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So why does a multiplayer-only title need a single player component?

I don't think they do need a singleplayer component. Why should they? Why force them to have one when it doesn't fit the vision of the game? Why take away that development and/or raise the budget if its not what the developers want or that will get much attention from the intended audience? If people want to whine about how they can't play it offline or whatever, then don't buy the game. It's not for you. Big fucking deal.
 

Zaku

Member
And a singleplayer-only game being $60 gets a free pass? Explain to me what makes a SP game get away with being $60 only, but when a MP game does it it's suddenly bad.

A single player-only game's content is always there, and if it's not long enough, that's on the developer.

A multiplayer-only game's content can be lost if the community doesn't reach critical mass and attain a consistent enough population that you can find a game any time.
 

KoopaTheCasual

Junior Member
It's not even the price tag. It's the fact that Titanfall pitched itself as a AAA game, when from a development standpoint, it certainly does not look the part.

If it was pitched exclusively to the hardcore PvP audience, it would meet expectations without SP. However the mass market aren't a bunch of hardcore PvP gamers. When not even half of gamers in general subscribe for only multiplayer, you know you're selling your product to a mainly single player audience. The nature of AAA games is to appeal to the widest audience possible (i.e. the casual consumer/predominantly single player audience).

Titanfall only needed single player to reach it's lofty goals of penetrating the casual market. Simple as that.
 

Tubie

Member
CoD and BF could get rid of single player and still be worth the $60, these are games where people do get their moneys worth in terms of hours per dollar.

I've spent 400 hours on BF4 multiplater, compared to the 15 I spent on Infamous single player. Both had the same retail price.
 

Kill3r7

Member
CoD and BF could get rid of single player and still be worth the $60, these are games where people do get their moneys worth in terms of hours per dollar.

I've spent 400 hours on BF4 multiplater, compared to the 15 I spent on Infamous single player. Both had the same retail price.

This. Due to the campaign save game bug I couldn't save in BF4 and yet it's one of my most played games the on PS4.
 

Solidsoul

Banned
When it's $60.

This is so why.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but i'm pretty sure there was a developer interview or documentary with a Titanfall Dev/Representitive saying that they were able to get a lot done quicker with just multiplayer because single-player was such a huge time sink that people could run through in 6-8 hours and proceed to multiplayer anyways.

I'm definitely paraphrasing because I can't remember the exact line but the point is, the multiplayer never justifys the $60 price, it's that quality campaign that does. At least of course, for me and many others.
 

lyrick

Member
I didn't need a single player experience to enjoy Unreal Tournament or Quake 3 Arena 15 years ago, and I didn't need one for Titanfall either.

Both were full priced games back then too.

ctf-face.jpg

totally worth every cent of $40 [1999 currency]
 
It all depends on the player honestly. I don't believe every game needs some great story or even needs a story at all. But then again I mostly play fighting games the most important thing to me is the multi-player an arcade mode or training mode is all the single player content needed. I have spent more time on Marvel 2 and 3 and other fighting games than any game with a substantial story. After playing through the story once it gets old for me and there is no reason to do so unless there is multiple paths that change the way the story plays out substantially. Most of the time of beating those games I feel I didn't get my money's worth but yet the game with very little single-player content and focuses on multi-player I have gotten my money's worth. It all depends on the player. Does every game need a lot of single-player content? No and same goes for multi-player.
 

Dougald

Member
When it has as much content as Titanfall did. Don't get me wrong I loved the game, but 6v6, a couple of game modes and an awful tacked on MP story was a bit light for full price
 

BokehKing

Banned
Titanfall didn't need a single player component, it needed a horde co-op mode plus alot more meat on the MP bones (could it have killed them to give us a king of the hill mode)

Lack of guns too, I mean come on, everyone just used the assault rifle anyway

Lack of customization ect ect, didn't need a single player, needed more MP rich features

I haven't played a COD campaign since black ops 1, so there is that, you don't - need- single player
 

BeauRoger

Unconfirmed Member
When it's $60.

Terrible argument. When a game is developed with the same amount of resources put in as a "normal" game with SP+MP, but instead focusing all that just on MP, why should they include a SP just because some consumers have a twisted view of what value means? Unless they are falsely advertising it as having SP, there is nothing to complain about.
 

King_Moc

Banned
Depends on the content in the multiplayer game. The complaints against Titanfall I thought were because the multiplayer looked pretty light on maps and features compared to cod. If you don't increase the multiplayer features, expect people to complain when you try charging full price.
 
Based heavily on my real-life circle of friends, so perhaps there is done bias to it, but here is how i see it. There are two big factors I've noticed.

First, in my experience, most people rarely delve deeply into any particular multiplayer mode. Being competitive enough to have fun in multiplayer mode takes more time and effort to do than messing sound for a few hours in a single-player setting. Given a random shooter's multiplayer mode and a modest-length single-player campaign, they get more time out of the single-player.

Second, whatever concept the game depicts that was the driving force behind the game purchase us usually sold to people more effectively through the context of a campaign than that of matches (when possible). Like, when people were first discovering halo, friends didn't pitch the game to each other in terms of what the scifi setting meant for battlefields and weapons, they did it in terms of "master chief is a badass." Story, setting, and thematic content at why the people I'm thinking of buy games to begun with. Dedicated multiplayer playtime is what happens when we have already been sold on game mechanics while in the prices of enjoying other things. Sure, you may reach a point where you roll with the setting and say "i can probably guess how a modern war game will play," but that can easily Co-inside with the point where you no longer care enough about the setting to try the game out. Prior buy games to go on adventures, not find a new sport to practice.
Tl;dr: even games that appear entirely gameplay and competition driven can still be at the mercy of narrative content to some extent.
 
I really don't see what the money has to do with it, other than as part of the value proposition that one is always faced with when making a purchase. I like my single player games, and I like my multiplayer games. I've bought games where I thought I got great value for money, and ones where I thought I got bad value for money. There's been absolutely no correlation between the two - so why put an arbitrary ceiling on how much a multiplayer game can cost?
 

Daouzin

Member
I don't think any player is morally against MP only games, I just think its about player expectations. I'm going to play Smash 4 primarily online in For Glory or offline in 1v1 and 2v2s, but I love the amount of content there is for when I'm by myself and have no access to Internet.

I think both Titanfall and Destiny have an abysmal amount of content, but if people enjoy them and play them for 50+ hours, than apparently I'm wrong and they don't need a SP.
 
I don't get why anyone would think a good multiplayer experience somehow should automatically be less valuable than a good singleplayer experience. I would gladly pay $60 upfront (and TBH I've probably spent more through the online store) to play DOTA 2 if I knew I was going to put over 2K + hours on the game. BF3 and BF2: Bad Company were well worth the price of admission as well. Neither of which needed singleplayer content ( I know I didn't even bother with it. Heck BF3's singleplayer campaign soured me to the game).
 

RedSwirl

Junior Member
Based heavily on my real-life circle of friends, so perhaps there is done bias to it, but here is how i see it. There are two big factors I've noticed.

First, in my experience, most people rarely delve deeply into any particular multiplayer mode. Being competitive enough to have fun in multiplayer mode takes more time and effort to do than messing sound for a few hours in a single-player setting. Given a random shooter's multiplayer mode and a modest-length single-player campaign, they get more time out of the single-player.

This is a big factor for me. I honestly only have room in my life for maybe one or two multiplayer games at a time, which I might play for months or years on end.

Basically, multiplayer games to me don't feel as needed as singleplayer games. My bandwidth for them is much, much smaller. If a game has singleplayer and multiplayer these days I'll almost always do the singleplayer and never touch the multiplayer. I don't touch multiplayer-only games at all because I already have TF2 and NeoTokyo. And if I want something different I can re-install CS:GO or get back on Street Fighter. I haven't even found time for online Smash Bros.
 
The problem with mp only games is that they have to rely on the community to keep them relevant. With a price barrier that becomes more difficult to achieve. With a sp component you will have an scenario of someone buying the game for sp and then move on to mp.
 

thenexus6

Member
Price, but then again having to pay $60 / £40 for a single player only game that takes 4-6 hours to complete with little to no replay value isn't right either. So I think it works both ways.
 

DSix

Banned
This year the only games I paid full price for are games that are heavily multiplayer.

I usually wait patiently on SP games because I know I'm not missing anything. But MP games have the early rush of going in at the same time as everyone else.

I rarely care too much about the SP features of such games (only looking at SSB4, 90% of my playtime is in MP), but it's always nice to have and I do enjoy the additional content when it's well done and relevant to your MP skills.
 

impact

Banned
Price, but then again having to pay $60 / £40 for a single player only game that takes 4-6 hours to complete with little to no replay value isn't right either. So I think it works both ways.

Even if you got 10 hours out of it, a good multiplayer game is gonna give you multiple times that at the very least. If there's no issue with SP only games then there shouldn't be for MP only games. Counter-Strike has shown you don't need a campaign to be the best game of all time.
 
Why does a MP-only title /need/ a single player component? What does a multiplayer-only title lack in comparison to a SP-only title or SP/MP game that makes it so abrasive to most platform owners?

It doesn't, as long as the developer/publisher understands that simply by being MP-only you are automatically a niche product and should market and budget as such.

The majority of market does not play multiplayer. At all. And another huge subset of the market will only play the most casual multiplayer or co-op modes available - ARAM or Bots in LoL, for example. The market for pure multiplayer experiences is a fraction of the total population. By being a multiplayer-only title, you are automatically limiting your potential audience to this relatively small niche.

Conversely, there are very few gamers who won't play SP modes or SP-only games. The MP-only crowd heavily overlaps while the SP-only crowd does not. So it's far more beneficial, financially, to make a SP-only game or a SP title that has a MP component than to make a MP-only game. The best case scenario, for both developers and most players, is to have a co-op multiplayer game (Diablo, Borderlands) that can be played solo. Competitive multiplayer just turns off too many people to wholly sustain AAA development anymore. You almost have to have a SP component or a huge on-ramp (co-op or bots) for everyone else.
 
So, if I'm understanding the point you're trying to make, MP only games aren't worth $60 because they are a new trend and because of servers? I can give you the servers point, because a MP only game is useless when the servers go down, but I don't agree with because they are new they aren't worth the money. Also, I've logged many, many hours into Titanfall and it was extremely, and I mean extremely, rare when the servers were down. That being said, I do think MP only games need to have offline bot lobbies at least for when the servers do go down.

Good for you.

Doesn't really say anything about my comment. Let's say I want to play MAG on the ps3, can I play it? NO.

But all my single players games can still be played even today.
 

Boss Mog

Member
BF4 is a multiplayer game that I bought specifically for the multiplayer but I'm glad the campaign was there. It wasn't earth-shattering or anything but I enjoyed playing though it multiple times unlocking all the achievements and such. It definitely added value to the package for me.
 
Multiplayer-only games don't need singleplayer. They should all include LAN functionality though for when the servers eventually get shut down.

Last generation there were a few MP-only titles that I enjoyed. Warhawk, Battlefield 1943, SOCOM: Confrontation, among others. If a game with only single player can cost $60 then so can a game with only multiplayer.
 
It doesn't, as long as the developer/publisher understands that simply by being MP-only you are automatically a niche product and should market and budget as such.

The majority of market does not play multiplayer. At all. And another huge subset of the market will only play the most casual multiplayer or co-op modes available - ARAM or Bots in LoL, for example. The market for pure multiplayer experiences is a fraction of the total population. By being a multiplayer-only title, you are automatically limiting your potential audience to this relatively small niche.

Conversely, there are very few gamers who won't play SP modes or SP-only games. The MP-only crowd heavily overlaps while the SP-only crowd does not. So it's far more beneficial, financially, to make a SP-only game or a SP title that has a MP component than to make a MP-only game. The best case scenario, for both developers and most players, is to have a co-op multiplayer game (Diablo, Borderlands) that can be played solo. Competitive multiplayer just turns off too many people to wholly sustain AAA development anymore. You almost have to have a SP component or a huge on-ramp (co-op or bots) for everyone else.

niche product? the most popular games in the industry are multiplayer.
 

BigDug13

Member
I didn't need a single player experience to enjoy Unreal Tournament or Quake 3 Arena 15 years ago, and I didn't need one for Titanfall either.

Both were full priced games back then too.

ctf-face.jpg

totally worth every cent of $40 [1999 currency]

Those weren't lobby-based games. You can browse for whatever server you wanted and they could be hosted by just about anyone. Titanfall needs to spin up Azure servers on a case by case basis and so you're left sitting in a lobby waiting for a full enough game to launch. If there are not enough gamers for your game type, you don't get to play it. You can't browse to another low populated server or start your own. You're left helpless.

So it's hardly the same thing because they have removed just about all the tools those old games had for you to find the exact server type, ping, game mode, max player count, population balance, etc.

Once Respawn decides not to run those servers anymore. Your game completely ends.

Also $40 was not the price of all games back then. Console games were $50.
 

Mman235

Member
It doesn't. As others have mentioned however, it's inherently more risky to buy an MP-only game. An SP game is theoretically playable forever (it's not quite that simple, but so far it's held up that if the data is somewhere then someone will get it working), an MP game relies on a playerbase with no guarantee it (or the servers, in Matchmaking's case) will last, and then there are side-issues like badly handled DLC that splits the playerbase, whereas questionable DLC for an SP game still doesn't affect the base game.

The annoying thing is that most modern MP games ignore the ways to mitigate this a lot; half-decent bots, modding support and dedicated servers (which all combine to help ensure a game's life even if the official servers go down) are the kind of things that make the above problems much smaller. CS:GO is a recent game that gets this right, and games like UT1 and Quake 3 were worth full-price because those features ensured they had lifespan even if you never touched the MP.
 

Gestault

Member
To appeal to the sizable part of the population that values single-player experiences, if the title needs those sales to justify its development. For a $60 title, this is especially important.
 

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
So you are saying that every single-player game without an MP mode is worth $60?
If it's open world, then I'd say yes, GTA, Witcher 3, AC etc would be worth $60 without MP modes as they're filled with content, however I would not purchase an SP linear story game for $60.
 

joecanada

Member
Titanfall as a MP only game for $60 was worth every single penny due to the ludicrous hundreds of hours I've put into playing it. That's how I weighed my purchase.

as you should... but i think what many are saying is that isn't worth 60 to them and the series didn't do well overall (its a ghost town now).
so as a business model it is suspect.

but some posters have taken that and replied "so every SP game is worth 60 then?
"
who buys every game?
of course they aren't all worth it. many fail.
 

Dr. Buni

Member
Because a lot of people don't want to play multi all the time? Like, I love Mario Kart 8, but it is been two weeks since I bought it and I have nothing left to do in the game, other than online multiplayer. On other hand, I started playing Sonic & All Star Racing Transformed back in December 2012 and to this day, I still have stuff do play other than multiplayer. So yeah, for me, even multiplayer-focused games need (meaty) single player content.
 
niche product? the most popular games in the industry are multiplayer.

... and all either have a SP, co-op or non-competitive multiplayer component that is enormously more popular than their competitive multiplayer components.

Take the (arguably) most popular "multiplayer" games:

League of Legends - Co-op vs Bots and ARAM are +75% of the players.
World of Warcraft - Solo players are the vast majority of their ~7 mil subs.
Call of Duty - A majority of players never play a single multiplayer match.

The most popular games in the industry have multiplayer. They are not multiplayer-only. Multiplayer-only is absolutely a niche market.
 
It doesn't.

But if the price is going to be $60 it better come with a lot more multiplayer content than you'd get in a game that includes single-player, multiplayer and co-op modes.

My problem with Titanfall's value proposition was that it was still content light and followed the same multiplayer-tax regimen of selling map packs. If Titanfall came with all of its DLC for the original $60 release day asking price than it would have been a much better deal as a multiplayer only game.
 

Astery

Member
mp only games depends on player base, and more often than not they need a running server.

Once players move on to other games/ or just bomba bad, your mp only games will no longer have enough players to be playable.

Or shutting down servers also renders them unplayable.
 

pa22word

Member
Conditioning.

People see lesser value there than they would otherwise, even though it has no fiscal basis as to the budget of the title and they probably will never touch that SP mode in the first place (see: ars tech. CoD stats).
 

RPGam3r

Member
What bothers me is games like Titanfall and Evolve seem primed for great campaigns based on their settings, mechanics and built in bosses that actually fit within the lore.

Then again I'm a campaign gamer so I guess I'm just jealous of the potential.

Edit is it common for people on this forum to have there icon/image changed?
 

system11

Member
I think it's a content issue. In all honesty I think people would be happy to see the single player gutted from games like Battlefield because the multiplaye component (ignoring the server issues) has an abundance of content.

I really like the campaign modes in this type of game - it's good training and a chance to enjoy the environments.
 
Because the ps4 and xbone charge for online. Even the most optimistic estimates only put about half the user base as subscribers to live gold or ps plus.

No singleplayer? There goes half your audience. This is why nearly all games have SOME SP content.

Release yours without any and not only is a big chunk of the base unable to play it, but it also comes off looking half assed because every other game except yours has an SP mode.

PC has been married to the internet so long that PC gamers who don't play online or have a suitable connection are rare as unicorns. Consoles aren't quite there yet and as long as they charge for online probably never will be.
 
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