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[Suairyu]

What?

A man wishing to avoid sexual encounters with a transexual is damaging his sexual development?

Bodily function and instinct, as I understand it, is to procreate.

There are biologically female women who are unable to procreate due to whatever problem. It doesn't interfere with anyone's base sexual attraction. If it did, that'd be psychology getting in the way of instinct.

Thus, seeing the most drop dead gorgeous woman who you later learn is a post-op MTF and letting it get in the way of your attraction is letting psychology get in the way of instinct.

Letting any thought get in the way of your sexual instincts isn't a pleasant or healthy process. It's like gay men being sexually attracted to other men but intellectualising that they cannot be attracted to men because men are attracted to women. It ruins their happiness and stunts sexual development. Tons of gay teenagers go through this all the time.

I'm not saying not being attracted to a woman once you learn she is biologically male will stunt your sexual growth as an individual, I'm just saying it falls into the same vague camp of problem. I don't see why, instinctively, your sexual orientation should play any part in stopping you from being sexually attracted to someone who is of the gender you are attracted to, appears as the sex you are attracted to but is actually of the biological sex you aren't - your body and eyes can't tell the difference. I was expressing my own personal point of view about the 'problem' as I see it.

And as I said, the reality is learning such information does interfere with physical attraction to these women for many people, so being judgmental about it is the wrong thing to do.

 

[Newduck]

Ladyboy really is commonly used throughout atleast South East Asia, both casually and in reference to the sex trade too.

Seems almost a different kind of transgender subculture here. It's different. I wouldn't call a western or non SEA person a ladyboy by default, but here it generally seems to be the term actually coined themselves for it.

Line is a little blurry but no reason to jump on anyone for using the term.

 

[vas_a_morir]

If ladyboy is an insult then why does Dominique slap my penis when I call her a ladyboy hmmm?

Because you ran your mouth, and your penis deserved punishment.

 

[fudgey_lumpkins]

I read through the thread and it seems like people are arguing two different things.

For one for most people sex = gender. So if someone say girl they most likely mean female. I know when I say girl I mean female and not anyone who thinks, feels, or acts like a female even though I know such cases exist.

Also, I have no issue with the OP saying he was almost "fooled". It pretty obvious that he meant that he almost believed that some of the males that he encountered strongly resembled females to the point that he believed that said males could have actually been females. Now this is also not to say that these people are out there trying to "trick" you into believing anything to the point that you should be "surprised" or think that you have been "fooled" to find out the contrary. It's not a "guess what I really am" type of thing. These are people trying look on the outside as they believe, think, and/or feel they are on the inside.

If it isn't clear enough, and I tried to be careful with my wording, my usage of the term male refers to beings born with a penis; and the usage of the term female refers to beings born with a vagina. Hermaphroditic individuals have been excluded in my reasoning due to the complexities associated with dual sex organs and gender identification.

P.S. If you want to be "fooled", "tricked", or "surprised" by transgendered people and/or cross-dressers, watch Maury.

P.S.S. Come at me bro.

Spoiler

Someone challenge me!

 

[Future]

Damn, people are so sensitive of this subject. This topic is similar to those about depression, ADD, homosexuals, etc. It's hard for people to get it when they can't experience. Some will think it's all in people's heads, they are choices, blah blah. People can't understand shit that they dont feel themselves

Of those that do understand, I find that they still get lambasted and called out if they don't have the most open view of the subject. Just as a trans girl may not understand why people don't get that she believes she is female, a straight male may also not understand how the trans community can't see how being with a person that was biologically male is off-putting. Or even that they would personally never consider a trans a "woman," mainly because they perceive women as possible partners. In this thread I see excuses of how it must be social constructs, or people need to be more openminded...only that could explain why men don't get it. But it may be just another example of how people can't understand shit they dont feel themselves. Not everyone is out to just be condescending

That said, some people will definitely be more tactful or "PC" than others. But man, if you can derive the meaning of what they are saying why jump on the details. I know this discussion has gone past the term ladyboy, but damn it sucks if that had any part of this.

 

[BakedPigeon]

There are biologically female women who are unable to procreate due to whatever problem. It doesn't interfere with anyone's base sexual attraction. If it did, that'd be psychology getting in the way of instinct.

Thus, seeing the most drop dead gorgeous woman who you later learn is a post-op MTF and letting it get in the way of your attraction is letting psychology get in the way of instinct.

Letting any thought get in the way of your sexual instincts isn't a pleasant or healthy process. It's like gay men being sexually attracted to other men but intellectualising that they cannot be attracted to men because men are attracted to women. It ruins their happiness and stunts sexual development. Tons of gay teenagers go through this all the time.

I'm not saying not being attracted to a woman once you learn she is biologically male will stunt your sexual growth as an individual, I'm just saying it falls into the same vague camp of problem. I don't see why, instinctively, your sexual orientation should play any part in stopping you from being sexually attracted to someone who is of the gender you are attracted to, appears as the sex you are attracted to but is actually of the biological sex you aren't - your body and eyes can't tell the difference. I was expressing my own personal point of view about the 'problem' as I see it.

And as I said, the reality is learning such information does interfere with physical attraction to these women for many people, so being judgmental about it is the wrong thing to do.

Yes, they can.

 

[SmokyDave]

I'll pretty much fuck anything in heels. I don't know if that makes me accepting or depraved. Probably a bit of both.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Because you ran your mouth, and your penis deserved punishment.

Oh...

Gotta call her ladyboy more often then.

I'll pretty much fuck anything in heels. I don't know if that makes me accepting or depraved. Probably a bit of both.

Toss in a predilection towards pain and you explain me!

 

[zon]

So... we should make no effort to understand transgendered people, who have been amongst world societies since their conception?

Bwuh?

Just because some people have an issue understanding those who shatter their precious gender dichotomy does not mean there shouldn't be an attempt made by those same people to make any sense of it. Considering intersex people are common and have been common for quite some time but completely marginalized due to cultural constructs, does not mean people, ESPECIALLY THESE WONDERFULLY IGNORANT STRAIGHT MEN, shouldn't think a little outside the fucking box.

I find it amazing that this is the idea you get out of my post. Think for one fucking second in your life. Trying to explain does not equal trying to condone FFS.

 

[ZephyrFate]

I read through the thread and it seems like people are arguing two different things.

For one for most people sex = gender. So if someone say girl they most likely mean female. I know when I say girl I mean female and not anyone who thinks, feels, or acts like a female even though I know such cases exist.

Also, I have no issue with the OP saying he was almost "fooled". It pretty obvious that he meant that he almost believed that some of the males that he encountered strongly resembled females to the point that he believed that said males could have actually been females. Now this is also not to say that these people are out there trying to "trick" you into believing anything to the point that you should be "surprised" or think that you have been "fooled" to find out the contrary. It's not a "guess what I really am" type of thing. These are people trying look on the outside as they believe, think, and/or feel they are on the inside.

If it isn't clear enough, and I tried to be careful with my wording, my usage of the term male refers to beings born with a penis; and the usage of the term female refers to beings born with a vagina. Hermaphroditic individuals have been excluded in my reasoning due to the complexities associated with dual sex organs and gender identification.

P.S. If you want to be "fooled", "tricked", or "surprised" by transgendered people and/or cross-dressers, watch Maury.

P.S.S. Come at me bro.

Spoiler

Someone challenge me!

Sex does not equate to gender, though. And it never has!

 

[Suairyu]

Sex does not equate to gender, though. And it never has!

Accurate, but such an understanding is really only a recent thing. It's no surprising most people don't understand the difference. Education is needed, not shouting at people.

 

[ZephyrFate]

Mere repetition is not shouting at people. I have been entirely calm.

 

[Shanadeus]

I kinda regret even writing this, but I'm not going to be afraid to speak my mind. I'll take whatever comes from my unpopular opinion.

And my opinion is, just as sure as after all Micheal Jackson did to himself, thinned his nose, slimmed his lips, feminized his eyes, lightened his skin color, straightened his hair and trained his voice to be high pitched and soft, after all that, he was still a black man.

Same goes for transsexuals. No matter how much a doctor hacks you up, no matter how much flesh he removes from your body, no matter how many hormone treatments you receive, once a man, always a man. You still have that "Y" chromosome in your DNA. You're a fraud. A wolf in sheep's clothing. An artificial woman, at best.

I understand people feeling they are in the wrong body and I feel sorry for them. I feel happy that there are options available to them so that they can be happy with their lives just as we all want to be happy with our lives. But to be true to myself, I would never feel comfortable calling someone who had surgery to remove his penis, a woman.

So that's my opinion. I know you guys won't agree, but hopefully you can respect it and understand my reason as to why a straight man would have no interest in being with a transsexual.

Micheal Jackson was not a black man in the end, to think so is pure delusion and an attempt from the black community to take his accomplishments and somehow apply them to all black men.

He was a white man in mind and that is all that counts when you get down to business.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Micheal Jackson was not a black man in the end, to think so is pure delusion and an attempt from the black community to take his accomplishments and somehow apply them to all black men.

He was a white man in mind and that is all that counts when you get down to business.

In the end, he was just a disturbed man.

Though I have to ask... how can you be a white man in mind? When white is a social construct.

 

[Suairyu]

He was a white man in mind and that is all that counts when you get down to business.

I have never come across a theory that ties skin colour to identity in sense anywhere near as strong as gender. Skin colour itself has zero effect on someone's outlook on life, so far as I know. I don't understand how you can be a white person in mind unless you are trying to attribute certain mental characteristics to specific colours (not even specific ethnicity in this case!) which would be a dangerous proposition.

For what its worth, the raising of the Michael Jackson idea as an analogue for transgender/transsexuality was entirely ludicrous to begin with.

 

[ZephyrFate]

In the end, he was just a disturbed man.

Though I have to ask... how can you be a white man in mind? When white is a social construct.

Exactly, race is a social construct as well. I don't know how this actually changes a person's thought process.

 

[RobertM]

Exactly, race is a social construct as well. I don't know how this actually changes a person's thought process.

Marshall Mathers is black?

 

[Shanadeus]

Was linked this by someone and I thought it's a good show of how good science is at changing a man to a woman today:

And in the future we'll even be able to clone up and implant female reproductive systems and milk producing breasts in the process.

I have never come across a theory that ties skin colour to identity in sense anywhere near as strong as gender. Skin colour itself has zero effect on someone's outlook on life, so far as I know. I don't understand how you can be a white person in mind unless you are trying to attribute certain mental characteristics to specific colours (not even specific ethnicity in this case!) which would be a dangerous proposition.

For what its worth, the raising of the Michael Jackson idea as an analogue for transgender/transsexuality was entirely ludicrous to begin with.

If you think you're white, you're white.

Micheal Jackson didn't consider himself black or he wouldn't go to the length he went to gain stereotypical "white" traits he got through surgery.

 

[Suairyu]

f you think you're white, you're white.

Micheal Jackson didn't consider himself black or he wouldn't go to the length he went to gain stereotypical "white" traits he got through surgery.

But being white or black is entire biological. It's physical. You don't think you're white because white has no mental characteristic to be thought of. Thinking yourself white is the result of mis-interpretting what white is or being extremely psychologically damaged to the point of not being able to understand reality anymore. As a final option, it's possibly racism for believing the colour of skin makes up a person's (in this case, your own) identity.

This isn't gender, where someone thinks themselves a woman and thus is a woman. Thinking yourself a different ethnicity is the equivalent of thinking yourself a third arm: it doesn't make reality.

Michael Jackson had a case for arguing he was white because his skin turned white. However, he was forever African American, not Caucasian. You can't think genetics away.

 

[dudeworld]

I'm pretty sure michael jackson didn't actually want to be white. the nose surgeries were done to effect his singing and his skin turned white because of a disease

also those pics above aren't really a good example of anything imo. he looks the same to me but shaved clean, with make up on, and with long hair. any guy can do that pretty much. just look at some scene/emo guys. they look pretty girly too without doing anything hormonal