.......what the fuck are you talking about?
I guess you haven't seen any "Marvel movies" then.
Like the one that literally came out two days ago. Or any that came before that.
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Why Hollywood filmmakers need to stop advertising LGBTQ characters who dont exist
- Thread starter LordOfLore
- Start date
.......what the fuck are you talking about?
I guess you haven't seen any "Marvel movies" then.
Like the one that literally came out two days ago. Or any that came before that.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
But in the end it didn't really amount to anything other than close friendship, which my problem with the new movie is it goes back to Quill trying to romance her again.
Glass Rebel
Member
Winter Soldier is also kind of a special case. The romance between Steve and Peggy from The First Avenger is resolved in a rather bitter-sweet way and he has barely any interaction with Agent 13. And Steve's relationship to BW isn't of romantic nature at all.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
I think it's true that Marvel is a little scared to venture down that territory with their characters. They don't want to offend anyone with their movies but then that results in them falling back to their successful but straightforward same strategy they've been doing for years. Things are going to have to change post-Black Panther/Captain Marvel.
NHarmonic.
Member
Bucky and Cap should've been a thing, specially after Civil War.
And lol people arguing there's no relationship stuff in Marvel movies? Every single movie has had an heterosexual pairing.
I wonder why it's still so dificult for Disney to feature LGBTQ+ characters prominently. What's the big fear? They are drowning in money, in case that's the principal worry.
And lol people arguing there's no relationship stuff in Marvel movies? Every single movie has had an heterosexual pairing.
I wonder why it's still so dificult for Disney to feature LGBTQ+ characters prominently. What's the big fear? They are drowning in money, in case that's the principal worry.
broncobuster
Banned
If the hypothesis that it's for China is accurate (which is questionable when Star Trek Beyond opened in China) it'll be interesting for series that haven't opened in China. Folks are expecting Gotham City Sirens to embrace the Harley and Ivy relationship.
share holders are not content with however much money you have today
hodayathink
Member
The nature of being a publicly traded company is that you can never have enough money. There's no such thing as too much of it.
I agree, but it's not that hard to do. Just don't write offensive stereotypes. Which is why it boggles the mind that gay characters are still written like that, Persona 5 is a particularly egregious example. But the excuses that always pop up in threads like these are tiring, such as "gay characters need to be written like x, y, and z" or the character being gay should basically be flavor text, or "I can't relate to gay characters so I only want them if there isn't a romance aspect".
A lot of the conversations between Cap and BW had to do with his love life.
Inferno313
Banned
A lot of it has to do with the fact that these are international products, they could probably be just fine with an LGBTQ+ pairing, for the most part, in America and Europe. But they want these things to be successful even in parts of the world where that certainly wouldn't fly. That's why LGBTQ+ pairings tend to be more common in popular TV than in popular films, as TV series aren't exported quite as far and wide as films.
That's not to justify this or say it's right at all. It's absolutely not, but from what I've read it international audiences are a big part of the reason.
Glass Rebel
Member
On a surface level, yes. On a deeper level they were about Steve being unable to let go of his past. They are talking about dating but the romance/relationship aspect is secondary.
I mean, not that it really matters for the topic at hand, I was just clarifying.
Prototype Viktor
Member
ahh my bad i saw PR in the quote and thought Public Relations regarding Gunn
excelsiorlef
Member
Yeah I figured that might have been the case when I looked back at the chain of conversation
Oh, so we're moving the goal posts then?
Inferno313
Banned
No. That stuff is as canonical to the films as the old Star Wars EU was. (Read: Not at all). The TV team at Marvel is a wholly separate entity from Marvel Studios, there was always poor communication between the two groups, but now that the film studio is seperate from the rest of Marvel, there's next-to-no collaboration between the two.
shawnbuddy
Member
Spoilers for Guardians 2:
Mantis. In the new movie Drax makes a big deal out of how he'd never sleep with her, and she tells him she doesn't like his kind of being.
There is one scene and one reference that portray Yondu as straight.
There is one scene and one reference that portray Yondu as straight.
Horse Detective
Why the long case?
Is it ignorant to think the problem lies with how much a lgbt relationship is reported on, rather than how its portrayed in the media in question?
There are plenty of shitty hetero relationships so its only fair that lgbt ones can be not well written. I just think the fact that these characters are so publicized invites people to have a conversation, as though its a divisive topic. As though there is a conversation to have. How can it be normalized if people keep being invited to have a conversation about it?
Someone tell me if this is somehow offensive, i'm just trying to wrap my head around it.
There are plenty of shitty hetero relationships so its only fair that lgbt ones can be not well written. I just think the fact that these characters are so publicized invites people to have a conversation, as though its a divisive topic. As though there is a conversation to have. How can it be normalized if people keep being invited to have a conversation about it?
Someone tell me if this is somehow offensive, i'm just trying to wrap my head around it.
Saucycarpdog
Member
Wait China bans LGBT in their movies? Why the fuck do they do that?
Chuck Norris
Banned
Sexuality being the overriding characteristic to define a character is also problematic in its own. There is nothing wrong with writers making the sexuality of a gay character a background detail just as it is for a straight character. The bigger issue is when that sexuality becomes the entire driving force and representation of a character, as if gay people are two dimensional beings who are only defined by the type of people they like
Inferno313
Banned
Do you have specific examples of what you're talking about? Outside of shitty gay stereotypes in bad comedy films, I'm struggling to think of a film that suffered from what you're talking about.
Horse Detective
Why the long case?
If you don't notice the scenes where Wallace is sleeping next to other men in Scott Pilgrim, Michael Cera makes sure to remind the viewer verbally so they don't get confused.
Fantastical
Death Prophet
Is "China" really the issue or is it parents who don't want their children exposed to homosexuality? I'll be so happy when homosexuality is not by the vast majority as something to shield children from. Even people that accept gay people and gay marriage get upset at children being exposed to the mere idea of homosexuality. It's incredibly insulting.
And Marvel movies are typically very violent. The controversy of a gay character would be delicious. "Won't somebody please think of the children!"
And Marvel movies are typically very violent. The controversy of a gay character would be delicious. "Won't somebody please think of the children!"
ryutaro's mama
Member
Do you seriously have to ask this question?
BlazinSkatinAxel
Member
Who has had sex in Marvel movies besides Tony Stark?
You're not going to see any of the heroes changed from how they were originally written.
China ain't exactly a LGBT friendly place, and doesn't have freedom of expression.
The sex vs violence debate continues. Most people in the West see sex as being far worse than violence. Why do you think the MPAA let's you say "fuck" in PG-13 films if it's not in a sexual context? Hell, if you say it in a gay sexual context it'll usually get you a NC-17.
Inferno313
Banned
What? Every single movie has given the male lead a heterosexual love interest.
Prototype Viktor
Member
a controlling country controls people's view point unless they know english and get around the great firewall?
NipplesAndToes23
Member
I think Dr. Strange was the only one without a romance in it. That comment from gun and Marvel is some shit though.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Well, technically Thanos is gonna fuck everyone
over when he gets the Infinity Gauntlet.
While blockbusters continue to be straight white circle jerks, TV shows recently have been leading the way on the diversity front (especially Netflix and Cable). In the past month we've gotten an almost all black cast in Dear White People, a diverse cast, including trans and gay characters lead in one of the most expensive TV shows ever made, Sense8.
Zvonimir Boban
Banned
Burt Macklin and that random alien chick at the start of Guardians.
And that poster was talking about relationships, not just "these two definitely had sex"
Cap and the Carter clan
Banner and Black Widow
Hawkeye has a wife and kids
Thor and Portman
Ant-Man and Pym's daughter.
Even Dr. Strange couldn't be friends with McAdams, she had to be his ex.
Can't change the heroes but the Ancient One can't stay Asian, yeah ok.
A token throw like Beauty and the Beast or something like GOTG2 where it doesn't even exist. I'll agree on. It's bullshit.
I'll defend PR though and say they did a pretty great job I felt with it. It's was her big point, and rather than having to spell it out and have a long dragged out scene. It's like, oh you're gay? Nothing wrong with that. Just acceptance from the group. Same with Billy and his Autism. The group just accepted each other like it was normal. Exactly how it should be.
I'll defend PR though and say they did a pretty great job I felt with it. It's was her big point, and rather than having to spell it out and have a long dragged out scene. It's like, oh you're gay? Nothing wrong with that. Just acceptance from the group. Same with Billy and his Autism. The group just accepted each other like it was normal. Exactly how it should be.
Kraglin
I think the long form and difference in budget allows TV to have less pressure when it comes these things and branch out more.
In addition to being the best comic book TV show, Legion featured a menacing female antagonist and another character who is gay, married and has an adopted black son.
Okay but here's the question - what does homosexuality have to do with "sex" here? We're not talking about two men going bareback, we're talking about orientation and relationships. Guardians of the Galaxy 2 has no problem using lines like "romantic love, sexual love, for... her!" and "do you have a dick?" etc. Those lines and gags are totally sexual in nature. Two guys being in a relationship and holding hands would not be "sexual" in any way, but it is considered far more taboo and controversial in conservative places. It's not a matter of sex vs violence, it's a problem of mentality.
Inferno313
Banned
There's absolutely a romantic subplot between Strange and Mcadam's character. Just because it doesn't conclude with them hooking up doesn't mean it isn't there.
Poor GRIMES
Banned
I really don't like it when LGBT+ peoples have to eat these crumbs of representation. Hell, that line was nothing at all considering it was framed around a joke and it was addressed towards another alien being. If these writers genuinely want good representation, then they need to stop pussyfooting around it and be declaratively LGBT+ with their characters.
UnemployedVillain
Member
This is some incredible reaching
shawnbuddy
Member
He hinted there's a gay character and that's the only line in the film that can be reasonably taken that way. I didn't write it.
MisterHero
Super Member
I'll disagree with what some said about Power Rangers. IMO PR Movie Trini should've been shown in a non-conforming relationship, not a weaksauce talking point. I go to movies to be shown something, not to be talked at.
I wonder if David Yost would agree to make Billy gay in the TV show, should he return. It would be like "He's been here all this time, and all those years as a Ranger/Mentor he still wasn't sure of who he was." Perhaps more than ever, kids have to deal with being LGBTQ+, the same applies to adults. It could be something great that PR dealt with. Probably not as cool if Sentai has tackled it already...
These kids/adults do NOT need countries in the world trivializing their issues by censoring our entertainment for them. Fuck those countries, and the TV/movie makers who have too much money but can't communicate the right thing.
I wonder if David Yost would agree to make Billy gay in the TV show, should he return. It would be like "He's been here all this time, and all those years as a Ranger/Mentor he still wasn't sure of who he was." Perhaps more than ever, kids have to deal with being LGBTQ+, the same applies to adults. It could be something great that PR dealt with. Probably not as cool if Sentai has tackled it already...
These kids/adults do NOT need countries in the world trivializing their issues by censoring our entertainment for them. Fuck those countries, and the TV/movie makers who have too much money but can't communicate the right thing.
excelsiorlef
Member
No one was in a relationship in the movie... no one and her "I'm Queer" scene was not a weaksauce talking point, it was an integral part of literally the scene designed to be about character building and the Rangers bonding and becoming actual friends who can trust each other by talking about the stuff they don't talk to anyone else about... That's what you were shown...
Sho_Nuff82
Member
There is no queer subtext in the Cap/Bucky relationship, and I feel like I need to say "I told you so" that Gunn's comments were purely hypothetical, not a promise or a plan.
Marvel isn't going to turn perform a sexuality flip on an established character. Disney is not the company to expect this from.
Edit: http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=1367431&page=1
The old thread is filled with people jumping to the same conclusion on a weak PR response.
He did not remotely hint that there was a gay character, only broadly that there could be gay characters at some point in the future.
Not ruling it out =/= confirmed
Marvel isn't going to turn perform a sexuality flip on an established character. Disney is not the company to expect this from.
Edit: http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=1367431&page=1
The old thread is filled with people jumping to the same conclusion on a weak PR response.
He did not remotely hint that there was a gay character, only broadly that there could be gay characters at some point in the future.
Not ruling it out =/= confirmed
MisterHero
Super Member
I would rather have scenes of the characters living their lives/experiencing their conflicts than being told through dialogue about their problems. Even Zack's bedridden mom got some screentime.
And because her dialogue was inconclusive, she isn't even really trusting the group with anything. Perhaps in the next movie!
Saucycarpdog
Member
I meant what reason do they have for doing it. Obviously places like Christian and Islamic countries do it for religious reasons. Taoism is the main religion of China and does not hate LGBT as far as I know.
Bigotry is the next main suspect but I would think with their overpopulation and the fact that they're trying to take title of the worlds leader from the US that they wouldn't have much of problem with LGBT. It's foreigners they hate.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
Power Rangers did it well.