Now that they're a more stable company, it's plausible albeit unlikely they could return to core related games for the XBO. Only, This time they'll handle the process much better hopefully anyway.
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More Insight into MS and Rare - Retro Gamer Issue 122 Interview with Phil Tossell
- Thread starter IOnEI Falcon
- Start date
Now that they're a more stable company, it's plausible albeit unlikely they could return to core related games for the XBO. Only, This time they'll handle the process much better hopefully anyway.
Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
I loved old school Rare as much as I loved Nintendo and SEGA back in the day. It is a shame that the Xbox brand was an ill fit for them and their games.
TheUnsunghero26
Member
Who was the one making the decisions to cancel the games? Wasn't Peter Molyneux head of the Europe Microsoft studios? Hopefully the positive response that Killer Instinct (even if it's not from Rare) has gotten will allow Rare to do more traditional games.
Scott Henson, a long-time MS exec, was studio head after Banjo bombed and Mattrick took over. Henson, probably on orders from Mattrick, wanted Rare to focus on Kinect.
microsofts treatment of rare is terrible. they didn't even give Killer Instinct 3 BACK to them (the creators)
Editk apparently I didn't know shank linked was fake
You could have just read it.
starwarsfan541
Banned
Microsoft killed Rare
Hopefully the Xbox One Kills them at least in this market.
Hopefully the Xbox One Kills them at least in this market.
jordan0386
Member
Make a cartoony paintball game, COD style.
BananasWithGuns
Member
It does suck but I wonder if it might change in the next few years. Obviously they have Kinect Sports Rivals coming but I wonder what's next. I know Phil mentioned that he'd been talking with Rare about a new non-Kinect project but odds are pretty good he's just blowing smoke.
Maybe Rare will be given a bit more of a leash now that Microsoft doesn't have to forcefully push the Kinect on people since it's in every box from launch. Or perhaps that's just wishful thinking as well.
Either way, I do think the reception for Killer Instinct caught Microsoft off guard. Perhaps if the sales for KI are enough they'll truly realize the demand for Rare created IP and finally get a non-Kinect Rare title to market.
Maybe Rare will be given a bit more of a leash now that Microsoft doesn't have to forcefully push the Kinect on people since it's in every box from launch. Or perhaps that's just wishful thinking as well.
Either way, I do think the reception for Killer Instinct caught Microsoft off guard. Perhaps if the sales for KI are enough they'll truly realize the demand for Rare created IP and finally get a non-Kinect Rare title to market.
jordan0386
Member
In a nutshell. Senior leadership are all MS guys. And the focus is Kinect.
It is best for everyone, if they let the 90s go.
Rare right now is basically Heroes Season 2, on repeat. Phil is Tim Kring, selling us a dream and vision that has long passed.
Black Door
Banned
I would have loved to play kiddy Kameo with a fairy MC instead of the weird hybrid of LOTR and a Fox Kids cartoon that we got, and its potentially dudebro sequel
iShouldGoPro
Member
Wow. This is actually pretty saddening in more ways than one
Well MS clearly bought rare all those years ago hoping it would keep laying golden eggs like it had for nintendo.
Think back on their output for the N64 years -
1996- KI gold
1997- Blast Corps, Golden Eye, Diddy Kong Racing
1998- Banjo Kazooie
1999- Jet Force Gemini , DK64
2000- Perfect Dark, Banjo Tooie, Mickeys speedway USA
2001- Conkers Bad Fur Day
Around this time a bunch of people left forming free radical, the guys who made time splitters. Outside of Conkers Bad Fur Day and possibly Jet Force Gemini , all of the above games were multimillion sellers. This also doesn't mention the 2 dozen or so other games Rare made , mostly donkey kong country and donkey kong land, while working with nintendo.
So the Rare which microsoft invested fully into was missing many of the people responsible for both goldeneye and perfect dark and it now didn't have access to any of Nintendos own IP's obviously. I'm sure the intent, initially was that rare could pump out 2-3 games a year that would hopefully attract the family audience to the xbox. The original xbox was pretty much popular among college aged men and little else. Unfortunately I think Nintendo got rid of rare because they saw something changing with their output , in 2000-2002 their output vastly decreased and I think Nintendo just wanted an out. MS bought in , expecting the late 90's rare but they got lemon. At the time of transfer only 4 games were being worked on - Grabbed by the Ghoulies, Kameo, Perfect Dark Zero and that early prototype banjo racing game. Ghoulies got shoved out the door and wasn't that great and the other 3 games got bumped to 360. To make up for that gap, a single game was built- Conker Live and Reloaded but it too, failed to set the sales world on fire.
Pre Kinect then, Rares output consisted of the aforementioned Perfect Dark Zero and Kameo , both 360 launch games and eventually that Banjo's nuts and bolts title. In the meantime, Microsoft attempted to again ape nintendo with a brand launch rivaling pokemon. Spending a shit ton of money on viva pinata as a game , show, comic, etc. There was even an expansion/sequel released but all in all not enough to make up for that initial investment. At this point, I'm sure you have Rare trying to start up a ton of products that might appeal to the existing audience but instead they get forced to spend a ton of time being MS' version of Nintendo once again. Making xbox live avatars that are just Mii knockoffs, creating kinect sports 1,2 and just generally doing nothing their previous fan base might have liked. It's now been so long that , outside of Killer Instinct I doubt ANY of Rares previous IP's have any staying power. But , thanks to kinect sales + crappy casual motion games I think MS may have finally broken even on that investment.
Think back on their output for the N64 years -
1996- KI gold
1997- Blast Corps, Golden Eye, Diddy Kong Racing
1998- Banjo Kazooie
1999- Jet Force Gemini , DK64
2000- Perfect Dark, Banjo Tooie, Mickeys speedway USA
2001- Conkers Bad Fur Day
Around this time a bunch of people left forming free radical, the guys who made time splitters. Outside of Conkers Bad Fur Day and possibly Jet Force Gemini , all of the above games were multimillion sellers. This also doesn't mention the 2 dozen or so other games Rare made , mostly donkey kong country and donkey kong land, while working with nintendo.
So the Rare which microsoft invested fully into was missing many of the people responsible for both goldeneye and perfect dark and it now didn't have access to any of Nintendos own IP's obviously. I'm sure the intent, initially was that rare could pump out 2-3 games a year that would hopefully attract the family audience to the xbox. The original xbox was pretty much popular among college aged men and little else. Unfortunately I think Nintendo got rid of rare because they saw something changing with their output , in 2000-2002 their output vastly decreased and I think Nintendo just wanted an out. MS bought in , expecting the late 90's rare but they got lemon. At the time of transfer only 4 games were being worked on - Grabbed by the Ghoulies, Kameo, Perfect Dark Zero and that early prototype banjo racing game. Ghoulies got shoved out the door and wasn't that great and the other 3 games got bumped to 360. To make up for that gap, a single game was built- Conker Live and Reloaded but it too, failed to set the sales world on fire.
Pre Kinect then, Rares output consisted of the aforementioned Perfect Dark Zero and Kameo , both 360 launch games and eventually that Banjo's nuts and bolts title. In the meantime, Microsoft attempted to again ape nintendo with a brand launch rivaling pokemon. Spending a shit ton of money on viva pinata as a game , show, comic, etc. There was even an expansion/sequel released but all in all not enough to make up for that initial investment. At this point, I'm sure you have Rare trying to start up a ton of products that might appeal to the existing audience but instead they get forced to spend a ton of time being MS' version of Nintendo once again. Making xbox live avatars that are just Mii knockoffs, creating kinect sports 1,2 and just generally doing nothing their previous fan base might have liked. It's now been so long that , outside of Killer Instinct I doubt ANY of Rares previous IP's have any staying power. But , thanks to kinect sales + crappy casual motion games I think MS may have finally broken even on that investment.
Banjo-Kazooie
Member
^
I wonder what game you should be making Rare...
I wonder what game you should be making Rare...
What do you mean 'no excuse', it did 1.5 million copies, what are you talking about?
dragonelite
Member
I just hope Microsoft will allow more stuff like Killer Instinct happen. Bring out old IPs and let 3. party studios have a go at it.
It did sub 1M.
It did sub 1M.
http://www.polygon.com/2013/9/11/4721764/the-unlikely-legend-of-rusty-pup-footage-revealed
This Game is being made by an Ex Rare Employee Chris Seavor
I wish Microsoft would let Rare make a Game that they want to make. Stay out of the way and when the game is finished Microsoft can do the marketing.
This Game is being made by an Ex Rare Employee Chris Seavor
I wish Microsoft would let Rare make a Game that they want to make. Stay out of the way and when the game is finished Microsoft can do the marketing.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
If KI doesn't do well, I doubt it.
IOnEI Falcon
Member
Yeah, I can't wait for this game to come out. A few other Rare guys are developing it with him.
and it's primarily back on a nintendo system, to boot. lol.
MS primarily bought rare to appeal to similar demographics that nintendo targets.
So when these rare-developed family friendly games bombed on the xbox, it's a result of microsoft's inability to make their consoles suitable for the 'family friendly' market.
when you look at the sales of fps games on nintendo consoles post-n64, you can clearly see that the market for this genre is nowhere near as popular as it is on xbox & playstation.
mulit-platform fps games selling better on non-nintendo hardware is more a failure on Nintendo's part, than it is 3rd parties.
same thing applies here. Rare's primary demographic not matching up with people who buy xbox is Microsoft's problem, not Rare's.
I'm really looking forward to this game.
Wishmaster92
Member
I agree, hopefully Phil can see potential in another Perfect Dark, Jet Force Gemini or Conker game.
IOnEI Falcon
Member
Jet Force would be great especially if we won't be seeing Gears for a while.
Steverulez
Member
Phil said he was a fan of Battletoads, I think Rare's catalogue of games has to be handled carefully, I can't see many of them being successful retail titles at the moment. Can see them going back to Banjo certainly but digital marketplace is where I can see that game performing better.
On the other hand, I don't see Perfect Dark coming back for a looong time.
outunderthestars
Banned
Why did Microsoft buy them again?
I don't think anyone at MS knows...
Colonel Mustard
Banned
"Wait, we own Donkey Kong now...right?"
This video needs to be posted in every Rare thread. At least until Nintendo buy them back. Which is happening. TBA 20XX.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
WAIT.. so isn't all of this Nintendo's fault for letting them go??
Banjo Kazooie and Conker could've been in Smash!
Banjo Kazooie and Conker could've been in Smash!
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
The thing that annoyed me about that was when he said they can just leave if they were unhappy, but realistically those types of decisions are life-changing. How many people would really make that kind of move back then, especially if Microsoft fed them hope for a great future?
On the other hand people keep buying Kinect Sports games and thus must be put on the path of nothing but Kinect Sports until time ends. Busniess wise making RARE the Kinect house was the right move, I think that gets lost in the mix.
Rare was leaving Nintendo's camp regardless, if it was not Microsoft it would have been Activision.
microsofts treatment of rare is terrible. they didn't even give Killer Instinct 3 BACK to them (the creators)
Edit
Not following, what is fake???
Looks interesting, hope it does well. And they should consider releasing it on PC.
Sad thing is, they really did think that.
Terrible. To get the best out of the company, you should give it it's freedom and allow it to do whatever it wants. I actually loved Kameo and really wished they made a part 2. Even today, I feel Kameo is a fantastic platformer that in a missing genre. Once you take away Rare' s freedom, it's personality and charm into its games is lost.
Auto-Reply
Member
Anybody know how many copies were actually sold of Kameo/PDZ/Viva Pinata etc?
Green Yoshi
Member
You can say about Nintendo whatever you want, but at least they let Rare produce such games like Conkers Bad Fur Day, GoldenEye 007, Killer Instinct and Perfect Dark, that didn't fit to Nintendos family-friendly image.
Kinect games are not hard to make. Microsoft could have easily found a new studio for these games instead of destroying Rare.
Kinect games are not hard to make. Microsoft could have easily found a new studio for these games instead of destroying Rare.
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