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Vegan community thread - Give Peas a Chance

Out of curiousity, does anyone here struggle with eating leafy greens?

Everything I have ever tried to eat tastes bitter or like grass so I end up gagging every time. Its really difficult for me to eat anything thats a leafy green of any kind although I know I need to for nutrients.

I never know what to do to change this or make it easier on my system :(
 

dude

dude
Actually there is a building trend in plant science to view plants as more sentient than we initially thought.

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2013/12/23/131223fa_fact_pollan
http://www.plantbehavior.org/neuro.html
http://www.naturalhistorymag.com/features/062208/do-plants-have-brains

Also, is "cruelty free" really necessary in the title? It comes off as a bit hostile towards non-vegans.

Really? I never intended it as hostile. If it bothers people I can ask a mod to edit it to something else.

Out of curiousity, does anyone here struggle with eating leafy greens?

Everything I have ever tried to eat tastes bitter or like grass so I end up gagging every time. Its really difficult for me to eat anything thats a leafy green of any kind although I know I need to for nutrients.

I never know what to do to change this or make it easier on my system :(

Try slightly frying spinach in a small amount of olive oil. You can then put it in a salad or wherever. It's delicious.
 
Out of curiousity, does anyone here struggle with eating leafy greens?

Everything I have ever tried to eat tastes bitter or like grass so I end up gagging every time. Its really difficult for me to eat anything thats a leafy green of any kind although I know I need to for nutrients.

I never know what to do to change this or make it easier on my system :(

Do you like spinach? I find it doesn't have a very strong flavour at all.

Damn beaten.
 
Question that apparently I had to answer for myself because people get touchy here: there was a scientific article saying that but there's also a lot of material saying that is false because feeding the animal consumes in theory more grain than actually consuming the grain.

You say "in theory" as if it's some sort of conjecture or unproven assertion. It takes an order of magnitude more grain to raise the same amount of animals for food.
 

nynt9

Member
Really? I never intended it as hostile. If it bothers people I can ask a mod to edit it to something else.

Maybe it's just me, but it gives off a moral high horse vibe, implying non-vegans are cruel. It's not a really great starting point to have a discussion imo.
 
Maybe it's just me, but it gives off a moral high horse vibe, implying non-vegans are cruel. It's not a really great starting point to have a discussion imo.

Well if we're gonna get into, I think eating meat is cruel. Actually I don't think the act of eating meat is cruel, personally if you go out and hunt your own meat, kill it etc and eat it fine. I think the meat industry is cruel and wasteful.

On a lighter note, apparently this stuff has made it to the UK, I checked out the ingredients and

biscoffspreadcreamynutrition2014.jpg
 

dude

dude
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_perception_(physiology)

Read: Plant Intelligence.

Not saying it's true that plants = animals, but I feel that you're being dismissive of a legitimate question.

Plants are not sentient. Even if they do possess something that can be described as intelligence, it is vastly different than the way we and other sentient animals possess it. We know plants do not possess the capacity to feel pain or suffering as we and other sentient animals do. I don't think "cruelty" is the right word to use here.
 
Really? I never intended it as hostile. If it bothers people I can ask a mod to edit it to something else.



Try slightly frying spinach in a small amount of olive oil. You can then put it in a salad or wherever. It's delicious.

How can you tell its done? I like spinach in small doses but I've never tried it fried so maybe that'll work.

But won't that also diminish the nutritional value?
 
Would any vegans eat oysters? They have no central nervous system right? I personally wouldn't because they look fucking disgusting.

How can you tell its done? I like spinach in small doses but I've never tried it fried so maybe that'll work.

But won't that also diminish the nutritional value?

If it's warm, it's 'done' it takes seconds to cook. I love it in curry.

At my old uni they would do a hummus, tomato and spinach toasted sandwich and it was heavenly.
 

EmiPrime

Member
Would any vegans eat oysters? They have no central nervous system right? I personally wouldn't because they look fucking disgusting.

Never had any desire to.

If anyone likes to order groceries online, Ocado now stock Fry's and a limited selection of VBites/Redwood stuff.
 

Octavia

Unconfirmed Member
I'm vegan. I'm not out to save the world or anything. I just do it to make myself feel better and I obviously cheat since I own a cat and don't subject it to veganism (thus, I buy wet canned cat food).

My diet is still nearly the same as before, I just buy all the substitute foods. What I've been enjoying is making my own pizzas. I buy the vegan pepperoni from walmart, Yves is the brand I think. Then Daiya mozz shreds, and make my own crust and sauce. I still make stuffed crust, either with a sauce variety or just the classic cheesy crust.

Honestly, the hardest part is it's hard to eat out anymore. You've got subway, pizza places that don't use butter/eggs/milk in their dough, and any place that serves fries.
 

dude

dude
How can you tell its done? I like spinach in small doses but I've never tried it fried so maybe that'll work.

But won't that also diminish the nutritional value?

I actually read somewhere that heating the spinach will make it better for humans to digest... If you're worried about it, you can also steam it.

You can tell it's done when the spinach turns darker and the leaves decrease in size a bit.
 

iirate

Member
No honey? Cruelty to bees? Farm bees have it p good IMO.

This is arguably a separate issue from most vegan issues. Domestication of bees can be good to bees on an individual level, but we're approaching a very real food crisis because bees aren't pollinating food on the level we need them to, and some of theories as to why point towards our domestication of them.

Some vegans consume honey and some don't - I tend to think of it as a separate issue.

Would any vegans eat oysters? They have no central nervous system right? I personally wouldn't because they look fucking disgusting.

At my old uni they would do a hummus, tomato and spinach toasted sandwich and it was heavenly.

I personally consider them a vegan food, at least from an ethical perspective. I'd try them, but I don't like most seafood.
 
No farmworkers cruelty, only peas now.

You could have framed that title better op.

This. Interested to see what culinary awesomeness comes out of this thread when people aren't arguing about philosophical quandaries, but the title certainly doesn't help. I have no problem with vegans, but there was no cruelty involved with the burgers I cooked last night.
 

dude

dude
Honey is the subject of an internal debate in the Vegan community, which also relate to insect food (and from that to stuff like oysters.)
Veganism is not a religion, there are no strict rules rules, and really anyone should do what feels right by them.

This. Interested to see what culinary awesomeness comes out of this thread when people aren't arguing about philosophical quandaries, but the title certainly doesn't help. I have no problem with vegans, but there was no cruelty involved with the burgers I cooked last night.

To clarify, the title didn't mean to insult non-vegans, but considering most vegans chose this lifestyle to reduce cruelty, I though it was a fitting title. If it offends people or distracts from the point of the thread I'd gladly PM a mod to change it.
Also, I addressed the issue of farm workers in an earlier post in this thread.
 

Famassu

Member
Well, for example, soy is one of the most popular ways of replacing protein from one's diet (though far from the only one) but soy is also used to feed animals. The thing is, it would be much better if that soy went directly to humans instead of the inefficient animal meat production chain, where most of it is used by the animals' metabolism & released as heat and such and never gets to humans. Currently, it's estimated that well over 50% (I've read estimates as high as ~70%) of arable land is used for grazing and producing food to livestock. If all cattle etc. just died overnight, we'd simply have a huge surplus of food that could feed all of mankind and then some (though, of course not all of that is necessarily fit for human consumption).

I haven't checked too many sources for this, so someone may correct me if these are just vegan propaganda, but producing 1kg of beef for human consumption requires, like, 40x more land than producing 1kg of soy for human consumption. Producing beef also uses 20x times more water than soy production (causing water depletion, desertification and destruction of arable land) and causes a lot more CO2 omissions (which can, indirectly, affect the amount of arable land & food production capacity in the long run through simple phenomena like climate change).

When a person stops eating meat, it means that he/she uses, at best (for some vegetarian/vegan foods), as much as 45x less land for producing his/her animal protein replacing products. If everyone needs that much SMALLER land areas for their food production, how would it ever turn out that you'd actually be using more land? I mean, if you just keep putting -40, -40, -40, -40, -40, -40, -40, -40 of land use etc. etc. for every person who switches eating 1kg of beef to 1kg of soy, I personally don't understand what kind of math would EVER make the sum of that positive (as in, how it would ever lead to veganism being more destructive for the environment than eating meat).

People should already be eating a lot of vegetables so it's not like that would need to change too much or cause huge environmental problems even if the amount of vegetables consumed would increase a ton, not when compared to producing meat + a lot of vegetables already go to waste because not enough people buy them, so maybe the amount of vegetables going to waste would decrease and as such we'd be using land more efficiently.

Vegans & vegetarians will just mostly be replacing the protein intake lost from animal products by plant kingdom products (and might have to increase their spinach eating for dat iron etc.). Otherwise their diets remain mostly the same. So if producing that protein takes way, waaaaaaay less land, in what scenario would the amount of arable land required to feed humans actually increase instead of decreasing a hell of a lot?


If visuals help. Imagine this is the amount of land that goes to meat production

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this would be the amount of land that goes to producing the meat-replacing amount of soy directly to a human

||

For every human that goes from eating beef to eating soy, the food production effect would go from the upper situation of needing a fuckton of land to only needing the "||" amount of land.

Another bad thing about meat production is... a lot or even most of it goes to waste. Some is thrown away already in farms to artificially keep up the price of meat, a lot goes to waste in stores as they can't sell a lot of the meat before it can't be sold anymore and quite a lot goes to waste in the homes of meat-eating people when people buy more meat than they eat and have to throw rotten/spoiled meat out of their fridges.
 

EmiPrime

Member
Generally speaking though a vegan restaurant or cook book will not feature honey nor oysters as the vast majority of vegans don't eat these things.
 
In regards to easy ways to get more straight up vegetables, I like sesame spinach. Boil the spinach (not too much or it just turns to mush, you'll know when it's done), cover it in sesame oil and seeds if you have them, and refrigerate it for half an hour to cool it down. It's easy and good. You don't have to cool it down, but it tastes better that way to me.
 
This. Interested to see what culinary awesomeness comes out of this thread when people aren't arguing about philosophical quandaries, but the title certainly doesn't help. I have no problem with vegans, but there was no cruelty involved with the burgers I cooked last night.

Lmao thought the same thing. I've tried a few vegan dishes but did not like them, would be interested in checking this thread out and the OP looks great but "cruelty free"? C'mon.
 

nynt9

Member
In case anyone here is also into metal:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeZlih4DDNg

To clarify, the title didn't mean to insult non-vegans, but considering most vegans chose this lifestyle to reduce cruelty, I though it was a fitting title. If it offends people or distracts from the point of the thread I'd gladly PM a mod to change it.
Also, I addressed the issue of farm workers in an earlier post in this thread.

Maybe it's because my social circle has a lot of Indian people in it, but I know a lot of people who are vegan due to religious reasons. Also I know some people who eat vegan for health reasons - I know a dairy intolerant friend and she just eats vegan when she eats outside so she can guarantee the foods won't contain dairy. I think those two, coupled with the fact that several people other than me have also taken issue with the thread title makes a good case for the title being sub-optimal.
 

EmiPrime

Member
You folks are really reaching to act like you're that bothered by what came off to me as a jokey title.

Somehow I've never tried it! I've only eaten them in restaurants.

Vegan topics inevitably get derailed with non-vegans getting precious over something related to morals, starting pointless debates about plant sentience and oh so funny posts about bacon. It is known.
 
There's this branch of bakers in Liverpool called "Pound Bakery" that do these veggie sausage rolls that are easily the better than most of the big bakeries meaty sausage rolls. That's probably the nicest veggie food I ever tried, I tried this veggie burger once, it was a grey patty and it tasted awful. Does anybody know what would have been in that?
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Vegan topics inevitably get derailed with non-vegans getting precious over something related to morals, starting pointless debates about plant sentience and oh so funny posts about bacon. It is known.

Pretty much this.

I do not think that Veganism is a good idea, and I typically would have just avoided a thread like this, but the title god me interested in taking a peak inside because I expected to the OP to be written in a very arrogant and holier-than-thou way, and I was hoping to get a chuckle from reading it. I leave somewhat disappointed.
 

nynt9

Member
Vegan topics inevitably get derailed with non-vegans getting precious over something related to morals, starting pointless debates about plant sentience and oh so funny posts about bacon. It is known.

Maybe these pointless arguments could have been completely avoided had the thread title not been provocative to begin with, no? Which was my point in the first post where I mentioned this. I'm not vegan but I'd much rather discuss vegan recipes and whatnot but I was sure people would take offense to the title, which would cause the thread to derail and they did indeed.

No need to make this an "us versus them" thing. Being inclusionary is great imo. Being hostile isn't.
 
Maybe these pointless arguments could have been completely avoided had the thread title not been provocative to begin with, no? Which was my point in the first post where I mentioned this. I'm not vegan but I'd much rather discuss vegan recipes and whatnot but I was sure people would take offense to the title, which would cause the thread to derail and they did indeed.

No need to make this an "us versus them" thing. Being inclusionary is great imo. Being hostile isn't.
It's not hostile in any way, though. It's cruelty free.
 

EmiPrime

Member
Maybe these pointless arguments could have been completely avoided had the thread title not been provocative to begin with, no? Which was my point in the first post where I mentioned this. I'm not vegan but I'd much rather discuss vegan recipes and whatnot but I was sure people would take offense to the title, which would cause the thread to derail and they did indeed.

No need to make this an "us versus them" thing. Being inclusionary is great imo. Being hostile isn't.

If the title was "Ethical Dining" instead I bet you would still take umbrage with it. If not that then any discussion of ethics in the topic itself.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Too bad then?

Great attitude to have. Anyway, I'll do my part and stop helping the derail.

Truly oppressed.

You obviously do not get it. Even if you think you're right with the cruelty statement, all it does is challenge people who think differently to come in and debate. You're also going to inevitably get a lot of trolls. Steadfast vegans will fight back, things will likely get really nasty, and the thread will probably get locked and some people banned.

Is that what you'd like to happen to the official Vegan thread that's supposed to be educating and helping people who choose to take this path?
 

nynt9

Member
If the title was "Ethical Dining" instead I bet you would still take umbrage with it. If not that then any discussion of ethics in the topic itself.

I don't personally care, I just foresaw that the thread would be derailed by people unhappy with the title. Also, see my post above, I know more health/religious vegans than moral vegans which is why the title was weird to me.

Oh well, title changed, let's move on.

I have a question related to health veganism. What's the best way to go about finding out if a restaurant offers vegan options if their website doesn't state nutritonal information and you can't be sure if certain dishes contain animal products?
 

dude

dude
I don't personally care, I just foresaw that the thread would be derailed by people unhappy with the title. Also, see my post above, I know more health/religious vegans than moral vegans which is why the title was weird to me.

Oh well, title changed, let's move on.

I have a question related to health veganism. What's the best way to go about finding out if a restaurant offers vegan options if their website doesn't state nutritonal information and you can't be sure if certain dishes contain animal products?

Here in Israel we have a great initiative called "Vegan-Friendly" which basically lists all vegan friendly places in one websites and put stickers on vegan friendly places. Their guideline, I think, is a minimum of 4 dishes and 1 dessert. We also have an app called "GoVegan" which lists the nearest vegan dishes to you.
Don't know what I would have done without the great local vegan community :)

I'm guessing the best way to go about it is call them and ask... Say you're allergic so that they will take you seriously.
 

EmiPrime

Member
I don't personally care, I just foresaw that the thread would be derailed by people unhappy with the title. Also, see my post above, I know more health/religious vegans than moral vegans which is why the title was weird to me.

Oh well, title changed, let's move on.

I have a question related to health veganism. What's the best way to go about finding out if a restaurant offers vegan options if their website doesn't state nutritonal information and you can't be sure if certain dishes contain animal products?

No such thing really as a "health" vegan. Either you abstain from all animal products (clothes, shoes, cosmetics as well as food) or you're not a vegan.

As for restaurants, phone and email ahead of time.
 
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