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[Nugg]

I have no idea what I'm looking at, but I'm excited. Is this what's going to give me 240 fps?

 

[Eideka]

50% less FLOPS. 50% less ROPS.

It's pretty pathetic.

Sony's first party output should destroy whatever MS studios will come up with at this point.

But I can't understand why MS would let Sony have such an edge.

 

[szaromir]

No, I am suggesting that even the official specs provided to devs are filtered through marketing. It certainly wouldn't be the first time for MS.

So what were the previous incidents?

Its weaker, 50% less FLOPS and half the # of ROPS.

50% less FLOPS. 50% less ROPS.

It's pretty pathetic.

Don't use numbers if you don't understand arithmetics.

 

[Spongebob]

I'm willing to bet that the special sauce was just misinterpretation of stuff that although new relative to the 360 GPU, is completely standard for any modern GPU.

That's exactly what I'm thinking now as well.

Aegies was saying stuff about depth/colour which would fit into what we know now, that they were just ROPs.

 

[Tek]

Needs more secret sauce

 

[Opus Angelorum]

ROPs?

Render Output Units.

 

[Mpl90]

No stop it

But...but I wanted easy-to-comprehend comparisons!

Seriously, what's the opinion right now?

 

[Kimawolf]

So next Gen is looking like Wii U, then Durango being what.. 5 times as powerful as Wii U, with PS4 being about 2 to 3 times as powerful as Durango? A simplified power amount to be sure but one that's easy to understand.

So was IGN's original leak of Durango being about 5 to 6 times the Wii U accurate then?

And does this finally put to rest the world destroying rumors of the next gen systems? Can we have more real life expectations now please?

 

[snoopeasystreet]

Explain this in Harry Potter power levels

Orbis: Harry
Durango: Ron
Wii U: Dudley

 

[Plinko]

Sony's first party output should destroy whatever MS studios will come up with at this point.

But I can't understand why MS would let Sony have such an edge.

Affordable launch price. It has to be.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Explain this in Harry Potter power levels

PS4 = Hermione Granger

Xbox 3 = Ron Weasley

 

[Auto_aim1]

3 pages, lot of info:

Antialiasing

The Durango GPU supports 2x, 4x, and 8x MSAA levels. It also implements a modified type of MSAA known as compressed AA. Compressed AA decouples two notions of sample:

Coverage sample–One of several screenspace positions generated by rasterization of one pixel
Surface sample– One of several entries representing a single pixel in a color or depth/stencil surface


Traditionally, coverage samples and surface samples match up one to one. In standard 4xMSAA, for example, a triangle may cover from zero to four samples of any given pixel, and a depth and a color are recorded for each covered sample.

Under compressed AA, there can be more coverage samples than surface samples. In other words, a triangle may still cover several screenspace locations per pixel, but the GPU does not allocate enough render target space to store a unique depth and color for each location. Hardware logic determines how to combine data from multiple coverage samples. In areas of the screen with extensive subpixel detail, this data reduction process is lossy, but the errors are generally unobjectionable. Compressed AA combines most of the quality benefits of high MSAA levels with the relaxed space requirements of lower MSAA levels.

 

[Can Crusher]

So 16 rops means it's even worse than people were expecting?

 

[Projectjustice]

Yea I knew it wasnt going to be super powerful as some gaffers here were hoping for. Nice specs and its going to have some great looking games. For those that expected the same leap as last gen need to move on from this already.

 

[Globox_82]

Those "pixel clear rate" and "pixel hierarchical z cull rate" figures are certainly a novel way to market features that have been standard in GPUs for a while.

The "pixel emit/resolve rate" clearly points to 4 RBEs / 16 ROPs.


16 ROPs

what is it and how many has rumored Orbis gpu?

EDIT:nevermind

 

[iMax]

Did the article state outright that this is the GPU running in the best-case scenario with theoretical maximum capabilities, and that real stats will most likely be lower?

Sony, I come to thee.

Surely the same goes for Orbis?

 

[Durante]

I didn't look in detail, but the additional pages seem to mostly describe the GCN architecture as we know it.

 

[i-Lo]

The triangle set up is identical to Orbis' GPU. Proelite say it would have been better. albeit by a small margin.

Any way, the specs look adequate for next generation. One question: Can anyone identify what was the "secret sauce"?

 

[Hoo-doo]

Sony's first party output should destroy whatever MS studios will come up with at this point.

But I can't understand why MS would let Sony have such an edge.

Maybe MS isn't interested in pushing the envelope on hardware anymore, just on services and living room entertainment. That's where all the money is coming from it seems.

It might also mean that they could launch at a significantly lower pricepoint, right?

 

[EMT0]

Orbis: Harry
Durango: Ron
Wii U: Dudley

More like

Orbis: Mad Eye
Durango: Ron
Wii U: Seamus

 

[Moral Panic]

That bandwidth urghhhhh

 

[Opus Angelorum]

Not as good as Orbis (on paper) but should be cheaper to produce.

Personally I want a good balance of performance and price.

 

[charsace]

Why did people vote for this?

 

[Mr YuYu]

Surely the same goes for Orbis?

My guess would be a yes.

 

[iMax]

The triangle set up is identical to Orbis' GPU. Proelite say it would have been better. albeit by a small margin.

Any way, the specs look adequate for next generation. One question: Can anyone identify what was the "secret sauce"?

I guess it's still the Move engine. Either that, or it's totally non-existent.

 

[Derrick01]

Sony's first party output should destroy whatever MS studios will come up with at this point.

But I can't understand why MS would let Sony have such an edge.

They're banking on the ps2/wii formula I guess. Seems like they really did lose their edge this gen. Assuming these numbers are true at least.

 

[odhiex]

Shut up and take my ROPs..

 

[sangreal]

1.2 is 33% less than 1.8. 1.8 is 50% more than 1.2

 

[Plinko]

Not as good as Orbis (on paper) but should be cheaper to produce.

Personally I want a good balance of performance and price.

Agreed. I have a feeling that if there is a $100 price difference between these at launch Sony will be in real trouble.

 

[Thug Waffle]

Can someone put the Durango vs. Orbis GPU comparison into, like, uber-layman's terms? These numbers and many of the terms mean very little to me because I don't understand the implications.

Just trying to make an educated decision, is all.

 

[grimshawish]

We don't need Dragonball Z or any other silly comparisons:

Orbis > Durango

Just how it is.

Agreed. I have a feeling that if there is a $100 price difference between these at launch Sony will be in real trouble.

$100? Nothing really indicates this. Orbis could be more expensive but this depends on a lot of unknown factors.

 

[Eideka]

Maybe MS isn't interested in pushing the envelope on hardware anymore, just on services and living room entertainment. That's where all the money is coming from it seems.

It might also mean that they could launch at a significantly lower pricepoint, right?

Unless their new controller is extremely expensive, yes that means something like 399€ at launch.

 

[shinra-bansho]

I didn't look in detail, but the additional pages seem to mostly describe the GCN architecture as we know it.

From a quick browse of B3D, Microsoft has simply renamed things in their documentation to create a delicious condiment?

 

[liquidboy]

3 pages of info, read the other 2 people before stupidly commenting

 

[Interfectum]

Agreed. I have a feeling that if there is a $100 price difference between these at launch Sony will be in real trouble.

Uh there won't be. You're forgetting Kinect. Just because MS is cutting back on the hardware power doesn't mean the package as a whole isn't still going to be expensive.

 

[i-Lo]

I didn't look in detail, but the additional pages seem to mostly describe the GCN architecture as we know it.

So what happened with them integrating GCN2?

I guess it's still the Move engine. Either that, or it's totally non-existent.

Thank you.

 

[goomba]

Doesn't WiiU also have 16 ROPS's ?

 

[TheGuardian]

3 pages, lot of info:

EQAA

 

[Spongebob]

Doesn't WiiU also have 16 ROPS's ?

Pretty sure that we don't know that yet.

 

[Kimawolf]

Why are folks complaining? Am I wrong or aren't those specs still a big step up from the Xbox 360? If you expected it to blow PC gaming out the water, or believed the "Avatar Graphics" nonsense, then it was your own fault. And seeing what it accomplished late in it's life it seems like it was a good idea to release a system that won't break the bank but still output good stuff. As it's always been, you want to push the envelope graphics wise, build a PC and download some of those high end mods for games.

 

[Man-is-Obsolete]

Affordable launch price. It has to be.

Or trying to match PS4 in price while at the same time packaging a Kinect 2.0 into every box and cable box features.

 

[systemfehler]

What a revelation 720 CUs are exactly the same as GCN CUs. The article is a rather superficial explaination of how current AMD GPUs work and what they consist of garnished by some numbers floating around the internet.

 

[AdventureRacing]

Not as good as Orbis (on paper) but should be cheaper to produce.

Personally I want a good balance of performance and price.

With how long generations are going on now i'd rather pay a premium and get a more powerful console. I'm not saying i want a repeat of the PS3 situation but in general i'm not worried about having to pay a decent amount for a new console.

 

[Into]

You will still have great looking Durango games, but the real interesting things will be how multiplatform games will look if the Orbis is really this much more powerful. Will 3rd parties really push that console or will we just see similar looking games but performance will be significantly better, 720 and 30 fps on Durango vs 1080p and 60 fps on Orbis. The other interesting part will be the price of these consoles, Sony will most likely again end up with the most expensive console, tough we will see.

That is assuming the Orbis is really that much more powerful

 

[neptunes]

Or trying to match PS4 in price while at the same time packaging a Kinect 2.0 into every box and cable box features.

How could they match the PS4 in price when they don't even know or could even guess the final MSRP?

 

[UrbanRats]

I hope they won't hold back muliplatform titles too much.

 

[NightAntilli]

It really seems as if there's gonna be a bandwith bottleneck due to the RAM...

 

[Plinko]

Uh there won't be. You're forgetting Kinect. Just because MS is cutting back on the hardware power doesn't mean the package as a whole isn't still going to be expensive.

Do we know:
A) how much Kinect costs

And

B) if it will be in every box?

 

[shinra-bansho]

Why are folks complaining?

I think people have been expecting "secret sauce." There may still be some in the bottle, I guess, but I don't think this points to it.

 

[Pagusas]

Antialiasing

The Durango GPU supports 2x, 4x, and 8x MSAA levels. It also implements a modified type of MSAA known as compressed AA. Compressed AA decouples two notions of sample:

Coverage sample–One of several screenspace positions generated by rasterization of one pixel
Surface sample– One of several entries representing a single pixel in a color or depth/stencil surface


Traditionally, coverage samples and surface samples match up one to one. In standard 4xMSAA, for example, a triangle may cover from zero to four samples of any given pixel, and a depth and a color are recorded for each covered sample.

Under compressed AA, there can be more coverage samples than surface samples. In other words, a triangle may still cover several screenspace locations per pixel, but the GPU does not allocate enough render target space to store a unique depth and color for each location. Hardware logic determines how to combine data from multiple coverage samples. In areas of the screen with extensive subpixel detail, this data reduction process is lossy, but the errors are generally unobjectionable. Compressed AA combines most of the quality benefits of high MSAA levels with the relaxed space requirements of lower MSAA levels.

Compressed MSAA, I guess this solves the problem of how they were going to make 4xMSAA work into the ESRAM