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[Graphics Horse]

Well a single physical button would be the stick, but there's the old problem of stick buttons traditionally being crap because of needing to avoid accidental inputs from lateral force. An unusual stick design as discussed above might help, not sure.

The reasons for the innovation are:

1. Increasing screen size without increasing over all device size
2. Providing a sense of immersion by hiding all inputs with your thumbs and having the screen shape resemble a human FOV

Both of these factors are important for a handheld, but not necessarily a home console controller.

Absolutely, but I'm looking at it from a p.o.v of Nintendo wanting to innovate a new control interface again. It could be that they don't care so much about that on the home side this time.

 

[Graphics Horse]

These same 4 buttons on each side could be easily mapped to the very tactile dpad and face buttons on the console controller (which would still feature a touch pad in my envisioning).

How do you envision the touch pad, something like the whole face of the Pokken controller or just circular pads? If they did have circular pads they could have real clicks and possibly tilt too. Might not be any good for dpad intensive games though...

 

[Fourth Storm]

Well a single physical button would be the stick, but there's the old problem of stick buttons traditionally being crap because of needing to avoid accidental inputs from lateral force. An unusual stick design as discussed above might help, not sure.


Absolutely, but I'm looking at it from a p.o.v of Nintendo wanting to innovate a new control interface again. It could be that they don't care so much about that on the home side this time.

About the sticks, I was thinking it would be cool/useful to have a miniature version of one of these bad boys on NX.

In the end, I'm not so sure how useful it would be though. Most inputs could be accomplished with the analog sticks and the circular touch area surrounding them. The other important part is that I think there would be a small region of dead pixels surrounding the hole in the display. Having a low profile stick with a wider operation surface helps hide that. Still, it's food for thought and we should be thinking outside the box when speculating Nintendo.

How do you envision the touch pad, something like the whole face of the Pokken controller or just circular pads? If they did have circular pads they could have real clicks and possibly tilt too. Might not be any good for dpad intensive games though...

In my mind, it's the whole surface (like the Pokken controllers's face). That's not to say I don't think that some areas could be clickable. I just don't see any way they can get virtual buttons to work in a satisfactory manner when you are not looking directly at a touch screen. Now, there will probably still be some control innovations in the home console pad (maybe the peripheral linear image sensors), but the more I think about it, the more it seems to me that Nintendo would be handicapping their console by not including traditional inputs. What happens to ports from the other consoles? The way I see it, the portable could be aimed more at casuals and the home console more at core gamers.

 

[Graphics Horse]

Another important part is that I think there would be a small region of dead pixels surrounding the hole in the display. Having a low profile stick with a wider operation surface helps hide that.

I think the patent says this is within 4x4 blocks of the missing ones, pretty small but pretty annoying if it means they are permanently on! Seeing as they also suggsst dpads and buttons there needs to be an alternative fix, like a tiny lip that covers that area.

 

[Fourth Storm]

I think the patent says this is within 4x4 blocks of the missing ones, pretty small but pretty annoying if it means they are permanently on! Seeing as they also suggsst dpads and buttons there needs to be an alternative fix, like a tiny lip that covers that area.

True, looking at some of Sharp's example displays, a thin lip would likely be enough to solve that issue. For some reason, I was remembering there being a greater number of affected pixels.

 

[Refreshment.01]

"Virtualizing" buttons and having dynamic UI is making things more inviting and intuitive. It's one of the main interface aspects of the DS family and this would be an expantion of that concept. To explain:

You would only have 2 very flushed physical inputs (like Circle Pads and thumbsticks) at the face of the device, something like an evolved version of the potentiometers present in the New 3DS C stick could work well with the device in the patent. The reasons to go with C stick like input instead of plain thumbsticks is because of the low profile and less surface area for operation and manipulation.

The rest of the UI at the face would be self explanatory virtualized buttons that changed in context in relation to the ingame actions. This increases intuitiveness since it would prevent confusion and the need to memorize every input.

They could also opt to use physical transparent overlays that surrounded the "C sticks" and retain the best of both virtual and physical buttons.

After hearing Refreshment.01, it actually makes perfect sense.

This could be the real evolution of Nintendo DS.


Actually, this would be perfect for the Wii U. Throw away the giant and freaky Wii U pad.

You have this small portable console with no buttons, just triggers and the analog sticks. Everything is touch screen.

If you're playing a tradional games, just plug over the screen the ''4 buttons'' style attachment.

If you're playing a game that requires only two buttons, either you plug this ''4 buttons'' attachment or a special ''two buttons'' designed with bigger buttons.

If these attachments are transparents, the touch screen will creat colors underneath these attachments to create a special effect like you were playing with gamecube or a SNES controller.

That seems really smart. If these attachmentes stick on the touch screen with magnets, in a way that theses buttons don't fall off the screen, it will be perfect.

On the other hand, people who don't care about buttons will be free to use only the touch screen.

Yes, this is basically how a device like the patent could work.

About the physical button overlays. What im considering since the device is made from the ground up with them in mind, Nintendo can enginner the frame or body of the devices to have indentations or surfaces to snap the physical button overlays, so they remain securely attached and reduces the chances of input errors.

The are other multiple advantages like total control symmetry, favoring left handed users and physically customizable button layouts that change dependening on the game or the system that you might be emulating.

 

[Refreshment.01]

If the chose to play it safe and go instead with physcial face buttons instead of overlays or just virtual ones, maybe they could go for a "flower" like configuration since it saves space and thus makes more screen area usable:

This setup retains simmetry which is always useful and it's lay out in an intituitive way. They could opt to leave the left side with just a circle pad instead. The reason for this is that if the circle pad has short displacement then it makes the Dpad mostly pointless and they could go with virtual buttons for games that use the Dpad as shortcuts.

 

[Graphics Horse]

I guess it's possible, it all depends on how low profile they can make the sticks, you don't really want an action game like Bayonetta having to deal with a stick between the buttons. If it's virtual buttons then you can place them in an arc to avoid that.
Of course it's arguable that any arrangement of buttons are better than virtual, virtual ones is entirely dependent on how good they can make the haptics.

Still curious about a stick that isn't stick shaped, like cutting the stalk off the gamecube sticks and just leaving the ball top shape and a grippy surface, but someone would have probably done it by now if it worked.

 

[Refreshment.01]

I guess it's possible, it all depends on how low profile they can make the sticks, you don't really want an action game like Bayonetta having to deal with a stick between the buttons. If it's virtual buttons then you can place them in an arc to avoid that.
Of course it's arguable that any arrangement of buttons are better than virtual, virtual ones is entirely dependent on how good they can make the haptics.

Still curious about a stick that isn't stick shaped, like cutting the stalk off the gamecube sticks and just leaving the ball top shape and a grippy surface, but someone would have probably done it by now if it worked.

Nintendo already have the solutions to the low profiles sticks, they could go with:

1) An improvent version of a potentiometer stick like the C Stick in the New 3DS but bigger in size an with a better top surface. This would work better with the surrounding buttons since it doesn't diplace and takes less operating area. Altought Circle pads or thumbstcks are prefered.

2) The circle pad in the 3DS since it's really low profile.

Regarding the surrounding buttons. The right/up petals (left stick) and left/up petal (right stick) could be elevated a bit more. The left/down petals (left stick) and the right/down petal (right stick) could be of lower or similar hight.

Also remember Nintendo can accomodate the "stick" in an area with a hole even lower in relation to the screen surface like how they pack the circle pad in the 3DS systems.

 

[Graphics Horse]

Next gen c-stick?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b68S0d_qZpY

 

[wild wild rice]

Next gen c-stick?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b68S0d_qZpY

Fire Emblem fans are gonna love the inevitable nipple tweaking mini game.

 

[Refreshment.01]

Next gen c-stick?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b68S0d_qZpY

i saw a video from the same company, maybe was in the other active NX thread?

Interesting indeed Graphics Horse. This solution covers some of the things i' ve been talking about for a directional input candidate for the Free Form Display, specially the low profile and low displacement to opperate characteristics.

Even if Nintendo didn't go with this specific technology, it gives the hope that at the least they might be thinking about making the thumbsticks / C sticks / Circle Pads (or whatever) of this device "push friendly". By this i mean, they could feel almost as good to push as a more traditional button and even more so than the clicks we have on the thumbsticks today.

It would be so neat to have the device come out exactly like the patent, so clean in terms of interface and intuitive. With 2 bumper wheels and these "sticks" that also worked exactly like 2 action buttons. That way you have all your index and thumbs resting on inputs.

That would give you at least 3 possible interactions for each index finger and like 9 minimun for each thumb. Plus an entire touch screen to tap, hold and swipe, in conjunction with the now ubiquitous motion sensors. Quite a decent amount of inputs with minimal finger movements.

 

[Refreshment.01]

So far this is the more realistic mock up for the patent. XD

i think the bump is warranted since the disscussion is way too diluted in the leak thread and people could use this one to get an idea of how it could work.

It seems wheels like things are visible atop of the image. Strangely too close to the two patents that were posted in these boards.

 

[buzzth]

If it had buttons that also somehow incorporated the sections of the screen, this concept could potentially be really cool. I think I'm out if it'd touch screen controls tbh. Make the buttons themselves part of the overall screen Nintendo.

 

[Refreshment.01]

If it had buttons that also somehow incorporated the sections of the screen, this concept could potentially be really cool. I think I'm out if it'd touch screen controls tbh. Make the buttons themselves part of the overall screen Nintendo.

For what i can gather in this thread as well as other more speculative ones, the main reservation with a device such as the one in this patent is the lost of feedback from pressing a button.

i think it would be possible for Nintendo to have a sort of a BIG button below the touchscreen. Basically the user could depress the touch screen downwards and register an input. Similar to a click in a touchpad but less so than a click and more of a "press".

Maybe design a system that alters the displacement of the screen downwards acording to application. For example, a game that relays on quick successive actions, say throwing Pikming, would make the screen travel a shorter distance.

Another nice perk, would be the added functionality when the touchscreen is used as a trackpad. Basically in a game the user could slide the finger in the screen to make a mouse pointer appear, place the cursor over an object but the interaction is not triggered until the screen is depressed.

This would complement nicely the virtual buttons around the thumbstick. Have the stick work as your home position, then when pressing a virtual button in either cardinal direction the user would get a feedback similar to a traditonal button.

 

[Refreshment.01]

In terms of the way the touch screen could be depressed like a physical button there could be 3 operating modes that are adjusted by the application. One mode could have the touchscreen register a press with a similar amount of force of a typical gamepad button. A second mode will have more resistance working similarly to a touchpad "click". A 3rd mode will fix the touchscreen in a postion without allowing any displacement.

Regarding the added costs of a device such as this, we should consider how costs have dropped down in the expensive components since the Wii U's introduction, now a days we have Tablets that go for 50/70 with quite an overlap in components when comparing it to this controller. The controller might have specialized components not common in mobile devices like the scroll wheels, but on the other hand a tablet has a dedicated SOC with a CPU and GPU. So it makes sense more than in the past for the company to retain a screen in the controller.

Another interesting point is the potential dynamics between a dedicated portable and the home console. For one, it would make sense for them to share the exact same input interface, a 1:1 equivalent, maybe same form factor even with one of the portable models. A bonus for them is that this could facilitate a poential sale, if the handheld can double down as a second screen controller for the home console. Specially if the price difference is kept in the margin of 2:1 between the handheld or just another console gamepad.

There's aslo the thing on how Nintendo will handle off TV play with the device. Will they support Off TV through the Internet for some gammes where lag in not a huge issue? In that case, it will make sense for the console pad handles to be an attachment, this way the device keeps an smaller profile and it's easier to carry around.

Another benefit of having an attachment with habdles and extra triggers is that it could be shared between the handheld and console controller. Potentially the form factor could be the same with one of the portable models, but with the handheld having more depth to house the extra components or just make the console pad the same size even if it had empty space inside. Not to mention the implications this has on manufacturing costs, the company would save a lot of money.

Another thing. At retail, only the controller with the screen should be sold and obviously the handheld since it could work as a controller. However, developers could support the millions of legacy controllers like the Remote and it's attachments or the Wii U Pro.