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[ozfunghi]

If it is an unannounced title, it won't be named in the piece and it would be unusual for DF to talk about "best versions" of unannounced games no-one in the public has seen running. I'd expect something we do know about, but I can't think which title it would be. All of the DF comparisons so far can be eliminated, so what does that leave us with?

Exactly. What other "state of the art" game is out for WiiU that hasn't been tested yet?
They tested CoD:BOII, ACIII, ME3, Batman, Trine2, Sonic RT, Darksiders, Tekken, Ninja Gaiden...

I can't imagine it being anything already released. And what current-gen state of the art multiplat games have been announced but not yet released?

 

[Cosmonaut X]

The only one that springs to mind - and it very much depends on your definition of "state of the art" - is "Aliens: Colonial Marines". DF have done a comparison between the 360/PS3 versions today, so perhaps they've had access to the Wii U build?

 

[wsippel]

The only one that springs to mind - and it very much depends on your definition of "state of the art" - is "Aliens: Colonial Marines". DF have done a comparison between the 360/PS3 versions today, so perhaps they've had access to the Wii U build?

Either Colonial Marines or Most Wanted. I don't think we've seen the Wii U version of either game yet.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

Either Colonial Marines or Most Wanted. I don't think we've seen the Wii U version of either game yet.

Ah, yeah - forgot about "Most Wanted" (as did EA, apparently...). The only other multiplatform that I can think of that might be classed as "state of the art" is "RE: Revelations", though I'd be surprised if multiple builds of that were available to DF at this stage.

 

[ozfunghi]

But Aliens CF surely can't make the case of better hardware. Can it?

That guy from Straight Right did say they might say something about their upcoming game when DICE is over... maybe the DF article will rise when that's the case?

Also, i have my doubts about NFS. It was done by launch, but they decided to delay it. Knowing EA and their current WiiU state of mind, i doubt they invested more time and money than needed.

Edit: So, possibly Aliens:CF, NFS:MW, RE:R, or Straight Right's soon to be revealed port?

I think it really depends who did the SKU. If it was Criterion themselves, then the game might have what to show..

Ok. Edit: is the title really "Need for Speed: Most Wanted - A Criterion Game"... then i do hope that's the case, lol.

It could be Sniper Elite V2 ... Or Sniper Ghost Warrior 2 (CryEngine 3 I think?).

Ok, totally forgot about those. There is also "Injustice" and "Walking Dead"...

 

[blu]

But Aliens CF surely can't make the case of better hardware. Can it?

That guy from Straight Right did say they might say something about their upcoming game when DICE is over... maybe the DF article will rise when that's the case?

Also, i have my doubts about NFS. It was done by launch, but they decided to delay it. Knowing EA and their current WiiU state of mind, i doubt they invested more time and money than needed.

I think it really depends who did the SKU. If it was Criterion themselves, then the game might have what to show..

 

[DrWong]

<cue> Dev in PR mode wanting to sell his game</cue>

Anyway, that post by NBtoaster made me curious.



Would this be a "new" title we don't know of? Or a released game? Maybe Deus Ex if that rumor is true, by the guys that did a good job porting ME3? This is probably going somewhat offtopic, but...

It could be Sniper Elite V2 (in a recent itw Rebellion stated the Wii U was more powerful than the PS360, ok it could be PR but well...).

NL: Do you find the Wii U to be more powerful than the 360 and PS3?

JK: In a word yes – it’s very capable, and we’re taking advantage of this to bring greater graphical fidelity to the Wii U version of Sniper Elite V2.

Or Sniper Ghost Warrior 2 (CryEngine 3 I think?).

 

[ozfunghi]

I just had a brainfart, probably, but this couldn't be Project CARS, could it? (Too far away? Slated for Thanksgiving)

Last thing i'll say about it. Pretty stoked to find out which 3rd party game actually received a decent effort, lol.

Edit: maybe we'll know more tomorrow after the next Nintendo Direct (3DS+WiiU). Possibly Digital Foundry is waiting for an announcement? Possibly Straight Right's game will be revealed as well? Both stated to possibly talk about it this week...

 

[Cosmonaut X]

Looks like it's probably Most Wanted - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=513122

Talk of using "PC assets" etc., suggests this is the "better performing" game DF are talking about.

 

[frankie_baby]

Looks like it's probably Most Wanted - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=513122

Talk of using "PC assets" etc., suggests this is the "better performing" game DF are talking about.

I reckon so too, haven't seen much of the ps360 versions to compare but looks good

 

[ozfunghi]

Looks like it's probably Most Wanted - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=513122

Talk of using "PC assets" etc., suggests this is the "better performing" game DF are talking about.

Looks like it. Looking good as well.

 

[KingSnake]

Talking about that slow RAM, right?

Finally a good port.

 

[pestul]

Wow, that looks really good. Framerate appears to be alright too.

 

[Schnozberry]

Looks like it's probably Most Wanted - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=513122

Talk of using "PC assets" etc., suggests this is the "better performing" game DF are talking about.

I'm legitimately impressed Criterion did their own port and were able to get a quick grasp of the hardware. Sounds like they didn't start until Mid 2012, so they might have even gotten full power Dev Kits to work on!

 

[Turrican3]

I hope they weren't teasing this one:

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...me-that-proves-the-wii-us-got-a-bright-future
(yeah ok, I know it's not DF, but still...)

 

[ozfunghi]

So, might also steer a bit off topic, but might be interesting nevertheless from a technical standpoint:

Arkam's latest posts on Gaf (EA 4th gen, Tiger Woods 14 not coming to WiiU but 15 will...) basically confirms he was working for a studio from EA, i assume. What game could he have been working on to warant his initial attitude, later to be partly downplayed by himself? Fifa? Madden? I doubt it was either ME3 let alone NFS

 

[frankie_baby]

So, might also steer a bit off topic, but might be interesting nevertheless from a technical standpoint:

Arkam's latest posts on Gaf (EA 4th gen, Tiger Woods 14 not coming to WiiU but 15 will...) basically confirms he was working for a studio from EA, i assume. What game could he have been working on to warant his initial attitude, later to be partly downplayed by himself? Fifa? Madden? I doubt it was either ME3 let alone NFS

battlefield 3 perhaps? it was worked on briefly then canned

 

[Gahiggidy]

I'm legitimately impressed Criterion did their own port and were able to get a quick grasp of the hardware. Sounds like they didn't start until Mid 2012, so they might have even gotten full power Dev Kits to work on!

At E3 last year in an interview with G4, the guy from Criterion said NFS would be coming to "All platforms", which piqued my ears at the time thinking this was a hint/slip-up that a Wii U version was in the works.

 

[ozfunghi]

battlefield 3 perhaps? it was worked on briefly then canned

I doubt it, because he did "update" his opinion later on, saying that their team experienced huge improvements after a while. So if the project was canned so soon, that doesn't make sense. I bet it was one of the sports games, which basically invalidates his opinion imo.

 

[frankie_baby]

I doubt it, because he did "update" his opinion later on, saying that their team experienced huge improvements after a while. So if the project was canned so soon, that doesn't make sense. I bet it was one of the sports games, which basically invalidates his opinion imo.

true unless of course the team moved on to bf4 on wii u straight after (unlikely though) yeah you're probably right about a sports game and probably correct conclusion then

 

[Schnozberry]

I doubt it, because he did "update" his opinion later on, saying that their team experienced huge improvements after a while. So if the project was canned so soon, that doesn't make sense. I bet it was one of the sports games, which basically invalidates his opinion imo.

Why would working on sports games invalidate his opinion? I'm curious. I don't know all of what Arkam has said, so I could have missed something.

 

[ozfunghi]

Why would working on sports games invalidate his opinion? I'm curious. I don't know all of what Arkam has said, so I could have missed something.

Well, because they (Madden, Fifa ports) weren't exactly shown a lot of love, regardles of hardware implications. By which i don't mean that such bottlenecks can't exist, but that (the devs of) those games might not be providing the needed proof to come to that conclusion.

 

[Schnozberry]

Well, because they (Madden, Fifa ports) weren't exactly shown a lot of love, regardles of hardware implications.

Ah, ok. Yeah, Madden was a clusterfuck. FIFA was better, but admittedly the team that made it said it was quick and dirty. Hopefully, if Criterion can get good things out of the Wii U on their first attempt, DICE can do the same.

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

The closest they could get is somehow mounting a Wii disc image and load it in Wii mode with the Wii U intercepting calls to read from the disc.

It's theroetically possible, but it depends on how much they want to keep Wii U and Wii mode separate. Given Microsoft's limited efforts of making OXbox games available (we STILL can't download Halo 2) and Sony's solution of "just port the damn thing and release it on PSN" for the most part, I think you're more likely to see Wii games cheaply ported with bare minimum Wii U functionality and made available as eShop downloads.

edit: I bring up the Sony and MS examples as the lack of competitive pressure for Nintendo to implement the functionality

I don't mean to derail the discussion, but this is technically related to Wii U's hardware analysis.
Is there some inherent difference between Wii U's Wii mode and a regular Wii that would prevent Nintendo from releasing a firmware update for Wii (aka a new IOS) that supports USB hard drives and then have the Wii load Wii games via a custom loader? This is what the homebrew community has been doing for years, and if I understand correctly having this functionality shouldn't expose Wii U to any of Wii's vulnerabilities...

 

[frankie_baby]

question, a lot of people moaned at hard drives only being connectable by usb2 and thus being not particularly fast, now nintendo advises harddrives (if not self powered) should be connected with a Y cable so using 2 usb ports, does this double the potential data rate or is the second port purely for electricity reasons?

 

[SpoonyBard]

question, a lot of people moaned at hard drives only being connectable by usb2 and thus being not particularly fast, now nintendo advises harddrives (if not self powered) should be connected with a Y cable so using 2 usb ports, does this double the potential data rate or is the second port purely for electricity reasons?

Only electricity. The second usb is not fully connected.

 

[gundalf]

It did strike me like a Thunder, but i think i found out why the Discs have rounded edges... it is to reduce noise from the spinning disc! Right?!

round edge = better aerodynamics = less noise

 

[Herb Alpert]

It did strike me like a Thunder, but i think i found out why the Discs have rounded edges... it is to reduce noise from the spinning disc! Right?!

I was figuring it was just a proprietary format.

 

[frankie_baby]

It did strike me like a Thunder, but i think i found out why the Discs have rounded edges... it is to reduce noise from the spinning disc! Right?!

round edge = better aerodynamics = less noise

and actually better aerodynamics would mean less power is needed to spin it fast, possible explanation for 1.6w bluray drive

 

[Van Owen]

DF article with Ward is pretty good. Basically confirms Wii U is weaker in some areas than current gen and stronger in others and if you can build around that you can see minor improvements in games.

Still disappointing that areas like parts of the CPU ended up worse than current gen though.

 

[AzaK]

DF article with Ward is pretty good. Basically confirms Wii U is weaker in some areas than current gen and stronger in others and if you can build around that you can see minor improvements in games.

Still disappointing that areas like parts of the CPU ended up worse than current gen though.

But overall stronger or at least able to produce better results. If anything concerns me its the 6 vs 8 online limit. That's a bit worrying.

 

[bgassassin]

DF article with Ward is pretty good. Basically confirms Wii U is weaker in some areas than current gen and stronger in others and if you can build around that you can see minor improvements in games.

Yeah, that's exactly what was said.

 

[FLAguy954]

DF article with Ward is pretty good. Basically confirms Wii U is weaker in some areas than current gen and stronger in others and if you can build around that you can see minor improvements in games.

Still disappointing that areas like parts of the CPU ended up worse than current gen though.

C'mon man, trying to downplay the strengths of the Wii U again now, are we?

Did you skip the parts when Ward talked about the nighttime segments of the game (superior lighting, something he seemed so proud of showing off that the Wii U game starts at night just to show it off) and textures which are most likely 2-3 times higher res than current gen consoles could produce? Hardly minor . (at least to me)

 

[Van Owen]

C'mon man, trying to downplay the strengths of the Wii U again now, are we?

Did you skip the parts when Ward talked about the nighttime segments of the game (superior lighting, something he seemed so proud of showing off that the Wii U game starts at night just to show it off) and textures which are most likely 2-3 times higher res than current gen consoles could produce? Hardly minor . (at least to me)

I watched one video where he talked about the nighttime lighting being tweaked to make it easier to see, not that it wasnt technically possible on the othe consoles. And it's changed from the PC version too, which has no technical hurdles compared to Wii U.

Plus the Wii U version is still using the 360/PS3 geometry.

 

[bgassassin]

I watched one video where he talked about the nighttime lighting being tweaked to make it easier to see, not that it wasnt technically possible on the othe consoles. And it's changed from the PC version too, which has no technical hurdles compared to Wii U.

Plus the Wii U version is still using the 360/PS3 geometry.

You're running out of straws to grasp at.

Considering Criterion benefited from some extra time, though still having to deal at times with the same tool issues as others should tell us that once the tools mature games will only get better. Constantly trying to say a console is maxed out that hasn't even been on the market for six months is asinine. I've said before and I'll say it again. We won't know what Wii U's full potential will be (AD. with multiplats) till PS360 development dies off.

 

[Van Owen]

Where did I say it was maxed out? I don't consider even NFS one of the greatest looking current gen games.

 

[bgassassin]

Where did I say it was maxed out? I don't consider even NFS one of the greatest looking current gen games.

Basically confirms Wii U is weaker in some areas than current gen and stronger in others and if you can build around that you can see minor improvements in games.

I don't see how you can say you didn't. So are now saying that Wii U could see games that have better than minor improvements? If you are that's fine as my argument is that it's too soon for finality one way or the other. If you aren't then you are saying Wii U is maxed out and that minor improvements are the best we'll see.

 

[megabytecr]

Key points from DF article and Dev Interview

- Wii U uses PC textures
- Geometry from PS360. We don't know if there was PC only geometry.
- From dev on CPU "I think a lot of people have been premature about it in a lot of ways because while it is a lower clock-speed, it punches above its weight in a lot of other areas".
So basically the CPU when worked on its strengths gets the job done. Still being objective here, this has no evidence of it being stronger then PS360 CPU but also evidence that it is no bottleneck either.
- Criterion has also improved night-time lighting after employing new staff who previously worked in the motion picture business.
- From Dev "The Wii U has had a bit of a bad rap - people have said it's not as powerful as 360, this, that and the other. That, by and large, has been based on apples to oranges comparisons that don't really hold water. Hopefully we'll go some way to proving that wrong".
Very interesting commenthe seems confident this game will prove the initial rep the Wii U hardware got was wrong.

From gamesradar interview
- pc textures and assets (this last part is not detailed enough).
- lighting improved, draw distance tweaked.

I do not recalled a mention about framerate, someone else minds to chime in?

 

[Van Owen]

We haven't seen minor improvements to the best looking current gen games, so it hasn't been maxed out yet.

 

[Van Owen]

Are the fewer number of online opponents due to CPU constraints?

 

[bgassassin]

We have seeninor improvements to the best looking current gen games, so it hasn't been maxed out yet.

Cool. I just wanted to get some clarification since the previous post could be taken in a different context.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

DF article with Ward is pretty good. Basically confirms Wii U is weaker in some areas than current gen and stronger in others and if you can build around that you can see minor improvements in games.

Still disappointing that areas like parts of the CPU ended up worse than current gen though.

Wow, all can say is wow. Tumbling down that rabbit hole, huh.

 

[DrWong]

Thread title has to be changed, there's no more "serious discussion" here, only childish discussions.

 

[bgassassin]

Key points from DF article and Dev Interview

- Wii U uses PC textures
- Geometry from PS360. We don't know if there was PC only geometry.
- From dev on CPU "I think a lot of people have been premature about it in a lot of ways because while it is a lower clock-speed, it punches above its weight in a lot of other areas".
So basically the CPU when worked on its strengths gets the job done. Still being objective here, this has no evidence of it being stronger then PS360 CPU but also evidence that it is no bottleneck either.
- Criterion has also improved night-time lighting after employing new staff who previously worked in the motion picture business.
- From Dev "The Wii U has had a bit of a bad rap - people have said it's not as powerful as 360, this, that and the other. That, by and large, has been based on apples to oranges comparisons that don't really hold water. Hopefully we'll go some way to proving that wrong".
Very interesting commenthe seems confident this game will prove the initial rep the Wii U hardware got was wrong.

From gamesradar interview
- pc textures and assets (this last part is not detailed enough).
- lighting improved, draw distance tweaked.

I do not recalled a mention about framerate, someone else minds to chime in?

Good question. I don't remember it being in the videos so I might have missed it too.

Thread title has to be changed, there's no more "serious discussion" here, only childish discussions.

Nuh uh.

 

[Van Owen]

Pretty sure NFS was 30fps on 360/ps3 (rare for criterion).

If they doubled it for Wii U Ward probably would have mentioned it at least once.

 

[wsippel]

Key points from DF article and Dev Interview

- Wii U uses PC textures
- Geometry from PS360. We don't know if there was PC only geometry.
- From dev on CPU "I think a lot of people have been premature about it in a lot of ways because while it is a lower clock-speed, it punches above its weight in a lot of other areas".
So basically the CPU when worked on its strengths gets the job done. Still being objective here, this has no evidence of it being stronger then PS360 CPU but also evidence that it is no bottleneck either.
- Criterion has also improved night-time lighting after employing new staff who previously worked in the motion picture business.
- From Dev "The Wii U has had a bit of a bad rap - people have said it's not as powerful as 360, this, that and the other. That, by and large, has been based on apples to oranges comparisons that don't really hold water. Hopefully we'll go some way to proving that wrong".
Very interesting commenthe seems confident this game will prove the initial rep the Wii U hardware got was wrong.

From gamesradar interview
- pc textures and assets (this last part is not detailed enough).
- lighting improved, draw distance tweaked.

I do not recalled a mention about framerate, someone else minds to chime in?

If the draw distance was indeed increased, the system still pushes more polygons even if the individual assets are the same.

 

[stupidvillager]

joystiq article mentions increased frame rate. It doesnt say whether it is above or below 30 or 60, just that it is increased.

 

[ozfunghi]

DF article with Ward is pretty good. Basically confirms Wii U is weaker in some areas than current gen and stronger in others and if you can build around that you can see minor improvements in games.

Still disappointing that areas like parts of the CPU ended up worse than current gen though.

Citation needed.

Key points from DF article and Dev Interview

- Wii U uses PC textures
- Geometry from PS360. We don't know if there was PC only geometry.
- From dev on CPU "I think a lot of people have been premature about it in a lot of ways because while it is a lower clock-speed, it punches above its weight in a lot of other areas".
So basically the CPU when worked on its strengths gets the job done. Still being objective here, this has no evidence of it being stronger then PS360 CPU but also evidence that it is no bottleneck either.
- Criterion has also improved night-time lighting after employing new staff who previously worked in the motion picture business.
- From Dev "The Wii U has had a bit of a bad rap - people have said it's not as powerful as 360, this, that and the other. That, by and large, has been based on apples to oranges comparisons that don't really hold water. Hopefully we'll go some way to proving that wrong".
Very interesting commenthe seems confident this game will prove the initial rep the Wii U hardware got was wrong.

From gamesradar interview
- pc textures and assets (this last part is not detailed enough).
- lighting improved, draw distance tweaked.

I do not recalled a mention about framerate, someone else minds to chime in?

Good question. I don't remember it being in the videos so I might have missed it too.

The framerate was mentioned by the journalist in the Joystiq interview. It wasn't a comment by Ward himself.

 

[Lonely1]

It's curious, based on the first months, you would think that people would have concluded that the Ps3 was much (much) weaker than the 360. Madden running at half the framerate, Splinter CellA lagging even compared to the Xbox version (in some areas), nothing shown (sans bullshots/bulltrailers) looked nearly as impressive as Gears of War, etc. Yet, for some reason, the Ps3 was always assumed to be the most powerful. Not a new phenomenon, mind you. At launch we had the Ps2 showing (significant) worse performance in DC ports such as Sonic Adventure games, and we know the rest of the story.

On more recent times, while more than one are (still) convinced that Vita is in the same tier, or close to, the ps3; the 3DS was declared "barely above the PSP (if at all)" and "around the same as a Dreamcast (DF)", Art Technica (I believe) went even farther stating that it offered "N64 tier graphics". I remember a particular post at BY3D that stating something like "I played the 3DS demo at a store and nothing gets even close to TC H.A.W.K. (Symbian)"... that game looks like an N64 game with better textures.

The perception of the device has changed little since, since now we have moved to better things (advances in mobile tech have been spectacular since 2010). I expect the same to happen to the Wii U. By the time NFS:MW releases, we will have Ps4 media (real time or not) "setting the bar higher".

 

[megabytecr]

It's curious, based on the first months, you would think that people would have concluded that the Ps3 was much (much) weaker than the 360. Madden running at half the framerate, Splinter CellA lagging even compared to the Xbox version (in some areas), nothing shown (sans bullshots/bulltrailers) looked nearly as impressive as Gears of War, etc. Yet, for some reason, the Ps3 was always assumed to be the most powerful. Not a new phenomenon, mind you. At launch we had the Ps2 showing (significant) worse performance in DC ports such as Sonic Adventure games, and we know the rest of the story.

On more recent times, while more than one are (still) convinced that Vita is in the same tier, or close to, the ps3; the 3DS was declared "barely above the PSP (if at all)" and "around the same as a Dreamcast (DF)", Art Technica (I believe) went even farther stating that it offered "N64 tier graphics". I remember a particular post at BY3D that stating something like "I played the 3DS demo at a store and nothing gets even close to TC H.A.W.K. (Symbian)"... that game looks like an N64 game with better textures.

The perception of the device has changed little since, since now we have moved to better things (advances in mobile tech have been spectacular since 2010). I expect the same to happen to the Wii U. By the time NFS:MW releases, we will have Ps4 media (real time or not) "setting the bar higher".

I don't think there is someone who will try to discuss your last statement. That is a given, those two systems and mostly PC iterations will certainly raise the bar higher. That is not the point of the Wii U technical discussions, we just want to know what the Wii U (in a bubble) can achieve. Some because they are fan boys, some like me who invested in the system, and others are just plain curious.

But I also think it is interesting indeed how the Wii U compares to the other systems, both technically and also the final outputs.