Zombie James
Banned
So how do LTD sales of the 360 and PS3 look now? Has the gap narrowed or stayed flat?
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Sony Reports Q2 Earnings: Game Division ($379) Million, PS3 2.43 million units
- Thread starter FrankT
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The Faceless Master
Member
that's the same thing i thought...YYZ said:wow, what have I started
yeah, something like (Banned) to confuse the n00bzDunlop said:
lowlylowlycook
Member
Forsete said:
No doubt. If Sony can run a profit this Christmas it's going to be a very long 10 year generation for them.
brain_stew
Member
MidiSurf said:
Its really not. The GCN at least generated a fair amount of profit for Nintendo, the PS3 has not only lost Sony a great deal of market share but also countless of billions of dollars as well. The PS3 can be classed as nothing but a disaster in light of that.
dammitmattt
Banned
road2serfdom said:
Is this part of the joke? Because what you are saying is not true at all.
Why are people not talking about the software sales. Sure, PS3 sales went up, but the overall net was (5 million) units. Even if they made up for it by the higher price of PS3 games, it's still a worrying trend.
Jive Turkey
Unconfirmed Member
Oh shit...What am I supposed to make of this???RJT said:
dammitmattt
Banned
Bust Nak said:
Quarter to quarter.
And now I'm more confused than ever.
dammitmattt said:
Software sales are pretty rollercoastery. They depend on what brand new releases were these from Sony studios during that quarter, and sometimes there just aren't any, or theres some crazy third party games stealing the spotlight. A variation of 10-20% percent year over year is not bad. Sometimes it really drops, sometimes it really climbs... In this case it dropped year over year...
Count Dookkake
Member
cress2000 said:
I was hoping that someone would respond with this. I was nervous that no one would. Thank you.
«þ» said:
1-2 years is peanuts for investors and shareholders. You would be hard pressed to find more than a few companies out there who are doing well in the current economy.
A significant net profit over a decade is a good sign. Especially when you consider this is just one division, not the whole of Sony. And the fact that the division is now in the black is an excellent sign if you look at the other periods when they had negatives, the positives following it were big and numerous.
brain_stew
Member
spwolf said:you sure cant count much... see fingers of your hand, use them
Erm, believe it or not the PS3 has been sucking Sony's finances dry for a lot more than the last quarter, and yes, those losses do add up to several billion.
AndyD said:
A $380 million dollar loss in the last quarter puts them in the black?
dammitmattt
Banned
AndyD said:
This was a drop of 33%, but regardless, it's worrying that the lost PS2 software sales are not being fully replaced by the PS3 software sales.
And seriously, what the hell is up with PSP software sales? It seems to be getting worse and worse as they sell more systems.
AndyD said:
By and large, investors and shareholders do not measure success in time, they measure it in earnings. If a company were to lose 50 billion dollars in 3 months, no one would claim "3 months is a short time, no one cares."
In addition, we know that Microsoft managed to produce a significant profit this last quarter in the E&D division, and we can readily assume that Nintendo is going to triple or perhaps quadruple the net profit of all Sony divisions (214 million this quarter, in total, for Sony. Projections peg Nintendo at 600-800 million).
Sony is being hit the hardest of the big three. This is not good news.
It would be a good sign if the profits were distributed evenly. They are not: they are heavily weighted towards the earliest years in the last decade. Secondly, those deep losses became booming profits because the PS1 and PS2 were the most popular systems of their time. The PS3 is not. Furthermore, the "other periods when they had negatives," as you call them, were never close to this bad. They didn't last this long -- this looks likely to be Sony's third year in a row in the red for the games division -- and 2007 in particular was not only Sony's worst year, but the worst year in the history of the video game industry, for any company.
You aren't looking at this objectively, Andy. This is hardly the end of the world, but today's report is very discouraging news for Sony. Their profits are down massively, they're still bleeding money in their games division, and they still have the smallest marketshare of the current generation systems. I'll repeat this for emphasis: Sony will be fine, and I strongly suspect they will make a profit in the games division next quarter, but spinning today's FR as good news is absurd. It isn't.
Opiate said:
I agree with all you said. I was not saying its positive news, only that its not as bad as it seems or could be. From an investment point of view, they lost billions over the past few years, but a savvy investor will know that Sony is a large and well founded company with its hands in dozens of industries and thus pockets. And some of the R&D is starting to pay off.
I work with a few financial investors for a large company, and while the average Joe screams and cries at the current market rollercoaster, a savy investor looks at it over time. Yes the situation is bad, but its not the end of Sony by any means as some make it out to be. Thats all I was trying to say.
Frankfurter
Member
I said wow, PSPs software sales completely continue to amaze me. "Tie ratio" for the quarter is under 4, that's ridiculous.
Frankfurter said:
Its LTD Tie Ratio is actually not that far away of GBA's Tie Ratio (~3,8 for PSP and ~4,6 for GBA). So, either GBA's software sales were also ridiculously low or the PSP has not that bad software sales (for an handheld). It could (and should) still do better, that's for sure...
Zombie James
Banned
CaptainABAB
Member
http://news.cnet.com/Sonys-quarterl...041_3-6247341.html?tag=newsEditorsPicksArea.0
Many analysts say share prices of top Japanese companies have fallen so far as to defy reason. Not only Sony but many of Japan's best-known brand names--including Toyota, Panasonic, and Bridgestone--have seen their market value drop below their so-called book value, the total worth of their buildings, equipment, and other physical assets.
As of Tuesday, Sony's market value was $21.4 billion, or about 0.58 percent of its book value, according to Paul Migliorato, head of research at NamiNori, a Honolulu-based equity research firm.
Theoretically, that means an investor could buy Sony or Toyota and turn a profit simply by selling off their assets--suggesting that the companies were worse than worthless as business franchises.
"The market is treating Sony and Toyota like pariahs," Migliorato said. "Any sense of reality has been hijacked by momentum and fear."
Many analysts say share prices of top Japanese companies have fallen so far as to defy reason. Not only Sony but many of Japan's best-known brand names--including Toyota, Panasonic, and Bridgestone--have seen their market value drop below their so-called book value, the total worth of their buildings, equipment, and other physical assets.
As of Tuesday, Sony's market value was $21.4 billion, or about 0.58 percent of its book value, according to Paul Migliorato, head of research at NamiNori, a Honolulu-based equity research firm.
Theoretically, that means an investor could buy Sony or Toyota and turn a profit simply by selling off their assets--suggesting that the companies were worse than worthless as business franchises.
"The market is treating Sony and Toyota like pariahs," Migliorato said. "Any sense of reality has been hijacked by momentum and fear."
dammitmattt
Banned
Brimstone said:
Same with Microsoft, too, right? Though last I remember, they were trying to actually spend that cash instead of swimming in it like Apple.
laserbeam said:
It doesn't work that way. As soon as you start picking up the shares, the price skyrockets... and the fewer there are left the higher the price.
A few American companies were in this situation a few weeks ago as well. Which is why Buffet advised young people with money to invest (young as in not retiring in 5-10 years).
That is mindboggling. I thought Toyota was the #1 car manufacturer, having surpassed GM, what's going on...
dammitmattt said:
At one point in the last year or so they had about $50 billion in cash reserves. With that said they have bought back a lot of stock as well announcing another $40 billion buy-back last month again.
Opiate said:
It would take a lot longer than 2 to 3 years at that rate to happen. They'll be lucky to see it happen before the next gen begins. We also know per sales that the 360 sold more in NA during the quarter and I'm pretty sure in Japan the differences over the quarter were negligible. I also highly doubt the EU made up for that much of a difference during the time frame especially when we know from ChartTrack 360 had a boost while the PS3 sales fell post price cut. Reasonably speaking, Sony could have very well pushed retail well before the holiday season actually takes off. Considering this is shipped to retail that really wouldn't have been a bad idea with how the currency rates started to fall in September. Q4 should be quite telling this year.
The Faceless Master
Member
yeah, but it's a NeoGAF thread title, not a financial statement.Onix said:
road2serfdom
Banned
dammitmattt said:
Yes, it is a joke, thought I am not sure if people got it based on some of the replies. Obviously ((or so I thougth)) a company cannot make profit in Japan measured in yen and have that be a loss simply by coverting yen to dollars.
You can't convert a positive number into another currency and have it not be posititve. Yet the dollar conversion was in parenthesis in the news article proving the numbers in parenthesis do automatically and clearly mean "negative" in business publications.
leroy hacker
Member
They were making a big push to expand into the pickup market just when gas prices started going crazy and cratered the sector.AndyD said:
lowlylowlycook
Member
leroy hacker said:
Even more to the point the car industry had massive oversupply problems even before the start of what is surely a world wide recession.
oldergamer
Member
Opiate said:
so 230k. Saying it as .23 million seems silly. Imho It's not going to happen at all at that rate. That amount is easily erased after the holiday shopping period. and shipped versus sold is a pretty tough argument to make. MS wouldn't need to ship as many units if the channel had a decent supply.
Zombie James
Banned
Karma said:
That's assuming both companies will continue to support their systems at the same rate until that period.