It's AR with VR Goggles + Kinect inside. It's KR: Kinected Reality.
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Microsoft: Hololense isn't VR or AR
- Thread starter Natureboy99
- Start date
It's AR with VR Goggles + Kinect inside. It's KR: Kinected Reality.
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
Your AV example is still AR in my mind. I feel like it's a distinction that helps if you want to be super nuanced, but it's still fundamentally the same thing. It's a virtual overlay over your hand. Your hand is the physical "anchor" that separates it from AR and VR.
The only distinction I make between AR and VR, assuming they're on opposite sides of a spectrum, is that VR doesn't have to conform to physical limitations of really use physical "anchors". It can, such as in an FPS having your arm be the "anchor" that controls your in game arm/aim, but the world shouldn't be limited by the bounds of the physical space or really influenced by it
An overlay is still an overlay. It still is fundamentally suppose to be a virtual item that takes into account the real world/physical space, whereas true VR doesn't really care about the physical space
Also, there really isn't any difference between AR and VR glasses. They've both fundamentally the same thing. The only difference is really that VR requires a lot more power because it's filling your entire view with a rendered environment. In both cases the camera is used to augment head tracking, but only in the AR case does what it's seeing also get relayed to the wearer
Natureboy99
Banned
Lots of AR games interact with your hand though. Thats the fun of AR.
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
Yeah, I know. I said that's still AR
Maintenance
Member
FantasticMrFoxdie
Mumber
So if I have a Oculus Rift with a stereo camera placed on it so I can see my hands when I place them in front of me overlaying the virtual world do you still think that it's just AR?
Nope! that would be AV.
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
So it would be a demo that ONLY shows your hands and nothing else? Why? I said the distinction is if your environment conforms to the physical world and utilizes it or not. Your hand being visible/overlayed can apply to both
For instance, if you had a world where it simply changed the texturing of your walls and all your furniture was changed into other innanimate objects, it would be an incredibly elaborate AR example, but AR nonetheless. If you had a world where the virtual world didn't conform to the physical space it would be VR.
You can call it AV or MR, but fundamentally it's about as different as the wiimote vs the move/wiimote+. They're all motion controls, but the latter allows far far more to be done
It would show more than your hands I'm saying that if I added a stereo camera to OR so that my hands would show up in the virtual world as I placed them in front of me.
That is AV adding the real world info of my hands into the virtual world.
MR cover AR & AV.
Yes, that is AR.
Betta Lines
Member
onQ123 has yet to answer the question 'where are you getting this definition from'.
Natureboy99
Banned
It's Augmented PR.
No it's AV
What definition?
yeah nobody actually working in this field uses these terms. It's VR and AR.
orly?
Huh have you never seen the movies? He wears that to block his eyesight and trust the force when practicing. He wears nothing to see hologram Leia because is protected by R2.
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
No it's AV
How come there aren't any arrows coming out from AV? That supports the fact that it's just a further, somewhat meaningless, distinction when AR and VR pretty much cover everything
Natureboy99
Banned
No it's AV
What definition?
Can't tell if serious or sarcasm. Augmented Virtuality sounds like a joke to me. All these other names fall into either AR or VR. Period. What's next? Cumberbatch Reality?
Remember glasstron? http://www.mellottsvrpage.com/index.php/sony-glasstron-plm-s700/
Natureboy99
Banned
Seriously I hope they have something. They are in the prime position to launch a VR-first console. Morpheus and Oculus will break the ice this year. But there will be problems with the controller. What has Nintendo always been great with? Inventing new control mechanisms...
so am I to take this to believe you think Nintendo invented positional tracking? or the analog thumbstick?
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
He's probably alluding to the fact that they're the only ones who dare to make a controller that isn't essentially the SNES controller with 2 shoulders and sticks. Or the fact that they seem to emphasize controller changes/innovations in new console releases
You mean aside from valve and Oculus, right?
Is that a fact? Canon MREAL Mixed Reality headset hitting US March 1st for $125,000
Marks's idea was to enable natural user interface and mixed reality video game applications using an inexpensive webcam, using the computational power of the PlayStation 2 to implement computer vision and gesture recognition technologies. He joined Sony Computer Entertainment America (SCEA) that year, and worked on the technology as Special Projects Manager for Research and Development.
Mixed-reality arena
US 20140125698 A1
ABSTRACT
A computing system comprises a see-through display device, a logic subsystem, and a storage subsystem storing instructions. When executed by the logic subsystem, the instructions display on the see-through display device a virtual arena, a user-controlled avatar, and an opponent avatar. The virtual arena appears to be integrated within a physical space when the physical space is viewed through the see-through display device. In response to receiving a user input, the instructions may also display on the see-through display device an updated user-controlled avatar.
This is a form of AV.
As a person who recently had to write a scientific paper on the matter and has a patent pending on it, there isn't really a consensus in the community as to what the conjunction of AR and VR should be called, some call it mixed reality, some call it augmented virtuality, there are several names for it. But the Hololens is not some magic new thing. It's basically AR glasses with some VR thrown in.
This is microsoft's usual "infinite power of the cloud" level spin. Hence my comment from the first page, "it's PR". There is no consensus name for it in the community because everyone knows it's basically AR+VR and the silly names come from some researchers trying to come up with fancy buzzwords for it.
This is microsoft's usual "infinite power of the cloud" level spin. Hence my comment from the first page, "it's PR". There is no consensus name for it in the community because everyone knows it's basically AR+VR and the silly names come from some researchers trying to come up with fancy buzzwords for it.
I had to read like 60 papers on the subject, FML
Betta Lines
Member
Your unnecessarily specific definition of AR:
"AR isn't really aware of the real world that it's overlaying."
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
This is BOTH companies first go at designing a controller. You're really comparing that to a company with a 20+ year history of creating various controllers? Really?! Not to mention neither has even released a controller yet, much less half a dozen different kinds like Nintendo has
No one is saying they don't have senior level talent with experience, but they're not really comparable...
JimboJones
Member
All those terms where probably coined years ago, AR and VR stuck the rest like you say where redundant so just forgotten.
You think the people working on these controllers have never designed or shipped a controller before?
K.
Because it really isn't aware of the things happening in the real world. AV is the part that make the virtual world aware of your movements & things that are happening in the real world.
Betta Lines
Member
See, you did it again. You're not telling me where you're getting your definition from.
Is that a fact? Canon MREAL Mixed Reality headset hitting US March 1st for $125,000
Marks's idea was to enable natural user interface and mixed reality video game applications using an inexpensive webcam, using the computational power of the PlayStation 2 to implement computer vision and gesture recognition technologies. He joined Sony Computer Entertainment America (SCEA) that year, and worked on the technology as Special Projects Manager for Research and Development.
Mixed-reality arena
US 20140125698 A1
ABSTRACT
A computing system comprises a see-through display device, a logic subsystem, and a storage subsystem storing instructions. When executed by the logic subsystem, the instructions display on the see-through display device a virtual arena, a user-controlled avatar, and an opponent avatar. The virtual arena appears to be integrated within a physical space when the physical space is viewed through the see-through display device. In response to receiving a user input, the instructions may also display on the see-through display device an updated user-controlled avatar.
You're citing canon pr speak and abstracts as proof people use these terms? I speak with vr developers daily, I've worked with ar - nobody uses these terms.
The terms themselves are poorly thought out. If you've augment reality, then it is a mixed reality by default. What a redundant term.
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
Are you being obtuse for the sake of it? If that post was about some "next generation digital shop" and someone posted that Valve would be better equipped to create one than Nintendo would you argue that as well?
Yes, both companies clearly have people with experience designing/implementing a digital shop, but one company is clearly a better choice. It's the same cases here. It's not a hard idea to grasp or understand, and I'm sure you do, yet you're arguing for some reason as if I'm admitting the companies are incapable of creating a controller or are incompetent
This is really great. Simple scifi in a believable future, asking how technology is going to [continue to] impact basic social behaviors like dating. Just really well made, definitely recommend anyone check it out even if you don't have any particular interest in AR.
The original post I replied to said just that. Without even seeing their controllers, the dude said they wouldn't work right but Nintendo's would because "they invent new control mechanisms."
Every bit of that comment was wrong.
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
No he said there would be "problems with the controller" meaning (at least as I understood it. Maybe this is where we differ), it probably wouldn't get it completely right the first time, which is the same with every major piece of tech introduced into the mainstream audience. The first iteration is good and functional, and does a lot of things right, but there's always room for improvements, and it does improve as it catches on and more companies get into the space
You can't seriously think the two companies will get everything right the first go around do you? That would be unprecedented
You say that no one uses the term yet it's right there in your face.
Hololens is a MR headset.
Betta Lines
Member
Apoleptica
Banned
As long as it keeps my head warm during the cold winter months I'll be happy.
ichtyander
Member
If you liked that, you should definitely check out the UK miniseries Black Mirror, especially the episodes White Christmas and The Entire History of You. I've never seen such disturbing yet believable glimpses into how future technology might influence social interaction in horrible ways.