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[jtb]

Destined to fail, but could be an important step towards a public option.

 

[Suikoguy]

I had the same thought. I don't think it'll get anywhere near a vote anyway.

That's not to say the core idea is bad. Medicare for all is the easiest path to single payer we have. But branding is important.

Ideally, giving everyone the option to buy into medicare is the single easiest route.

 

[TheLaughingStock]

I think it's DOA unless Sanders takes the Republican approach a la the Bush tax cuts and doesn't offset the plan to make it revenue neutral.

 

[Beelzeboss]

This is a great idea to start now. Trump and his goons fell on their faces trying to repeal and replace so if Democrats can get a real plan out there 2018 and 2020 will be the elections to fix healthcare. Trump even gave tons of ammo saying he's going to move on and doesn't really care about fixing anything.

 

[Protein]

Rich people don't want to pay for "lazy" white people, brown people, and black people's health care. They instead pour billions into propaganda and politicians that make poor white people think healthcare is evil and it takes their money away to give it to minorities.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

At the very least, forcing many republicans to vote no on this will have clear repercussions for 2018.

 

[LakeEarth]

This bill was not made to pass. It was made to show that it is possible.

 

[pigeon]

Goodluck.gif
Seriously, I like Sanders' enthusiasm, but he should really be pushing for the public option, because that's how you get to the public option. Singlepayer right now is a non starter, it would require to much to chanel to work.

Bernie's job is to push for the farther-left options to open space for the rest of the Democrats to support things like the public option.

 

[sugarhigh4242]

That's from May 2016, almost a year ago.

I bet the numbers are very different now.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...overnment-should-ensure-health-care-coverage/

 

[dramatis]

I would like to see the actual proposed legislation text.

It's not going to pass obviously, but the text should probably stand up to scrutiny.

 

[Xe4]

At the very least, forcing many republicans to vote no on this will have clear repercussions for 2018.

So they even have to vote "no"? I think they won't even bring it to the floor, just like Garland.

Bernie's job is to push for the farther-left options to open space for the rest of the Democrats to support things like the public option.

You're not wrong, but that kind of defeats the argument that it gives something for the be democrats to push for. I suppose it's a kind of "shoot for the stars" kind of thing where they aim big and hit low.

 

[Maxim726X]

Read the room Bernie, jesus.

It's political posturing.

Obviously he knows this has zero change of gaining traction... But at least they can be on record! They tried!

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...overnment-should-ensure-health-care-coverage/

Been over this before... Everyone is gung-ho about single payer until they see how much they have to pay.

 

[sugarhigh4242]

Yeah, and you guys should do it. You would go to war less as well, which means less americans dying for no good reason halfway around the world. Noone is responsible for america's military overspending besides america.

We need a new party to do this. Both existing parties are furiously opposed.

 

[Aaronrules380]

It's political posturing.

Obviously he knows this has zero change of gaining traction... But at least they can be on record! They tried!

Yeah, this should be pretty obvious

 

[rjinaz]

Rich people don't want to pay for "lazy" white people, brown people, and black people's health care. They instead pour billions into propaganda and politicians that make poor white people think healthcare is evil and it takes their money away to give it to minorities.

you're not wrong.

 

[sturgboski]

Yeah, this should be pretty obvious

Yeah I mean with a Republican party who in a state basically said babies from rape and incest are a divine work of God are definitely not going to go along with this.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

So they even have to vote "no"? I think they won't even bring it to the floor, just like Garland.

Same effect, except people will actually care about healthcare more than a SCOTUS justice.

Bernie/Dems could just say, "We tried to offer real solutions, but the GOP wouldn't even listen! Wouldn't even vote on it! They clearly don't care about your health!"

 

[metalslimer]

I would like to see the actual legislation, how it's paid for to gauge the reaction by constituents. People are fine with the idea usually up until the point they learn that everyone has to pay higher taxes

 

[pigeon]

So they even have to vote "no"? I think they won't even bring it to the floor, just like Garland.

He can probably get an amendment into the votarama on this, although it won't actually matter if it passes or fails since that's the thing about the votarama.

 

[Earthstrike]

The US' military spend allows enormous influence worldwide, more than simple economics can. It's been quite helpful for US interests as well.

Yes, and a lot of those interests benefit very few citizens. The U.S.A needs to start focusing on uplifting its middle class.

 

[shem935]

I mean yeah duh it won't pass. That's not the point. It's good to have ideas out there especially when trump isn't very popular and he just embarrassed himself on healthcare. It also puts the lie to republicans saying "Democrats are just obstructing". No we have a plan. Come to the table and we can talk about it.

 

[Protein]

It might also work to single out the leftover Blue Dogs to primary them in favor of actual Democrats that give a shit about their constituents.

 

[sugarhigh4242]

Been over this before... Everyone is gung-ho about single payer until they see how much they have to pay.

This is a right-wing frame. First, tax the rich. Second, slash the utterly corrupted military budget.

Notice that media outlets rarely show Americans what they're paying to "liberate" the Arab world.

 

[Measley]

I would like to see the actual legislation, how it's paid for to gauge the reaction by constituents. People are fine with the idea usually up until the point they learn that everyone has to pay higher taxes

Wouldn't the higher taxes be offset by people not having to pay monthly payments to private insurance companies, or massive doctor/hospital fees?

 

[dramatis]

We need a new party to do this. Both existing parties are furiously opposed.

Go put your efforts into doing so then.

 

[pigeon]

It might also work to single out the leftover Blue Dogs to primary them in favor of actual Democrats that give a shit about their constituents.

There aren't any left. They sacrificed their careers to get Obamacare passed.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

Been over this before... Everyone is gung-ho about single payer until they see how much they have to pay.

This is unfortunately true. People are generally dumb as rocks and are incapable of understanding that higher taxes on the front end is still likely much cheaper than existing health care costs. Or that maybe we can afford a 25% reduction in military spending and could still nuke the world 20 times over!

Or they think they won't get sick or an accident can't happen and will never need to use health services.

 

[entremet]

Bernie isn't stupid. He knows this won't pass.

He's only introducing it as a strategic move since the GOP blundered on the health bill.

He's playing chess not checkers.

The ACA has gaps and this will help get it back in the public consciousness.

 

[sugarhigh4242]

Go put your efforts into doing so then.

Thanks for the encouragement.

 

[tbm24]

That's not to say the core idea is bad. Medicare for all is the easiest path to single payer we have. But branding is important.

Ideally, giving everyone the option to buy into medicare is the single easiest route.

I think if there's gonna be a genuine push for healthcare this soon, that the push for a public option would make he most sense if single payer is what you want.

 

[Maxim726X]

This is a right-wing frame. First, tax the rich. Second, slash the utterly corrupted military budget.

Notice that media outlets rarely show Americans what they're paying to "liberate" the Arab world.

They do. All the fucking time.

Guess what? Half the country believes that we're not spending enough on the military... As ridiculous as that is.

Yeah, I get it, tax the rich. That requires legislation. Not empty rhetoric and grandstanding.

 

[rokkerkory]

So other 1st world countries can do this to great success but we can't?

WTH

 

[shem935]

Drafting a new bill right now myself actually. It would remove all board game analogies from popular vernacular on penalty of watching pundits pundit for 1 week straight.

 

[pigeon]

I mean, I think the argument that single-payer will cost a lot of money in taxes is not that great. Yes, it will, but...that's what taxes are for? To pay for services?

Basically half of Europe has mastered the idea of passing a regressive VAT that hurts the poor but using it to pay for social services that lift them up anyway. America can do the same. We've already got the payroll tax, which is significantly worse for the poor than a VAT! Maybe we'll get lucky and Paul Ryan will pass his VAT and eliminate the employer-provided health care tax break, both things the GOP's proposed this year, for reasons I don't understand.

 

[Protein]

In all honesty, we need to regulate pharmaceutical prices too. Good luck with that. Also, Big Insurance would send in bulldozers filled with lawyers the moment this became a potential reality. Health care for all is going to be the fight of the century once it actually gains traction.

 

[Byakuya769]

Perfect timing for this. Democrats aren't by in power, so they don't need to fight over what is or isn't possible, and Fepublicans are strong in a bunch of lies about how they could cover more ppl than Obamacare. Great time to push the conversation leftward and test all these republican voters on if they really support single payer or just wanted to hear something not referencing Obama.

 

[Suikoguy]

I think if there's gonna be a genuine push for healthcare this soon, that the push for a public option would make he most sense if single payer is what you want.

You could make medicare the public option. Medicare has high approval ratings, it may very well be the easiest path.

 

[djkimothy]

I'm unaware of he internal politics but if Colorado couldn't pass single payer at the state level how is this even possible?

 

[Maxim726X]

I mean, I think the argument that single-payer will cost a lot of money in taxes is not that great. Yes, it will, but...that's what taxes are for? To pay for services?

Basically half of Europe has mastered the idea of passing a regressive VAT that hurts the poor but using it to pay for social services that lift them up anyway. America can do the same. Maybe we'll get lucky and Paul Ryan will pass his VAT and eliminate the employer-provided health care tax break, both things the GOP's proposed this year, for reasons I don't understand.

Not that great? Good luck convincing the country to pay more taxes. For anything. Because remember- if it's not done by private industry, it will be royally fucked up by the government.

It's like no one remembers what happened in November.

 

[Xe4]

I'm unaware of he internal politics but if Colorado couldn't pass single payer at the state level how is this even possible?

It's not. This is grandstanding. Same as republicans voting to repeal Obamacare 50 or so times.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

In all honesty, we need to regulate pharmaceutical prices too. Good luck with that. Also, Big Insurance would send in bulldozers filled with lawyers the moment this became a potential reality. Health care for all is going to be the fight of the century once it actually gains traction.

Thing is, though, we were basically one vote away in 2008 (at least from a public option) - until Joe Lieberman fucked it all up. I think an option is at least possible. But yes, it would still be a massive fight to pull off.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

They do. All the fucking time.

Guess what? Half the country believes that we're not spending enough on the military... As ridiculous as that is.

Yeah, I get it, tax the rich. That requires legislation. Not empty rhetoric and grandstanding.

Actually, all it requires is voting in a democratic Congress and presidency.

Not that great? Good luck convincing the country to pay more taxes. For anything. Because remember- if it's not done by private industry, it will be royally fucked up by the government.

It's like no one remembers what happened in November.

Trump didn't win because of his tax policy.

That's revisionist at best.

 

[FuturusX]

So other 1st world countries can do this to great success but we can't?

WTH

We can do it, but it means the death of the medical insurance industry. Those poor executives, what will they do?

 

[dramatis]

Thanks for the encouragement.

Shirley Chisholm was not wrong. If you're not going to help or support the Democratic party, and you're really hungry for a third party, then get out of the Dems' way and go do your own thing and let them do theirs. If you need that third party, then it is up to you to make that third party that can challenge the status quo. Since your ideas are so popular in your opinion, I'm sure you'll be president soon enough.

 

[Misha]

Imo good idea to present this as the other option against the plan that everyone hates.

It probably won't get anywhere but it'll help make it seem like a viable option

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

I'm unaware of he internal politics but if Colorado couldn't pass single payer at the state level how is this even possible?

This bill won't pass anyways with a Republican congress and president but there's a few differences here.

Colorado had a lot of money and basically all of its public officials come out against the bill. Because their single payer wouldn't be a federal service, it would have to raise taxes without gaining money from not heavily subsidizing employer insurance like the federal government does. A significant portion of the Democratic party portrayed single payer over the course of the primary as something that will never happen and is unrealistic fantasy territory. Plus, Colorado isn't very Democratic at all, it's only about 3 points more Democratic than the country as a whole in the past couple presidential elections. ColoradoCare also wouldn't have the same branding advantage as a Medicare For All program would.

That doesn't mean this will pass (it won't, at least until large changes happen in the American political system) but it's not a 1-to-1 comparison here.

 

[UnObtainium17]

Not that great? Good luck convincing the country to pay more taxes. For anything. Because remember- if it's not done by private industry, it will be royally fucked up by the government.

It's like no one remembers what happened in November.

Pretty good to be doing by Dems. Now that the country knows how much of a turd republicans replacement plan is. People will buy into this. It didn't back then because a lot of people actually believed Republican s will actually come up with a better version of AHA.

 

[pigeon]

Not that great? Good luck convincing the country to pay more taxes. For anything. Because remember- if it's not done by private industry, it will be royally fucked up by the government.

It's like no one remembers what happened in November.

The guy who ran on giving everybody in America health insurance won, right? That plus racism.

 

[jack_package_200]

Good on Bernie.

It won't pass but it allows the left to look productive during Donald's shit tier presidency.

 

[jwhit28]

It's good to see Dems not fall into the opposition party trap that Paul Ryan was talking about. It would be easier to move moderates to the left than to get tea party reps to accept any bill with the good parts of the ACA still in it.