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[JohnnyFootball]

What are some great doom 3 mods that enhance the original game?

I know perfected and sikkmod are big ones, but are there other ones that people might recommend?

 

[Raptomex]

What are some great doom 3 mods that enhance the original game?

I know perfected and sikkmod are big ones, but are there other ones that people might recommend?

Perfected DOOM 3. You're welcome.

 

[Skab]

Perfected DOOM 3. You're welcome.

You just recommended one he just said he knows about.

 

[subversus]

Even the supposedly old school shooters released nowadays don't have level design like that

Rise of the Triad?

 

[Raptomex]

You just recommended one he just said he knows about.

Aaah. Didn't see that. I was on my phone when I posted it. Well Perfected Doom 3 is worth mentioning twice. Most of the "enhancement" mods I found for Doom 3 seem to include the Wulfen textures and Sikkmod. But if anyone finds any others be sure to list them. I don't mind revisiting Doom 3 with whole new reason to play.

 

[Raptomex]

So true.

I'd recommend the Serious Sam series to anyone who liked older FPS games. It's not so much about level design as it is about being swarmed but it's still good fun and they're a decent length. The levels are pretty huge.

 

[Dragoon En Regalia]

Rise of the Triad at least compensates with multi-floor rooms, something Doom cannot do natively (and, one would argue, Build delivers in fair supply—pretty crazy what source ports have done for both engines!). There's always going to be difficulty designing levels to have a sense of space or, hell, internal logic, something that Doom manages from the very start with an unusual, inefficient, but still recognizable hangar design.

 

[SparkTR]

Rise of the Triad?

Wrack, no other recent shooter has captured that 90's gameplay better than Wrack. It's made by the guy who created Skulltag.

 

[TUROK]

This picture is stupid.

 

[G-Fex]

This picture is stupid.

how so?

 

[TUROK]

how so?

Well, not so much the picture as the people who think it's accurate and not an exaggeration.

 

[Dragoon En Regalia]

Wrack, no other recent shooter has captured that 90's gameplay better than Wrack. It's made by the guy who created Skulltag.

Faithful and competent as it looks, the bestiary's unremarkable and I feel like I'd rather play Doom. That's the problem with a lot of games taking their influence from Doom, which is a relatively simple game that's been expanded upon by implementing adventure-game mechanics, puzzling and platforming. Serious Sam and the like provide pure arena shootouts and map design has generally moved on from long halls and labyrinths unless needed (as in Ultima Underworld).

One crazy idea that might work in a post-Souls era would be to use that crazy Quake concept Romero had that let you witness other players' exploits during single-player. I don't think an open-world Doom game could work, but a Souls-like hint system that shows you other players' tactics in an inclement/finished situation could give new players a tutorial system. This would ideally play into the more supernatural element of the series without requiring hellish maps specifically (which is what Sandy built his atmosphere around).

 

[G-Fex]

Wrack sorely needs a lot of work, but I like to think he was on the right track.

Well, not so much the picture as the people who think it's accurate and not an exaggeration.

Well there's actually a lot I learned from that. It's a culmination of watching KingDime's history of the WAD as well as hearing Tarnsman and others talk.

Doom is really a unique thing, but it needs together like a C4 and a Detonator, cookies and milk.

DOOM's ingenius and amazing chess strategy like gameplay of not just run and gun but run, strategize, improvise and wielding weapons that are NOT the least bit underpowered this side of the handgun.

It has to go together with GOOD maps really good maps compliment the gameplay well. There's a reason people choose Ultimate Doom over Doom 2's. There's a good reason a lot prefer Plutonia to TNT. TNT had a lot of good intentions and ideas but didn't quite click like Plutonia's maps did to me.

There could be HUGE and there is HUGE maps that are either in fan made Megawads or even official wads like Final Doom or whatever and they could just be..bad. Really bad. There's got to be something planned with it to make it good. Not just big for the sake of big.

Look at Community Chest Map 29.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZp9cT6PDh0

so AMAZING looking at the beginning, but it's honestly a clusterfuck of a mess. Looks amazing on the outside though.

A lot of people also think that bigger maps = more difficult, yeah that's true if you want to turn it into a slaughtermap practically. Some of the most difficult maps aren't even that big like a GREAT example is E4M1 or E4M2 or even Underhalls in Doom II. They're basic as hell and got the difficulty.

So in all with this rambling on, it could be in the old style of doom with mazes and things and still be garbage cause they're not designed well, they could be a clusterfuck but a pretty one or a ugly rat maze.

Maybe that's why there's so many 'O' of destruction/Dead Simple/Underhall/Entryway clones.


Wrack has that problem of the areas almost all looking the same and it's easy to get lost or confused and there's no automap. Least Doom has distinction where you can tell different areas apart.

Lot of thought and ingenuity goes into map making, and it'll show in a lot of the good wads listed by the OP and ViewtifulJC.


Heck even new game levels can be done well, Bioshock 1 had some pretty good level layout if I remember right.

 

[TUROK]

Well there's actually a lot I learned from that. It's a culmination of watching KingDime's history of the WAD as well as hearing Tarnsman and others talk.

Doom is really a unique thing, but it needs together like a C4 and a Detonator, cookies and milk.

DOOM's ingenius and amazing chess strategy like gameplay of not just run and gun but run, strategize, improvise and wielding weapons that are NOT the least bit underpowered this side of the handgun.

It has to go together with GOOD maps really good maps compliment the gameplay well. There's a reason people choose Ultimate Doom over Doom 2's. There's a good reason a lot prefer Plutonia to TNT. TNT had a lot of good intentions and ideas but didn't quite click like Plutonia's maps did to me.

There could be HUGE and there is HUGE maps that are either in fan made Megawads or even official wads like Final Doom or whatever and they could just be..bad. Really bad. There's got to be something planned with it to make it good. Not just big for the sake of big.

Look at Community Chest Map 29.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZp9cT6PDh0

so AMAZING looking at the beginning, but it's honestly a clusterfuck of a mess. Looks amazing on the outside though.

A lot of people also think that bigger maps = more difficult, yeah that's true if you want to turn it into a slaughtermap practically. Some of the most difficult maps aren't even that big like a GREAT example is E4M1 or E4M2 or even Underhalls in Doom II. They're basic as hell and got the difficulty.

So in all with this rambling on, it could be in the old style of doom with mazes and things and still be garbage cause they're not designed well, they could be a clusterfuck but a pretty one or a ugly rat maze.

Maybe that's why there's so many 'O' of destruction/Dead Simple/Underhall/Entryway clones.


Wrack has that problem of the areas almost all looking the same and it's easy to get lost or confused and there's no automap. Least Doom has distinction where you can tell different areas apart.

Lot of thought and ingenuity goes into map making, and it'll show in a lot of the good wads listed by the OP and ViewtifulJC.


Heck even new game levels can be done well, Bioshock 1 had some pretty good level layout if I remember right.

Yeah, big for the sake of big and complex for the sake of complex don't make for good maps.

It's been a few years since I've last completed Plutonia and TNT, but I remember liking the last level of TNT more. I also remember having the shit scared out of me in Plutonia by all the fucking Revenants. Not really relevant, just wanted to share the anecdote.

And in regard to Doom VS Doom 2, I found myself preferring Doom more for the visual aesthetic, the hellish aesthetic, rather than the level design, although I do prefer the level design in Doom. For lack of a better word, I'd call it clever, much more so than Doom 2's.

Giant maps are difficult to me, not because they're populated with monsters, but because sometimes they're fucking confusing. Still, though, my favorite type of WAD is the Hell Revealed/Alien Vendetta type. They're the most fun to I.

Not really sure where I was going with any of this.

 

[Estocolmo]

Hey guys, how about sending tweets, mails and messages to ID Software about re-releasing Doom 64?

 

[TUROK]

Hey guys, how about sending tweets, mails and messages to ID Software about re-releasing Doom 64?

I doubt they have the rights to the code and assets of it. It was developed by Midway, after all.

I love me some Doom 64, though. It ties with Doom 1 as the best Doom game there is.

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

Hey guys, how about sending tweets, mails and messages to ID Software about re-releasing Doom 64?

It's likely not in their power anymore. The developer, Midway Games, went out of business in 2009. Legal nightmare.

 

[G-Fex]

Hey guys, how about sending tweets, mails and messages to ID Software about re-releasing Doom 64?

There's Doom 64 EX and Doom Absolution. Google them and have fun. DOOM 64 EX is currently the one of choice and it plays great with mouse + Keyboard

On the topic of maps, let's enjoy some hilarious D! Zone maps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CBkh3JSwVQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xH0_RDiAI6E

 

[Dictator93]

There's Doom 64 EX and Doom Absolution. Google them and have fun. DOOM 64 EX is currently the one of choice and it plays great with mouse + Keyboard

On the topic of maps, let's enjoy some hilarious D! Zone maps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CBkh3JSwVQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xH0_RDiAI6E

Absolution is relatively horrible if you compare it to Doom64 eX. I would definitely only ever recommend Doom64eX.

Speaking about beasiary in concern to Wracked is pretty relevant btw. Doom managed to combine an interesting, diverse, and fund to shoot beasiary with its great level design.

While it is pretty easy to find that circle strafing gameplay in other games, the type of things you shoot or the settings in which you are forced to shoot them (I say forced, because opening a door and having a hell knight on the other side is do or die) are 1 of a kind in doom.

It is actually one of the reasons why I prefer a lot of doom 1 levels or some of the less open levels from doom II in general. They place you in scenarios where you have to be extra cautious and have to check all corners whilst being health and ammo resourceful (doom64 is like this the whole way for example).

IMO, tight quarters close combat in doom tends to be more memorable than circle strafing with a plasma gun/rocket launcher in the out door areas of a level like downtown.

 

[G-Fex]

Absolution is relatively horrible if you compare it to Doom64 eX. I would definitely only ever recommend Doom64eX.

Speaking about beasiary in concern to Wracked is pretty relevant btw. Doom managed to combine an interesting, diverse, and fund to shoot beasiary with its great level design.

While it is pretty easy to find that circle strafing gameplay in other games, the type of things you shoot or the settings in which you are forced to shoot them (I say forced, because opening a door and having a hell knight on the other side is do or die) are 1 of a kind in doom.

It is actually one of the reasons why I prefer a lot of doom 1 levels or some of the less open levels from doom II in general. They place you in scenarios where you have to be extra cautious and have to check all corners whilst being health and ammo resourceful (doom64 is like this the whole way for example).

IMO, tight quarters close combat in doom tends to be more memorable than circle strafing with a plasma gun/rocket launcher in the out door areas of a level like downtown.

Speaking of concern thank you for saying that word cause it reminded me of a very good wad I remembered

get ConC.E.R.N.ed today , a 3 Episode megawad for Doom

If not just for the E1M1 music then.

also yes on the subject of Wrack there is a lot of things carnevil needs to fix this side of overhauling the entire game.

Oh man where to start, the weapons aren't quite there , theres good idea and design but it doesn't have quite the firepower feel or impact. It needs some standard goals on what each gun wants to be. I don't like the sword.

Bestiary, yes the enemies are really a mess, spiders are annoying but it's what he's going for, the humanoid enemies still need work, and the big robots are a really neat idea but he doesn't really know what he wants them to do so they come off as confusing moving enemies. If he wanted he could make them in the vein of Hell Barons or even Revenants.

Story sucks too.

Onto close quarters, I agree with you. I actually like fighting in corridors, if you do it right it really is awesome and exciting. Like I mentioned, Underhalls aka E1M2 of Doom II is nice, tight, memorable and just simple.

I love small levels, I think Episode 1 and 2 of Doom 1 do a lot right with corridor tight personal battles.

Speaking of which, I recently decided to become a Doom speedrunner like some people I know of, it's going to be a pain but I'm going to do everything I can to nail a good personal best in Episode 1. I'm going to study Demos and videos for strats and all that stuff.

 

[Apoc87]

Dey be hating on Doom3

 

[Estocolmo]

It's likely not in their power anymore. The developer, Midway Games, went out of business in 2009. Legal nightmare.

I doubt they have the rights to the code and assets of it. It was developed by Midway, after all.

I love me some Doom 64, though. It ties with Doom 1 as the best Doom game there is.

There's Doom 64 EX and Doom Absolution. Google them and have fun. DOOM 64 EX is currently the one of choice and it plays great with mouse + Keyboard

On the topic of maps, let's enjoy some hilarious D! Zone maps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CBkh3JSwVQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xH0_RDiAI6E

I dont have a PC, only a MAC and Xbox 360 I think more people will have the opportunity to play this hidden gem if someone re-releases it again. And its nice playing it with achievements, leaderboards and those kind of things too

 

[SparkTR]

I dont have a PC, only a MAC and Xbox 360 I think more people will have the opportunity to play this hidden gem if someone re-releases it again. And its nice playing it with achievements, leaderboards and those kind of things too

Doom 64 EX has a Mac version. The game will probably never get officially re-released because it's likely in some copyright hell due to it being developed by Midway and there's barely any demand for it.

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

I dont have a PC, only a MAC and Xbox 360 I think more people will have the opportunity to play this hidden gem if someone re-releases it again. And its nice playing it with achievements, leaderboards and those kind of things too

I know... you kinda ignored what I said though, lol.

 

[Claneko]

Very cool, I actually just got back into playing Doom. Downloaded it on iPad, was awash with nostalgia, and immediately bought the Doom 3 BFG edition on Steam. At home or at work, I'm battling the armies of hell.

I was also a fan of the Playstation version back in the day mainly because of the coloring and soundtrack they used. It was very cool. Between that and the PC games, I literally have no idea how many times I have blasted my way through these games. Very good times!

 

[subversus]

This picture is stupid.

Yeah, I can't get its point.

 

[Ifrit]

No reference to Deus Vult and Deus Vult II?? Booo!

The best megawads, imo.

Surprised by this too, really amazing stuff and fun as hell. Really one of the best wads I've ever played, last levels are pretty insane, hard but possible tough

 

[Atruvius]

Dey be hating on Doom3

I think it's pretty good with sikkmod and when you have toggled high movement speed on. It feels more like a traditional Doom game when you can sidestep incoming fireballs with relative ease. But most of the levels just look boring.

 

[Shadow Hog]

immediately bought the Doom 3 BFG edition on Steam.

Hate to tell you this, but you got the wrong version. BFG edition has annoying censorship issues (pills instead of red crosses on stimpacks, medikits and berserk packs, complete bowdlerization of the Wolf 3D secret stages in Doom 2, etc). I'm not 100% sure if there's a fanmade patch that fixes it... might be, but I'm not sure.

Although I suppose you get No Rest for the Living, so there's that?

 

[Tain]

how so?

It was a cute joke the first time I saw it but I've seen it more often posted as an actual argument. It's as though most don't realize there's a reason it doesn't specify a real game under "2010".

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Let me rephrase:

Aside from Perfected Doom and Sikkmod are there any other mods that allow things like:

Gamepad support.
Aim down the sights.
Native widescreen.

Surely these must exist since the game has had its source code released.

yes, I want to replay Doom 3 using a controller on my couch.

 

[Dylstew]

If somone that's european ever wants to play some doom online(especially if you wanna play megaman 8 bit deathmatch) through zandronum, add me on steam(Dylstew) or PM me.

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

It was a cute joke the first time I saw it but I've seen it more often posted as an actual argument. It's as though most don't realize there's a reason it doesn't specify a real game under "2010".

Sure, it's exaggerated, but that doesn't take anything away from the point it's making. It just adds a bit of humor to it.

 

[Dylstew]

Hey OP, I think you should explain how to play online using IDE(Internet Doom Explorer) and Doomseeker.
You might aswell add Megaman 8 Bit Deathmatch, great TC that combines 2 games I love.
http://cutstuff.net/mm8bdm/

Somehow 60 fps doom gives mouselag/input lag, so I always turn ''uncapped fps'' off in zandronum's settings. I also run Zandronum in OpenGL,which makes it full 3D, you can fully look up and down. 60fps doom looks really smooth, but it's a lot harder to play than 35 fps doom.

IDE Link: http://doomutils.ucoz.com/
Doomseeker link: http://doomseeker.drdteam.org/

 

[TheDarkKnight774]

Sure, it's exaggerated, but that doesn't take anything away from the point it's making. It just adds a bit of humor to it.

the problem is like the Master Race joke, people are now not taking it as an exaggerated joke but some salient point.

 

[daedalius]

So can we talk about Doom 4 here?

Brad on GB postulated what I think would actually be the best going forward for Doom: Remake Doom with the most mindblowing engine/graphics imaginable, same music(well, obviously redone in orchestral perhaps), guns, etc.

I think the nostalgia feels from that would outweigh any CoD style campaign that might already be planned, but unfortunately I'll be that is what we are going to get. Who is even driving the vision for Doom 4 at this point?

Also, think I'm just about done with my Doom 2 brutal playthrough, some of those levels are just insane. Nothing like coming into a level with a wall of fireballs speeding towards you.

 

[Jazzkokehead]

Let me rephrase:

Aside from Perfected Doom and Sikkmod are there any other mods that allow things like:

Gamepad support.
Aim down the sights.
Native widescreen.

Surely these must exist since the game has had its source code released.

yes, I want to replay Doom 3 using a controller on my couch.

BFG Edition has native widescreen and gamepad support. If you don't want to spend money on it (which I understand), you can change the resolution via console if you have the latest patch (though the HUD will be stretched), and you can use some kind of program like Xpadder to enable you to use a controller as well. As far as I know, there's no mod that features an updated HUD, nor that allows for widescreen resolutions without using the console and editing the config file, although that by itself is a simple process.

As for the ability to aim down sights - the game wasn't designed with that in mind, so I'm not really sure what that adds at all nor why you would want it. Though there probably is a mod that allows it.

Edit: I looked, and apparently the Perfected Doom 3 mod has iron sights for several of the guns. So try that, maybe.

 

[JNT]

So can we talk about Doom 4 here?

Brad on GB postulated what I think would actually be the best going forward for Doom: Remake Doom with the most mindblowing engine/graphics imaginable, same music(well, obviously redone in orchestral perhaps), guns, etc.

I think the nostalgia feels from that would outweigh any CoD style campaign that might already be planned, but unfortunately I'll be that is what we are going to get. Who is even driving the vision for Doom 4 at this point?

Also, think I'm just about done with my Doom 2 brutal playthrough, some of those levels are just insane. Nothing like coming into a level with a wall of fireballs speeding towards you.

Officially, I think Kevin Cloud is still lead man on that project.

If cinematic, cover-based, story-driven shooter is what id are going for they are going to have a hard time differentiating Doom 4 from their competitors' output and I honestly think that could spell the end of id as a game developer. However, I get the feeling that there is an itch among plenty of people right now, brought on by a fatigue of bland first person shooters, that a big-name title has yet to scratch. The most effective way for id to make a splash with Doom 4 is to go back to Doom's roots, while at the same time taking hints from Brutal Doom on how to modernize the gameplay.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

I'm not even sure what a Doom 4 could even be. No matter what, they can't capture that lightning in a bottle that was the original release. id have been pretty much irrelevant since the turn of the century, only releasing two games to somewhat middling reactions in the face of the 90s Doom and Quake games. I'm afraid Doom 4 will just be another shooting game, probably with demons that shoot with a shotgun, perhaps a double barrel variety.

Just lookin' at their output the last decade or so and the development hell the game's been trapped in, I just have zero faith it will be anything special. But I guess I should save some of this manly rugged pessimism for when we actually see it.

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

So can we talk about Doom 4 here?

Brad on GB postulated what I think would actually be the best going forward for Doom: Remake Doom with the most mindblowing engine/graphics imaginable, same music(well, obviously redone in orchestral perhaps), guns, etc.

I think the nostalgia feels from that would outweigh any CoD style campaign that might already be planned, but unfortunately I'll be that is what we are going to get. Who is even driving the vision for Doom 4 at this point?

Also, think I'm just about done with my Doom 2 brutal playthrough, some of those levels are just insane. Nothing like coming into a level with a wall of fireballs speeding towards you.

Noooope. Nope nope nope. Doom 3 was essentially a Doom remake. And for all its graphics, engines, and tech, it didn't touch the original experience of playing Doom.

 

[Shadow Hog]

What id needs to do is basically take the mechanics from Doom 2 verbatim (maybe fixing some of the more egregious bugs along the way), but allow for freelook and have true 3D level designs (a la Quake) without sacrificing the surreality/gameplay-first mentality that made Doom work.

 

[goombatommy]

This song in particular creeped me out on Doom PSX. Just so goes with the atmosphere..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEqckyRC-Ek

 

[daedalius]

Noooope. Nope nope nope. Doom 3 was essentially a Doom remake. And for all its graphics, engines, and tech, it didn't touch the original experience of playing Doom.

I know it didn't, what I'm saying is make the mechanics almost exactly the same as original Doom and Doom 2, but make it look/feel absolutely incredible with a modern engine.

I wouldn't want something like Doom 3 again, playing through it again with the BFG variety, its actually quite boring considering you get 1 or 2 enemies at once, ever.

 

[Raptomex]

I don't know if you can ever recapture what made Doom and Doom 2 so special. Doom 3 certainly didn't do it. However, John Carmack is a genius when it comes to programming and since he is no longer part of id that could mean Doom may never be the same. However, if they stay away from the immense focus on horror and more on running and gunning with Doom 4, I think it could be amazing. id has always implemented great shooting mechanics and now we can see how they do without John. The AI wasn't too shabby in Rage either so maybe some decent AI will come along as well.

As for level design, I was never a fan of the big open levels in Doom 2. The game really wasn't designed for that, or so it feels. The enemies can pretty much hit you from anywhere, especially the zombie soldiers. It's more about corridors and rooms. Now the days of keycards seem to be over and platforming in FPS games as well minus a few. Duke Nukem Forever is a perfect example of attempting 90s mechanics, and even that game would have been bad in the 90s. One of my gripes with Doom 3 was everything began to look the same. I got lost more in Doom 3 then I ever did in the original games. Needless to say the levels were more interesting in the original games, too.

 

[Apoc87]

Hate to tell you this, but you got the wrong version. BFG edition has annoying censorship issues (pills instead of red crosses on stimpacks, medikits and berserk packs, complete bowdlerization of the Wolf 3D secret stages in Doom 2, etc). I'm not 100% sure if there's a fanmade patch that fixes it... might be, but I'm not sure.

Although I suppose you get No Rest for the Living, so there's that?

Wat.

I just bought BFG edition for ps3. The red cross censor doesnt bother me but god dammit the nazi levels were by far my favorite in the OG doom 2.

Wat.

 

[sp3000]

I'm not even sure what a Doom 4 could even be. No matter what, they can't capture that lightning in a bottle that was the original release. id have been pretty much irrelevant since the turn of the century, only releasing two games to somewhat middling reactions in the face of the 90s Doom and Quake games. I'm afraid Doom 4 will just be another shooting game, probably with demons that shoot with a shotgun, perhaps a double barrel variety.

Just lookin' at their output the last decade or so and the development hell the game's been trapped in, I just have zero faith it will be anything special. But I guess I should save some of this manly rugged pessimism for when we actually see it.

I'm not sure where the idea that Doom 3 was middling came from. It scored very high reviews when it released, and still has an 87 on metacritic. This was back before hyped games had review sites paid off as well.

It wasn't a sequel to doom to begin with, it was a survival horror reboot and an excellent one at that. You can fault iD for not making a Doom 3 in the sense of a direct sequel with similar gameplay, but Doom 3 absolutely worked in what it tried to do.

Rage on the other hand sucked in every way

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

It wasn't a sequel to doom to begin with, it was a survival horror reboot and an excellent one at that. You can fault iD for not making a Doom 3 in the sense of a direct sequel with similar gameplay, but Doom 3 absolutely worked in what it tried to do.

Rage on the other hand sucked in every way

Then don't call it Doom 3. Don't hype it as a Doom successor.

 

[Raptomex]

Doom 3 isn't a bad game I just don't think it's a good Doom game. As for Rage. The shooting was phenomenal. It's biggest problem was it tried to be so many things and they were all half-assed. Semi open world, story was forgettable, car combat was shallow, racing was eh, the post apocalyptic feel doesn't even come close to rivaling any games like Fallout. But the shooting was amazing. At least I thought so.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

I did like the shooting parts in Rage. It was every other thing it did that I didn't care for.

Hopefully the former Starbreeze guys can put the gunplay to good use in a more focused environment of Wolfenstein. And with less pop-in, God willing.

 

[Rickenslacker]

I'm not sure where the idea that Doom 3 was middling came from. It scored very high reviews when it released, and still has an 87 on metacritic. This was back before hyped games had review sites paid off as well.

It wasn't a sequel to doom to begin with, it was a survival horror reboot and an excellent one at that. You can fault iD for not making a Doom 3 in the sense of a direct sequel with similar gameplay, but Doom 3 absolutely worked in what it tried to do.

Rage on the other hand sucked in every way

I dunno if you can say that Doom 3 was an excellent survival horror reboot of the franchise and then say Rage sucked in every way in the same post. There's nothing survival about Doom 3, just a pared down corridor shooter that's overbearingly dark, by the time most enemies have done their flourishing introductions they've already been boomsticked. Someone at id sure thought the teleporting imp animation was really impressive because they made it long enough to be their biggest vulnerability, which was a pretty big one as they would often just make you fight one at a time. It just felt like an incredibly sedated version of the games they were known for.

Rage has a lot of problems, but I think it had way more going for it overall.