IHaveCandy
Banned
I really hope the PS4 takes off and sells more than the Xbox One to not give MS the leverage to do this. It's an absolutely disgusting practice.
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ID@Xbox launch clause has dev signing exclusive deal with Sony in order to be on XB1
- Thread starter chubigans
- Start date
Fnord
Member
I'm glad I'm not the only one.
No. I don't even know how you came to that conclusion.
And what happened to minecraft?
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/minecraft-not-launching-with-playstation-4/1100-6416102/
No reason for the delay. They didn't sign for an exclusive ps4 launch (The game was probably just finished early) so the loophole was most likely not available.
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/minecraft-not-launching-with-playstation-4/1100-6416102/
No reason for the delay. They didn't sign for an exclusive ps4 launch (The game was probably just finished early) so the loophole was most likely not available.
Aren't Minecraft Xbox One Edition and Playstation version of Minecraft slightly different as the Xbox One version has/is going to have a multiplayer mode or something - or did I just imagine that.
Plus regarding the playstation launch - I would hazard a guess Sony meant Launch Window.
NemesisPrime
Banned
The XO version is not the same as the PS4 version though.
Wow... some bottled up nerd rage there.
Takamura-San
Member
That escalated quickly....
NemesisPrime
Banned
They are the same version the only difference is Kinect support. I don't know why people keep repeating this and even if they were different it would not matter it is still Minecraft on all platforms and would probably fall under this clause.
Omnistalgic
Member
Didn't this happen with ff13? I could've sworn I read an interview saying the ps3 version could've had multiple languages but they wanted console parity...smh I'm buying a xbone in 2017...can't stand the monopoly policies of giant companies...let debs release wherever they want...
This is understandable. They are giving away SDKs and want something in exchange. If an indie developer can't afford to develop for both platforms simultaneously (or to wait to release their game in the PS4) then the choice is simple: just burn bridges and release your game only for PS4.
I can understand the fuss, but the ID@Xbox program is great for developers who don't have $2500 to spend in a PS4 devkit.
I can understand the fuss, but the ID@Xbox program is great for developers who don't have $2500 to spend in a PS4 devkit.
If the free SDK and Unity license are such an amazing deal, there shouldn't need to be arm-twisting needed to get developers to release first on Xbone.
Takamura-San
Member
So... in exchange for a dev kit and unity license (a whopping $2,500), you give up:
* the right to decide when to release the game.
* the ability to release the game on another platform first if that version is finished. Potentially losing more than 2.5k.
Seems legit...
Facism
Member
they're just having devs make the dirty decision themselves on whether to delay the product on a competing platform for launch parity or not release at all.
They can't just let indies do their thing? They have to lock them down with more terms and conditions, more stifling restrictions and barriers to making money?
LiquidSolid
Member
Kazuma Kiryu
Member
You know what this thread reminds me of? When MS announced that they wouldn't be allowing self-publishing and would keep the same old model, and people started spinning it. "well, i'm glad, indie games suck and less games will be better, it means less junk".
Now we're getting reports that this deal isn't exactly the best thing ever (other platforms do allow games to launch later) and now devs "need to make an effort/follow the true indie path" and "well, they're getting free unity so it's fair".
Now we're getting reports that this deal isn't exactly the best thing ever (other platforms do allow games to launch later) and now devs "need to make an effort/follow the true indie path" and "well, they're getting free unity so it's fair".
Well, if you can't afford a PS4 devkit is a good deal, because you are not going to release a PS4 version of the game any time soon. Also, if we are talking about losing money, burning bridges is the worst decision you can make.
If you want to develop for the XB1 you will have to play under Microsoft's rules, but those rules are just asking for a simultaneous release (or a XB1 exclusivity for some time). The only thing you can't do is to release the game first on PS4. For new games (i mean games which development hasn't started yet) this rules won't harm the indie developers, only the PS4 users (i wonder why the most people complaining in this thread are Sony fans... oh wait!). So, from a indie dev standpoint, this is not a bad deal at all.
Interfectum
Member
My hope is indie devs reject this bullshit and just opt to not release on XB1 until they change their stance.
UltraRascal
Banned
"Our whole involvement at ID@Xbox is trying to go through the gauntlet to let developers know what's what. So far, with the exception of the parity clause, our experiences have been quite positive."
I read that and that is all I really needed to hear.
I read that and that is all I really needed to hear.
Nightengale
Member
Not bad doesn't make it a good thing.
And it's easy to say that it's hurrr Sonyfans complaining, but you know what's the worst possible outcome from this policy taking shape as a acceptable deal?
Sony doing the same thing.
If that happens, it's no longer indie love from either company, it's "with-me-or-against-me."
No problems at all. Perhaps a bit gay but I wouldn't see that as a problem.
I think a major defeat early on, like the PS3 faced, would be healthy for Xbox. Cut of from MS wallet and instead realay on their own studios. Think it would be healthy for brand loyalist to admit that they are in an abusive relationship.
Cut the ties until big daddy(MS in this case) learns how to behave and shows some real remorse. Perhaps starting with Penolo taking out his thumbs from his bum and tasting it.
Ludicrous Speed
Banned
Am I missing the big deal here?
Microsoft wants the games to be released on the xbox first, or at minimum, at the same time as the ps4 version, right? Developers are choosing to develop the ps4 version first and not release an xbox version? If they have limited resources what is stopping them from developing the xbox version first and then the ps4 version? It sounds like if they release first on ps4 they can't release on xbox? So better to release on xbox first if you want it on both consoles, right??
Microsoft wants the games to be released on the xbox first, or at minimum, at the same time as the ps4 version, right? Developers are choosing to develop the ps4 version first and not release an xbox version? If they have limited resources what is stopping them from developing the xbox version first and then the ps4 version? It sounds like if they release first on ps4 they can't release on xbox? So better to release on xbox first if you want it on both consoles, right??
Wasn't expecting to read about cockmeat sandwiches and bum thumbs this morning, thanks.
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
The deal is there are many independent devs with current projects on the PS4 that may never see the light of day on the Xbone because of bad policies. MS is forcing indies to keep their ready-to-launch PS4 code on hold until they can launch on Xbone. So instead of possibly making money on the PS4 while developing for MS, they have to sink more costs into getting both versions ready.
Facism
Member
It's a shit restriction. Not all indies have the resource to dev on multiple systems, so what happens is you force exclusivity or delay if an indie dev wants to publish a game across both consoles.
We all get fucked. What happens to those indies that have the ps4 game already finished and now have to make another version before they even see any money for their labour?
That's the big deal? That some indies won't release on X1 because they already have PS4 versions ready to go? I don't see why its such a big problem. Its not like the parity clause is forcing exclusives or anything, and yet everyone is acting like its killing the indie genre.
Mr Moose
Member
Why not let them decide what they want to do with their own game?
Nightengale
Member
Some indie games may never be able to be released on XB1, ever, because they released it on PS4 first.
Multiplat devs who have started work on PS4 version of their game, have to sit on that to finish up an XB1 version first, or on the same time, else they may not be allowed to release it on XB1.
Devs who wanted to release on PC/Playstation/WiiU or other platforms first over XB1 are now forced to prioritise XB first because of the restriction that restricts releasing that game if they don't make XB the priority.
Ultimately, it takes away the dev's freedom to do whatever they want with their product, on their own accord, if they ever want the Xbox audience.
It's a restrictive policy that benefits no one except the platform holder.
It doesn't look as shitty as it is right now, because Steam/Sony/Nintendo doesn't have the same policy. So there's the "best option" of release on Xbox first(for small devs who cannot support many platforms), or release all simultaneously.
However, if Valve, Sony or Nintendo even decides that it's better being an asshole and follows suit with a similar policy, it will cause damage to the indie scene.
It's a bad policy, period.
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
You're working under the assumption that indie devs have the money to crunch through these projects. They do not. They mainly work on one project/port at a time.
So MS is basically forcing timed exclusives of the lower-end of indie devs because they may not be able to afford launching at the same time. Existing projects that signed after the loophole closed now either have to remain dormant while an Xbone version is being coded or never show up on the Xbone to begin with.
Interfectum
Member
You don't see the big deal because you don't understand the issue.
Ludicrous Speed
Banned
And they can decide.
If they only want it on the ps4 they can certainly do that. If they want it on both consoles they have to release simultaneously or on the xbox first. Choices and thangs
Takamura-San
Member
Let me help with that.
Yes this is what they want.
No. They are not "Choosing" that. Most developers, unless they have an issue with the platform, want to release their games on as many platforms as possible.
Maybe, just maybe, they already started development on the ps4. As you may know this ID@Xbox is quite new and Sony has been working with indies for a good while now. That means that there are many projects that have already started on PS4. Microsoft is saying that if they want to release those on xbox they would have to delay their almost if not finished products on PS4. So basically, they are asking indies to sit on finished products, not make profit and invest money on a xbox ver.
That is correct, and people have an issue with that. The other platform holders have no issue with games releasing first on other platforms, yet.
That would be fantastic right?, but this is why this is so scummy. There was a time that if you wanted exclusivity or timed exclusivity there was a benefit for it. Either you got development money, marketing money or some kind of perk. If microsoft wants indies to develop games for xbox first, why don't they actually put money to their efforts? instead of trying to blackmail indies using these "policies".
Ludicrous Speed
Banned
So this problem will be rectified in the future after ID@xbox has become more prevalent and developers are aware of the terms?
so it's a moot point in 6 months to a year. sucks for now. not a big deal later
Interfectum
Member
So everyone should just support Microsoft's anti-competitive bullshit? What if Sony sees this as a problem (all indies releasing on xbox first) and decides to make their own launch clause as well? Do you see where all of this is going?
One can only hope that the Xbox One does bad enough sales that MS has little leverage to keep policies like this in place.
I love that you completely ignored the entire thread. Day one parity is exactly what this entire thread is about. You really need to lighten your agenda dude.
Its less of a problem later on but it is still shitty for anyone making multiplatform games and will screw over ps4 and wiiu owners in favor of xbo. I understand an xbox one owner would be ok with that but it is still a shitty practice.
Nightengale
Member
MS is specifically asking for launch date parity. This is not a problem for MS, because they consciously chose to make the programme that way.
If all devs accept this, MS will never change this because it benefits them.
You're so quick to post anything to defend Microsoft, you don't even read the thread or what we're discussing in here. Day one parity is the problem.
Do you work?
Let's say you're a contractor going from jobsite to jobsite. Now you finished this months workload and are a preparing to cash in that cheque before starting on the second contract.
But hey the second jobsite blocks your cheque from the first job. Now your figuratively screwed since you have to work that extra month without any payment from the first job. Or you're forced to work for two months on both jobsites without payment from any until you're done on both.
Why? Because some major head case with a Napoleon complex dressed in fugly gold sprinkled banana hammocks in camp 2 said so.
Go figure
Black Mantis
Member
PS4 dev kit isn't free, they a loaned free of charge for a year.
"Although this $2,500 price is being cited in development circles, the game-makers we spoke to all said that Sony had lent them dev kits for a limited period of one year, for free."
http://www.polygon.com/2013/7/24/4553842/so-how-much-does-it-cost-to-develop-for-playstation-4
Nobody here are talking about MS asking for exclusivity.
Interfectum
Member
UltraRascal
Banned
I am almost certain that you misunderstood what launch parity is referring to. It is talking about launch date only. Not game quality.
amazing.... have you worked before? handle a project?
so just "deal with it"
I guess things with same attitude gravitate toward each other huh....
Zuhzuhzombie!!
Member
Is this the same policy as the 360, where indie games must release at the same time or they can't be released onto the system at all, or a situation where if you get the free dev tools from MS you have to launch with parity?
If its the latter I don't think that's terribly a bad thing for MS to do. May be dumb in the grand scheme of things.
If its the latter I don't think that's terribly a bad thing for MS to do. May be dumb in the grand scheme of things.
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