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[Brigandier]

Yeah still very probable

Prepare to be very disappointed if you think the next Nintendo console is on par or greater than a XSX/PS5.... DLSS isn't just some software that you download over WiFi lol it still needs a GPU with Tensor cores to function and they generate heat ontop of the RT cores and the GPU cores etc etc a hybrid handheld device is extremely limited by it's temps so unless Nintendo release a really expensive device it's not going to be pushing out a 4k 60fps RT DLSS monster lol

Only way around this is if they release a dock that has hardware inside it this time to properly boost the capabilities of the device but I dunno if that's even possible someone with more tech knowledge would have to explain that if it's possible.

 

[Tsaki]

I don't have those expectations. That's simply what I'm seeing OTHERS claim lol. "Ray tracing better than Xbox and ps5", "able to run the matrix demo", "on par with ps5" etc etc.

That's good then. People need to remember that: 1. Switch lower price tag is a big reason for its success, 2. Nintendo will make profit from the console hardware from day 1 so advanced manufacturing nodes are probably a no-go, 3. Power consumption. The bigger the chip the higher the power consumption and heat dissipated, a no-no for handheld play and battery life.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

Without reading the whole thread, it's because nVidia is a pain in the ass to work with. AMD is a good partner. Even Intel is a much better partner.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Nvidia is a fucking garbage company.

 

[YCoCg]

Nvidia screwed Microsoft with the original Xbox and then screwed Sony with the PS3, that's the main gist, no technical reason just Nvidia burning bridges in the past.

 

[BlackTron]

Prepare to be very disappointed if you think the next Nintendo console is on par or greater than a XSX/PS5.... DLSS isn't just some software that you download over WiFi lol it still needs a GPU with Tensor cores to function and they generate heat ontop of the RT cores and the GPU cores etc etc a hybrid handheld device is extremely limited by it's temps so unless Nintendo release a really expensive device it's not going to be pushing out a 4k 60fps RT DLSS monster lol

Only way around this is if they release a dock that has hardware inside it this time to properly boost the capabilities of the device but I dunno if that's even possible someone with more tech knowledge would have to explain that if it's possible.

It's possible, but also adding to the complexity and expense. Really, who knows. Nintendo has done some crazy hardware stuff, and they have a VERY good partner in Nvidia. And given that Switch 1 came out when both companies were trying to turn two flailing products into a success (Wii U and Shield), who knows what they will do now that their partnership bore the 2nd best selling system of all time. If switch 1 was safe and conservative, who knows what can happen now when they really put their thinking caps on together. Nvidia is probably like bro. Did you really just sell over 120 million of these stupid tegras. Let me take off my leather jacket. Let's smoke a blunt and talk in the back room. I have my best tech guys on your new custom chip. It will be way better than the Xbox deal...trust me bro

 

[jorgejjvr]

Cause if they went with NVDA consoles would cost 800$ just for the added DLSS which is over hyped to the moon. if you wanna pay 300$ for a better upscaler then you would be happy.

But I mean, if rumors are to be believed, sounds like we might be getting a pretty darn capable portable/console from Nintendo. And that probably won't be more than $300-400

Also, I would totally pay $800 for a console lol

 

[jorgejjvr]

Nvidia screwed Microsoft with the original Xbox and then screwed Sony with the PS3, that's the main gist, no technical reason just Nvidia burning bridges in the past.

That was like 15+ or so years ago tho.

NVidia burned both Sony and Microsoft quite badly on the times they worked with them - and it wasn't just simple issue of costs. Although cost-wise the deals they made were indeed quite bad, IIRC og XBox was literally losing more money on the console each passing year - in no small part thanks to NVidia part of the deal. And Sony also got the short end of the stick coming to them way too late on PS3, with no real options but to take whatever was offered.

Cost likely still plays a factor but the relationships also need to be rebuilt for these things to happen.

Like others have stated, that was ages ago, and Microsoft is one of Nvidia biggest customers. This ain't about something petty that happened 20 years ago

 

[YCoCg]

That was like 15+ or so years ago tho.

Like others have stated, that was ages ago, and Microsoft is one of Nvidia biggest customers. This ain't about something petty that happened 20 years ago

And that's one of the reasons why they went with AMD, a d that relationship has been profitable and working well. Neither have any reason to switch to Nvidia unless they offer one hell of a deal, considering how Nvidia is now making mega profits outside of Graphics they don't have a reason either to try and bargain.

 

[BlackTron]

But I mean, if rumors are to be believed, sounds like we might be getting a pretty darn capable portable/console from Nintendo. And that probably won't be more than $300-400

Also, I would totally pay $800 for a console lol

I do think the rumors are overblown. But I also think the handheld will haul ass -for a handheld.

That was like 15+ or so years ago tho.

Like others have stated, that was ages ago, and Microsoft is one of Nvidia biggest customers. This ain't about something petty that happened 20 years ago

Nvidia's prices are insane to customers as well. They are always "you want quality, you pay". Nintendo lucked out by leveraging them in a moment of weakness -they happened to need each other at just the right time. And then Nvidia realized working with N wasn't that bad and quite profitable. They have an efficient, symbiotic relationship pumping out SoCs for Nintendo's tablets. They already have a market for their beefy desktop GPUs and I don't think they are willing to budge on the value of their GPU tech even for consoles. Especially for consoles even. They may not want to send a message of "why buy a $500 Nvidia gfx card when you could just buy a $500 console subsidized by Microsoft?" so they are tough negotiators.

 

[Astral Dog]

How is Nintendo doing it then? They went with Nvidia and switch was profitable day 1, while consoles went with AMD and they were selling at a lost

I heard they got a good deal for those outdated Tegra X1, plus being a portable might have something to do with it and Nintendo probably was desperate to find a partner to update their development tools, they realized GameCube wasn't going to cut it anymore

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

But I mean, if rumors are to be believed, sounds like we might be getting a pretty darn capable portable/console from Nintendo. And that probably won't be more than $300-400

Also, I would totally pay $800 for a console lol

Rumors... You know the Switch can run Doom, right? And even Witcher 3... and yet, it's less than half as powerful as an XB1s. Of course, the switch 2 would be abe to run PS5-type games or UE5. Being abe to run something though, and being on par with something ... are two very different things.

That was like 15+ or so years ago tho.

Like others have stated, that was ages ago, and Microsoft is one of Nvidia biggest customers. This ain't about something petty that happened 20 years ago

Oh, you are clearly only reading what you want to read and this is a glorified hype thread... carry on then. My bad.

 

[UnravelKatharsis]

How is Nintendo doing it then? They went with Nvidia and switch was profitable day 1, while consoles went with AMD and they were selling at a lost

Struggling to understand if this is a serious question or not just based on how obvious the answer is. The system on a chip is just one part of Sony and Microsofts consoles. There's lots of custom hardware in both boxes. Think about the custom SSD in the PS5. The liquid metal, the huge copper heatsink. Does the switch have a cooling fan? Does its processor produce enough heat to even need one? Then remember Nintendo was able to make a sweetheart deal when nvidia was in a bad position.

Saying Nintendo went with Nvidia, the "expensive" supplier and Sony/Msoft went with AMD, the "cheap" supplier so "how is Nintendo doing it" just ignores literally every other aspect of these consoles designs.

 

[UnravelKatharsis]

Oh, you are clearly only reading what you want to read and this is a glorified hype thread... carry on then. My bad.

This was evident to me on page one.

 

[jorgejjvr]

This was evident to me on page one.

What am I even hyped about?

 

[twilo99]

Nvidia is a fucking garbage company.

Nah, they are actually a very good at what they do.

 

[64bitmodels]

Even if Nvidia were willing to make hardware for consoles and AMD wasn't good enough.... Why not just go for Intel? They make dedicated GPUs now with Arc and have the software capability Nvidia does while having the cheap prices and cooperation AMD does. Why go for Nvidia specifically who doesn't even make X86 cpus?

 

[jorgejjvr]

Even if Nvidia were willing to make hardware for consoles and AMD wasn't good enough.... Why not just go for Intel? They make dedicated GPUs now with Arc and have the software capability Nvidia does while having the cheap prices and cooperation AMD does. Why go for Nvidia specifically who doesn't even make X86 cpus?

Idk anything about this subject. I was just curious and asking lol

Intel allows for dlss?

 

[Ozzie666]

Pretty sure Nvidia and Sony relationship was destroyed over the PS3 and attempts to reduce the size of the GPU. Nvdia didn't make things easy from what I recall.

 

[64bitmodels]

Intel allows for dlss?

XeSS is pretty much 99% of the way there, so yeah. It's far superior to FSR.

 

[zeldaring]

But I mean, if rumors are to be believed, sounds like we might be getting a pretty darn capable portable/console from Nintendo. And that probably won't be more than $300-400

Also, I would totally pay $800 for a console lol

You would pay 800$ for a console just for better upscaling?

 

[UnravelKatharsis]

You would pay 800$ for a console just for better upscaling?

You have to turn your brain off for this discussion.

 

[jorgejjvr]

You would pay 800$ for a console just for better upscaling?

Better upscaling and performance, sure. I see what it does to PC gaming, it's pretty impressive

 

[zeldaring]

You have to turn your brain off for this discussion.

Lol nvda is sure doing a great job advertising dlss. If the game is using DLSS or fsr from 4k to 1440p.the difference is hardly noticeable in most games.

 

[zeldaring]

Better upscaling and performance, sure. I see what it does to PC gaming, it's pretty impressive

It doesn't give better perfomance it varies in many games Maybe try watching some videos lol . If the game is downscaling from 4k it's hardly noticeable.

 

[UnravelKatharsis]

Better upscaling and performance, sure. I see what it does to PC gaming, it's pretty impressive

Lol nvda is sure doing a great job advertising dlss. If the game is using DLSS or fsr from 4k to 1440p.the difference is hardly noticeable in most games.

But it's worth 800 at least.

 

[THE DUCK]

No doubt Nvidia greed has played a huge role in this overall fail for Nvidia.

 

[64bitmodels]

I see what it does to PC gaming,

So buy a PC then. Join the gaben side. We have steam sales and cdkeys.

Making consoles overtly expensive defeats the purpose.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Nvidia doesn't have an x86 license. As long as Sony insists on sticking with x86, it's basically AMD or nothing because Intel doesn't make a x86 CPU with a high performance GPU and Nvidia doesn't make x86 CPU's period.

Nintendo has never cared about x86, so switching to Nvidia was just a matter of the right hardware at the right price.

 

[Beechos]

Prolly cause nvidia chips are a hell more expensive than amd.

 

[zeldaring]

How is Nintendo doing it then? They went with Nvidia and switch was profitable day 1, while consoles went with AMD and they were selling at a lost

Is this a joke? Ps4 came out in 2013 and switch in 2016 while ps4 was still a generation ahead graphically. Switch was a garbage hardware and nintendo got the nvda chips cause they were basically useless and nintendo got a amazing deal.

 

[Tams]

You said that Nvidia has shown no inclination to do extensive custom work, when the Nvidia leaks show that they are doing extensive custom work for Nintendo.

That was the point I was making.

I mean no, they aren't. They're recycling old Tegra designs again.

AMD offer Sony and Microsoft access to their latest designs (at the time of development) and accommodate esoteric requests

 

[RoadHazard]

What am I even hyped about?

I'm not that tech savvy

But did Nintendo struck lighting? They now got tech inside their device that can compete with consoles 6-7 times it's size, with 5-7 times it's terraflops?

 

[Black_Stride]

Idk anything about this subject. I was just curious and asking lol

Intel allows for dlss?

XeSS is Intels DLSS analogue and is 99% as good and runs on dedicated ML units on Intel devices.

And Intel have mobile APUs so they could easily make an 8/16 mobile CPU cut off the e cores and load it up with Xe Cores.

This is their concept MeteorLake mobile APU with LPDDR5X-7500 on the package.

 

[Kiya's Guard]

What I understand is that home consoles use amd because of cost efficiency and their APU design, and Nintendo used nvidia for the switch because it was an old technology used for the nvidia shield.

Nintendo's philosophy is utilising hardware that is already tested and works (some would say a bit old), so they can reduce costs.

 

[NanaMiku]

No one posted this yet?



Even Nvidia was really horrible to PC partner, that's why EVGA got out of graphic card business

 

[mrmeh]

How is Nintendo doing it then? They went with Nvidia and switch was profitable day 1, while consoles went with AMD and they were selling at a lost

Switch was old cheap hardware when it launched and they charged top dollar for it.

NVidia are price gouging arseholes to consumers and everyone they have ever worked with.

'Switch 2' tech is probably a spin off of some already existing tech, temper your expectations really fucking hard. For a handheld releasing next year I expect ps4 level base performance but with the latest tech features added e.g DLSS, I will be delighted with anything better!

With modern games becoming more CPU limited it will be interesting to see how the arm based CPU holds up, may become the more limiting factor.

 

[Moses85]

How is Nintendo doing it then? They went with Nvidia and switch was profitable day 1, while consoles went with AMD and they were selling at a lost

The Tegra was already outdated. So it was cheap to produce and get.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

That was like 15+ or so years ago tho.

Like others have stated, that was ages ago, and Microsoft is one of Nvidia biggest customers. This ain't about something petty that happened 20 years ago

How it is not obvious after all these responses as to why nvidia won't be making the next GPU for Sony and MS? Honestly, with about 5 minutes of research it should have been obvious.

There are too many advantages to sticking with AMD at this point. Yes, DLSS is superior to FSR, but FSR isn't trash, but it's not the end all be all. They'd have to pair it with a CPU and you would lose all BC.

Plus, I doubt nvidia has any interest in making a GPU for a system that would need to be sold at $500-$600 and be powerful enough when they can sell a GPU at the same price and keep much of the profit.

Nvidia appearing in an MS/Sony console is dead. It won't happen.

 

[Woopah]

I mean no, they aren't. They're recycling old Tegra designs again.

AMD offer Sony and Microsoft access to their latest designs (at the time of development) and accommodate esoteric requests

Last time Nintendo used an already existing Tegra X1, this time Nvidia are building a new SoC specifically for Nintendo. Its a completely different situation.

They are designing it based on Nintendo's wants/needs so it is customised.

 

[RoboFu]

Amd provides cpu, gpu, sound , and io . They are just cheaper and cover everything.

Buuuuttttt….

I do think that in next 2 or 3 gens when everything switches to full ray tracing things could change and it may be someone completely different than amd or nvidia.

 

[alucard0712_rus]

Nvidia doesn't have x64 APU's

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

PS5 is no longer sold at a loss. Not sure about series.

Series is still sold at a loss.

Nintendo didn’t get a good deal from Nvidia. They just used the Nvidia shield and sold it at triple the price, and got away with it because BOTW was a goat launch title.

Still sounds like Nintendo got a good deal to me. 200% profit margin on the chip from Day 1 is Nintendo making out like a bandit.

 

[Mister Wolf]

Nvidia being an industry leader are able to negotiate from a position of power. AMD doesn’t have this luxury and the console makers prefer it that way.

 

[nowhat]

Nvidia being an industry leader are able to negotiate from a position of power. AMD doesn’t have this luxury and the console makers prefer it that way.

Yeah, this. Sony alone makes for a significant portion of AMDs revenue nowadays - with razor thin margins I'm sure, but still, revenue and (small but existing) profit as well.

Edit: 16 to 20 percent (depends on how you count it) of revenue because of Sony in a quite recent financial statement. Not insignificant by any measure.

 

[SkylineRKR]

Its much easier to go to AMD. They also make CPUs and they used to beat Intel even. On the GPU side I doubt Nvidia will even deliver at an affordable price. Plus they would need to sign Intel or AMD for the CPU who would probably ask a higher fee too.

AMD is in the position they do both GPU and CPU. And their GPU are good. They aren't as good as high end Nvidia ones, but cheaper and for cost, ergonomics and power saving reasons you won't see a high end GPU in a console anytime soon. Nvidia wants you to buy their overpriced cards only.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

Cost

Cheaper to work with AMD than Nvidia. You get both a CPU and GPU while with Nvidia you'd still have to get either an Intel or AMD CPU.

That's more integration than cost.

Having to use different CPU and GPU IHVs would mean it cannot be a SoC.

 

[Fabieter]

I'm not that tech savvy

But did Nintendo struck lighting? They now got tech inside their device that can compete with consoles 6-7 times it's size, with 5-7 times it's terraflops?

Well I would expect switch 2 to costs at least 499 bucks if rumors are true.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Well I would expect switch 2 to costs at least 499 bucks if rumors are true.

Naaa... it won't cost anything over $399. If it's even that high. Ignore the rumors, rumours are always exaggerations. The greatest indicator of what a Switch 2 can be comes down to the power budget and that we are dealing with Nintendo. Armed with those two things its pretty easy to guess what hardware it would have and what it would be capable of.

 

[FullMetalx117]

Xbox/Playstation having Nvidia GPUs would make Nvidia lose some prestige/devalue the brand. Consoles will always be underpowered to PC, and Nvidia doesn't want that sucker association, they want to be the main reason you do end up buying a dedicated GPU (mostly for prestige, partially for the unnoticeable 5% performance gain). They made an exception with Nintendo but it was never in Nintendo's strategy to claim the best graphics and Nvidia is okay with that