appeal gained acceptance. Once this proved unacceptable, they reverted back, but my guess is that there will be a strong push to migrate consumers to being online (games like TtianFall being online only, KI's scaleable delivery methods, Fable Legends, Forza's tracks and cars). Games will be more tailored to online. If this is indeed their plight, it seems to me that if the TV strategy doesn't take off; then its going to be difficult for them regain what they had before let along exceed it. They've got stiffer competition this time.
 

cornerman

Member
Windows 8..

Using it now and its a stable OS, seems just as good as 7. I think most of the issues reside with the user interface. Its not as intuitive and makes some tasks a little more drawn out. Using it with a touchpad is aggravating for me. But I think the upcoming update will help things out a lot.

The start menu, conceptually, is a good idea...especially for casual users. Its just that from time to time you'll be at odds with it when you need to do tinker with options (go a layer below)
 
Using it now and its a stable OS, seems just as good as 7. I think most of the issues reside with the user interface. Its not as intuitive and makes some tasks a little more drawn out. Using it with a touchpad is aggravating for me. But I think the upcoming update will help things out a lot.

The start menu, conceptually, is a good idea...especially for casual users. Its just that from time to time you'll be at odds with it when you need to do tinker with options (go a layer below)

What do you find less intuitive? If anything the improvements to general usability are my favorite things. It features all of the old desktop shortcuts and also introduces a key combination(windows+x, or right click bottom left corner) that allows instantaneous access to admin functions such as command prompt, run, programs and features, etc. It's so much faster to use than any Windows os to date, and arguably any other one I've tried.

Metro isn't what I'd call a 'take it or leave it feature'.
Given it can be completely ignored or even replaced it's exactly what I'd call a take it or leave feature. You can either use it and certain applications(I personally use the music and mail apps often) or completely ignore it and stick to the desktop portion which is an improved version of Windows 7. Nothing has been removed and further short cuts have been added. If one really wants the old start system back one can do so but start has been one of the slower ways to open things for a long time.
 

Pacioli

Neo Member
How would we change channels on the television if XBox we no longer around ? That would be a sad days folks.
 

Godslay

Banned
Linux and MacOS are much more stable.

Being the ONLY choice (which is what 7 and XP were) does NOT make them GREAT.

Figured as much. I've used multiple variants of Linux with my personal favorite being OpenSuse which I ran on for several years. I'm not getting into a religious war here, but I don't think any Linux variant is better than XP or 7 for that matter. There is much more to a great OS than just stability.


Windows 8, which whether people want to admit it or not is just an improved version of Windows 7 that runs much better and has some take it or leave it extra features :p



What does stable mean? Virus free? Optimized? MacOS is rather limited in terms of what you can control and any perceived stability comes from Apple's stranglehold over the hardware given they're the only ones to make macs. And which linux? There are many, many variations.

Windows in general is approachable, visually attractive, and is very customizable. What has been bested so definitely by competitors?

I didn't throw 8 out there, because I didn't want to hear the complaining about the UI.
 

MYE

Member
the traditional living room is dead

this is not 1998 anymore. Kids want ipads, not a fisherprice looking 2ds. the current big three in this industry are dinosaurs and the most ass backward companies in the field. the second Google or Apple bats an eye at them it will be a steamroll

lol
 
Spring/fall of 2015? Will there even be an interest for the game by then?

It depends on the growth of the two platforms at that time. If the price gap is still there and the PS4 has the momentum on that advantage, the interest will be there and grow even more. If the XboxOne becomes a more enticing and affordable investment in comparison, then the interest won't grow by much, but will likely still be there for those whose only option is the PS4.

This isn't quite like the Diablo 3 situation when a game and genre that isn't traditionally available for that type of platform [read: console] comes out unbidden. A game like Titanfall should not have that sort of issue if the PS4 is doing leaps and bounds (for a $400 system).
 
the traditional living room is dead

this is not 1998 anymore. Kids want ipads, not a fisherprice looking 2ds. the current big three in this industry are dinosaurs and the most ass backward companies in the field. the second Google or Apple bats an eye at them it will be a steamroll

No they don't. Mobile games are the new addicting games we grew up with in the 00's. Kids still love the traditional vidya game model.
 

spisho

Neo Member
MacOS is rather limited in terms of what you can control and any perceived stability comes from Apple's stranglehold over the hardware given they're the only ones to make macs.
Driver stability is a plus on OS X. Windows is okay, and Linux has it the worst.

As for control, if you're referring to UI, Windows by default is pretty limited. I mean what's more limiting than Metro? On Windows and Mac OS X you can install third party apps to customize looks and behaviour, so really it's somewhat moot. That being said I find that Apple does a great job with its UI. Windows tends to be a mess with several different metaphors trying to rule the roost. Linux is chaotic, so it's up to the user to experiment.

I'm not going to knock Windows, but I much prefer *nix and the Mac UI.

OT OS warz aside:
It's not a given that Sony catches up on the online side. They are trying but given what we've seen MS is still growing their online infrastructure. Dedicated servers, additional media capabilities, and budding partnerships (NFL) are going to put additional distance between the two.
Some are assuming that MS are providing free dedicated servers for all online titles, but MS haven't been clear on this so we'll see. Sony have been offering dedicated servers for first party titles on their free online service for years whereas XBL has been paid p2p. With the mandatory PS+ fee Sony are promising even better online infrastructure as a result.

Given what we've seen from Sony recently I wouldn't say they were behind MS; I'd even say they're ahead strategically with Gaikai.
 
Given what we've seen from Sony recently I wouldn't say they were behind MS, I'd even say they're ahead strategically with Gaikai.

We haven't seen anything about Gaikai yet. It's still essentially a concept (since we've seen nothing), and we've been given these type of pitches by Sony in the past that didn't quite pan out. I hope Gaikai is everything we hope it to be and more, but we can't really count on it until we see something of it.
 

spisho

Neo Member
We haven't seen anything about Gaikai yet. It's still a concept, and we've been given these type of pitches by Sony in the past that didn't quite pan out. I hope Gaikai is everything we hope it to be and more, but we can't really count on it until we see something of it.
We know a lot about Gaikai from before the Sony purchase, and the tech is already part of the PS4's remote play. Other Gaikai features such as download while you play are going to work day one.
 

Godslay

Banned
Some are assuming that MS are providing free dedicated servers for all online titles, but MS haven't been clear on this so we'll see. Sony have been offering dedicated servers for first party titles on their free online service for years whereas XBL has been paid p2p. With the mandatory PS+ fee Sony are promising even better online infrastructure as a result.

Given what we've seen from Sony recently I wouldn't say they were behind MS; I'd even say they're ahead strategically with Gaikai.

Azure.

That one word should explain it, but I'll leave you with a Respawn Entertainment employee article on the topic (which I'm sure some will attempt to discredit since they are developing a game for MS):

So what is this Xbox Live Cloud stuff then?

Microsoft has a cloud service called Azure (it’s a real thing – you can go on their website right now and pay for servers and use them to run whatever you want). Microsoft realized that they could use that technology to solve our problem.

So they built this powerful system to let us create all sorts of tasks that they will run for us, and it can scale up and down automatically as players come and go. We can upload new programs for them to run and they handle the deployment for us. And they’ll host our game servers for other platforms, too! Titanfall uses the Xbox Live Cloud to run dedicated servers for PC, Xbox One, and Xbox 360.

But it’s not just for dedicated servers – Microsoft thought about our problem in a bigger way. Developers aren’t going to just want dedicated servers – they’ll have all kinds of features that need a server to do some kind of work to make games better. Look at Forza 5, which studies your driving style in order to create custom AI that behaves like you do. That’s totally different from what Titanfall uses it for, and it’s really cool! So it’s not accurate to say that the Xbox Live Cloud is simply a system for running dedicated servers – it can do a lot more than that.

Full read here:
http://www.respawn.com/news/lets-talk-about-the-xbox-live-cloud/
 
Driver stability is a plus on OS X. Windows is okay, and Linux has it the worst.

As for control, if you're referring to UI, Windows by default is pretty limited. I mean what's more limiting than Metro? On Windows and Mac OS X you can install third party apps to customize looks and behaviour, so really it's somewhat moot. That being said I find that Apple does a great job with its UI. Windows tends to be a mess with several different metaphors trying to rule the roost. Linux is chaotic, so it's up to the user to experiment.

I'm not going to knock Windows, but I much prefer *nix and the Mac UI.

Metro isn't windows 8 though, it's one part of it. The desktop portion is the same fully featured, easily customizable product as ever. And by control I just mean general functionality. Apple tries to make the OS as smooth as possible so basic features are hidden away, file directories and installed files are nonsensically listed, nearly everything is locked off without giving specific admin access, etc. I just find it a pain to use in general because I feel apple in an effort to make it simple to use makes anything other than basic browsing very difficult. Their touchpad commands are second to none through in terms of ease and design if that's what one is using though. Really can't speak much for linux just because of how vast the amount of versions is. I've tried Ubuntu and that's it.

As you said though, suppose it's all off-topic :D
 
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