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Racism in Canada: CBC closes comments due to excessive racism towards Aboriginals

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Walpurgis

Banned
This happened on November 30 but I don't believe a thread was made on it.

Uncivil dialogue: Commenting and stories about indigenous people
CBC said:
Today we made the difficult decision to temporarily close comments on stories about indigenous people. We hope to reopen them in mid-January after we've had some time to review how these comments are moderated and to provide more detailed guidance to our moderators.
CBC said:
We've seen thoughtful, insightful and moving comments on our pages. We've seen ignorant, ill-informed and objectionable comments as well. All of it is acceptable, in our view, in a marketplace of ideas where the issues of the day are freely debated and tested. For that to work, the debate must be respectful, even if it's vigorous and pointed.
But as our guidelines make clear, we draw the line on hate speech and personal attacks.
While there are a number of subjects and groups of people who seem to bring out higher-than-average numbers of worrisome comments, we find ourselves with a unique situation when it comes to indigenous-related stories.

We've noticed over many months that these stories draw a disproportionate number of comments that cross the line and violate our guidelines. Some of the violations are obvious, some not so obvious; some comments are clearly hateful and vitriolic, some are simply ignorant. And some appear to be hate disguised as ignorance (i.e., racist sentiments expressed in benign language).

This comes at the same time CBC News has made a concerted effort to connect with indigenous communities in order to improve our journalism and better reflect these communities to a national audience. The success of our Aboriginal unit and our investigative journalism around missing and murdered indigenous women are just two examples of that commitment.

We don't want violations of our guidelines by a small minority of our commenters to derail our good work or alienate our audience. So we're taking a pause to see if we can put some structure around this. We will reopen comments as soon as possible.
Thank you for your patience in the meantime.

Brodie Fenlon
Acting director of digital news
CBC News and Centres
So, basically, there is a ton of racism towards Aboriginals, overt and covert, and the contracted mods are having difficulty detecting the coded racism that is commonly used in the comments section. CBC promised to reopen the comments for mid-January but I just checked and the comments are still closed.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/aboriginal

Many of you are probably wondering, how bad was it? CBC posted a one minute video later that week that answers that question.
CBC indigenous staff read real comments from CBCNews.ca
duncan-mccue-reads-cbc-comments.jpg

Here is a YouTube link. It's kind of funny actually.

Here is The Guardian's take on this. I'll just highlight the parts that stood out to me.
CBC's racist comment sections spark debate on Canada's prejudice problem
The Guardian said:
It’s a significant move for the CBC, which, as a publicly funded corporation, faces pressure to maintain an open space for democratic discussion. While other Canadian publications have shut down comment sections altogether or turned them over to Facebook, CBC still allows readers to post anonymously and employs moderators to weed out the hateful posts, which Fenlon says amount to between 15-20% of the one million monthly comments.

It’s no surprise that the discourse on indigenous stories, which the CBC reports on more than most other major news outlets in Canada, is contentious. The legacy of forced cultural assimilation, in which the government funded church-run schools to abolish aboriginal culture, is still felt by First Nations, Métis and Inuit people. They make up 4.3% of Canada’s population and many live on reserves in deplorable conditions. They experience higher unemployment, addiction and murder rates than other Canadians.
Let me just interject here to quickly explain why this is the case for those who might not know. For 150 years, instead of segregation, the strategy in Canada was "integration" or more accurately, assimilation. Sounds nice right? Wrong. The goal was essentially to "kill the Indian in the child" and to "civilize the savages" or "save" them. This was done by kidnapping Aboriginal children from their homes and placing them in church-run schools where they were banned from speaking their mother tongue and practising their religion. In these schools they were physically and psychologically abused, as well as molested by the staff and students. Conditions were so poor that at some schools, the morality rate was close to 70% (disease, undernourishment and murder). The result was cultural genocide. The last residential school closed in 1996 so this isn't in the distant past. The people that are committing these crimes and doing drugs either attended these schools or were raised by parents with PTSD that did. This is something that CBC commenters love to ignore.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Indian_residential_school_system
Anyway, back to the article.
The Guardian said:
Indigenous comedian Ryan McMahon has less faith that open spaces online facilitate productive discussion. “There’s no one who walks away from a three-day online fight and managed to make some guy with an egg avatar and a fake name say ‘You know what? Maybe I am wrong about the history of Canada.’ That’s never happened ever.”

Though he believes in free speech, Winnipeg-based McMahon has lost countless hours trying to persuade ignorant commenters that indigenous people are not drunks who live off government handouts. He abandoned hope in 2014, when a group of commenters threatened to “shoot up” the Alberta theatre where he planned to perform his comedy special, Red Man Laughing. His CBC producers added extra security measures.

McMahon says the real problem is that commenters represent the views of Canadians at large. “It’s not a small segment of the population,” he says. “There’s a large racism problem in Canada no one’s talking about.”
The Guardian said:
[Female indigenous writer] doesn’t think the onus should be on indigenous people “to wade into these really harmful conditions and ‘educate people’” and resents the fact that when her kids go online to learn about their history, they “see a bunch of comments about dirty Indians and all these other stereotypes”.

“We’re talking about people who literally express their belief that indigenous people are subhuman,” she writes. “You can cure ignorance with information, but that doesn’t work with racists.”
Meanwhile, in Canada's most racist city...
Winnipeg community centre fires worker for hurling racial slur at boy
CBC said:
A Winnipeg community centre is apologizing to a mother after her teenage son was called a "stupid f---ing Indian" by an employee while waiting for a ride after school.

Lisa Harper says her 14-year-old son was with his friends just after 3 p.m. Thursday on the field outside Champlain Community Centre, which backs onto the school he attends, when a worker yelled at them to get off the grounds. Harper said she learned of the incident a few minutes later, when she arrived at the school to pick her son up.

"I got a call from him and he just said, 'Mom, the guy in the park called me a stupid f---ing Indian,' and my son was just really upset, he couldn't even talk," she said Friday afternoon.

Harper said she doesn't know what could have prompted the remark. She added that a community centre supervisor who later approached her on the field tried to deflect the issue.

"'Why would your guy call my son a stupid f---ing Indian?' Like, why? What's going on?" she said.

"I didn't get an answer [as to] why somebody would do that to a child. It didn't make sense to me."
That was on Friday.

TL;DR: Racism is alive and well in Canada. It's just towards a group of people that nobody here cares about.
 

Quick

Banned
The Aboriginals hate is alive in Canada and it's disgusting, and I'm not even just referring to the racism.
 
Yeah, it's a serious and common problem for sure. My cousin is from the Island and the open racism and contempt I've seen there is off the charts.
 

Valhelm

contribute something
Why is anti-Native racism (apparently) a bigger issue in Canada than the United States? Simply because indigenous people make a bigger proportion of the population?
 

Alexlf

Member
Ya, it's really bizarre. I know a ton of otherwise very 'liberal' people who stand out against racism against most minorities yet are the first to jump on how 'horrible' the aboriginals are. Not sure what can be done :/
 

Walpurgis

Banned
Why is anti-Native racism (apparently) a bigger issue in Canada than the United States? Simply because indigenous people make a bigger proportion of the population?
It's historical reasons. They are the only minority group here to suffer from centuries of racism and oppression by Europeans, since they were the only non-white people around for a good while. In fact, I think Canada tried to keep things white until like 1960 or 1970 when they started accepting non-European immigrants. Currently, the largest non-white group is probably Chinese.

edit: I just checked and as of 2011, Chinese are at 4%, South Asian is at 4.8% and Aboriginal is at 4.3%.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Canada#Visible_minority_population
 

aeolist

Banned
Why is anti-Native racism (apparently) a bigger issue in Canada than the United States? Simply because indigenous people make a bigger proportion of the population?

yeah probably. there's more of it in states like arizona, new mexico, and oklahoma where native americans are seen more frequently.
 

Divvy

Canadians burned my passport
I never hear anyone say anything about aboriginals, which is the problem. Their problems are out of sight and out of mind for most Canadians which is exactly why nothing is done to help them.
 

br3wnor

Member
Americans aren't really outwardly racist towards Native Americans in that way (outside of our pro football team being named the 'Redskins'), we just killed most of them off, stole their land and now let them live in alcohol induced squalor (after giving a select few the privilege of becoming filthy rich off of casinos).

NOONE gives a shit about them in the US and it's really sad. Seems to be the case in Canada as well w/ a more racist tint.
 

nicanica

Member
Every single person I've met north of chiliwack (quesnel, prince george etc.) has a passively negative scope of aboriginal people. I can't say shit because the frequency and liklihood of living closer to reserves gets much higher in those areas, and I never grew up/actively interact around too many first nation peoples.

When I say passive scope, they aren't actively making racist or ignorant comments. Just a common bearing of "I try not to hang around natives because everywhere around me they're drunk/unemployed/dangerous/aggressive/rude. I don't care what anyone thinks. They didn't grow up / live where I live/grew up."

I was pretty taken aback the first time I heard it, but I just heard the same thing from non-consecutive and unrelated people and friends for over a decade. And ofcourse, there's always "one of the good ones" stories.
 

Makonero

Member
Americans aren't really outwardly racist towards Native Americans in that way (outside of our pro football team being named the 'Redskins'), we just killed most of them off, stole their land and now let them live in alcohol induced squalor (after giving a select few the privilege of becoming filthy rich off of casinos).

NOONE gives a shit about them in the US and it's really sad. Seems to be the case in Canada as well w/ a more racist tint.

My high school played sports against a Native American high school and racism was alive and well. I remember feeling really uncomfortable with my classmates calling them "injuns" and warning everyone that they'd get knifed if we wandered off. I don't think I recognized it as racism until I got older because that was just how my classmates and "friends" acted.
 

KrellRell

Member
Every single person I've met north of chiliwack (quesnel, prince george etc.) has a passively negative scope of aboriginal people. I can't say shit because the frequency and liklihood of living closer to reserves gets much higher in those areas, and I never grew up/actively interact around too many first nation peoples.

When I say passive scope, they aren't actively making racist or ignorant comments. Just a common bearing of "I try not to hang around natives because everywhere around me they're drunk/unemployed/dangerous/aggressive/rude. I don't care what anyone thinks. They didn't grow up / live where I live/grew up."

I was pretty taken aback the first time I heard it, but I just heard the same thing from non-consecutive and unrelated people and friends for over a decade. And ofcourse, there's always "one of the good ones" stories.

This sums it up perfectly, I live close to several reserves.
 

Azih

Member
Two things here.

1. Canada has a major major issue with its First Nation, Metis, and Inuit peoples.

2. Online commenting on media (such as articles, videos, etc.) was a nice idea but completely fails in practice. Don't read the comments -->Better to just disable comments altogether.
 

Dr.Acula

Banned
Personally, I don't want comments on news sites at all. I don't want the news outlets to waste the little money they have on managing user accounts, building and maintaining a commenting system, moderating, etc.

If you want to comment on news, you can do it on social media or on message boards, like people already do.

Let's be honest, if you see a news story and you think it's a big deal and want to have a discussion on it, you take that story to reddit/facebook/gaf, basically anywhere except the news site.
 

Walpurgis

Banned
Every single person I've met north of chiliwack (quesnel, prince george etc.) has a passively negative scope of aboriginal people. I can't say shit because the frequency and liklihood of living closer to reserves gets much higher in those areas, and I never grew up/actively interact around too many first nation peoples.

When I say passive scope, they aren't actively making racist or ignorant comments. Just a common bearing of "I try not to hang around natives because everywhere around me they're drunk/unemployed/dangerous/aggressive/rude. I don't care what anyone thinks. They didn't grow up / live where I live/grew up."

I was pretty taken aback the first time I heard it, but I just heard the same thing from non-consecutive and unrelated people and friends for over a decade. And ofcourse, there's always "one of the good ones" stories.
I believe I've mentioned this before but it's pretty much the same in Winnipeg. Whenever I go to Millennium Library which is downtown, I see it. It's either an intoxicated person sleeping on the bus in their piss or acting weird and talking or moaning to themself or a drunk homeless person getting into a fight with library security or being confronted by a homeless person aggressively asking for change or someone jaywalking across one of the city's busiest intersections or someone stealing a pastry from a coffee shop while you're in line. In all of these cases, the person is likely Aboriginal (and occasionally white but that never seems to count).

This is all incredibly common and I see it whenever I go downtown, as have many people in Winnipeg. In downtown Winnipeg, this is an unavoidable reality and it sounds like it's not much different near reserves. This results in most people being racist towards them and I don't mean just white people (my dad who is African refuses to trust them). People see these events out of context and just think "damn natives" without understanding the history that led to this. They think "o their jus takin government money 4 drugs, etc." without realising that we are all living on their land which was stolen from them.

I live in Winnipeg and pretty much grew up here so I do understand. There is no excuse for the ignorance that those northern B.C. people you met expressed. I think the problem is a lack of education. We learned a lot about residential schools and Aboriginals here but they never connected those events to today. It doesn't take much to connect the dots but I guess that's too much for most people.
 

DJ_Lae

Member
It absolutely is common, and it's sad.

I've had a couple of healthcare related research projects shelved because they were to focus on aboriginal populations and it was too hot a topic politically. It's not quite the same as outright racism, of course, but those projects could have helped to answer questions about how we can raise their life expectancy (which currently sits more than 10 years below the Canadian average) and quality of life.

Here in Edmonton, unfortunately, the most interaction people seem to have with aboriginals is with the homeless, and that only seem to reinforce those racist opinions. People seemed to be less racist back in the Okanagan, but maybe they were just more subtle (and I was younger, maybe I didn't notice).
 
we have our share of racists up here in Canada, oh it's true.

Natives (First Nations) have it the worst, especially in the West.

Canada is not squeaky clean.

Canada equally interned Japanese-Canadians and Italian-Canadians during WW2

Anglo-Protestant vs Franco-Catholic divide continued through the centuries what is refereed to as the Two Solitudes.

Today, there is this odd Conservative Right leaning portion that denies past wrongs and refuses to acknowledged persistent racism towards First Nations people.

Heck Stephen Harper refused to launch an investigation towards missing Aboriginal Women
 

Dazzler

Member
I spent Christmas up in Pemberton and the attitude towards First Nations people was a real eye opener. Just a level of casual racism I didn't think existed in 2016
 

nicanica

Member
This line is the one people use that pisses me off the most. Its thee most bullshit excuse for descriminattion ever. When I hear it it just pisses me the fuck off.

I really wish it wasn't true because I feel the same way about the line. It's hard to notice over the internet and something you do have to witness in reality.

Due to government funding natives are given free education but the graduation from HS or even the most basic educational needs are astronomically abysmal.

There's select number of HS's around Vancouver in the inner city that is always looking for substitutes teachers. Colleagues who have been ToC'ing for YEARS and are desperate for hours refuse to pick up those contracts because they are known to be jam packed with inner city native teens. The accepted consensus is that because education is free, there is no drive to succeed. There is a loop that develops where because there is no drive to learn, the students become accustomed to failure. Without positive aspects to move them forward, the classroom is simply unruly. It's not uncommon for the subs (who are already in a shit spot because substitutes need to earn the respect of students within a day) to get in verbal and near physical altercations with the students. From what I hear its just not worth it.

Again, I don't have anything against natives and try to keep my broad stroke paintbrush dry. In my search for hope to find positiive outlooks for Natives in Canada, I run into a LOT of stories from first hand accounts, which by majority, are not pretty. They have a pretty shit deal.
 
the biggest negative about Canada is the way they teach history.

Many negatives never get brought up in history class or by journalists when the wrongs of the best never get covered enough.

it is typically Canadian to gloss over dark times when it comes to history.
 

DopeyFish

Not bitter, just unsweetened
They should honestly close all the comments, because it seems after the election all the stupid fucks are out in full force
 
They should honestly close all the comments, because it seems after the election all the stupid fucks are out in full force

Toronto Star has closed their comments section because people just bashed the editorials and became bigger stories than the editorials themselves

CBC should close their comments section IMO
 

MMarston

Was getting caught part of your plan?
They should honestly close all the comments, because it seems after the election all the stupid fucks are out in full force
I generally avoid the comments section in any news website now, regardless of content or political leaning.
 
My father-in-law was working close to a reserve, and early one morning three aboriginals ran him off the road, beat him up and torched the car. The poor guy never hurt anybody in his life and now is dealing with PTSD as a result.

I don't post that as an example of something that justifies racism, it doesn't change the way I look at aboriginal issues, or my support for the native community. Rather I posted that as an example of how tense relations can be between reserves and the larger cities around them. There's an obvious problem here we should be addressing.
 

Walpurgis

Banned
the biggest negative about Canada is the way they teach history.

Many negatives never get brought up in history class or by journalists when the wrongs of the best never get covered enough.

it is typically Canadian to gloss over dark times when it comes to history.
I know it's regional but I think it is pretty well covered in Winnipeg. Everyone here knows about the residential schools. People just aren't applying their knowledge, I guess
They should honestly close all the comments, because it seems after the election all the stupid fucks are out in full force
The CBC comments were always like that. In my experience, they were at their worst in Aboriginal articles and articles about Syrians/Muslims.
 
I know it's regional but I think it is pretty well covered in Winnipeg. Everyone here knows about the residential schools. People just aren't applying their knowledge, I guess

The CBC comments were always like that. In my experience, they were at their worst in Aboriginal articles and articles about Syrians/Muslims.
negative events in history are not taught

I mean government sanctioned negative events like interment camps during WW2, that is not common knowledge
 
the biggest negative about Canada is the way they teach history.

Many negatives never get brought up in history class or by journalists when the wrongs of the best never get covered enough.

it is typically Canadian to gloss over dark times when it comes to history.

Cant comment on how it is now, but in the 90's history education was more than adequate and far superior to what ive heard the US teaches (especially the south).

All of this I think arises more from a broader issue and that is how Canada has dealt with Aboriginal issues as a whole. Its hard to fathom a group of people in a first world that is as decimated by such a myriad issues like the aboriginal population is here. In my mind it is at least on par with African Americans in the States if not worse becuase of the reserves.

Spend time in downtown Regina (which has actually greatly improved in the last 15 years) or Winnipeg and you will get a real taste of the hardship.
 

Alavard

Member
negative events in history are not taught

I mean government sanctioned negative events like interment camps during WW2, that is not common knowledge

Stop assuming your education speaks for everyones' in Canada. Plenty of us were taught about things Canada did wrong in the past.
 

jstripes

Banned
They should honestly close all the comments, because it seems after the election all the stupid fucks are out in full force

It's seriously amazing.

If you got all your news from comment sections, you'd think our economy completely crashed and our society turned to anarchy, taken over by refugees, within 5 minutes of Trudeau taking office.
 
My grandfather and all of his siblings fled Canada because of the racism towards natives there. I wouldn't exist if life was better for Canadian Natives, it's weird to think about.
 

Walpurgis

Banned
My father-in-law was working close to a reserve, and early one morning three aboriginals ran him off the road, beat him up and torched the car. The poor guy never hurt anybody in his life and now is dealing with PTSD as a result.

I don't post that as an example of something that justifies racism, it doesn't change the way I look at aboriginal issues, or my support for the native community. Rather I posted that as an example of how tense relations can be between reserves and the larger cities around them. There's an obvious problem here we should be addressing.
A lot of people have stories like this, especially in areas with a large Aboriginal population. And because of what was done to their people and how recent it all was, it is unavoidable. It happens a lot and will continue to happen a lot for the foreseeable future. There's no simple switch that can heal this collective soul wound. I mean, just look at this.
Over 150 000 students attended residential schools, constituting approximately 30% of the population of native children in Canada. The legacy of the schools on aboriginal people of today has been referred to as a “collective soul wound.” A sample of 127 survivors revealed that half of these survivors have criminal records, 65% have been diagnosed with posttraumatic stress disorder, 21% have been diagnosed with major depression, 7% have been diagnosed with anxiety disorder and 7% have been diagnosed with borderline personality disorder.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canad...system#Lasting_effects_of_residential_schools

The healing will take time, a lot of time. In the mean time, the government should do more to get others to feel some empathy. This is completely their fault, after all. The Liberal Party's win in October is definitely a step forward. From what I recall, they had the strongest platform for Aboriginal people. It also helps that they aren't racist like Harper and his Conservatives. With their promise to implement all of the Truth and Reconciliation recommendations and investiage the missing and murdered Indigenous women, the future is bright.
negative events in history are not taught

I mean government sanctioned negative events like interment camps during WW2, that is not common knowledge
I think people know about the Japanese interment camps but I've never heard of Italian interment camps. I agree that negative events need to be focused on a lot more instead of wasting time circle jerking over stuff no one gives a shit about like Vimy Ridge or the war of 1812, etc.
 

Walpurgis

Banned
Pretty sure that is the case for many countries including the USA, England, Japan, etc.

That is true. Relatively speaking, I don't think Canada is that bad on that front. There is a lot of room for improvement but the history that I described in the OP is common knowledge here, or at least in areas with a larger Aboriginal population. What I am beginning to wonder is if it even makes a difference.
My grandfather and all of his siblings fled Canada because of the racism towards natives there. I wouldn't exist if life was better for Canadian Natives, it's weird to think about.

That's messed up. Where did they go? And do you have any specific stories to share? The perspective of this thread has been pretty one-sided.
 

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
Ouch. I admit, I had no idea the racism was so bad. We have very few aboriginals here in Montreal (and Québec in general) so it's not in the news as much, I guess. Hell, I think I only met like, one aboriginal person in my whole life, a Métis girl in high school. That's all I can think of. I asked my boyfriend if he's ever met a single aboriginal person in his life and he thought for a while and said "no, I don't think so".

I knew of course about the reserves and the cultural genocide of the past, but the part with that comedian getting death threats in Alberta really shocked me, holy shit. So much for the smug Canadian superiority over the Americans and their treatment of black people. :\
 

Kinitari

Black Canada Mafia
I've been mostly shielded from this, as I don't really know any native people, and didn't grow up with them, and even then I live in Toronto where I think the hate is probably on the lower level - and even then I understand how crazy bad of an issue it is in Canada. I remember once I was at a restaurant and someone at the table beside me was just spouting the most creative racial slurs and insults aimed at natives and I literally just stared at her open mouthed. I guess I didn't even think it was a thing you were allowed to do, be so openly racist, until I heard the stuff she was saying.
 

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
negative events in history are not taught

I mean government sanctioned negative events like interment camps during WW2, that is not common knowledge

Wait.... what? I heard about it repeatedly when I went to school in the 90s. That and residential schools.

If anything I'd think the problem is the opposite: a couple of atrocities are acknowledged and then acknowledged as shameful... in a way that makes us think it's all in the past and we can wash our hands of it, and everything is perfect now.
 
It was tough for my girlfriend who moved out to Alberta about a year ago. Before moving she couldn't understand the racism and thought people out west were just ignorant. Then in a span of about two months she was verbally assaulted a dozen times, had a beer can thrown at her, had sexual remarks shouted at her, seen multiple arrests, people drunk during the middle of the day, etc. She called me to complain and though she was educated about Canada's sordid history with indigenous people, she felt bad because she felt like she was losing her empathy for them. Very sad.
 
That is true. Relatively speaking, I don't think Canada is that bad on that front. There is a lot of room for improvement but the history that I described in the OP is common knowledge here, or at least in areas with a larger Aboriginal population. What I am beginning to wonder is if it even makes a difference.

I think the fact the government actually acknowledged the residential school atrocities and issued reparations (the Commen Experience payments), shows we are actually doing a much better job in terms of not glossing over the past.

Though i would debate the usefulness of those payments in terms of moving past the issue heavily.
 
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