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[MrKaepora]

The way I see it, the only thing that he shouldn't do is saying the true identity of the trans. He did good in coming out with the truth though and shouldn't be punished for this.

 

[JaseC]

About Destructoid firing/suspension? I'm not sure, the situation is just too complex. I just knew there was gonna be an inevitable fall out when he was saying how the surgery isn't life saving, calling Chloe a 'he' and seeing countless tweets made against him because of those trans-gender tweets.

Yes, and thanks for responding.

 

[Sblargh]

People merely stating "he did nothing wrong" should start telling us why they feel he did nothing wrong.
The situation is less clear than people are making it to be.

One question is: outting her was really relevant for the story? Simply saying that a scam was indeed happening, but declining to comment on the reason as to protect her privacy (which, in her case, means protecting her emotional and physical health from hate groups that are very real) wouldn't it be enough?

I'm genuinely curious as to what people think because then I think we would be having a discussion. Simply saying he did nothing wrong is not even paying attention to the reasons he gave himself for believing what he did was wrong.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

I'm confused why his career is ruined. He outed a liar asking for donations for surgery to remove a piece of metal of she will die but in fact is using it for sex reassignment surgery.

Surely that's a good thing?

Something something Life threatening

This whole episode disgusts me. It is no way fair how everyone is tiptoeing around the clear moral and ethical issues involved here.

 

[dan2026]

I don't understand what being gay or transgender or martian or whatever has to do with anything.

As I understand it he outed a crook who was attempting to obtain money under false pretenses.

He should be given a pat on the back if anything.

 

[redlemon]

Anyone who is unaware of the situation or thinks he did nothing wrong, I implore you to read this post.

I read that when it came out and I can't agree with her conclusions. While I think the way he presented the truth was awful and judgemental (like daily mail level judgemental) but in terms of the lesser of two evils it's not about that at all. It's about the correcting the public record and the truth. I would consider SRS life saving but I think it's safe to say the general public would not. Chloe must have realised that or she would have said how it was lifesaving so I think it's safe to say the result was fraudulent. In this case I can't say that outing her was wrong but pretty much everything else he did was.

 

[see5harp]

I could care less about outing a trans person who has tried to scam people, but the fact of the matter is that his employer asked him to hold off and he didn't. He could have published the info anonymously if he felt like he had to get it off his chest.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

This is wrong. If the person involved was someone who would be covered in, say, the New York Times, and they found out that this person scammed people for a certain type of surgery and the name they used to raise funds was not that person's official name, I think they would publish it.

This writer had a disrespectful tone in his original tweets, but that should be the issue, not "outing" someone who was obviously trans and had a different (male) legal name. It is our responsibility to treat trans people with respect and recognize their gender, not to bend reality around the details of their crimes.

Agreed. The tone of the tweets should be the real issue here.

 

[Spongebob]

CRIMINALS do too, but they should expect to lose it in some fashion when they commit fraud.

I'm not sure what's so hard to understand about this.

 

[Sophia]

Some of you people in this thread should be ashamed of yourself. While her scam wasn't acceptable, he disobeyed a direct order and put her life at danger by outing her as trans.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

I don't agree with the argument that you can just say "she was committing fraud" without being specific. It looks like you're just pointing fingers without any substance.

 

[ArchedThunder]

Agreed. The tone of the tweets should be the real issue here.

He was being blackmailed, I can understand why he was more than a little pissed off about it.

Some of you people in this thread should be ashamed of yourself. While her scam wasn't acceptable, he disobeyed a direct order and put her life at danger by outing her as trans.

No he didn't, people already knew she was trans and she had already attempted suicide when he revealed that she was going to use the money for SRS.

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

I don't get the outrage for outing her. She shouldn't have stolen money.

 

[TheLegendOfMart]

Some of you people in this thread should be ashamed of yourself. While her scam wasn't acceptable, he disobeyed a direct order and put her life at danger by outing her as trans.

He was being blackmailed by her on threat of suicide, she tried to commit suicide before he outed her.

 

[Jburton]

right. at least, that's how I feel anyway. If Chloe wanted to admit what she really wanted it for in an attempt to salvage her reputation, that would have been her right, or not. to claim that she had a condition that was going to kill her, in a completely non vague 'I have pieces of metal in my body killing me' way was terrible and not what she should have done.

no need to turn it into anything else. If someone commits fraud it doesn't mean we have a right to know all the details of their life and why they wanted that money. Be it for spending too much on a mistress, be it for a drug habit, be it for paying someone to keep quiet about something, whatever.



according to people like you, it's come down to tweets. that's sad however you look at it.

"If someone commits fraud it doesn't mean we have a right to know all the details of their life and why they wanted that money" ... ?


Really? ...... of course it does, it's what constitutes the basis of the fraud?

This person defrauds people of their money under false pretences in a public manner, that goes to court and all the truth comes out ......... the hidden reason is the basis of the fraud.


Gender / sexual preference is no basis for protection under the law, or from it and those defrauded deserve the truth as to what their money was actually going to be used for rather than the reason they originally believed it to be for.

 

[Sophia]

I don't get the outrage for outing her. She shouldn't have stolen money.

Because it puts her life in danger. Permanently.

He was being blackmailed by her on threat of suicide, she tried to commit suicide before he outed her.

He didn't need to out her to prevent her suicide and get her help. That's the problem here. And he disobeyed an order not to say anything too.

 

[diffusionx]

I remember the original story about this on Eurogamer, commentators were calling BS on the car accident metal pieces story and speculating on this. It's really not surprising. Nobody would have outed her or tried to out her had she not tried to misappropriate peoples' money.

 

[Spongebob]

Some of you people in this thread should be ashamed of yourself. While her scam wasn't acceptable, he disobeyed a direct order and put her life at danger by outing her as trans.

You speak pretty lightly of a person who attempted to scam thousands of dollars out of people.

 

[theytookourjobz]

People merely stating "he did nothing wrong" should start telling us why they feel he did nothing wrong.
The situation is less clear than people are making it to be.

One question is: outting her was really relevant for the story? Simply saying that a scam was indeed happening, but declining to comment on the reason as to protect her privacy (which, in her case, means protecting her emotional and physical health from hate groups that are very real) wouldn't it be enough?

I'm genuinely curious as to what people think because then I think we would be having a discussion. Simply saying he did nothing wrong is not even paying attention to the reasons he gave himself for believing what he did was wrong.

She could live out her life however she wants and maintain her privacy or she can take to the Internet to use the platform to raise money so she could afford surgery. Seems like she wanted to have her cake and eat it too.

 

[SneakyStephan]

Good journalism. But son, this is the video game PR industry.

You're fired.

Perfect reply.

 

[ImpendingFoil]

He was placed in a situation where looking at all aspects of it, there was no way this was going to end in a positive way for him.

What the girl did with the fundraiser was wrong and rightfully needed to be exposed. Also holding suicide over a person as a deterrent is an absolutely despicable act as well. Outing her was probably not the best thing to do, but it was at the time what appeared to be the right thing to do.

I personally know people that have transitioned their gender and I have seen how stressful such an act can be. At the end of the day though what she had done with her fundraiser was a criminal act and was rightfully exposed. While it is not an easy task to transition, you still need to respect others and not mislead them. I hope the best for all parties involved in this because in the current situation there are no winners or losers here, just people who are facing some difficult times.

 

[Effect]

I don't get the outrage for outing her. She shouldn't have stolen money.

People that have been outed have been killed in the past. There is a very real life endangering aspect to that. Which is why you don't so easily shine a spotlight on something like that. It's also very likely why they told him not to publish the story.

 

[Igo]

Now i'm not sure whether the public suicide attempt was a cry for attention or to spite her enemies. What a farce.

 

[Alec]

Fucking Twitter, man.

Do you value your current position in life? Yes? DELETE YOUR GOD DAMN TWITTER.

Hope he lands on his feet. I personally don't believe he should be fired.

 

[tim.mbp]

I don't get the outrage for outing her. She shouldn't have stolen money.

Did she? I'm pretty sure the Indiegogo campaign was already suspended and refunds were given by the time of his tweets. Outing her seemed over the line at that point, especially doing it on twitter of all place. At least have the decent to write an actual thoughtful article on the subject.

 

[kirblar]

Because it puts her life in danger. Permanently.



He didn't need to out her to prevent her suicide and get her help. That's the problem here. And he disobeyed an order not to say anything too.

Her suicide attempts are on her, not him.

Her decision to make a public scam is on her, not him.

 

[Kifimbo]

One question is: outting her was really relevant for the story? Simply saying that a scam was indeed happening, but declining to comment on the reason as to protect her privacy (which, in her case, means protecting her emotional and physical health from hate groups that are very real) wouldn't it be enough?

It was relevant. Not saying anything would have bring more questions. Was it crucial/important ? Don't think so, but you'd end up with a lot speculations (boob job, other cosmetic surgeries, drug rehabilitation, all kind of hypothesis).

 

[Jac_Solar]

There's no short amount of conflict in this story. In no conceivable universe could this have had a happy ending.

I seem to remember that, when GAF was analysing said IndieGogo fund, it was common knowledge that Chloe was trans*. If I'm not crazy, then he didn't out anyone. That much is objective. But he also seemingly confused her gender. Generally, when one seeks reassignment surgery, it's not because they want to maintain identification of their biological sex, especially not in real life as opposed to the internet. So, that's pretty cut and dry, too. You get beyond those points, things start getting murky.

The debate of Chloe misconstruing a heart condition in order to seek reassignment surgery is one where I back both sides. It's an impossibility to say that she didn't deceive anyone, and a heart condition, especially one that seemingly mimics that of, of all inspirations, Iron Man, is not something that won't hit close to home. However, considering the environment she was raised in and her state's view on trans* culture, it doesn't take a genius to figure out why she did it, and it's hard not to empathise either.

I'm unsure of what Alistair's societal crimes were. I don't think he outed Chloe as trans*, simply on the basis that the information was already out there. If that's not the case, however, then few mistakes could have been bigger. On the other hand, he did seemingly spill these beans simply out of some semi-petty bet. Because of an attempted suicide, he perceived her to be breaking a promise, which was reason enough to tell an anonymous webspace everything about her. Investigative or no, it's a breach of trust, especially when she's lying in the hospital, apparently unaware of her reputation as of now. It's not a professional error, not shouldn't have the fraud been reported on in some capacity, but the expectation of complete empathy in that situation was a fallacy.

Divisive's too kind a word to describe the situation. Unfortunately, there are very few respondants in this situation I'm proud of. Alistair's received too great an amount of hate for offences that seem wiffly waffly, and yet most defending him misunderstand not just what could be perceived as the wrong moves, but what honestly were.

All in all, all I can nail him to the cross for is misconstruing her gender and being a dick about it. Unlike Ryan, who expressed little desire or capacity to move on, Alistair's learning. I don't think he should lose his job and reputation.

And while I have some thoughts about Chloe's actions, I don't think I really care to share much of them. She nearly died. I'm glad she's safe. I'm glad she's not dead. I really, REALLY, wish everyone, Al included, thought that way. This issue honestly should not be bigger than her.

I think he chose to out the scam because a lot of independent game developers were going to donate their game sales for a period of time, not to mention all the other people who might have donated.

 

[Sophia]

Her suicide attempts are on her, not him.

Her decision to make a public scam is on her, not him.

Neither of which are justifications for outing her as a trans person.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

People that have been outed have been killed in the past. There is a very real life endangering aspect to that.

How common is it? Is it regional? Is there precedence for this in the gaming industry? Is it preventable? Are the murderers potentially known entities that could be watched, monitored or stopped? Are the police aware of this and are the police in the region capable of protecting someone who has received death threats?

 

[Hrothgar]

I think he chose to out the scam because a lot of independent game developers were going to donate their game sales for a period of time, not to mention all the other people who might have donated.

Yeah

This is wrong. If the person involved was someone who would be covered in, say, the New York Times, and they found out that this person scammed people for a certain type of surgery and the name they used to raise funds was not that person's official name, I think they would publish it.

This writer had a disrespectful tone in his original tweets, but that should be the issue, not "outing" someone who was obviously trans and had a different (male) legal name. It is our responsibility to treat trans people with respect and recognize their gender, not to bend reality around the details of their crimes.

I agree, although I can partially understand his tone. This guy was blackmailed into not revealing the truth with the threat of suicide. When the suicide then takes place regardless, I can't entirely blame him for feeling disillusioned, frustrated and not paying too much attention to possible sensitivities when he revealed the truth. He was too emotionally involved to go into this cool-headed.

 

[Akira_83]

People that have been outed have been killed in the past. There is a very real life endangering aspect to that. Which is why you don't so easily shine a spotlight on something like that. It's also very likely why they told him not to publish the story.

can you actually give some specific examples of someone in the public spotlight outed for being transgender and then being killed because of it?

sounds like some tinfoil hat shit right there

 

[Quixzlizx]

It's not like anyone believes gaming websites practice real journalism anyway. There's not even a need to fake it.

 

[dan2026]

Since when do transgender people get special treatment under the law?

Fraud is fraud.

 

[Pitmonkey]

Did she? I'm pretty sure the Indiegogo campaign was already suspended and refunds were given by the time of his tweets. Outing her seemed over the line at that point, especially doing it on twitter of all place. At least have the decent to write an actual thoughtful article on the subject.

If she let it go quietly there would have been no reason to out her. Drawing attention to herself by live streaming her suicide attempt inevitably drew attention to the darker details of the story. Her bid for attention brought this on her, nothing else.

 

[Spongebob]

If I'm not wrong wasn't it pretty much confirmed before hand that she was trans?

 

[Polari]

Did she? I'm pretty sure the Indiegogo campaign was already suspended and refunds were given by the time of his tweets. Outing her seemed over the line at that point, especially doing it on twitter of all place. At least have the decent to write an actual thoughtful article on the subject.

Did she suspend it? If Indiegogo were the ones who suspended it, the intent remains and her actions were still criminal.

 

[kirblar]

Neither of which are justifications for outing her as a trans person.

She was continuing to make donation appeals on false pretenses after IndieGoGo shut down. This solves that problem.

I have nothing but sympathy for her issues as a trans individual, but outting the real reason behind everything was vital for putting the scams to an end.

 

[NeonZ]

One question is: outting her was really relevant for the story? Simply saying that a scam was indeed happening, but declining to comment on the reason as to protect her privacy (which, in her case, means protecting her emotional and physical health from hate groups that are very real) wouldn't it be enough?

People would question it and might believe that it was just a baseless rumor created due to some personal grudge. "Hey, she doesn't have any life threatening condition, it's all a lie." just doesn't have much weight coming from a gaming journalist. It'd be a different situation if he could get that into a big newspaper or something, but, considering the situation, giving details about the case was the only way he could make people take his words seriously in a situation like this.

 

[Ravensmash]

People that have been outed have been killed in the past. There is a very real life endangering aspect to that. Which is why you don't so easily shine a spotlight on something like that. It's also very likely why they told him not to publish the story.

So therefore she had no intent to reveal the true goal of her funding, thus continuing to deceive donors who were led to believe they were donating for a different cause.

While I certainly wish her no harm and hope she gets the help she really needs, I think the public has a right to know if they are donating money under false pretences.

I dunno, I'm mixed with the whole thing - I guess it's a case of weighing up every angle and evaluating it from there. Was his story and subsequent outing of Chloe justifiable amidst the wider picture? The fact that she is transgender was relevant to the story, after all.

I dunno...

 

[shuri]

Because it puts her life in danger. Permanently.

He didn't need to out her to prevent her suicide and get her help. That's the problem here. And he disobeyed an order not to say anything too.

She is the only person responsible for her own fate. Emotionally blackmailing people to protect herself over being exposed as a scammer is NOT a noble thing.

Everything is her own fault.

Revealing that the money was going to be used for gender re-alignment surgery (I have no idea if its the correct term) is part of the story. Especially considering from what I reckon in previous, she admitted the fact over instant messengers that she was going to use the money for the operation instead herself.

I can understand that being outed is not fun. But the 'sex change operation' narrative was part of the story.

 

[Wolves Evolve]

This is all so fucking weird to me.

I was looking at the crowdfunding page hours before it was taken down. To my mind, it was 100% clear what the money was for. There was open discussion of her being transgender, and the ambiguity about the surgery being funded was framed about how much gender surgery costs. It was completely clear. The metal poisoning stuff.. I read it as a openly-admitted cover story. It was clear as day.

 

[ArchedThunder]

Neither of which are justifications for outing her as a trans person.

According to other people in this thread, it was already known that she was trans. He didn't out her, all he did was say that the money was for SRS.

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

Because it puts her life in danger. Permanently.

She seems to be more life threatening to herself.

 

[CheesecakeRecipe]

Destructoid stood behind Jim Sterling and some of his more outrageous phrasings and continually refused to fire him (and good on em for doing so), but Alistar wouldn't get that kind of protection...why? I'm not entirely sure.

He did good journalistic work - He exposed the truth about a fraud and told the people exactly where their money was going. You don't start stealing $30,000 under the pretense of one thing and then have it be another. I'm all for people living their lives and being happy, but I don't buy that one article's attempt at claiming how SRS should be legally defined as "Life-Saving". Her suicide attempts and any complications arising from that is one thing, gettin yer parts re-arranged is an entirely different matter.

What's he supposed to put at the end of the article, "As it turns out, the funds for her life-saving surgery turned out to be for something completely different." and just leave it at that? Readers will want to know. The people she stole money from will want to know. And if Dtoid's article doesn't have the info, the story may either slowly fall through the cracks and no one will care, or the internet would have outsed her anyways.

There's going to be a mob either way, and while I don't wish for either to have to suffer more in this ordeal I find myself more on Alistair's side than hers. It really sucks that she has to live in a morally compromising position due to the way she was born but that does not justify stealing a bunch of money to make it right.

 

[StarCreator]

can you actually give some specific examples of someone in the public spotlight outed for being transgender and then being killed because of it?

sounds like some tinfoil hat shit right there

Wikipedia has a convenient list just for this purpose: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unlawfully_killed_transgender_people

I am in no way siding with Chloe's actions though. Whatever comes of this, comes of her own doing. She is completely responsible for her own fate.

 

[Domstercool]

Neither of which are justifications for outing her as a trans person.

If this person was using the money that this person stole from the public, the public should know where that money could have potentially used for. It was just unfortunate that the truth was to get an operation of this kind.

If the money was to fund buying a new car, a new house or even to help someone else, that would have been called out as well. Like I said, it was just unfortunate that it happened to be something relating to sex.

Imagine donating to a cause to help something, then that something was never helped. The people who donated have a right to know what they could have potentially -or in some cases, did - help support.

 

[Captain Tuttle]

Because appearances. This Chloe person is a deranged individual, and this fellow did the right thing by exposing the scam she was trying to run, but because of the drama that followed the site has to take disciplinary action to satiate the frothing, angry hordes.

They needed a sacrificial lamb.


Bad stuff all around, surely this could have been handled better.

 

[Jac_Solar]

Because it puts her life in danger. Permanently.

What do you mean by this? Are there active trans-hate groups in whatever country she is located?

 

[Alec]

Detective-GAF should put their skills to use and try to save this guy's job. But I suppose the risk is that it would make things worse.