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Obsidian's Feargus Urquhart on insane publisher Kickstarter requests
- Thread starter EatChildren
- Start date
They've still gotta earn that funding with a compelling pitch. It's not free money.
Edit: To clarify - I have no problem with anyone *asking* for money. That doesn't mean I will give them any.
ThoseDeafMutes
Member
The Return of
Banned
Honestly, I laughed and read the OP so many times that I just kept forgetting to post. I think this might be the funniest thing I've read in the past 4 months within the game industry
Easy money? Most people would think it.
fizzelopeguss
Banned
This was probably bethesderp.
Backfoggen
Banned
Hilarious.
It'll still be around for quite some time. Try and kickstart a new AAA franchise and see how that goes. Or a license game like FIFA.
Sure. I mean, who would even think that someone would agree to something like that.
I just realized Bethesda was changed to BetaShed LOL
At least publishers understand that they can't go hijacking the crowdfunding movement upfront, but I'm sad they're trying to be duplicitous about it.
However, if I find out any Kickstarter, whether it's one I backed or not, is doing this then I will avoid the developer and the publisher involved for a very long time. This really isn't an acceptable thing to do, and I'm glad Obsidian has come out and said this is what publishers are trying. The only thing I wish is that we had the names of the publishers responsible.
However, if I find out any Kickstarter, whether it's one I backed or not, is doing this then I will avoid the developer and the publisher involved for a very long time. This really isn't an acceptable thing to do, and I'm glad Obsidian has come out and said this is what publishers are trying. The only thing I wish is that we had the names of the publishers responsible.
GravityMan
Member
This is why we can't have nice things forever, and is one reason why I'm a bit leery of the entire Kickstarter initiative. There will be future attempts by certain entities (e.g. publishers) to "abuse" KS and eventually some of them will sadly succeed. I can definitely see future instances where a financially healthy large publisher will attempt to leverage KS for part of (or all of) a game - risky or no...when they easily have the money to support the game themselves and are just using us to save costs and improve their bottom line.
Kudos to Obsidian for recognizing the bullshit and turning down these pubs.
Kudos to Obsidian for recognizing the bullshit and turning down these pubs.
This is making me wary for the next time a kickstarter by a renowned Studio appears, this shit didn't fly with Obsidian but publishers will keep on sweetening that deal until one of the independents accepts. For all we know it already happened and we find out when the game is near release.
If it does happen one day I hope there will be a massive community backlash against all involved parties, it's nothing less than a scam.
If it does happen one day I hope there will be a massive community backlash against all involved parties, it's nothing less than a scam.
Was my first thoughts as well, even though I'm usually not into EA-bashing affairs.
Getting onto XBLA still isn't straightforward, if I understand correctly a developer can't self-publish there so if you don't want to involve another publisher you need to rely on Microsoft to be your publisher which has its price too if they are interested at all.
Aside from that, I can't think of many direct benefits they can offer I, there is marketing, music licensing, cross franchise promotions (like Kingdoms of Amalur and ME) but that's not too convincing. Indirectly I see plenty of opportunities for publishers, they can promise funding for a sequel if the KS project reaches certain goals, assuming there is a pre-existing relation between the studio and publisher they could improve the support for an ongoing unrelated project up to giving them more development time if that's what the developer wants. Going further would get into the territory of blackmail though.
Publishers are salivating elbowing each other to enter this crowd funding space. Inevitable. But at least they're smart enough to know that going full on will explode in their faces. I hope that further future subreptitious attempts are barred right from the start, or at least met with such a disinterest that they quickly get out.
Marketing, localization and possibly QA.
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
This is one of the most fucked up things I've ever heard of in gaming
I want names.
This happens in every industry.
It's fucking disgusting.
Creative Control is a precious commodity in the world.
BassForever
Member
If a company who's financially well off say Nintendo/Capcom/Square Enix/etc made a Kickstarter that said
"Help fund a localization/release in a long absent franchise" I'd support even if it felt dirty.
"Help fund a localization/release in a long absent franchise" I'd support even if it felt dirty.
Yep. Once it happens and a kickstartered game is released with a publisher, there will probably be a lot less faith in kickstarter projects and some people could get screwed over in funding.
Castor Krieg
Banned
Shows how badly videogame industry is in need of skilled managers, not amateurs. No, this type of behavior is not acceptable in management. However, if you are simply a dick and bad at your job you will act like that.
Callibretto
Member
it will be outside of the kickstarter promise at first, because once the kickstarter project is finished and the people who fund it get their game, they are free to do with the game as they see fit.
like maybe the kickstarter only promise a steam/pc version. once the game is out and everyone is happy, that's when they announce any partnership with a publisher to bring the game to more people, to xbla/psn. we know that you need a publishers to put games on xbla, so they'll have to talk to publishers at some point if they want to expand beyond steam pc.
the only thing ballsy about the publishers in op story is that the publishers want ownership of the ip as well. which is stupid and no surprise Obsidian refused. if they promise different thing like marketing campaign, or help producing the promised rewards like poster, soundtrack, steel case etc, some developer may actually agree with it because a small developer may like be able to focus on the actual game development and leave the merchandising etc to other who are more experienced in dealing with that stuff, which is some of the things a publishers do.
or, I can almost see publishers using kickstarter to gauge a potential sales of an uncertain games/genre, like maybe after seeing a particularly successful kickstarter in progress, a publishers step in and actually fully publish the title, kickstarter is canceled and the game move to traditional channel.
I'm amused at the guys who show up in every Kickstarter thread implying that the entire model is a house of cards that will fall apart when something bad happens with a single game.
I'm pretty sure this has already happened. Sort of. One of those realistic FPS projects was actually for a prototype which would then be shopped around to publishers for conversion into a real game. I can't remember the name of the project but the developers were reasonably forthright about their plan.
I'm pretty sure this has already happened. Sort of. One of those realistic FPS projects was actually for a prototype which would then be shopped around to publishers for conversion into a real game. I can't remember the name of the project but the developers were reasonably forthright about their plan.
Corleth the Fey
Member
I'm surprised no ones pointed a finger at THQ. I think they out of anyone are probably desperate enough. And aren't they working with Obsidian on South Park?
water_wendi
Water is not wet!
From what Feargus said it was multiple publishers so maybe it was all of them? It wouldnt surprise me if all the large pubs tried this. The worst that could happen in their eyes is Obsidian says no. If they said yes then its easy money.
Callibretto
Member
but jason rubin is one of the good guys right? he had panel about why he think upper management is not good on the developer and how the publisher model are oppressing the developer so they are forced to depend on them, limiting their creative vision etc. probably one of the reason he left ND and Sony in the first place.
Because it could be anyone. Zenimax, Zynga, EA, Activision etc. droping names you think isn't any construtive post.
They won't say who because they don't want to burn bridges.
If the devs want an actual retail presence with boxed copies they will almost surely have to get a publisher involved at some point. Hopefully it is more along the lines of how EA does Valve games. (Though I don't see much upside for a brick & mortar release for these games, the audience is already fully on board with digital releases especially in the US.)
It also seems likely that one of the major Kickstarter projects will run out of funding before the game is done. Are people going to be upset when the dev gives up some of the profits, rights, or what not to a publisher in return for the funding to finish the game?
It also seems likely that one of the major Kickstarter projects will run out of funding before the game is done. Are people going to be upset when the dev gives up some of the profits, rights, or what not to a publisher in return for the funding to finish the game?
Nicely done.
I would wish there were another way to help fund to finish the project. If not, a publisher would be okay but not at the cost of giving up IP rights. I'd rather the project get cancelled than see a developer lose IP rights. Especially in case of Obsidian.
Well i don't oppose at all when publisher is doing publishing. I oppose only publisher being DEV and funding games.
In case of PE it will be probably like Witcher. They will be only releasing it boxed but they won't have any right to IP.
Callibretto
Member
I'm more curious about the scale of some the kickstarter project imo, the Obsidian rpg kickstarter is only have $1mil target at first. how big of an rpg could that get? rpg are usually expensive to make, and we hear even typical AAA game have around $20mil budget and more.
sure they're not going to pursue AAA production value, but an rpg still require bigger than usual art asset for environment, enemy, music, not mention tons of pages of script. and playtesting to make all the abilities and skill is balanced and didn't broke the game.
I'm just curious if that amount of money is enough
water_wendi
Water is not wet!
Feargus has said for some time that for them to do an IE style game they would need at least a million dollars.
Unless they had really wasted the cash or bit off way more than they could chew, I wouldn't think it would be likely the developer would have to give up IP rights. I could easily see a deal though that the publisher has the right of first refusal on sequels or something similar.
SolarPowered
Member
Yep, these are our publishers.
RedNumberFive
Banned
The only thing surprising about this, is that it hasn't happened sooner.
I'm not even fully sure why this would suddenly be an immoral thing. It's basically just an extreme pre-order.
If Capcom asked for the funding for Mega Man Legends 3 up front, would people hate them for it? It might not be that bad of an idea honestly.