Dash Kappei
Not actually that important
It also keeps track of DS software in the activity log tho.
Have any of the 3DS' updates broke some of the flashcarts which were workin' at launch?
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Day-1 Hello World, the PS Vita already hacked? (EDIT: not exactly)
- Thread starter The Faceless Master
- Start date
It also keeps track of DS software in the activity log tho.
Have any of the 3DS' updates broke some of the flashcarts which were workin' at launch?
Mama Robotnik
Member
Fascinating.
This could lead to a playable game, packed as a ROM, wrapped in an emulator, running via homebrew, wrapped in another emulator.
Unless they can use the emulated PSP homebrew to actually glitch the wrapper emulator itself, then its difficult to see how this can be used to make the Vita's capabilities truly accessible to the homebrew community.
Of course, given the homebrew guys have achieved this on day one, and as a company Sony pretty much painted themselves as hacking target number one, this could simply be the first step to blowing the whole system open.
I'd prefer they focussed on the 3DS personally as it needs to be region-free'd one way or another. But nonetheless I am very impressed with this.
This could lead to a playable game, packed as a ROM, wrapped in an emulator, running via homebrew, wrapped in another emulator.
Unless they can use the emulated PSP homebrew to actually glitch the wrapper emulator itself, then its difficult to see how this can be used to make the Vita's capabilities truly accessible to the homebrew community.
Of course, given the homebrew guys have achieved this on day one, and as a company Sony pretty much painted themselves as hacking target number one, this could simply be the first step to blowing the whole system open.
I'd prefer they focussed on the 3DS personally as it needs to be region-free'd one way or another. But nonetheless I am very impressed with this.
....
zerodayPopbot
Member
Fuck yeah, can't wait to play some roms' of twenty year old games on my new system.
Emulation involves the interpretation or translation of instructions meant for a specific machine on a different one.
What the 3DS does is closer to virtualization, where CPU instructions are run natively by the host's CPU but IO calls are (input and display) intercepted and redirected.
Mama Robotnik
Member
Infinitesimal.
Even within the restrictions of the PSP emulator, this would make Vita a great homebrew machine. Sure, being able to access the whole Vita hardware would allow to emulate better machines, but even if this wasn't possible the PSP is powerful enough for quite a bit of applications.
Fair enough, that's all well and good for the CPUs but what about the GPU? Do you think Nintendo has included the DS GPU in every SoC or are they emulating it or could they possibly have added the DS functions into the API natively? I'm genuinely curious here.
Negative Zero.
test_account
XP-39C²
Maybe already mentioned, but the same happened to the 3DS (not 100% sure if it was day 1, but it was very very early at least). It is possible to run own code on the 3DS through DS mode, but 10 months later, the 3DS is still not hacked.
OtherOS also let you run own code on the PS3, still it took a long time before someone managed to hack the PS3 because OtherOS was running in sandbox mode. I think it is the same with this PSP emulator on Vita, so i dont think this means much in hacking progress on the Vita.
I do wonder why this isnt patched though. Isnt it possible to patch this exploit? And is it being tried on firmware 1.00 or 1.50?
OtherOS also let you run own code on the PS3, still it took a long time before someone managed to hack the PS3 because OtherOS was running in sandbox mode. I think it is the same with this PSP emulator on Vita, so i dont think this means much in hacking progress on the Vita.
I do wonder why this isnt patched though. Isnt it possible to patch this exploit? And is it being tried on firmware 1.00 or 1.50?
Raonak
Banned
Well, Aslong as the PSP software is gated off from the vita OS, then there should be no problem.
Theres almost no way sony could've avoided this, since PSP keys are out in the wild due to the ps3 hack. So in the eyes of the console (vita or psp) theres no way to diffirentiate between an actual game and homebrew code- assuming it was signed with the PSP keys.
EDIT:
This is actually the best of both worlds. You can have the awesome PSP homebrew stuff, but at the same time; vita is technically unhacked, you won't see any rampant piracy that weakened the PSP.
If all goes well for, it will remain unhacked for quite some time, sony have become pretty proficient at gaurding the ps3 against hacking, it was actually their own mistakes that caused it to be cracked: the PS3 debug mode, and the non-random keys. So hopefully they learned to not shoot themselves.
Theres almost no way sony could've avoided this, since PSP keys are out in the wild due to the ps3 hack. So in the eyes of the console (vita or psp) theres no way to diffirentiate between an actual game and homebrew code- assuming it was signed with the PSP keys.
EDIT:
This is actually the best of both worlds. You can have the awesome PSP homebrew stuff, but at the same time; vita is technically unhacked, you won't see any rampant piracy that weakened the PSP.
If all goes well for, it will remain unhacked for quite some time, sony have become pretty proficient at gaurding the ps3 against hacking, it was actually their own mistakes that caused it to be cracked: the PS3 debug mode, and the non-random keys. So hopefully they learned to not shoot themselves.
MightyKAC
Member
Ditto.
I'm actually fine with this, provided it doesn't go past the PSP emulation side of the OS. There's lots of cool stuff made from the PSP's homebrew scene that I wouldn't mind seeing on the Vita.
Considering that 3D DS games look identical on the 3DS, down to the smallest GPU glitches, I'm sure the 3DS contains the DS GPU in some form, probably as an extension of the 3DS GPU.
The 3DS CPU is very far from enough to emulate the DS GPU via software (we're talking ~2GHz for accurate emulation) and HLE using the GPU would result in differences on the image output.
BladeoftheImmortal
Member
And you guys thought they were stupid to go proprietary media cards. whose laughing now?
How would they patch this? It's a bug in a specific PSP game. The game itself would need to be fixed.
The most Sony could do is have the emulator encrypt the save behind the scenes to prevent tampering, like Nintendo did with DSiWare after Sudokuhax. I think PSP games use a system-wide save API, so it should be possible.
However, the saves would become system-locked.
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
The hackers...
Betta Lines
Member
I wonder if the Vita can emulate the PSP at higher than 333MHz... then it might be time for... 60fps Super Mario Kart.
Raonak
Banned
Good point. I didn't think it would make a difference, until I found out that the transfering software works from the vita. not the PS3/PC.
Basically, the vita handles what gets transfered and it signs the stuff itself. Which is a VERY interesting move. Since the vita could potentially block anything that isn't a recognised format.
Even if the PC/PS3 client is hacked, aslong as the vita isn't it'll be secure, in theory.
Because of the proprietary mem cards, you can't smuggle in homebrew, until card readers are possibly made for it.
I see.
test_account
XP-39C²
Since it is an emulator, and the game is offered through digital download only (people need to redownload the game if they want it on the Vita i think?), i assume that it could be fixed
I also noticed that it says PSP firmware 6.31, but 6.60 is the latest.donkey show
Member
Bjoern the Smexy
Member
So, does that mean that Sony will remove the PSP emulator with a future firmware update?
Diablohead
Member
Blue Submarine No. 6
Member
uh, no... no it's not... not even close... this is a nothing exploit in the PSP emulator, and if they (them haX0rz) somehow break out of that sandbox, Sony should execute it's OS security team...
MightyKAC
Member
Probably not but it will make anyone developing consoles think twice about offering backward compatability in the future.
mclaren777
Member
Poor Sony.
mattiewheels
And then the LORD David Bowie saith to his Son, Jonny Depp: 'Go, and spread my image amongst the cosmos. For every living thing is in anguish and only the LIGHT shall give them reprieve.'
Being able to play my translated Policenauts and all the emulators on day 1 would be mindblowing.
Since this is pure emulation, I guess the old programs can't benefit from the better hardware, right? It would be nice for the SNES emu to run at 100%
Since this is pure emulation, I guess the old programs can't benefit from the better hardware, right? It would be nice for the SNES emu to run at 100%
This is what I was thinking, I hope we see all the PSP homebrew such as emulators and etc. Also it would be nice if you can play PSP ISO's as not every PSP game is available on the digital store. Finally I hope we get PS1 emulator hack too as not every PS1 game is on the store either. If we can get all this without the Vita getting fully hacked, I say it is the best of both worlds.
funkystudent
Member
psp backwards compatibility to be removed from the Vita for the US launch.
Thanks hackers.
Thanks hackers.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
I will laugh. Not that I care but I would like to play my PS1 games on my Vita. I can do it on my PSP so it's no biggy there.
Louis Cyphre
Banned
There is simply no way to prevent piracy 100%. Sony can try using proprietary memory cards, system updates and keeping the system tied to PSN but people will figure a workaround.
Make the storage device expensive and charge less for games. That to me would be an incentive to not bother.
Make the storage device expensive and charge less for games. That to me would be an incentive to not bother.
Mama Robotnik
Member
It is a hack that allows homebrew to run on Vita. Regardless of it being contained in an emulator wrapper, its still homebrew code running on the system.
How in the name of God's bollocks, by any sane interpretation, is actual homebrew code and hacks running PS Vita "not even close" to homebrew code and hacks running on PS Vita.
The paradox of logic is making me reach for the paracetamol.
djplaeskool
Member
This is running PSP software (albeit homebrewed) on a PSP emulator.
Barely a "hack," but that will depend on what hardware control is given to the emulator.
I'm guessing, "not much"
Barely a "hack," but that will depend on what hardware control is given to the emulator.
I'm guessing, "not much"
Opus Angelorum
Member
As others have mentioned, the significance of this depends on how well Sony have sand-boxed it.
DR2K
Banned
Are you accusing sony of removing features?
DangerousDave
Member
Then, if it's about the apps... it's already done. Nobody will try to hack Vita because they already can use the PSP emulator to run apps...
butter_stick
Banned
I can't wait to use fantastic PSP homebrew apps on my Vita such as
Almost every update so far killed a few flash cards.
butter_stick
Banned
What does this have to do with the GBA SP?
Biff
Member
This should be quoted in the OP.
Insta-reply gloss-over posters ruin most threads, true fact.
