always a good way to start a post
lol at that reddit link having a spoiler right away
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Ready at Dawn responds to "concern" over The Order: 1886 campaign length
- Thread starter DarkLordMalik
- Start date
always a good way to start a post
lol at that reddit link having a spoiler right away
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Really? You think that they're somehow immune?
The Interview had North Korea issuing death threats.
The Satanic Verses got Rushdie a price on his head.
JK Rowling's received death threats.
This isn't somehow unique to gaming at all. Pull your head out of the sand.
I have a question for those claiming that the game takes 10+ hours to complete. Why is it taking you that long?
Based on everything I've seen (including impressions from people who have played it in the impressions thread), the game is extremely linear. People talk about exploring but there's nothing to explore (no largely open environments or branching paths). There's barely any platforming, if you can even call it that.
My question is, does it take you that long because you died a lot? Are you having difficulty lock-picking? Are you spending a lot of time taking screenshots?
Based on everything I've seen (including impressions from people who have played it in the impressions thread), the game is extremely linear. People talk about exploring but there's nothing to explore (no largely open environments or branching paths). There's barely any platforming, if you can even call it that.
My question is, does it take you that long because you died a lot? Are you having difficulty lock-picking? Are you spending a lot of time taking screenshots?
Reviewers should know their audiences, and many gamers want to know if a AAA title is worth the Day 1 tax; and that includes quantifiable numbers like playtime. By halving the pricetag to $30 it would be an easier pill to swallow like what Metal Gear Ground Zeroes did.
It was a bad jk. there is all kinds of crazy out there. So yeah, anyone dealing with the public really should have a bit of a siege mentality.
Good post, but this in particular really put a different perspective into words. Had not quite thought of things this way.
MegaSackman
Member
I agree with everything you said 100%.
LightofRohan
Member
I'm wondering if games like Mirrors Edge and other short titles got this much shit before they released. The internet is too instant now, bullshit can be spewed so fast and people accept it even faster.
And people don't even know if it's "5 hours". They are taking the word of people that havent played the game, but have read about peoples impression that have watched a video of someone playing the game. Yet whenever gaf members state the time they finished the game in, everyone goes, "Ohh I don't believe you. I believe the guy that heard from a guy who watched another guy play a game on youtube".
And people don't even know if it's "5 hours". They are taking the word of people that havent played the game, but have read about peoples impression that have watched a video of someone playing the game. Yet whenever gaf members state the time they finished the game in, everyone goes, "Ohh I don't believe you. I believe the guy that heard from a guy who watched another guy play a game on youtube".
bananafactory
Banned
Was there this much hulabaloo over Uncharted? 6-7 hour story, no MP, etc.
I didn't post on GAF back then so I don't know.
I didn't post on GAF back then so I don't know.
The best way to do it
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
Mirror's Edge wasn't so heavily filled with cutscenes and QTEs beside it having time trials.
LightofRohan
Member
Ok that's another issue then.
Make up your mind.
Ok then that's another issue.
And it was something fresh at the time
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
I am just stating why it might have gone over better with that game. Mirror's Edge was about the perfect length and I already said waaaaaay earlier in the thread that I was glad this game was short.
Hatty
Member
a game could have multiple issues you know
and two small issues could combine to make a bigger issue. Not to mention the apparent lack of enemy and situation variety
The game stars an immortal order of knights fighting werewolves and other supernatural creatures. Such wasted opportunity if you just fight men with guns most of the game
And was fastpaced...
No, because Uncharted wasn't packed with over 2 hours worth of unskippable cutscenes. It was also pretty groundbreaking in terms of action-adventure games and it featured a lot of exploration, gorgeous environments, platforming, puzzles and a fun combat system that offered a lot of different ways to fight enemies. Extremely well paced with lovable characters. The Order doesn't appear to have any of these things to offset the short length aside from extremely good visuals.
LightofRohan
Member
How long did it take you to finish the Order?
bananafactory
Banned
So people aren't mad about the length, they are upset the game isn't good? That sounds like it's what you're saying, which is funny because the game isn't out yet.
Based on...? Did you play it?
You may have solid points about gameplay being "standard fare", so I can't argue until I play it.
Characters have gotten mostly positive reception, as has aspects of the story and lore, though seemingly fair shortcomings have been made of the plot.
Probably someone causing a fuss not like this though.
A short game means a game I could beat, unless it's Elder Scrolls I don't want a long ass campaign, probably why I never beat shadows of mordor or GTA, or I'll never beat Bloodborne or Witcher 3
I like short campaigns
If the average movie is 2 hrs and cost $12 a ticket then I can enjoy 10 hr of movies for your $60.
I will take the 10 hrs over your 5 hrs.
Because it was not trying to achieve that. RAD wanted to do that, you might not like it but that's the game proposition and there is nothing dishonest with it. You can dislike something for what it is. But it makes no sense to hate it because you wanted it to be completely different.
-MD-
Member
You must have not read the last sentence in his post.
But the audience is very diverse. For some people $60 is most of their allowance money they get from their parents to buy a handful of games a year and for others it's chump change. The value of 60 bucks isn't the same for everyone so it's difficult to judge a game based on price for most people in the context of a review.
LightofRohan
Member
For someone really not into this game, you sure hang around a lot.
-MD-
Member
I plan on renting it. Problem?
CambriaRising
Member
There are quite a few people like that in these threads.
Those are pretty confident claims to make using the words "doesn't appear".
Especially with the generally positive impressions on aspects of the game apart from its length.
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
Read my post after the one you quoted.
NullPointer
Member
Mirror's Edge included a separate free run mode that was 100% pure mechanics and leaderboards. So even after completing the campaign there was plenty to enjoy.
The Order has more niggling issues to it besides the game's duration. Those black bars, a public focus on emulating film rather than offering up engaging and interesting gameplay, overly constrained and linear design, a hefty preponderance of QTEs, a third or more of the game consisting only of unskippable cut-scenes including whole chapters of nothing but cut-scenes, the short length of the overall game, the lack of replayability hooks, and lore that seems to set up the world and a sequel more than adding to the game itself.
Add to that that from the earliest GAF threads there was a lot of back and forth on all of this. But for everyone who thought the game might be too hefty on cinematics/QTEs/taking control from the player, etc, there were others who said that it was too soon to tell and that the game couldn't and shouldn't be judged by its marketing, developer interviews or that very same demo footage we'd all seen so much over the past year. Thats still going today too, with posters saying that you can't judge the game's story, scenario design or AI behaviors from watching YouTube.
Like Titanfall and Destiny, the build up to release and reviews for this game has been crazy fascinating to read and participate in.
iceatcs
Junior Member
Look like the price is problem with people to satisfy. $60 is a lot of money.
I think this market shouldn't keep only $60 standard. I don't see it all AAA games have to be $60. I feel I can 100% blame EA who is the one to start $60 made all publishers sticking with it. It is all about maximum profit in short time as possible.
No more $60 standard, just go for what devs want.
At least there will be short campaigns game forever, no matter how people want 3 hour per level or stupid massive openworld. Something I want to play AAA game that I could finish it on whole free day that I rarely have it in my life.
I think this market shouldn't keep only $60 standard. I don't see it all AAA games have to be $60. I feel I can 100% blame EA who is the one to start $60 made all publishers sticking with it. It is all about maximum profit in short time as possible.
No more $60 standard, just go for what devs want.
At least there will be short campaigns game forever, no matter how people want 3 hour per level or stupid massive openworld. Something I want to play AAA game that I could finish it on whole free day that I rarely have it in my life.
loaf of bread
Member
For fucks sake stop using 5 hours as a basis, yes someone beat it in 5 hours, that doesn't make it the average, it makes it the bottom of the range.
TheChocolateWar
Member
It is ultimately the publisher who decides what the price is, not the developing house.
The quality shouldn't be a part of the discussion - on either side of the argument. "It's about the experience" - but I don't know how the experience will be, so I have to metrics that are known... like game length in relation to the money I can and am willing to spend. That's totally subjective & differs from player to player.
I can only speak for myself here, since I don't know what the majority's argument is, but deluting the discussion by bringing up often times non-sensical (or at least unfair as you said yourself) analogies like the movie or steak one, doesn't help in any meaningful way.
So, yes, it comes down to "value" and for advocates of the "videogames are art"-arguemnt, this is certainly a sad assessment, but I almost want to say, they shouldn't be a discussion in the first place - at least not about whether one side is "right" or "wrong", because this whole thing so heavily relies on one's financial and social background, that there is little room to wiggle on side of the one's who think a game like The Order is too short.
All in all, I think, there has to be an acknowledgmend of both sides, that people have a very real & true sentiment behind their argument (Again, on both sides). To which degree those people voice their opinions, is probably the core problem, why this all "escalated.
I'm basing this on the troublesome points made by people who have played the game and also what I've seen of it being played.
- Extremely linear
- Unskippabe cutscenes
- Limited variety in terms of enemies
- Environment limits combat variety
The other things I mentioned are very specific to Uncharted which the other poster brought up as an example. For what it's worth, I absolutely think people would blast Uncharted 1 if it was released today because frankly, there are other games that do everything Uncharted 1 does better and moreso (Uncharted 2 & 3 for starters).
I bring up these points because I am on the fence on whether or not I should get The Order and these are valid questions that need to be answered before I make my decision. Right now, I'm leaning towards not buying the game until it hits the $30 mark and people who are defending the game have no answers to these criticisms.
Remember when gaming used to be about having fun and not arguing over games on the internet? Those were the days.
Just because this person likes this game and that person doesn't like that game, doesn't mean the game is either GOTY or a bad game. I don't know everything about a game from a few previews either, so the idea that you can judge ALL facets of a game before it's released just to argue with others is...interesting.
I'm still on the fence about the game and the length is worrisome (although some games are too long nowadays with just filler) but every damn thread is like a warzone anymore. If you think the game is worth the price of admission, buy it. If not, that's fine. But to convince others of your opinion is so futile.
Just because this person likes this game and that person doesn't like that game, doesn't mean the game is either GOTY or a bad game. I don't know everything about a game from a few previews either, so the idea that you can judge ALL facets of a game before it's released just to argue with others is...interesting.
I'm still on the fence about the game and the length is worrisome (although some games are too long nowadays with just filler) but every damn thread is like a warzone anymore. If you think the game is worth the price of admission, buy it. If not, that's fine. But to convince others of your opinion is so futile.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
What the...
....Fast food?
It's not really a defense, but I like those things. The Wolf Among Us and Wolfenstien are a couple of my favorite games from the last 12 months.
Ricky Ricardo
Member
What the...
Tomorrow will be a day to remember
I don't think anyone likes unskippable cutscenes and more enemy types are always welcome, surely.
Welfare
Member
EightBitNate
Member
The argument isnt about whether the game is good or not. At least not in this thread.