polyh3dron
Banned
Oh the whole misinterpreting thing.You'll also have to elaborate where the irony lies (but not the salt).
Oh the whole misinterpreting thing.You'll also have to elaborate where the irony lies (but not the salt).
I am not being obtuse. I've had one point and I've stuck to it. It's your problem that you cannot understand it or rather would prefer it to mean something else. If you think my original post should not have been made, then you are wrong. Any community, be it music, film, TV, etc. where this situation would come up or could come up, it should be made the same there. But on that note, do we legitimately see nearly as much anonymous hate towards minorities there as we see in the gaming communities? On TV it's usually hating people for disagreements on TV shows.
Oh the whole misinterpreting thing.
This discussion relates to the gaming community and other communities using anonymity on the Internet in order to be fucktards. That article, while a fair point on the music industry in general, is not relevant to the subject of anonymity or even the community as much as it is the producers of rap content.
Absolutely. Maybe you don't see it because you aren't as involved in other communities. The other day they crowned an Indian Miss America and there was a flood of racist tweets and comments on news/blogs sites.
Every community has very loud bigots. Hell, everyone here likely has them somewhere in their families.
He said that it was trivial, that he would have shrugged it off, and said that she was acting like a "special snowflake" for becoming upset.
That wasn't a community though; that was an uncoordinated group of people with a similar interest (racism). I doubt that the people saying all of those things were huge Miss America fans for the most part.
People, we have to remember that she TRIED to resolve it in private and was refused access. Public shaming wasn't her first option that she took.
Aside from apparently people at the show floor not revealing presenter's name, I do not remember that.
Were there private messages to the presenter, Eurogamer expo's organizers, Microsoft etc before that? I do not remember that being mentioned.
And people have to remember we only have her word on how she tried to resolve it privately, despite what she said we have no idea if she said "I want to speak to the presenter please" and that's it, or if she went into full detail and said "I want to complain about the presenter, I'm a woman and he referred to me as a man and that person, it made me feel small, terrible and humiliated - this isn't right and I would like if possible to speak to him about it".People, we have to remember that she TRIED to resolve it in private and was refused access. Public shaming wasn't her first option that she took.
Oh really? And what makes you qualified to determine what's a community and what's not?
I hereby declare that all the hate the journalist got was not from gamers, but from an uncoordinated group of people with a similar interest (Transphobia). In fact, I doubt most of those people on Twitter game at all.
And people have to remember we only have her word on how she tried to resolve it privately, despite what she said we have no idea if she said "I want to speak to the presenter please" and that's it, or if she went into full detail and said "I want to complain about the presenter, I'm a woman and he referred to me as a man and that person, it made me feel small, terrible and humiliated - this isn't right and I would like if possible to speak to him about it".
I'd bet the handlers get a lot of requests to speak to the presenters and they all get turned away, due to her changes in story I just don't think we can take her word on how she initially tried to complain about it.
But lets say she did try the latter way, you don't go from a first option of reasonable request of complaint (to speak to the presenter), to a second option of public naming/shaming, lying about what they said, affecting someone's career and opening them up to a lot of hate messages (what she actually did).
That wasn't a community though; that was an uncoordinated group of people with a similar interest (racism). I doubt that the people saying all of those things were huge Miss America fans for the most part.
We can observe a history of misogyny, transphobia, homophobia, and racism in the gaming community. There's documented evidence of active participation by the gaming community in all of these things. I've provided numerous examples. Care to show that a strong connection exists between the racists re: Miss America?
That wasn't a community though; that was an uncoordinated group of people with a similar interest (racism). I doubt that the people saying all of those things were huge Miss America fans for the most part.
We can observe a history of misogyny, transphobia, homophobia, and racism in the gaming community. There's documented evidence of active participation by the gaming community in all of these things. I've provided numerous examples. Care to show that a strong connection exists between the racists re: Miss America?
People, we have to remember that she TRIED to resolve it in private and was refused access. Public shaming wasn't her first option that she took.
I'm flabbergasted that you continue to suggest that these things are somehow more prevalent in the gaming community without any shred of evidence whatsoever.We can observe a history of misogyny, transphobia, homophobia, and racism in the gaming community. There's documented evidence of active participation by the gaming community in all of these things. I've provided numerous examples. Care to show that a strong connection exists between the racists re: Miss America?
Gotta love the sense of entitlement PC warriors have in this forum. People have to walk on a minefield not to offend them and be labeled sexist or bigot or worse but the warriors can call a people manchildren and make accusations against anyone they want.
I'm flabbergasted that you continue to suggest that these things are somehow more prevalent in the gaming community without any shred of evidence whatsoever.
You could be talking about pretty much any community, even communities that predominantly exist to fight one or more of the things you've listed.
Gamers are a far tighter group of people I can only assume than watchers of Miss America. Can we assume there to be a good reason why you don't hear about the "Miss America community" than you do the "gaming community"? Miss America's negative reception was an example of people making no attempt to conceal their identities making severely racist comments, and certainly not nearly as organized as I often see similar people in the gaming community act.
So you're basing your argument on Anita Sarkeesian backlash?Point taken. The fact that I can cite multiple corporations that encourage all of these things - the fact that I can cite numerous examples of vocal misogynistic campaigns in response to a SINGLE person on the Internet - the fact that I can cite numerous examples of some of the best-selling video games fostering the shittiest gamers around - is totally not me presenting a shred of evidence whatsoever.
So you're basing your argument on Anita Sarkeesian backlash?
Because its probably is very small community. There are hundreds of millions of purported "gamers". What I find interesting is that gamers are never given the same respect as other communities. you will never hear "TV community", "music community", or "book readers"... because those are ridiculous broad statements that encompoasses a massive chunk of the worlds population. Those groups are defined more narrowly by their tastes.
So yes, there is a "Miss America community".
Chû Totoro;84669185 said:Doesn't a transgender person could also be upset to be called a woman?
I don't really get it because I wouldn't know what to say too... Mr, Miss, Young Man, Yougn Lady?
What should people say then? I think the journalist should just have said when being called that she was a woman... this can be said in a discrete way or just while presenting herself.
So it's looking like the whole thing was an honest mistake?
No TV community? You srs? While you make a point with book-reading and music-listening, TV watching is such a general community by design that it's definitely a community in the same way "gaming" is a community, arguably more so. No one's just a "Breaking Bad watcher" or a "South Park watcher". The common perception is that a lot of people who watch TV regularly do so to watch TV rather than to catch a specific show. This is arguably less prevalent than what it was - what with the Internet and all - but it's still a thing. Gaming is viewed in the same way, where the communities are generally.. well, general. The Nintendo gamers, the CoD gamers, the MMO gamers, etc.
A transgender person who identifies as a man would be upset if they were called a woman, yes.
That isn't one of them.So you're basing your argument on Anita Sarkeesian backlash?
http://youtu.be/gcPIu3sDkEw
There are lots of legit reasons to criticize Anita's video series that don't make the critics sexist.
So you're basing your argument on Anita Sarkeesian backlash?
http://youtu.be/gcPIu3sDkEw
There are lots of legit reasons to criticize Anita's video series that don't make the critics sexist.
I think we're missing the heartwarming story here about how white knighting transcends traditional gender conventions.
I don't have any sympathy for hyperbole, distortion of the facts, or playing the victim card- especially if that's your tact whenever someone calls out your bullshit. Freaking out over a faux pas and publicly trumping up your accusations does a disservice to anyone who's been on the receiving end of truly malicious intent.
My point stated early on is not that they were critical of her, or even that they specifically targeted and threatened her. It's the fact that any discussion after that about women in video games, misogyny in video games, etc. became a shithole because of it.
Also, Grizzly...
There's a big difference between the two sets of hate mail. She received hate mail not because she made a mistake, but because she was transgender. Anyone who accused her of lying were not doing so because of any prior knowledge but rather bigotry. His hate mail was from people who found what he was purported to have said disgusting. No matter whether she was lying or not, at the time when she portrayed herself as a victim, people targeted her and victimized her further.
If you're going to type out a blog detailing how you got hate mail after you intentionally falsify info in order to publicly ruin another persons reputation/career opportunities and also cause someone else to receive hate mail...
I don't really care about your feelings tbh.
Sorry.
Nothing excuses hateful behavior, but all that was completely avoidable if she hadn't drawn all sorts of attention to herself in a fundamentally dishonest fashion. Besides, it's the internet. The fact that some anonymous assholes react in ignorance doesn't absolve her of being foolish in handling the situation. She doesn't deserve defending any more than she deserves small minded bigots and trolls casting stones on twitter.Assuming that she was intentionally lying about what happened, that still doesn't excuse the hate mail she received. IIRC, the hate mail was due to her being transgender and not due to her making it up, right?
That's not the point though. Throughout the entire thread I've not defended anyone for lying nor have I criticized the comedian. What I have done is pointed out that this happens every time regardless of what happens. She wasn't receiving hate mail for lying, she was receiving hate mail for being transgender.
Surely she deserves defending from the hoard of small minded bigots? I mean we can at least all agree on that no?She doesn't deserve defending any more than she deserves small minded bigots and trolls casting stones on twitter.
For trying to ruin someones career, she would have received hate mail regardless of whether she was transgendered or not. It's just that people go after what they think will hurt you the most.
The comedian also received hate mail, which goes to show, that people will cling to anything to attack someone.
For trying to ruin someones career, she would have received hate mail regardless of whether she was transgendered or not. It's just that people go after what they think will hurt you the most.
The comedian also received hate mail, which goes to show, that people will cling to anything to attack someone.
You're missing the point though. If it was her receiving hate mail after it was discovered that she fabricated her claims and the hate mail pertained to her lies, it would be one thing. However, she was being attacked due to the fact that she was transgender before people knew that she fabricated what she said. The comedian received hate mail for things that people believed him to have said. That is the point - he was being attacked for what he (purportedly) did while she was being attacked for what she was.
You're missing the point though. If it was her receiving hate mail after it was discovered that she fabricated her claims and the hate mail pertained to her lies, it would be one thing. However, she was being attacked due to the fact that she was transgender before people knew that she fabricated what she said. The comedian received hate mail for things that people believed him to have said. That is the point - he was being attacked for what he (purportedly) did while she was being attacked for what she was.
"It's just the internet" isn't a reasonable excuse for the transphobic abuse Laura has received, that abusive and toxic element that exists in most online communities needs to be destroyed.
Please stop defending these people.
Is there evidence of this hate mail?
Not especially. People are constantly making hurtful and inflammatory comments on the internet. You'd think a journalist would understand that and know take the peanut gallery for what they're worth. Bigots are going to be bigots I don't endorse bigotry, but she drew attention to herself, posted her own private information publicly, demonized and floated the name of some guy with a phony account of events so people would perceive him unquestioningly as the aggressor, etc., etc. Everything that followed that is wholly predictable. If you thrust yourself in the spotlight seeking attention don't be surprised when it's not the kind you'd like.Surely she deserves defending from the hoard of small minded bigots? I mean we can at least all agree on that no?
Theres really not a whole lot you can do about assholes being assholes. You can preach on your soapbox all you want but mean people will still continue to exist and say mean things. Theres no destroying it."It's just the internet" isn't a reasonable excuse for the transphobic abuse Laura has received, that abusive and toxic element that exists in most online communities needs to be destroyed.
Please stop defending these people.