LyleLanley
Banned
I would've done it for half.
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Justice Department to withdraw legal action against Apple over San Bernardino iPhone
- Thread starter chadskin
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I would've done it for half.
Doctor Ironic
Member
Because the FBI was slowly losing the PR war and/or realized Apple wasn't going to cave on the matter while they had a different solution just sitting there.
It DOES matter if it's an old phone because that's how software vulnerabilities work. Someone in the community finds them, reports them to the company, gets a bounty for it as long as they kept their mouth shut before they told the company, and only once it's been fixed are they allowed to disclose it. If this is a phone that hasn't been receiving regular Apple software updates and security fixes it's going to have more solutions available than to get to it. Security is always a matter of obfuscation, not sheer defense force - even if you find some way to make one area impenetrable, like making the password impossible to brute force, someone will find some other weird way to get in like by fucking with system settings on a PC attached to it. (I don't think that's what happened, it's just an example.)
The real question here is that in a case where Apple has done literally everything right and even has Google backing them, why are you so desperate to make them look bad?
I'd like to know what they found.
But keep on fighting the good war against the evil empire.
Lol still better than android malware.
But keep on fighting the good war against the evil empire.
Doctor Ironic
Member
They broke into an iPhone 5C which is getting discontinued in two weeks anyways with an exploit that likely isn't possible with the security measures on newer versions. Current iPhone users can rest easy, people with older phones... well, this is the risk you run, welcome to capitalism, it's not like every other tech company doesn't do it.
Jezbollah
Member
It depends on the methods and logistics they used to do it, the version of the phone + IOS and how seriously the people involved in it take NDAs, to be honest.
Prototype Viktor
Member
They claimed they did doesn't matter if they did or not because it was pointing to them losing before. Can't take the L just claim you won and hide it all
Yes it is good.
We should not care that they found a way into the phone.
Just that Apple was not forced to do it. As long as Apple continues to patch vulnerabilities (including this one) all is well.
DOWN
Banned
timetokill
Banned
This is the best outcome we could've hoped for. Glad it went this way.
Right but if it was all for show and precedent who's to say the FBI would admit that they got the phone unlocked by someone else? They could easily turn down outside help and keep applying pressure to Apple.
show me where I've been so desperate to make apple look bad? Because I don't buy their PR, that means I want them to look bad?
I just think many on here are glorifying apple unnecessarily.
I like how your response is lol android is worse, so there!
5C and an old iOS version..
Besthelboy
Banned
They were always going to hack into it, this was an older phone with known vulnerabilities. They lied when they said they couldn't hack into it to try and force Apple's hand, experts knew about these vulbervailties.
AnotherNils
Member
I'm not usually a conspiracy nut, but I wouldn't be surprised if they cooked this up so they could withdraw the appeal without losing too much face,
Would be kinda funny if they found nothing, because that would mean they wasted all the time and stirred this whole stuff up for nothing
Jezbollah
Member
Yep. And there will be a significant amount of resources put into analysis of newer iPhone models and IOS builds to try and find any new vulnerabilities. While there is the human element in designing such products, new exploits will always be found.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
There's no way for us to know if they actually got into it or not. They already seem to be telling us way too much about a federal case whether or not they might unlock it etc.
So, I'm inclined to agree.
Sky Interloper
Member
Well that was a boring outcome.
But I'm pretty sure this scare made Apple to increase security in their next iPhones.
But I'm pretty sure this scare made Apple to increase security in their next iPhones.
charlequin
Banned
I don't think you've really been following the case closely if you think this was a plausible series of events.
Given the other information known about the phone in question so far, actually, yes it would.
EatinOlives
Member
It wasn't about preventing the FBI from breaking into the iPhone. It's about whether the FBI would get a precedent in making Apple break their own phone security for them.
TheLaughingStock
Member
What would have been on a county phone anyway? Any ideas out there?
I mean that's the thought process, because if the shooter was smart he wouldn't have kept anything on that phone he didn't want others to see, since the agency that actually owned the phone theoretically could've viewed the contents of the phone at any time. Also the fact that the shooter and his wife destroyed their actual personal phones, which are more likely to have housed info the FBI is seeking.
because that's what happened. let's just be real.
They literally filed in the document that "Apple's assistance" was "necessary to effectuate the warrant." They cannot turn down outside help and still contend they are making a reasonable, unburdensome request.
Of course, the FBI was executing a legal search warrant.
I don't think anybody was really arguing that they shouldn't be able to break into the phone on their own accord.
Freyjadour
Member
so much for understanding something before having an opinion and posting about it
Well, nothing is perfect. This just keeps Apple on its toes.
Exactly. They have every right to search the phone. My problem was them trying to forcibly coerce a third party into unlocking for them.
Well, good for them, I suppose. Problem for them is, this will probably be the last time they'll be able to do this, since this whole fuss has only made every tech manufacturer in the world tighten their encryption even more.
And, of course, they'll never admit to the fact that, after all the hubbub, they found absolutely fuck all on that phone.
NekoFever
Member
Assuming it's the NAND duplication vulnerability, which a lot of reports think it is, it's not possible on newer phones anyway.
Sir Abacus
Member
Then it definitely sounds like NAND duplication.
I suspect Apple will still be auditing the fucking out of SecureROM over the next few weeks/months just in case though.
I suspect Apple will still be auditing the fucking out of SecureROM over the next few weeks/months just in case though.
Because the precedent of the FBI losing is also a precedent.
If Apple can prove the FBI can do something without its help, the FBI loses.
If Apple can prove the All Writs Act doesn't allow them to request Apple to do this (especially since there was a specific law that prohibited it), the FBI loses.
All signs were pointing to the FBI losing one way or another once the facts and arguments were coming out.
Only because the user of the phone used a 4-digit pin. If you use an alphanumeric passcode it's not really possible. 4-digit pins are brute forceable even with the best security.
Can absolutely guarantee Apple will be hardening all they can in revisions going forward.
I'd say it's a good outcome.
1) FBI didn't get an ethereal magic skeleton key to unlock every phone from this point forward.
2) First amendment rights are preserved.
3) People realize security is only as good as your passphrase.
4) Apple will harden newer and newer phones and so will everyone else.
The FBI was never concerned about being able to get into this specific phone, they wanted the legal skeleton key.
Sir Abacus
Member
The base OS loader chain is already pretty hard. There hasn't been a known exploit in SecureROM since 574.4 which was iPhone 4 days.
Also, if the exploit they used was NAND mirroring, the technique already doesn't work for the 6 or later due to the Secure Enclave
GameAddict411
Member
I doubt newer iPhones could be hacked with the same method. Ever since touch ID became a thing, Apple significant increased the security of the device.
Sir Abacus
Member
Actually 5S or later. The A7 has both the AES DMA engine and the Secure Enclave.
The Albatross
Member
From what I had read before, the way they were cracking it was pretty insane.. One of the methods required high strength lasers that would somehow read the bits of data from memory. I have no idea how any of it works.
Their methods are protected, but here's an article about them:
http://motherboard.vice.com/read/me...mpany-reportedly-cracking-iphones-for-the-fbi
It's extremely likely they used the technique people were guessing - desoldering the NAND and putting a shim in that let them reset the nand and replenish the guess tries.
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