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[Fredrik]

For Wii fans i can see it - for PS3/360 fans? i doubt they'll give a shit.

Why is that? I'm the latter and I'm planning on getting WiiU day one, just like I did with the Wii even though I loved the 360. It's something new and original, and you can get Uncharted 3 visuals from it, why exactly wouldn't you "give a shit" about that??

 

[Durante]

The one thing I find interesting about the WiiU situation. It's RAM amount is going to be about as close to Fusion as it is to the 360. Top end for a console launching in 2013 would be 3 gigs split pool if they aren't breaking the bank and 6 gig top end if they are. The largest I could see unified being if they are willing to waste the money is 4 gigs, but that still might be too pricey for a console that needs to launch at $500 maximum.

You can get 3GB of fast GDDR5 on GPUs (with nice profit margins) for $400 shipped right now.

Vita is not cutting edge. It´s made of off shelf components.

I'm tired of reading stuff like this. Vita, at its launch, was faster than any other portable device (at any price) out there. If that's not cutting edge, then what is? (Hint: consoles will certainly not be nearly as fast as a high end stationary device at their release)

If it would be "easy" we wouldn't have crappy PC ports anymore now wouldn't we.

Even crappy PC ports let you set the resolution. On a platform fast enough to do it and any remotely sane game engine it's changing two variables.

 

[Krev]

What most people in this thread seem to be missing is that the online setup and services are far more important than visuals in this day and age. Nintendo will have to execute near flawlessly in that area if they really intend to capture the core market.

This is the big question mark. Nintendo have to completely change their mentality in this area if they're serious about competing.

 

[frostbyte]

What most people in this thread seem to be missing is that the online setup and services are far more important than visuals in this day and age. Nintendo will have to execute near flawlessly in that area if they really intend to capture the core market.

Yep, I honestly think power is going to become a secondary concern due to diminishing returns and the general public not seeing an enormous difference between the 3 consoles. It's going to be a battle of services and which one is the most consumer friendly and functional. Nintendo not only has to catch up to Sony and Microsoft but also provide something that can attract the core userbase from their Gamerscore/Trophies. They'll honestly have to have some kind of unique social function on Nintendo Network that only they have (some people guessed streaming of your game to your friends' uPad in the Wii U spec thread?) to really pull people away from their already established social network in Xbox Live/SEN.

 

[Shadow of the BEAST]

Why is that? I'm the latter and I'm planning on getting WiiU day one, just like I did with the Wii even though I loved the 360. It's something new and original, and you can get Uncharted 3 visuals from it, why exactly wouldn't you "give a shit" about that??

chances youll see uncharted 3 graphics on a system like that is slim.

Just like you did not see many games with graphics comparable to resident evil 4 on wii. Even though wii is clearly superior to gc.

games like uncharted 3 or resident evil 4 are made with huge budgets and some of the most talented people around.

I suspect those people would rather work on real next gen consoles.

 

[IrishNinja]

the rumour is $200 base unit, $120 controller and a $299 "pack" - i'm pretty sure that is reasonable.

this is the first rumor i havent seen elsewhere on GAF...where is this coming from? i can get behind a $300 launch, but the allocation to the controller is interesting.

Good enough for me. I'm still playing and enjoying Wii titles.

pretty sure that's scientifically impossible, bro
might wanna stop lying about your games 4 babiez now

a generational leap starts somewhere around 8x.

my favorite metrics are always created on the spot.

What happened to most of us (the old guys)?

my mom says we all go to a big farm somewhere, and there's lots of games to play and no one fights!

 

[z0m3le]

It would be way more apt to compare first year sales of Xbox 360 to those of PS2, and it did struggle, even in its strongest territory. By the time Wii arrived, most developers have already abandoned PS2 and the focus was shifted onto the new generation. Wii U is going to be the one fighting the uphill battle this time around.

The PS2 was console king though, 360 and PS3 share almost all of their games and neither really has a large hold on the market, people also had only had the PS2 for 5 years when the 360 released, it's been 7 for the 360, that is a big difference. Plus this was also a big generation for multiple platforms, so Wii U will likely sell well for a large number of reasons, as long as the price is under 400, and the games are there at launch.

What most people in this thread seem to be missing is that the online setup and services are far more important than visuals in this day and age. Nintendo will have to execute near flawlessly in that area if they really intend to capture the core market.

This is actually the one place where Wii U should excell, people would actually use the Upad to post on tweeter and facebook, used for netflix and youtube, and it would also be a powerful browser with something like opera (the original DS browser was opera wasn't it?) With stuff like NFC for purchases being in the controller, and the tablet being a window for game purchases, I really think Wii U has a very compelling sales pitch when it comes to those things. As long as NN can actually match up well with Sony, they will do fine.

 

[Medalion]

So its less a matter of capability but laziness

Even if Wii U was packing itd still would have lazy devs of games

Bot every powerful console has games that take close to max their potential, even late in their
Ife cycles

 

[manzo]

Basically things are turning out as I thought. All the "extra" power that WiiU has against current gen are going into streaming data to the controller.

720p on the main screen and 480p on the controller. I think Nintendo went the route that make sure games are PS3 level on the main screen and add enough power that the controller screen doesn't hinder it.

 

[guek]

chances youll see uncharted 3 graphics on a system like that is slim.

Just like you did not see many games with graphics comparable to resident evil 4 on wii. Even though wii is clearly superior to gc.

games like uncharted 3 or resident evil 4 are made with huge budgets and some of the most talented people around.

I suspect those people would rather work on next consoles.

I actually played RE4:Wii Edition last weekend. It...doesn't hold up as well as I thought it would, and I friggin love that game. I think there are 1st party Wii games that look definitively better.

Besides, I suspect the likes of Retro and Monolithsoft will outperform any console game this gen if the hardware is at all capable of pulling it off.

There's also the (frankly laughable) possibility that that speculation piece that came out the other day will end up being true and MS wont put out a true xbox successor until 2014/15

 

[Fredrik]

It would be way more apt to compare first year sales of Xbox 360 to those of PS2, and it did struggle, even in its strongest territory. By the time Wii arrived, most developers have already abandoned PS2 and the focus was shifted onto the new generation. Wii U is going to be the one fighting the uphill battle this time around.

That's because the 360 had nothing special except more power. That ain't selling, that's what I've been saying all along. And it's even worse now when everybody will run the same resolution and they all can handle Uncharted 3 type of graphics, which in my opinion is good enough.
So as far as I see it it's the tablet that will sell the WiiU. And WiiU should really be like the Wii in that sense - in that it has about the same power as current gen but comes with a new interface. Plus, it's still holding on to it's poular Wii roots with the compatibility with the Wii remote etc. I just don't see why it should have to struggle if the price is right and third party devs are aboard.

 

[NBtoaster]

So its less a matter of capability but laziness

Even if Wii U was packing itd still would have lazy devs of games

Bot every powerful console has games that take close to max their potential, even late in their
Ife cycles

Are we really starting with the lazy devs drivel already?

 

[z0m3le]

Are we really starting with the lazy devs drivel already?

Well, to be fair, the PC version isn't going to see much improvement, it will reflect most games this generation, and there is things we know for a fact that could be improved on the Wii U version (such as higher resolution textures, lighting and shadows) so lazy devs does actually make sense, especially when they will have 3 to 5 months before the Wii U launches, with their game already finished.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

The PS2 was console king though, 360 and PS3 share almost all of their games and neither really has a large hold on the market, people also had only had the PS2 for 5 years when the 360 released, it's been 7 for the 360, that is a big difference.

I don't think it matters that neither of them is "the king" when combined they hold the majority of the market. By the time Xbox 360 launched, PS2 was the only remaining competitive system, and Wii U will have to square off against two. Their sales show that it doesn't matter how long they've been on the market either, the sales have only recently started to slump, and there's plenty of room left for price adjustments, at least in Microsoft's case.

Whether and how the reinvigorated PC gaming and the threat of iOS devices enter the equation remains to be seen, too.

Plus this was also a big generation for multiple platforms, so Wii U will likely sell well for a large number of reasons, as long as the price is under 400, and the games are there at launch.

"Well" is such a vague term. Better than the current gen competition? I don't know. And what happens when Durango and PS4 launch? From where we're standing now I can't tell that either.

This is actually the one place where Wii U should excell, people would actually use the Upad to post on tweeter and facebook, used for netflix and youtube, and it would also be a powerful browser with something like opera (the original DS browser was opera wasn't it?) With stuff like NFC for purchases being in the controller, and the tablet being a window for game purchases, I really think Wii U has a very compelling sales pitch when it comes to those things. As long as NN can actually match up well with Sony, they will do fine.

Sure, in theory. I'm just saying that they will have to provide strong community features and execute on those ideas well, and that will require some drastic changes in Nintendo's online strategy.

That's because the 360 had nothing special except more power.

You're completely ignoring the changes they introduced with the 360 iteration of Live. Consumers and Sony did not. Deep online integration and motion sensing are the two things that defined this generation.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

While I wholeheartedly agree Nintendo needs to seriously reconsider how they handle their online infrastructure for the Wii U (I still can't believe just how horrible Brawl's online wound up being), just how important are achievements or trophies? I know online you'll usually have some people who use them to brag but offline even with COD-obsessed friends nobody I talk to ever seems to particularly care how many times they've had their 360 or PS3 acknowledge they shot someone 'X' amount of times. Keep in mind I don't equate achievements to profile/statistics cards; nearly every big online mutliplayer game this generation and even a few on the Wii let you show others exact numbers on how well you play the game.

Personally I don't see the point and I know Nintendo's said as much before hand (I think it was Miyamoto who described it as a cheap 'carrot on a stick' tactic to get people to repeat menial tasks), but is there any solid evidence that they're a huge selling point for a a significant portion of console buyers?



Also in keeping this somewhat relevant to the original theme of this thread; I don't see the issue if the Wii U is only a very slight step above the current generation. Simply means to me the Wii U will simply be the cheaper alternative I can go with first to get my 1st-party titles while I can wait and see how Microsoft and Sony's next-gen offerings fare and make an informed judgement on which of their more powerful systems I'll save up and invest in, all while catching up with 3rd party titles on my PC.

 

[z0m3le]

I don't think it matters that neither of them is "the king" when combined they hold the majority of the market. By the time Xbox 360 launched, PS2 was the only remaining competitive system, and Wii U will have to square off against two. Their sales show that it doesn't matter how long they've been on the market either, the sales have only recently started to slump, and there's plenty of room left for price adjustments, at least in Microsoft's case.

The main reason I said that, people couldn't find their games on the 360 and had no reason to expect 360 to get the majority of the games that PS2 was getting last generation. My point is everyone will expect Wii U to see the same multiplatforms on it as the consoles they are upgrading from, COD, Assassin's Creed, Dark Siders, ect... That is quite different than "PS3 is going to be unstoppable when it is released thanks to the brand name alone."

BTW Microsoft still has a $400+ SKU for the 360, price is only an issue when it's outside of the market's demographic, which is over $400 imo.

Whether and how the reinvigorated PC gaming and the threat of iOS devices enter the equation remains to be seen, too.

I think Wii U is addressing this in a very smart manner with a tablet controller, it will be able to have the apps that make iOS so compelling, and could have Nintendo's own small app games, which could become quite popular too.

"Well" is such a vague term. Better than the current gen competition? I don't know. And what happens when Durango and PS4 launch? From where we're standing now I can't tell that either.

"Well" being between: DS first year numbers. (it didn't really take off until DSlite) and Wii numbers. I expect it to do about what the 3DS does now, as long as it is priced below 350 and has high quality first party software.

Sure, in theory. I'm just saying that they will have to provide strong community features and execute on those ideas well, and that will require some drastic changes in Nintendo's online strategy.

Yes, I agree completely, Nintendo has already made some of those changes with the 3DS and have confirmed changes in the direction we want them to go with the Wii U (accounts separate from system)

I'd also like to say that this is all speculation, that is why we are doing it in a speculation thread... oh wait, why are we here?

You're completely ignoring the changes they introduced with the 360 iteration of Live. Consumers and Sony did not. Deep online integration and motion sensing are the two things that defined this generation.

Sony's current network is actually enough to pull gamers away from the 360, so Nintendo matching that is where they want to be, of course with a Nintendo twist, like the whole coins thing we see on the 3DS.

 

[frostbyte]

Yes, I agree completely, Nintendo has already made some of those changes with the 3DS and have confirmed changes in the direction we want them to go with the Wii U (accounts separate from system)

I'd also like to say that this is all speculation, that is why we are doing it in a speculation thread... oh wait, why are we here?

Sony's current network is actually enough to pull gamers away from the 360, so Nintendo matching that is where they want to be, of course with a Nintendo twist, like the whole coins thing we see on the 3DS.

Even if Nintendo Network turns out to be on par with SEN (and it has shown indications of doing so), I seriously doubt that's going to be enough. Why would people leave their Gamerscore/Trophies and their friends/community to the Wii U? Things like NFC are nifty but hardly a gamechanger. Coins are a good start but Nintendo needs a figurative 'killer app' for Nintendo Network or it isn't going to be appealing to the core gamer pie they want a piece of.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

What most people in this thread seem to be missing is that the online setup and services are far more important than visuals in this day and age. Nintendo will have to execute near flawlessly in that area if they really intend to capture the core market.

I'm not sure 'online' is any more of a key seller than visuals are.
If it was, OnLive would probably be the best selling console around.

The actual differentiator for success and failure is the same as it always has been - a 'killer app'.

If the WiiU has something that really shows off what it can do and completely justifies its design - like Mario 64 did for analogue as primary control, Wii Sports did for waggle, Nintendogs / Brain Training did for Stylus control, etc - then nothing else actually matters.

 

[NBtoaster]

Well, to be fair, the PC version isn't going to see much improvement, it will reflect most games this generation, and there is things we know for a fact that could be improved on the Wii U version (such as higher resolution textures, lighting and shadows) so lazy devs does actually make sense, especially when they will have 3 to 5 months before the Wii U launches, with their game already finished.

edit: wait i misinterpreted T_T nevermind

 

[Maxrunner]

3DS did cost 250€ on its release day and was a lot slower than phones available on that same day.

In comparison, Vita cost 250€ on its release day and was faster than any phone available on that same day. It's also ~10 times faster than 3DS, and I don't think you can ignore that kind of gap because of the difference in release dates.

As I said, if Nintendo intended for their device to be a graphical powerhouse they failed.

And this type of model is whats going to kill Sony...if they dont sell to compensatecthe losses...

 

[z0m3le]

Even if Nintendo Network turns out to be on par with SEN (and it has shown indications of doing so), I seriously doubt that's going to be enough. Why would people leave their Gamerscore/Trophies and their friends/community to the Wii U? Things like NFC are nifty but hardly a gamechanger. Coins are a good start but Nintendo needs a figurative 'killer app' for Nintendo Network or it isn't going to be appealing to the core gamer pie they want a piece of.

I don't think the trick is getting people to buy a console for the network, EARLY on, gamers might have bought a 360 to play on xbox live, but people are back to buying consoles for other reasons, games and netflix being the main reasons... Seriously if you ask the majority of 360 members what they use their console for mostly, it won't be gaming, but netflix, I am talking as a 360 netflix users... but my gold membership is up in October, so I'll be watching netflix through Wii U after that, and for free.

People will buy the Wii U for the games, and they will end up buying multiplatform games for the system because they end up using it more, it's very realistic to imagine someone buying the next call of duty for 360 and seeing what the Wii U version can do. (something like the ghost recon game is what I'm thinking) at that point, they would buy the Wii U version and play online for free. That is the main way people will switch, not because of the coins.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

Except there are statements from Iwata saying they're contemplating taking a loss...

Thinking about it, doesn't mean anything. If Iwata is still undecided, their FY results will decide for him.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

While I wholeheartedly agree Nintendo needs to seriously reconsider how they handle their online infrastructure for the Wii U (I still can't believe just how horrible Brawl's online wound up being), just how important are achievements or trophies? I know online you'll usually have some people who use them to brag but offline even with COD-obsessed friends nobody I talk to ever seems to particularly care how many times they've had their 360 or PS3 acknowledge they shot someone 'X' amount of times. Keep in mind I don't equate achievements to profile/statistics cards; nearly every big online mutliplayer game this generation and even a few on the Wii let you show others exact numbers on how well you play the game.

Achievements/trophies are very important to some gamers. On their own they seem quite meaningless, but being able to compare your accomplishments with friends can be stimulating. So while I'd say that most people probably don't care about them or their gamerscore, they do foster a sense of community and they played an especially important role at the start of this generation (they might play a big role at the start of the next one as well, because it's rather safe to assume that there is quite an overlap between achievement whores and early adopters).

However, singular online identity with easy connectivity and sharing features, developed store systems, matchmaking, being able to transfer your account and everything that's tied to it between devices and even generations of devices - they're absolutely crucial.

The main reason I said that, people couldn't find their games on the 360 and had no reason to expect 360 to get the majority of the games that PS2 was getting last generation. My point is everyone will expect Wii U to see the same multiplatforms on it as the consoles they are upgrading from, COD, Assassin's Creed, Dark Siders, ect... That is quite different than "PS3 is going to be unstoppable when it is released thanks to the brand name alone."

There's still a lot of skepticism over third party support for Nintendo's home hardware, this thread is a testament to that. Also, there is the question of exclusives, and Nintendo's first party is not particularly strong when it comes to kinds of experiences that are popular on other platforms.

I think Wii U is addressing this in a very smart manner with a tablet controller, it will be able to have the apps that make iOS so compelling, and could have Nintendo's own small app games, which could become quite popular too.

It's a double-edged sword because for a device that should make Wii U appear unique... Well, it's not that unique, certainly not as unique as the Wiimote used to be.

 

[frostbyte]

I don't think the trick is getting people to buy a console for the network, EARLY on, gamers might have bought a 360 to play on xbox live, but people are back to buying consoles for other reasons, games and netflix being the main reasons... Seriously if you ask the majority of 360 members what they use their console for mostly, it won't be gaming, but netflix, I am talking as a 360 netflix users... but my gold membership is up in October, so I'll be watching netflix through Wii U after that, and for free.

People will buy the Wii U for the games, and they will end up buying multiplatform games for the system because they end up using it more, it's very realistic to imagine someone buying the next call of duty for 360 and seeing what the Wii U version can do. (something like the ghost recon game is what I'm thinking) at that point, they would buy the Wii U version and play online for free. That is the main way people will switch, not because of the coins.

So you're just suggesting Netflix is the key? Netflix is on everything these days; you can count on it being on the Wii U. Even if Netflix is there in conjunction with multiplats on the Wii U, why wouldn't people wait for the true Xbox successor (assuming it's announced at E3) instead of jumping to the Wii U early? The Wii U isn't going to have an enormous graphical advantage even at highest estimates and the online service won't be as mature and nuanced as Xbox Live anytime soon. Free online is a good motivator but it's not a good enough motivation to switch from something gamers have gotten used to and prefer for the past few years.

 

[Wrestlemania]

However, singular online identity with easy connectivity and sharing features, developed store systems, matchmaking, being able to transfer your account and everything that's tied to it between devices and even generations of devices - they're absolutely crucial.

Are they? I mean, yeah, they should absolutely be there, but I wouldn't go so far as to say they're 'crucial', as if their omission would seriously harm a platform. Just look at the 3DS.

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

Same goes for the BigN Fanboys btw. Nintendo dosent need to be defended. The steamrolled over everyone this generation with the little white box that could! Even if WiiU is not able to be as successfull as the wii, it will still make BigN enough money. Even if they end up on third place end of next gen.

You can´t be sure of that at all. We have seen Nintendo lowering the 3DS price and giving them huge losses in the process. That can happen for the WiiU as well if the WiiU did not sell within Nintendo´s expectations.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

Are they? I mean, yeah, they should absolutely be there, but I wouldn't go so far as to say they're 'crucial', as if their omission would seriously harm a platform. Just look at the 3DS.

I agree.

I'd go one further and suggest a unified online identity is something that third parties want to create and run themselves more than something a hardware manufacturer necessarily needs to provide.

 

[frostbyte]

Are they? I mean, yeah, they should absolutely be there, but I wouldn't go so far as to say they're 'crucial', as if their omission would seriously harm a platform. Just look at the 3DS.

I'd argue that console gaming is often more multiplayer focused, and therefore community focused than handhelds. Handhelds have been more dominantly focused on local multiplayer, especially in Japan, while consoles tend to be online focused multiplayer games (eg. Call of Duty).

So yes, it's is crucial in this time and age. Wii could be partially forgiven since it launched at a time where broadband hadn't even be widely possessed by the general public. It's a different landscape today.

 

[Averon]

I think NiN will be a mess early on. It took Sony years to get PSN where it's at, and many still feel it pales in comparison to XBL, which took even longer still to get where it's at. I don't see the incentive for gamers to abandon their friends/trophies/achievements on PSN/XBL for an inferior version of either. I hope Nintendo prove me wrong, but I have seen nothing to suggest it.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

Are they? I mean, yeah, they should absolutely be there, but I wouldn't go so far as to say they're 'crucial', as if their omission would seriously harm a platform. Just look at the 3DS.

People have different expectations when it comes to portable systems, certainly people who are used to their Lives and SENs and whom Nintendo is trying to attract. I don't think we'll see all that many of them defect unless those features are in place.

 

[frostbyte]

You can´t be sure of that at all. We have seen Nintendo lowering the 3DS price and giving them huge losses in the process. That can happen for the WiiU as well if the WiiU did not sell within Nintendo´s expectations.

Nintendo could probably sustain two complete bombas and still survive. Not that they would be particularly healthy but they could still be around. Even in the GC era where they were absolutely thrashed by PS2, they still made a profit, although not particularly much.

 

[magash]

Nintendo could probably sustain two complete bombas and still survive. Not that they would be particularly healthy but they could still be around. Even in the GC era where they were absolutely thrashed by PS2, they still made a profit, although not particularly much.

If I am not mistaken Nintendo made more money during the PS2 generation than Sony

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

Even if Nintendo Network turns out to be on par with SEN (and it has shown indications of doing so), I seriously doubt that's going to be enough. Why would people leave their Gamerscore/Trophies and their friends/community to the Wii U? Things like NFC are nifty but hardly a gamechanger. Coins are a good start but Nintendo needs a figurative 'killer app' for Nintendo Network or it isn't going to be appealing to the core gamer pie they want a piece of.

SEN on PS4 will be leaps and bounds that it is right now on the PS3. We can see that the Vita has better online features than the PS3.

 

[Spieler Eins]

chances youll see uncharted 3 graphics on a system like that is slim.

Just like you did not see many games with graphics comparable to resident evil 4 on wii. Even though wii is clearly superior to gc.

games like uncharted 3 or resident evil 4 are made with huge budgets and some of the most talented people around.

I suspect those people would rather work on real next gen consoles.

Most 1st party games certainly did. (Even some overlooked 3rd party titles) Just like on the GCN, where Nintendo had some of the best looking games of the gen.
Not expecting anything else for WiiU, especially since Nintendo designs artstyles that could easily cover up certain weaknesses, instead of trying to achieve super realistic environments in generic warfare- and Star Trek scenarios.
If they once again can also achieve their usually short loading times, it's going to be glorious and certainly good enough for me.

 

[z0m3le]

There's still a lot of skepticism over third party support for Nintendo's home hardware, this thread is a testament to that. Also, there is the question of exclusives, and Nintendo's first party is not particularly strong when it comes to kinds of experiences that are popular on other platforms.

It's a double-edged sword because for a device that should make Wii U appear unique... Well, it's not that unique, certainly not as unique as the Wiimote used to be.

Those network features you named are already on the 3DS, they should be on the Wii U without delay, so I guess I'm saying I already addressed them, also if the 3DS rumor is true, you'll be able to manage your account and purchases from any online enabled device, that would be a step beyond 360 IMO.

All those games I mentioned are launch titles, Aliens vs predators, batman, NG3 for what it's worth... the list does actually go on, the point is, multiplatform games are the norm in this generation, in the last it was something exclusive to PS2 for the majority of titles, and with the Wii U's launch lineup having those games will quickly quiet people actually worried about it.

So you're just suggesting Netflix is the key? Netflix is on everything these days; you can count on it being on the Wii U. Even if Netflix is there in conjunction with multiplats on the Wii U, why wouldn't people wait for the true Xbox successor (assuming it's announced at E3) instead of jumping to the Wii U early? The Wii U isn't going to have an enormous graphical advantage even at highest estimates and the online service won't be as mature and nuanced as Xbox Live anytime soon. Free online is a good motivator but it's not a good enough motivation to switch from something gamers have gotten used to and prefer for the past few years.

The reason people will buy the console is for the games, netflix is the reason a lot of gamers buy xbox live. It was sort of tongue in cheek, though I personally am excited to use the tablet to find content or play games even before the tv is changed to the Wii U, that alone should sell the system to the average family man gamer.

I think NiN will be a mess early on. It took Sony years to get PSN where it's at, and many still feel it pales in comparison to XBL, which took even longer still to get where it's at. I don't see the incentive for gamers to abandon their friends/trophies/achievements on PSN/XBL for an inferior version of either. I hope Nintendo prove me wrong, but I have seen nothing to suggest it.

I think it will match up with 3DS's right out of the box, matter of fact, it's likely the same exact network, so I think we can look there to see the choices they are making with online. (the main difference being accounts are not tied to the console, and you can create multiple ones)

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

If I am not mistaken Nintendo made more money during the PS2 generation than Sony

Yes, a lot more.

SEN on PS4 will be leaps and bounds that it is right now on the PS3. We can see that the Vita has better online features than the PS3.

Neither service will remain what it is right now, I expect big changes (hopefully improvements) for all of them.

Those network features you named are already on the 3DS, they should be on the Wii U without delay, so I guess I'm saying I already addressed them, also if the 3DS rumor is true, you'll be able to manage your account and purchases from any online enabled device, that would be a step beyond 360 IMO.

Fingers crossed.

All those games I mentioned are launch titles, Aliens vs predators, batman, NG3 for what it's worth... the list does actually go on, the point is, multiplatform games are the norm in this generation, in the last it was something exclusive to PS2 for the majority of titles, and with the Wii U's launch lineup having those games will quickly quiet people actually worried about it.

Maybe, but soon the first Durango/PS4 titles will start appearing and the situation might not be so clear-cut then, depending on the gulf between the platforms.

By the way, third party games are mostly multiplatform nowadays because there's no clear market leader in all segments. If the situation changes in the next generation, we'll have more or less a repeat of PS2's glory days.

 

[frostbyte]

SEN on PS4 will be leaps and bounds that it is right now on the PS3. We can see that the Vita has better online features than the PS3.

That's absolutely true. The competition isn't going to stand still while Nintendo implements Nintendo Network. This just shows Nintendo needs to put even more work and, as I said, a figurative 'killer app' in NiN that is unique to the Wii U and appeals to the Live/SEN people enough to lure them over.

That's quite a tall order.

The reason people will buy the console is for the games, netflix is the reason a lot of gamers buy xbox live. It was sort of tongue in cheek, though I personally am excited to use the tablet to find content or play games even before the tv is changed to the Wii U, that alone should sell the system to the average family man gamer.

Tablets aren't exactly something new fangled. I can understand if you're excited (I want to try this out too) but it's not exactly the 'OMGMOTIONCONTROLS' Wii was.

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

That's absolutely true. The competition isn't going to stand still while Nintendo implements Nintendo Network. This just shows Nintendo needs to put even more work and, as I said, a figurative 'killer app' in NiN that is unique to the Wii U and appeals to the Live/SEN people enough to lure them over.

That's quite a tall order.

Nintendo does/did not have infrastructure for online integration. I really doubt the WiiU´s Nin will be on SEN/Live level at launch. These things take time, and by that time the PS4 and Durango would have released with much more features for SEN/Live. Nintendo will spend the rest of the generation playing catch up, but will not fully catch up. That´s what i think it will happen at least.

Nin might lure some people before te PS4 Durango launch but i really doubt they can lure the majority of online gamers.

 

[z0m3le]

That's absolutely true. The competition isn't going to stand still while Nintendo implements Nintendo Network. This just shows Nintendo needs to put even more work and, as I said, a figurative 'killer app' in NiN that is unique to the Wii U and appeals to the Live/SEN people enough to lure them over.

That's quite a tall order.




Tablets aren't exactly something new fangled. I can understand if you're excited (I want to try this out too) but it's not exactly the 'OMGMOTIONCONTROLS' Wii was.

To your first point (even if it wasn't directed at me) if the network of the console can sell it, I would be extremely confused, seriously GAMES sell consoles, that is what has sold every console ever...

PS was FF7
Xbox was halo
360 was Gears of war
N64 was Mario64

YES, there was other games, but those were the exclusive must haves early on that made the system gain attention from other gamers on other systems.

Motion controls didn't sell the Wii btw, it was Wii Sports, I know it's probably a fine line with some people here, but Wii Sports is the game that people bought the system to play, that is what Wii U needs, a game that is a watershed moment for gaming... Mario64 or Wii Sports, something big like those games.

Networks don't really matter, they are a function that needs to be there, but shouldn't sell a console. The controller is a bit of a different story, it's more like motion controls, and while that didn't alone sell Wiis, it was the reason Wii Sports was so compelling, and PERSONAL gaming should be pretty big with the family man... If the wife is going to watch dancing with the stars 2 or 3 nights a week, a man can't game, that is where Wii U raises it's hand and the man opens his wallet to court the thing to his living room.

anyways that is the difference between the two, also interestingly enough, a 480p 6inch screen powered by Wii U could probably look a lot more "high spec'd" then a 1080p game on the system... Just saying it might be a way people compare the graphics between the next gen consoles, if developers even pay attention to this.

 

[frostbyte]

Nintendo does/did not have infrastructure for online integration. I really doubt the WiiU´s Nin will be on SEN/Live level at launch. These things take time, and by that time the PS4 and Durango would have released with much more features for SEN/Live. Nintendo will spend the rest of the generation playing catch up, but will not fully catch up. That´s what i think it will happen at least.

Yes, Nintendo's making steps (as evidenced in the 3DS and the announcement of accounts in NiN) but I have my doubts they'll able to even catch up to Live/SEN level. It's basically the largest step in online connectivity they've ever taken.

Then again, they did say they're 'cooperating' with outside companies in areas they're not competent in. One would think their major weakness is their infrastructure for online services. We can only speculate from here on so I guess we'll see at E3.

 

[Witchfinder General]

Eh, I'm playing Mass Effect 3 on the 360 and if WiiU games look as good I'd be over the moon.

 

[z0m3le]

Eh, I'm playing Mass Effect 3 on the 360 and if WiiU games look as good I'd be over the moon.

Wii U games should have no problem matching ME3 from 360... (beat it last week, fantastic game, there is a thread on the forums about the ending if you need a hug afterwards)

 

[frostbyte]

To your first point (even if it wasn't directed at me) if the network of the console can sell it, I would be extremely confused, seriously GAMES sell consoles, that is what has sold every console ever...

PS was FF7
Xbox was halo
360 was Gears of war
N64 was Mario64

YES, there was other games, but those were the exclusive must haves early on that made the system gain attention from other gamers on other systems.

Motion controls didn't sell the Wii btw, it was Wii Sports, I know it's probably a fine line with some people here, but Wii Sports is the game that people bought the system to play, that is what Wii U needs, a game that is a watershed moment for gaming... Mario64 or Wii Sports, something big like those games.

Networks don't really matter, they are a function that needs to be there, but shouldn't sell a console. The controller is a bit of a different story, it's more like motion controls, and while that didn't alone sell Wiis, it was the reason Wii Sports was so compelling, and PERSONAL gaming should be pretty big with the family man... If the wife is going to watch dancing with the stars 2 or 3 nights a week, a man can't game, that is where Wii U raises it's hand and the man opens his wallet to court the thing to his living room.

anyways that is the difference between the two, also interestingly enough, a 480p 6inch screen powered by Wii U could probably look a lot more "high spec'd" then a 1080p game... Just saying it might be a way people compare the graphics between the next gen consoles, if developers even pay attention to this.

That's true, games do sell consoles, especially Nintendo consoles. However, with today's stigma in the general public and gaming media towards Nintendo, I don't think massive droves of gamers will go adopting New Super Mario Bros Mii along with the Wii U. I'm being a bit hyperbolic but it's a point of concern. If Nintendo wants to capture a piece of the core gamer pie, they're going to need to be more aggressive and also develop their online system to the industry standard. Of course, they could just do what they do best: making kick-ass software and they're still going to be successful but they could do so much more.

and I agree that Wii Sports sold the Wii. It was the killer app of motion controls and sold it to the public. It's just I can't envision anything more radical with a tablet controller that can drive sales similar to how Wii Sports did to Wii. I guess I'll leave it to Nintendo to wow me with the possibilities of tablet controlling at E3.

I can see the personal Wii U gaming for the family man scenario being popular with the general public but not with core gamers. Core gamers would most likely have their own dedicated TV or handheld to game on.

 

[Plinko]

I posted this in the other thread but it applies here, too:

Again, I'm not sure why this information is surprising to anyone. I strongly believe that Nintendo has found their "niche" in the gaming industry--offering systems that are a bit less-powered than MS/Sony (i.e., 3DS, Wii, Wii U) but offer a more unique and wider variety of play styles.

My guess is this next generation is only a 5-year cycle for Nintendo and they release the successor to the Wii U sometime in 2017. MS/Sony probably stay in the cycle a little longer, and Nintendo now has the "halfway/stopgap system that is more powerful for a couple years" spot.

 

[kingkaiser]

Eh, I'm playing Mass Effect 3 on the 360 and if WiiU games look as good I'd be over the moon.

Sure, but the problem is that a Mass Effect 4 with even better graphics will be on the NextBox/PS4/PC while the WiiU will just get an on rail shooter remake of the first trilogy...

 

[Gravijah]

since wii u is on par with this generation maybe we'll get persona 6 with interactive hugging on the bottom screen on it.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

with today's stigma in the general public and gaming media towards Nintendo

Yeah, because the 'hardcore gamers' have unconditionally loved Nintendo in every other generation.

 

[Shion]

Eh, I'm playing Mass Effect 3 on the 360 and if WiiU games look as good I'd be over the moon.

I wouldn't be OK with Metal Gear Solid 1-level graphics during the PS2-GC-XBOX era.

I wouldn't be OK with Ninja Gaiden Black-level graphics during the PS360 era.

And I won't be OK with Mass Effect 3-level graphics when the next-gen comes.

And the problem here isn't 3rd party games, anyone who is not a blind fanboy can play all these games on a proper next-gen console. The problem is that holding back two of my favorite series (Zelda and Metroid) into last-gen experiences, disappoints the hell out of me.

 

[frostbyte]

Yeah, because the 'hardcore gamers' have unconditionally loved Nintendo in every other generation.

Hate for Nintendo succeeding on the motion control gimmick and last gen hardware is at an all time high. I don't see how this is a point of contention.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

Hate for Nintendo succeeding on the motion control gimmick and last gen hardware is at an all time high. I don't see how this is a point of contention.

It doesn't seem any different from "Nintendoooomed / going third party / 'only for kids'" to be honest.

It's just a hate based on success rather than perceived failure now.

EDIT: I don't think nintendo have been 'mainstream loved' since the SNES. And even then there was a sizable portion of gamers believeing sega do what nintendon't.