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EA and 2k are Killing the Sports Genre

Bullet Club

Banned
EA and 2k are Killing the Sports Genre

In my 20+ years of gaming, I have known some pretty hardcore sports gamers. Back in the days when the Fight Night games were still a thing, I knew guys who would play the Career/Legacy mode of those games until they became undisputed world champion. Of every weight class.

I have never been one such hardcore sports gamer, but I definitely enjoyed sports games growing up. Part of this had to do with all the options that I had as a kid. Basketball games are my favorite sports games, and as a kid, I had NBA Live, NBA 2K, NBA: Inside Drive, AND 1 Streetball, Backyard Basketball (Believe it or not, the Backyard sports games were actually fun), NBA Hoopz, NCAA March Madness, and NBA Ballers.

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Fast forward to 2020, and we have NBA 2K and NBA Live. NBA Live has lived in the shadow of NBA 2K for years now, so basically, you just have NBA 2K. Which, you know, sucks.

Football games aren’t doing any better. When’s the last time you heard of a football video game that wasn’t Madden? I think that MLB The Show isn’t as horrible as its’ basketball or football counterparts, but it’s still pretty bad.

Whatever your sports game of choice may be, there are four constants in the modern sports genre: Microtransactions, stagnation, EA, and 2K. And these four things are making the sports genre arguably the worst in gaming.

$60 is a lot to ask for a video game, so it had better be worth the money. And modern, annual sports games honestly aren’t. As Angry Joe very furiously puts it in his recent rants about NBA 2K20 and Madden 20, modern sports titles are largely copy and paste jobs. Lazy ones at that, since they can’t even be bothered to fix the shortcomings found in last year’s entries. The only things that change are the microtransactions. Sports gamers are essentially paying for the “privilege” of resetting their accounts so that they can start at the bottom of the microtransactions, grind-fest ladder once again. Repeat ad infinitum.

And since we are on the topic of sports gamers, we need to talk about the role they play in the downfall of the genre that they love. Because sports gamers are indeed enablers of video game industry villains like EA and 2K. A lot of these guys are hardcore sports gamers, but casual also gamers. What do I mean by that? I mean their investment in the gaming industry as a whole is very minimal. If they played Game Dev Story, chances are, they’d get zero of the gaming references. They don’t know about the way that Konami has treated Hideo Kojima since his departure from the company, or about Blizzard’s plummet from grace. They sure don’t care about these things. For a lot of sports gamers, gaming is just NBA2K and Madden, and that’s it.

It’s not really a surprise that people with very little investment in the video game industry aren’t as inclined to care about what happens to it, but you would think they’d at least care a little more about the game they pour hundreds of dollars and hours into right?

I was into a lot of trading card games as a kid and teenager, but folks like EA and 2K have caused me to despise even hearing the words card packs now. I guess that we should be thankful that the extreme sports genre has been long dead; otherwise, they’d ruin that too. I don’t even want to know what microtransactions in a skateboarding game look like. New deck tape for the low price of five dollars?

At the pace it is going, the sports genre of video games is completely doomed. The sports games put out by EA and 2K share the same harmful qualities that atypical mobile games do. They are very profitable for the developers, but extremely detrimental to the industry and consumers. One of the most effective ways to push back against developer overstepping is with your wallets. But a significant portion of gamers in the sports community don’t know or care how bad it is getting. Combine this with the ever-growing problem of pig consumer culture and gamers just accepting whatever it is developers give them, and I worry that these terrible digital casinos will permanently solidify themselves as the new norm of the sports genre.

There is a little ray of hope, though. Governments around the world are taking notice of the monetization practices of companies like 2K and EA. Last year, Belgium made loot boxes illegal, and despite some initial resistance, EA was forced to remove sale of FIFA’s currency to continue selling the game in Belgium. You may not like governments stepping into this matter for fear of oversight, but their actions at least bring more attention to the issue.

Even prominent figures in the sports community have spoken up and voiced their displeasure with the numerous problems in the most recent annual entries in the NBA2K and Madden series of games. If even more of them were to continue to take a stand against the severe decline of the sports genre, then maybe the average sports gamer will finally take notice of the issue and realize that they deserve so much better. There is only so much that we outside gamers can do. If real change is to ever happen in the sports genre, sports gamers are the ones who need to lead the charge.

Unless they start doing something to invoke change, and soon, what we have now is all we will ever have. And what we have now needs to die in an Amaterasu dumpster fire.

Even people in the sports community aren’t too happy with the numerous problems in NBA2K20. If the prominent figures of the sports community were to collectively take a stand against the severe decline of the sports genre, then maybe that will wake up the average sports gamer and get them to realize that they deserve much better. Because unless they start doing something to invoke change, what we have now is all we will ever have. And what we have now needs to die in an Amaterasu dumpster fire.

Source: Exclusively Games
 

Moneal

Member
The sim-sports genre, not counting text sims, died years ago with the rise of Ultimate Team like bs. Prior to that franchise mode dominated the changes each year. Even gameplay changes were done to enhanced franchise mode aswell.
 

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
Sports games are almost universally trash, and have been for a good 25 or so years. Back when NBA Jam/Hangtime, Baseball Stars 2, Neo Turf Masters, and NFL Blitz were around, it was a different story. Those games were fun. Those games are still incredibly fun. Seriously, go back and play them again - you'll be amazed. But at some point, everyone decided to chase the idea of sports sims, and fun mechanics fell by the wayside in favor of statistics. And then the prevailing studios realized that you could actually just charge for those statistics, and they've been successful, so we're not going to see a return to when sports games were actually good for the foreseeable future. At least, not with any major license.
 
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ph33rknot

Banned
Sports games are almost universally trash, and have been for a good 25 or so years. Back when NBA Jam/Hangtime, Baseball Stars 2, Neo Turf Masters, and NFL Blitz were around, it was a different story. Those games were fun. Those games are still incredibly fun. Seriously, go back and play them again - you'll be amazed. But at some point, everyone decided to chase the idea of sports sims, and fun mechanics fell by the wayside in favor of statistics. And then the prevailing studios realized that you could actually just charge for those statistics, and they've been successful, so we're not going to see a return to when sports games were actually good for the foreseeable future. At least, not with any major license.
You are some one never played the games i can see
 
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killing? sports games died a long time ago. Now it's just glorified gambling packaged as a "sports" game that gets refreshed yearly, and aimed at children, no less.
 

PerfectDark

Banned
I play allot of NBA 2k20 franchise or myleague. Devs are trash and ignore everything not online. Funny thing is Online is gimped and they have 90% of the games camera views not useable online. I can't even use my camera views I play with and have been using for 10 years online. Or else I would just play online because they ignore franchise.

Rosters are half assed. Each draft class I have to spend 5hrs on editing or else you get 0 good players with any talent. Now half my draft class players are getting WNBA signature moves and packages. I drafted a stud in my franchise and he had 90 dunk and never could dunk. Went into all his animation packages and they all were WNBA. Think that was the last straw for me I just deleted my franchise in season 3 where i played the 4th quarter in every game.

Madden is unplayable. NBA 2k is not much better.

College sports was a kick i the junk. Sport games are my favorite. Its just pure torture to be a sports gamer nowdays.
 
ESPN2K5 was great because it was an incredible title with amazing value that made EA go all out with Madden. It made Madden a great title and also had EA selling Madden for $20-30 when it would normally be $60.

Unfortunately the $20 price scheme got the attention of the NFL and ruined everything. I think had they launched 2K5 at $60, we’d still have competing football titles today.

Of course, that doesn’t guarantee quality. NCAAF was a fucking glorious franchise and EA had no competition there. I think the problem with all of these sports titles (Madden, NBA2K, FIFA, The Show) is there are all of these avenues for micro transactions and monetization, the publishers force devs to focus a ton of time on those areas and little elsewhere. So franchises that aren’t as exploitable, like NCAAF or a lesser extent NHL, get more focus on actual gameplay and presentation issues.
 

Chromata

Member
I couldn't agree more. There were some great sports games back in the day, made with passion and purpose beyond solely money. Now it's all garbage.

Unfortunately, sports games are bringing in a lot of revenue so even with recent pushback I doubt anything will change.
 

Miles708

Member
Part of the reason I love when a great game like Super Mega Baseball comes out. No licenses, no bloated crap - just great sports gaming that puts the sport front and center without all the extraneous bullshit.
I agree with this feeling.
I can't help thinking that this is one of the primary reasons why the sport games stagnate and iterate just a little at a time: licences cost a lot of money, so the game is already a black hole even before it's made, so it better be made in the safest/cheapest possible way. Most fans love their licenses, so there is a reason behind all this. That's also where whales are.

Second problem: FIFA, PES, NBA2K are so difficult to pick and play, so whoever is not a BIG fan of that specific sport has no hope to just enjoy it.
I mean, I watch soccer on TV maybe once a year, so I do not have the "passion" outside the game that can drive me to muscle through all the damn game systems. Virtua Fighter is so much easier than FIFA, dammit!

Personally, i would love to see more Virtua Striker's, more Dead or Alive Xtreme Beach Volleyball's (the "volleyball" part was arcade fun, easy to play and a blast with other people), more Virtua Tennises (maybe more like the first one, when it wasn't braindead) and so on.
Mario games are, at the moment, the only specimen left for arcade sport games with a non-indie budget, and that's a bit sad.
 
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I blame the death of arcades. Arcade devs grasped the instinctive pick-up-and-fun nature of a sport far better than EA or 2K ever did.

Modern sports games feel like a chore. Wii Sports should've been the rallying cry to get other companies to make their own sports titles and push back against license holders (read: EA and 2K), but alas.
 

Dane

Member
Can it sop? Yes, but its a tough thing.

For example, Cowadoody Ghosts and beyond suffered from stagnant to drop in sales, it wasn't until MW 2019 that things got back on.

It depends on how much shit in overall quality is the current title and if it saw a drop in numbers compared to previous one.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Arcadey sports games aren't worth $60. Nobody is going to buy them up.

But I'm pretty sure these aracdey sports were tried as cheaper download kinds of games and still nobody bit. They seem perfect as $15 downloads.

So EA and Midway ditched them.
 

MoreJRPG

Suffers from extreme PDS
The saddest part about this monopoly is the games will still look like they could release on PS3 & 360 when we get next gen consoles.
 

Stuart360

Member
I think part of the problem is the lack of choice now. EA and 2k own all the rights so if you want a sports game, chances are you have to buy one of theirs,
Its funny really. The 2k sports games have some of the worst microtransactions, and scummy business practices around, they constantly have 'mostly negative' to 'overwhelmingly negative' user scores on Steam ,yet they still sell by the bucket load.
Its a sad time for sports games.
 
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I think part of the problem is the lack of choice now. EA and 2k own all the rights so if you want a sports game, chances are you have to buy one of theirs,
Its funny really. The 2k sports games have some of the worst microtransactions, and scummy business practices around, they constantly have 'mostly negative' to 'overwhelmingly negative' user scores on Steam ,yet they still sell by the bucket load.
Its a sad time for sports games.

It really speaks to WWE, NFL, Futbol (sorry I'm American), NBA, MLB, NHL, and other's lack of give a fuck in the whole arena.

Guess they're satisfied with shit. So be it.

People love eating shit, just look at that Fornite $1.8 billion thread.

Guess Kids in the Hall was right
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S

SLoWMoTIoN

Unconfirmed Member
Yet Europeans, South Americans and urban youths buy yearly sports titles every (year).
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
It's a weird dynamic because historitcally consoles/PCs weren't powerful enough to make gritty realistic looking kinds of games. It might have been stat filled, but the visuals were always gamey.

Now, the visuals are getting pretty wild. Play some shooters and sports and they look pretty realistic. And that's where gamers have gravitated to. Racers toos.

However, there's still fatigue. All the modern shooters seem to have taken a back seat to the Fortnites, Apex Legend, Overwatch games with wacky colours and gameplay. Gamers seem to be willing to play these, so not all genres have to be ultra realistic to sell.

But when it comes to sports and racers, people want to play with real teams, players, cars, and more realistic gameplay than going all out playing NFL Blitz.
 

Alexios

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Mostly cos none of you bought the awesome SEGA sports games back in the day so they stopped doing them.
 
I agree with you (OP). I used to play a ton of sports games, now it’s pretty much much only rocket league. The lack of competition among individual sports has made games quite stale. Although I primarily blame the sports leagues for this. For example, the NFL chose to limit the license to one game. They didn’t have to do this and squash competition.
 
Whats worse is that EA is building their yearly ESPORT scene on pay to win mechanics. If your ultimate team has legends and higher rated players (check their weekly promos), you have significant advantage over your opponent and subsequent chance to make it to the big stage.
 
I miss arcade sports games like NBA Jam, Street, NFL Blitz, and such. Those were fun. Today is very lacking due to the big leagues licensing out sports teams names and players association. It sucks bad, because I would go for a new Tecmo Bowl game.
 

Horatius

Member
the 2k revival with the 2k11 jordan game was so promising and then it literally went to shit immediately

microtransactions and the whales that support them are the death of the genre, and yet it's more profitable than ever qqqqq
 

TwiztidElf

Member
I miss REAL NFL Blitz, and NHL Hitz.
The best football game is Rocket League.
Wrestling games are also long dead.
With the exception of Wreckfest, racing games are toast.
What a sad state of affairs. :messenger_anguished:
 
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anthraticus

Banned
I was pretty into sports games in the sega genesis era and PES 3 & 5 on PS2, but for the most part felt, as they try and made the games look more and more realistic, the more control they took away from the player making them have a very automated/on rails type feel, like you're only really 'half playing'.
 
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D

Deleted member 774430

Unconfirmed Member
Agreed with the OP.

Sports games used to be great, but now that EA/2K realized they can milk the hell out of it and get away with it, it's becoming less fun every year.

Yet their profits keep Going up year after year. It’s funny how that works.

Id like to have a business that died this way, Can anyone point me to one?

Because they go after a type of audience which will buy any sort of crap as long as there is Cristiano Ronaldo or Messi in it.

For years PES has been mechanically a far superior game than FIFA and most importantly far less shady with the mtx and lootboxes but people kept buying FIFA only because of the licenses and marketing.
 
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small_law

Member
I didn't touch sports games this generation at all. Once NCAA football bit it, I also lost interest in Madden. Add in the trouble EA had adapting Frostbite for Madden and my interest in football games disappeared. I fell off golf pretty hard too. There very well could be a hard limit to what you can do with sports games in general, but I haven't given it much thought.

Still waiting on a Top Spin follow up. No one has quite nailed it yet.
 

Zoanoid33

Member
The genre has been declining since the ps2 honestly. Once they figured out they can charge you 60 bucks for a roster update every year, they could really care less about any improvements they need to make. As long as people buy these games and drop thousands on these terrible pay to win models we will never see a change. The fact that popular review sites get paid off for good scores doesn't help either. We know these games dont deserve a 8 or higher every year.

I think sports games would benefit from being games as service where you pay 20-30 for a upgrade each year that would include roster updates, new mechanics, updated graphics/animations, new modes etc.
 

Bryank75

Banned
But they have to be multiplatform... So, you're limited right there.
Sony do a great job with MLB but now even that is being forced to go multiplatform.
Who would do a better job than EA or TTwo?
And honestly, do most Fifa fans deserve a better game?
I'd give them the extra features and upgrades but I'd charge 100 euro minimum each year.
These people usually only buy one game a year.... Let it be at a premium.
 

GreyHorace

Member
I just want a good basketball or wrestling game without any microtransaction bullshit or horrendous bugs on it.
 

anthraticus

Banned
I just want a good basketball or wrestling game without any microtransaction bullshit or horrendous bugs on it.
The new Fire Pro isn't bad. And Andrew over at NLSC has been working on a roster update for 2K11, if you're into that. (I've been playing an updated NBA Live 96 recently and having fun with it)
 

ROMhack

Member
Agreed but they were always minimum investment games. Yearly updates were minor and big investment was only made every 5 years or so. FIFA was regularly derided as the crap football game so when EA updated it finally in 2008, they did so out of necessity. Now? They don't gotta because it controls the market.

You can though, I think, very much blame the audience for their willingness in being part of the journey. They've (meaning urban youths as one poster called it) have eaten this up despite some dispute. At this point, sports games aren't really games. They exist to make money apres base sale through micro-transactions and commercial partnerships with e-sports companies (the China of online gaming)

Even Rocket League - a real breath of fresh air initially - has done fuck all to update itself except try and capture the e-sports market. It's got a horribly toxic fanbase to boot and there's no obvious direction from the developers except to ride it out as long as possible through commercial partnerships.

Tl;dr There's no genre as bloated, money-driven and generally as shite as sports games are in 2k20.
 
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GreyHorace

Member
The new Fire Pro isn't bad. And Andrew over at NLSC has been working on a roster update for 2K11, if you're into that. (I've been playing an updated NBA Live 96 recently and having fun with it)
Just checked this out.



That looks... interesting. I was kinda thrown off by the retro look, but if it plays good then hell yeah. Thanks for the recommendation.
 

ROMhack

Member
Yet their profits keep Going up year after year. It’s funny how that works.

Id like to have a business that died this way, Can anyone point me to one?

Yeah I'd think differently if I were an EA shareholder too.
 
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Psykodad

Banned
Honest question from someone who hasn"t bought any sportsgames since PS1, but what do people want to see changed about sports games?

(Like Fifa or NBA or whatever)

I get that the loot stuff like in Fifa are trash, but other than that, I don't see how much can be done other than make the games play in a more realistic way.
 
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