Support NeoGAF

[JudgmentJay]

Heh, I was about to buy a used F8500 locally, but I noticed he had some burn-in. Sure enough, it was the Destiny HUD. The TV only had about 800 hours on it, and 250 of those were Destiny. He had never used any of the TV's anti-burn in measure either. I hear the F8500 is extremely resistant to burn-in, but even if it's not permanent I have a feeling it would take a very very long time to come out.

I've babied my Kuro, so it has no burn-in despite hundreds (thousands?) of hours of gaming. You just have to be careful with plasmas.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Been discussed in this thread already. Doesn't work.

Destiny image retention is so aggressive, that it only takes a few minutes to hit. For this reason, constantly moving the screen bounds actually just increases the area of IR.

If your image retention is hitting that quickly it sounds like 1 of 2 things.

Either something is wrong with your TV, or you need to dial back some other settings like brightness or gamma.

No TV or Monitor should have retention in a matter of minutes.

 

[dallow_bg]

I thought some Bungie guys said they had been looking into this a long ass time ago.

I guess the answer was no. Hard stuff.
Oh well. My top of the line Panny is now failing due to another factory issue (magenta blobs). Guess it's LCD for me next.

 

[diffusionx]

Heh, I was about to buy a used F8500 locally, but I noticed he had some burn-in. Sure enough, it was the Destiny HUD. The TV only had about 800 hours on it, and 250 of those were Destiny. He had never used any of the TV's anti-burn in measure either. I hear the F8500 is extremely resistant to burn-in, but even if it's not permanent I have a feeling it would take a very very long time to come out.

I've babied my Kuro, so it has no burn-in despite hundreds (thousands?) of hours of gaming. You just have to be careful with plasmas.

There is a difference between burn-in and image persistence. I don't think anything is truly burned-in on my plasma, but lots of images persist for some length of time.


Babying a TV is annoying and ridiculous. I'm not surprised the general public never gone on with it.

 

[Tathanen]

My VT60 is a disaster when it comes to this shit. Even with pixel orbiter and me running the white screen wipe bar often for hours at a time or overnight after playing, I've got significant burn-in in the lower-left corner of the screen from playing Splatoon, where the words "Come on!" display. I had something similar from Shovel Knight, but eventually went away after a huge stretch of time. Splatoon's doesn't seem to be going away.

This TV is SUPER-susceptible to IR overall though. When I first turn it on I have to "warm it up" for a few minutes with the screen wipe, because on a cold-boot it'll get IR from the no-signal or Vierra logo literally after SECONDS. Often times after ONE second. The screen wipe will nuke the IR after a minute or two and then it's more resistant for the remainder of the time it's powered on, but it really makes me think there's something wrong with my specific set.

I am honestly horrified to play Mario Maker on it, that game is all about static HUD shit. Xenoblade X ain't gonna be pretty, either. It gets me pretty down sometimes, I bought the set used after they were discontinued for a premium cause it was Panasonic's last plasma hurrah, and here I am stuck with something that's actively hostile to gaming, which I do on it more than anything. I've got a V10 from way back downstairs that has a channel logo burned in the corner from a long time ago but these days it's basically invincible, I couldn't get IR on that set if I tried. I can only hope the VT60 one day becomes bulletproof from aging the same way.

 

[Alebrije]

In think is more cheaper for Bunjie to send you a LED tv. Than invest time on your issue , so your approach to them is wrong..

 

[Fitts]

I forget which one I have - maybe a ST50.

My VT60 is a disaster when it comes to this shit.

I've seen a lot of denial about the subject, but Panasonic's plasma's took a huge step backward in combatting image retention ever since they introduced the "fast transition" phosphors that allowed for active 3D. I have a good deal of hands-on experience with both of these models and they are indeed prone to retention. Their non-3D models, however, continued to be pretty good overall. Of course, there's going to be a bit of variability with any model, but on the whole I've found this to be true every single time. This is one of the reasons why I decided on the S60 during plasma's last hurrah. It's in no way bulletproof, (unlike the Elite Kuro I previously owned -- I threw anything and everything at that and nothing stuck) but what little retention I do get is gone literally in seconds.

I still do most of my gaming on an Asus monitor, though. I've found a 65" screen (at 10 feet) to be a bit overwhelming when there's a ton of action on screen.

EDIT: I played a lot of Destiny on my plasma. From the alpha to the beta to the full release, the HUD never stuck.

 

[Schryver]

My S60 has been fine. Only played Destiny for the first few weeks but didn't notice anything. Sorry to all with issues. One reason I love Driveclub is the hud adjustments. Should almost be an option for a console wide setting similar to the new button config on PS4 but that would be impossible to implement I'm guessing

 

[CREMSteve]

Destiny fucked my VT60 as well.

Bungie ignored any attempt I made to ask if it's something they could tweak.

 

[Boombloxer]

There is a difference between burn-in and image persistence. I don't think anything is truly burned-in on my plasma, but lots of images persist for some length of time.


Babying a TV is annoying and ridiculous. I'm not surprised the general public never gone on with it.

same here, VT-65. It goes away with the screen wipe after a bit, but Diablo actually did something similar.

I went looking for TVs earlier this year, and found nothing yet.

 

[JudgmentJay]

Babying a TV is annoying and ridiculous. I'm not surprised the general public never gone on with it.

Mmm, I don't think it's very annoying or ridiculous. I just use the pixel orbiter when gaming and occasionally run the screen wiper overnight if I've been playing alot of a game with a static HUD. It's a small price to pay for the best picture quality in my opinion.

 

[djplaeskool]

A half hour of DYAD acts like a whiteboard eraser for me.

 

[iMax]

My VT60 is a disaster when it comes to this shit. Even with pixel orbiter and me running the white screen wipe bar often for hours at a time or overnight after playing, I've got significant burn-in in the lower-left corner of the screen from playing Splatoon, where the words "Come on!" display. I had something similar from Shovel Knight, but eventually went away after a huge stretch of time. Splatoon's doesn't seem to be going away.

This TV is SUPER-susceptible to IR overall though. When I first turn it on I have to "warm it up" for a few minutes with the screen wipe, because on a cold-boot it'll get IR from the no-signal or Vierra logo literally after SECONDS. Often times after ONE second. The screen wipe will nuke the IR after a minute or two and then it's more resistant for the remainder of the time it's powered on, but it really makes me think there's something wrong with my specific set.

I am honestly horrified to play Mario Maker on it, that game is all about static HUD shit. Xenoblade X ain't gonna be pretty, either. It gets me pretty down sometimes, I bought the set used after they were discontinued for a premium cause it was Panasonic's last plasma hurrah, and here I am stuck with something that's actively hostile to gaming, which I do on it more than anything. I've got a V10 from way back downstairs that has a channel logo burned in the corner from a long time ago but these days it's basically invincible, I couldn't get IR on that set if I tried. I can only hope the VT60 one day becomes bulletproof from aging the same way.

Mine does that too.

 

[GnawtyDog]

Plasma sets still get burn-in nowadays?

Yes. Sammy's specially. For Panny's it's almost impossible. NVM... I guess newest Panny's too. But my old Panny doesn't get it soo...2009 model I think.

 

[Seth Enosh]

My VT60 is a disaster when it comes to this shit. Even with pixel orbiter and me running the white screen wipe bar often for hours at a time or overnight after playing, I've got significant burn-in in the lower-left corner of the screen from playing Splatoon, where the words "Come on!" display. I had something similar from Shovel Knight, but eventually went away after a huge stretch of time. Splatoon's doesn't seem to be going away.

This TV is SUPER-susceptible to IR overall though. When I first turn it on I have to "warm it up" for a few minutes with the screen wipe, because on a cold-boot it'll get IR from the no-signal or Vierra logo literally after SECONDS. Often times after ONE second. The screen wipe will nuke the IR after a minute or two and then it's more resistant for the remainder of the time it's powered on, but it really makes me think there's something wrong with my specific set.

I am honestly horrified to play Mario Maker on it, that game is all about static HUD shit. Xenoblade X ain't gonna be pretty, either. It gets me pretty down sometimes, I bought the set used after they were discontinued for a premium cause it was Panasonic's last plasma hurrah, and here I am stuck with something that's actively hostile to gaming, which I do on it more than anything. I've got a V10 from way back downstairs that has a channel logo burned in the corner from a long time ago but these days it's basically invincible, I couldn't get IR on that set if I tried. I can only hope the VT60 one day becomes bulletproof from aging the same way.

That's pretty awful. I've never seen retention on my Panasonic S64 except once from playing 20+ hours of Destiny in a week with no other content, and that retention went away within a week. Splatoon never gave it retention for me and neither has any other game.

Maybe you just have a bad run of the VT60, I never heard anything about the more expensive panels being worse for IR. (edit: I see above someone saying it's the 3D capable panels. My s64 is 2d only, so I guess I dodged a bullet there.)

 

[On Demand]

Lot of misinformation about plasmas on the first page alone. I don't even know where to begin and who to respond to. I have no burn in on my kuro and don't use any protection settings it has. I use it like normal and don't worry about it.

OLED's are not better than the best plasmas. Besides black level, plasmas- the reference ones anyway- still do everything else better.

Panasonics new OLED is said to improve alot of things though. Like near black detail. Which the kuro does better than LG's OLED.

 

[Jonboy]

I've seen a lot of denial about the subject, but Panasonic's plasma's took a huge step backward in combatting image retention ever since they introduced the "fast transition" phosphors that allowed for active 3D. I have a good deal of hands-on experience with both of these models and they are indeed prone to retention. Their non-3D models, however, continued to be pretty good overall. Of course, there's going to be a bit of variability with any model, but on the whole I've found this to be true every single time. This is one of the reasons why I decided on the S60 during plasma's last hurrah. It's in no way bulletproof, (unlike the Elite Kuro I previously owned -- I threw anything and everything at that and nothing stuck) but what little retention I do get is gone literally in seconds.

I still do most of my gaming on an Asus monitor, though. I've found a 65" screen (at 10 feet) to be a bit overwhelming when there's a ton of action on screen.

EDIT: I played a lot of Destiny on my plasma. From the alpha to the beta to the full release, the HUD never stuck.

So weird, man. I have the S60 as well and the HUD on the bottom left (the weapon and ammo, in particular) does not want to go away. Then again, I'm nearing 1000 hours total play time for Destiny.

 

[tebunker]

Did you try any of the colorblind settings? Adjust the colors to not have as much brightness and image retention?

 

[iMax]

A glimmer of hope...

 

[iMax]

Did you try any of the colorblind settings? Adjust the colors to not have as much brightness and image retention?

They don't affect the elements of the HUD that cause IR; namely the white weapon icons and the super bar.

 

[HokieJoe]

I ran the plasma break-in DVD from AVS Forum when my Panny plasma was new. I downloaded the ISO, burnt it to a DVD, put the DVD in my player and set it to loop continuously. I ran it at night while I was asleep and during the day while I was at work. I did that for 200 hours. I never have issues with IR and I game quite a bit on that TV.

From what I understand, it's good to use it if you're having IR issues as well, so I'd give it a go. Just look under the plasma section of the Displays forum.

 

[Jonboy]

A glimmer of hope...

Yeesh. DeeJ said pretty much the exact same thing a year ago. I'm not a programmer, but this can't be that big of a deal. The programming has to already be there b/c if you watch the video where they debut the new multiplayer map, they walk around the map with no HUD at all...and it looks glorious.

 

[Fitts]

I ran the plasma break-in DVD from AVS Forum when my Panny plasma was new. I downloaded the ISO, burnt it to a DVD, put the DVD in my player and set it to loop continuously. I ran it at night while I was asleep and during the day while I was at work. I did that for 200 hours. I never have issues with IR and I game quite a bit on that TV.

From what I understand, it's good to use it if you're having IR issues as well, so I'd give it a go. Just look under the plasma section of the Displays forum.

This is good advice for those who need to clear retention and, in the unlikely event that you're purchasing a new plasma, is a great way to ensure even break in while the phosphors are in their most volatile state. However, good old white noise/TV static or the Disney WOW pixel flipper are the best options to fight retention since they're rapidly working every pixel between full on/off. Just be careful as these methods can cause plasmas to hit their power draw ceilings and could potentially shorten the life of the display. (more of a concern with pre-Energy Star units)

So weird, man. I have the S60 as well and the HUD on the bottom left (the weapon and ammo, in particular) does not want to go away. Then again, I'm nearing 1000 hours total play time for Destiny.

Sorry to read that. As I wrote, the S60 certainly isn't the least retentive display I've encountered, but it's been great on the whole. Maybe try to give the game a rest and run one of the methods listed above overnight to see if you're able to reverse it at all. Good luck and enjoy -- it's an underrated gem for sure! I was floored when I was TV shopping and found it preferable to more premium models. It was incredibly simple to calibrate and I adore its lack of a screen filter. (hadn't had a filterless plasma since 2007)

 

[Bill Rizer]

From my experience (ut50 euro model):

1. Orbiter works wonder in preventing IR. First time I turned it off, I got immediate long-lasting retention after 5-6 hours of playing.

2. Maybe most important, set your Contrast/Picture control right. Latest Panasonic can be plenty bright, but a bright room with contrast maxxed out isn't really their best option. Plasmas give their best in a dim room, with contrast set to not clip whites and leaving enough headroom to have the correct brightness both with dark and bright scenes.

To make an example, try observing Demon's Souls hud, bars and tendency indicators. They should be some very light shades of grey, but in a generally dark game as DeS, because of how plasmas work distributing brightness, those can turn very bright with contrast set too high and even become almost glowing white if you are really exaggerating. This is guarantee of IR. If this happen, lower your contrast until brightness fluctation of hud elements between dark and bright scenes doesn't happen anymore. You'll have a steadier, more pleasing picture and lowered IR probability a lot.

 

[iMax]

2.0 Patch Notes are out. No fix. https://www.bungie.net/en/News/News?aid=13474

 

[pj]

Unbelievable that this is still not fixed. I saw that TTK is scheduled as a deal today on amazon and thought for about 4 seconds that I would buy it. Then I remembered I couldn't play it because I don't want to ruin my tv.

I had to stop playing in March after putting 'only' 100 hours into the game over the course of a couple months. My play sessions were 1-2 hours, rarely more than that.

I can STILL see the outline of a gun on the lower left of my VT60 in some circumstances.

 

[amar212]

THANK YOU, FINALLY!

FINALLY.

Fck, yeah.

 

[Monty Mole]

With OLED being the future, developers really need to start factoring this stuff in. Also there was a huge amount of plasma gamers (myself included before I got my OLED) due to the low lag and high motion resolution, crazy when developers don't account for that.

IR was never an issue on my 50" VT65, nor has it been on my 55" 9500 OLED, but then I don't play Destiny 24/7 - perhaps if I did I'd be suffering from similar issues.

 

[iMax]

Gave up on Destiny ages ago but this is great news for plasma owners who still play.

 

[SmoothRunningGun]

Been playing on plasma since destiny alpha. Never any hint of burn in.