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XB1X 4K standard includes checkerboard and dynamic
- Thread starter nynt9
- Start date
Tbh i don't think i've seen any analysis comparing a 2160 cb and a native 2160. Can't do it with horizon for instance since it has no "native" version to compare to. Any examples?
I mean i know its the case with tomb raider, but then those are upscaled on top of their 1800 cb solution. So thats to be expected.
Theonik
Member
They'll be great!
Head.spawn
Junior Member
Checkboarding can also leave artifacts, so theres that.
Crayon
Member
The wipeout game has a native and a checkerboard mode. From what I've heard, you can detect artifacting from the checkerboarding with the fast moving images. DF has a whole article.
Wipeout seems like a game particularly bad for checkerboarding, since it does temporal averaging. A slower moving game like Horizon would be totally fine, but fast games will suffer the worst.
Checkerboarding in wipeout is only in effect with motion blur turned on (which is the result of the artifacts, since its pretty poor quality) so its not really a like for like comparison. Any others? Maybe something indie-ish?
chromatic9
Member
Nope.
RIse of the Tomb Raider is 2160p checkerboard and blurrier than 2160p native on PC
Crayon
Member
Damn that's right. I don't know of any others that even come that close.
Head.spawn
Junior Member
Rise of the Tomb Raider and even the new Assassins Creed exhibit artifacting in some instances utilizing the checkerboarding technique.
No it isn't. Its 1800 checkerboarded and upscaled, hence why its blurrier.
What other pro games are a full 2160 checkerboard? Anyone? Is the division?
EASTC0AST_GH05T
Member
Phil Spencer said the PS4 Pro is in competition with Xbox One S and he toted the Xbox One X as a true 4K console so I am sure many didn't think it would be utilizing CBR since that is viewed as fake 4K by many.
I'm just talking about the 4Kcb games cover by DF. You don't need a native version to compare to. CBR isn't perfect and displays artifacts and other slight blemishes that wouldn't be in a native 4K frame.
They mention it in today's analysis of AC Origins where the textures don't look as sharp as they could and highlight artifacts on the bird's feathers.
Again I'm fine with the technique, I just want developers to be honest whether or not it's native, CBR, or upscaled. Mostly for my own technical curiosity.
My mind says temper, the voice in my heart tells me to run rootcause run!
But not all checkboarding is created equal. Obviously if you're only checkerboarding to 1800 your going to have to rely on traditional upscaling for the rest, thus lntroducing blurrier results. I want to know about true, 2160 checkerboarding (horizon for instance) and how it fairs against native. But obviously with a game that can be compared and how noticable the differences actually are, even at a 200% DF style zoom.
Now, what about that micromachines-esque indie racing game? Or is that native 4K?
Edit: even the article you mentioned states this
"It's only when looking closely at texture detail that a slight softness is evident - just as it is on other 2160p checkerboard titles we've seen, like Horizon Zero Dawn and Days Gone. Image integrity is solid, with just minor artefacts around fast-moving objects - easy for us to see on still shots blown up to 300 per cent, but virtually impossible to detect in gameplay on a 4K TV."
Which was my entire point to begin with. If you can't even see the difference, why do people even care? And why would anyone spend $500 trying to achieve it?
Head.spawn
Junior Member
The only people pushing this angle are being disingenuous.
Literally a matter of hours between that statement and this thread, but people formed that opinion? Hell, we saw Scorpio docs last year (IIRC) stating that Scorpio will be able to utilize these techniques, OnQ was posting about it and CPU scaling back then.
Crayon
Member
Ok I loled. Best possible answer.
I knew this was the case the moment he announced it. They'd be fools to go after native 4k.
I'm here on PC with a 980ti hoping we get checkerboarding.
Still, shitty of them, and I'm sure they'll have an indie or something like Rocket League rendering at native 4K at some point, but whatever.
They should have stuck with the 40% extra power resulting in better framerates and graphics as well as more often supporting 4K checkerboarding.
Companies gonna business.
I'm here on PC with a 980ti hoping we get checkerboarding.
Still, shitty of them, and I'm sure they'll have an indie or something like Rocket League rendering at native 4K at some point, but whatever.
They should have stuck with the 40% extra power resulting in better framerates and graphics as well as more often supporting 4K checkerboarding.
Companies gonna business.
EASTC0AST_GH05T
Member
Of course we knew it could utilize CBR but after watching Microsofts conference I honestly didn't think the Xbox One X would.
chromatic9
Member
You're wrong. Digital Foundry asked the devs and they have said it's 2160 checkerboard, it's been known for a long time now.
This 1800p myth was started by DF in speculation long before release.
It's 2160 checkerboard and blurrier than native 2160p on PC.
Check here for rendering resolutions
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1324251
Search for DF articles on ROTTR and you'll find the info within. It's mentioned in a DF ROTTR video as well, one of John's videos who is Dark10x here on GAF.
Chief_Mitch
Member
I don't think there needs to be an agenda... As far as i'd seen, the BoneX had always been spruik as being native 4k. So this is certainly interesting news to me!
Hehe I'm glad I made someone laugh today.
You asked for an example, I gave you an example that you quote and then dismiss the example. You asked for a 2160p CB example and they state how there is a slight softness to the texture detail and artifacts.
People wouldn't be spending $500 on one port of a game that's apparently shooting for parity. People would spend $500 for what may generally be the best version of multiplatform games. The same reason that people purchased a PS4 or PS4 Pro. You're focusing on only one aspect of what makes up an entire graphical makeup.
To dismiss any advantage of a native 4K resolution is to dismiss where the industry is going. When the next gen consoles launch focusing on 4K, will you still be questioning why we need them when you think 4K CBR is good enough?
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