• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

John Boyega photo bombs people at Star Wars Celebration

Status
Not open for further replies.

SeanC

Member
From what I remember, they complained about the diversity constantly being pushed as some amazing thing, they didn't complain about diversity itself and thought John and Daisy were both great? If you can link me to them saying that John/Daisy were cast just for diversity and that this is a bad thing then sure I'll agree with you there.

.

Do you remember "BoycottStarWarsVII" ?

It was entirely about there not being white male leads. Some of the most racist shit I've read on the internet came from that with "white genocide" flippantly thrown in there because of course it would be.

You can also google "White people complaining about The Force Awakens" and get results.


Edit: To stay on topic, I absolutely love Boyega. He seems like such a fanboy himself that it's impossible to not like him. Videos like this is what I want to see a nerdy community like - welcoming and friendly. I feel like a lot of that is being overtaken by trolls, though.
 

JoeInky

Member
Do you remember "BoycottStarWarsVII" ?

It was entirely about there not being white male leads. Some of the most racist shit I've read on the internet came from that with "white genocide" flippantly thrown in there because of course it would be.

You can also google "White people complaining about The Force Awakens" and get results.

Edit: To stay on topic, I absolutely love Boyega. He seems like such a fanboy himself that it's impossible to not like him. Videos like this is what I want to see a nerdy community like - welcoming and friendly. I feel like a lot of that is being overtaken by trolls, though.

I know that it happened in a general sense, it ruined the /tv/ board for me (well, made it even worse, it was already bad) ever since Boyega was cast because it went from a few racist topics that I could easily avoid to over 50% of the topics being absolute trash.

But I don't remember any such comments from RLM in their videos, there was a little bit about how disney was pushing the diversity as marketing, but nothing about the diversity itsself being bad and Jay and Mike both liked Daisy and John in TFA.
 
The black fan's reaction was why representation matters. I'm so glad personally we also have a british pakistani in Star Wars! :D

JS115706328_Copyright-2016-Lucasfilm-Ltd-26-a-All-Rights-Reserved_null-large_trans_NvBQzQNjv4BqpLgMts1CzNGsUqKUYU-Rd8dnQhCAwlEcLnMgK2IcM6g.jpg
 

SeanC

Member
I know that it happened in a general sense, it ruined the /tv/ board for me (well, made it even worse, it was already bad) ever since Boyega was cast because it went from a few racist topics that I could easily avoid to over 50% of the topics being absolute trash.

But I don't remember any such comments from RLM in their videos, there was a little bit about how disney was pushing the diversity as marketing, but nothing about the diversity itsself being bad and Jay and Mike both liked Daisy and John in TFA.

You know what, my bad. I thought I tracked the conversation but didn't realize it was about RLM and was more general about the racist reaction to the casting. Someone more versed in their vids can maybe provide a link should that be the case.
 

Surfinn

Member
From what I remember, they complained about the diversity constantly being pushed as some amazing thing, they didn't complain about diversity itself and thought John and Daisy were both great? If you can link me to them saying that John/Daisy were cast just for diversity and that this is a bad thing then sure I'll agree with you there.

I didn't really care about their complaint that TFA was lacking in romance, but I don't remember them framing it as wanting sex to ogle at? There was no sex in the original OT just a love story, and they wanted something a bit more like that in there. It's a weird personal complaint about what they thought should be in the film, but I can't comprehend it as some kind of terrible viewpoint, what am I missing here?

So I guess I don't care about the bigoted undertones then? I can't really think of many off the top of my head that stand out other than some stupid shit rich evans says now and then, but that's not enough to make me stop watching. They have made one or two jokes before that made me feel a bit uncomfortable, but the good far outweighs the bad which hasn't yet been bad enough to give me a sour taste in my mouth when I watch their videos. Maybe it's because I've seen increasingly worse on the internet over the years that's ruined certain online communities for me, which is usually a lot more blatant and disgusting to the point that I can see some of RLM's comments as just being ignorant jokes or not really understanding certain things, but maybe that's just me being naive and their videos are actually filled with wink wink moments for racists.

https://youtu.be/miVRaoR_8xQ?t=5227

One of his criticisms of the film, is literally called THE DIVERSITY AWAKENS. He devoted an entire section of his review to it. So the biggest question I have, is.. why? Why even MENTION this? He says in the video I linked above that it's "a fine thing", and to have a diverse cast and that he think's "it's great" that a variety of people are represented, just like "in real life". Then prefaces his complaints with criticizing the MRA's bullshit.. but then.. goes on to say that there's a "girl, a black guy" and points out a lot of other minorities who acted in TFA.. to recognize said diversity, but then says we're "overthinking" (the inclusion of) diversity. What..? Then he even goes on to say that kids "don't give a shit" about diversity.

.. so what the fuck is your point? What's your reasoning for dedicating an entire section of your review to diversity if there's no problem with it?

It raises my eyebrow for damn sure, especially when there's no point being made.. all he really says is that it's "annoyingly diverse". What does that even mean?

So, in short, he says he's OK with diversity, and that its inclusion is great.. but then complains about it simultaneously and says it's too diverse? That makes it seem like there's a problem that the film doesn't have more white people. Which is a fucking alarming criticism, considering there's literally no reason for there the film to be LESS diverse other than "that's what I'm used to, and I'm not OK with it changing".

He concludes his "point" with "they wasted their time" by making the film more diverse because "no one really cares about it".. what? If no one cares, why did you devote 20 minutes to it in your review suggesting that it shouldn't have happened?

The projection is strong with this one.

So.. the alternative is that we make a film full of white people and a token minority, and everything is fine? Is that the argument being made?

What's better.. we try to include a much wider variety of people so that there are more individuals and communities that can connect with Star Wars (a universe built on a type of diversity in the first place, in its scope and wide range of alien inhabitants) on various levels, or we keep things the same with no potential benefit? Would the latter be better so that a small percentage of people feel more satisfied with their viewing experience?

The only reason he mentioned it as a complaint in the first place is because he's uncomfortable with Star Wars being increasingly diversified, for no reason other than "I don't like it much".

https://youtu.be/miVRaoR_8xQ?t=5911

There's a pretty thick undertone of sexism sprinkled throughout the video. In the one above, he's literally encouraging Kylo to "put some moves" on Rey while she's tied down, captive. You could pass this off as "but it's just a joke", but the point here is that these jokes are reoccurring and representative of what this guy expects from his adventure movies (man being sexually involved with the woman).

He also complains from like 15-20 minutes before that instance about how there's no sex in TFA and that its characters feel like robots because of it. He flashes to a few scenes where Leia is, of course, in her slave outfit, and the scene where she's lying down on a table in ANH dressed in her white dress. Yeah, he says there should be "romance" and "love", but there are questionable undertones here because.. you know, of course, Finn and Rey should have had a romance or fallen in love or been sexually involved in some capacity in TFA (by the way, this is a three film triology and Han/Leia weren't even happening until ESB).. naturally, it should have happened because of there being a man/woman in lead roles. Hell, you could argue that there's more of a sexual current running between Finn and Poe.. and while he jokes about it, he never actually expects them to be together as he does Finn/Rey. Hmm

That's why I've gotta sideeye the shit out of his love/sexuality comments. Simply including those things for the sake of doing so makes no sense. If they choose to eventually push a romance, they will have done it because it makes sense for their narrative and for the story.. not because they feel like they NEED to. TFA suffered in no way because there wasn't more romance or sexuality.

The expectation alone that it should automatically just be IN the film makes me feel like there's an alternate reason that undermines what's actually being presented.. one that's not being outright stated, just like the complaints about diversity.
 
https://youtu.be/miVRaoR_8xQ?t=5227

One of his criticisms of the film, is literally called THE DIVERSITY AWAKENS. He devoted an entire section of his review to it. So the biggest question I have, is.. why? Why even MENTION this? He says in the video I linked above that it's "a fine thing", and to have a diverse cast and that he think's "it's great" that a variety of people are represented, just like "in real life". Then prefaces his complaints with criticizing the MRA's bullshit.. but then.. goes on to say that there's a "girl, a black guy" and points out a lot of other minorities who acted in TFA.. to recognize said diversity, but then says we're "overthinking" (the inclusion of) diversity. What..? Then he even goes on to say that kids "don't give a shit" about diversity.

.. so what the fuck is your point? What's your reasoning for dedicating an entire section of your review to diversity if there's no problem with it?

It raises my eyebrow for damn sure, especially when there's no point being made.. all he really says is that it's "annoyingly diverse". What does that even mean?

So, in short, he says he's OK with diversity, and that its inclusion is great.. but then complains about it simultaneously and says it's too diverse? That makes it seem like there's a problem that the film doesn't have more white people. Which is a fucking alarming criticism, considering there's literally no reason for there the film to be LESS diverse other than "that's what I'm used to, and I'm not OK with it changing".

He concludes his "point" with "they wasted their time" by making the film more diverse because "no one really cares about it".. what? If no one cares, why did you devote 20 minutes to it in your review suggesting that it shouldn't have happened?

The projection is strong with this one.

So.. the alternative is that we make a film full of white people and a token minority, and everything is fine? Is that the argument being made?

What's better.. we try to include a much wider variety of people so that there are more individuals and communities that can connect with Star Wars (a universe built on a type of diversity in the first place, in its scope and wide range of alien inhabitants) on various levels, or we keep things the same with no potential benefit? Would the latter be better so that a small percentage of people feel more satisfied with their viewing experience?

The only reason he mentioned it as a complaint in the first place is because he's uncomfortable with Star Wars being increasingly diversified, for no reason other than "I don't like it much".

https://youtu.be/miVRaoR_8xQ?t=5911

There's a pretty thick undertone of sexism sprinkled throughout the video. In the one above, he's literally encouraging Kylo to "put some moves" on Rey while she's tied down, captive. You could pass this off as "but it's just a joke", but the point here is that these jokes are reoccurring and representative of what this guy expects from his adventure movies (man being sexually involved with the woman).

He also complains from like 15-20 minutes before that instance about how there's no sex in TFA and that its characters feel like robots because of it. He flashes to a few scenes where Leia is, of course, in her slave outfit, and the scene where she's lying down on a table in ANH dressed in her white dress. Yeah, he says there should be "romance" and "love", but there are questionable undertones here because.. you know, of course, Finn and Rey should have had a romance or fallen in love or been sexually involved in some capacity in TFA (by the way, this is a three film triology and Han/Leia weren't even happening until ESB).. naturally, it should have happened because of there being a man/woman in lead roles. Hell, you could argue that there's more of a sexual current running between Finn and Poe.. and while he jokes about it, he never actually expects them to be together as he does Finn/Rey. Hmm

That's why I've gotta sideeye the shit out of his love/sexuality comments. Simply including those things for the sake of doing so makes no sense. If they choose to eventually push a romance, they will have done it because it makes sense for their narrative and for the story.. not because they feel like they NEED to. TFA suffered in no way because there wasn't more romance or sexuality.

The expectation alone that it should automatically just be IN the film makes me feel like there's an alternate reason that undermines what's actually being presented.. one that's not being outright stated, just like the complaints about diversity.
You're talking that Plinkett review way too seriously considering Mike stated (as Plinkett himself and on the half in the bag review) that he liked the force awakens. All of them did. On the Plinkett review he even states like early on that any criticism will be nitpicking. I don't think any of them are proud of that Plinkett review. It's just expected from fans and the internet that everything star wars needs a Plinkett review and they aim to please.

The main joke in the whole diversity section is that for every good x gender y race person the camera also made sure to show that they were represented in the bad guy side. In the rogue one trailer reaction, which was also meant as a joke, they made a similar joke when the raid guys were there. Notice how half of review is him discussing the prequels. He didn't have anything to really complain about in the force awakens.
 

Surfinn

Member
You're talking that Plinkett review way too seriously considering Mike stated (as Plinkett himself and on the half in the bag review) that he liked the force awakens. All of them did. On the Plinkett review he even states like early on that any criticism will be nitpicking. I don't think any of them are proud of that Plinkett review. It's just expected from fans and the internet that everything star wars needs a Plinkett review and they aim to please.

The main joke in the whole diversity section is that for every good x gender y race person the camera also made sure to show that they were represented in the bad guy side. In the rogue one trailer reaction, which was also meant as a joke, they made a similar joke when the raid guys were there. Notice how half of review is him discussing the prequels. He didn't have anything to really complain about in the force awakens.
He didn't include an entire section on it and devote a 20 min explanation/breakdown/analysis as a joke. It's the same format as the PT reviews, more or less, and those weren't jokey criticisms either, even if it's layered in a jokey tone.

Someone asked whey a lot of people don't watch their videos because of reoccurring bigoted undertones, and I was responding to them.

And lol at "but they had to make the video, who cares if it turned out to be a raging dumpster fire" excuse.

They didn't have to make shit if they didn't want to. It was their decision to satisfy the desire for a review, and if they didn't have anything of substance to say, they shouldn't have made it.

It sucked. That's on them, no one else.

Plus the half in the back review was like the day of or the day after TFA was released. Lots of people turned on the film, to some degree, after that point

But I guess it's easy to just ignore all the points I raised and lazily throw out "you're taking Mike's criticism too seriously, he was obligated to make it".. even though these undertones are reoccurring in other videos too
 

Harmen

Member
Haha, I love the prank they pulled on that black dude. His reaction to the photo lol. Boyega seems like a nice guy.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom