Support NeoGAF

SarusGray · Mar 6, 2017

Nuu said:
Between Microsoft and Sony's DLC and pay to play online shennigans, Valve pushing the mindset of mods should be paid for, and Nintendo's laughably anti-piracy stance to the point of wanting to shut down emulators and shitting on Fair Use, and not to mention the"controversial" topic of free games, what is it with gamers being so eager to concur with them and become corporate ballwashers?

Um, cause they are the ones making the games for us to enjoy and if we stop buying it they'll stop making it lol. (this lowkey applies to sony and nintendo only)

To chime in, you can't stop emulators or piracy, so just keep buying video games and supporting them. If you're playing on emulators and buying the game, I have no problem with you at all!

R_thanatos · Mar 6, 2017

MatrixMan.EXE said:
I agree with the first part of what you say, but I wish you emulation enthusiasts wold get off your high horse with this "if you actually cared about the medium" bullshit. It's a lame retort.

Actually game préservation is a thing and emulation allow us to keep game safe from disappear AT all.

In this age of licenses and corporation , several games need préservation to exist in a decade or 2. Zelda might not be concerned but many other titles are.

Let's not act like game préservation is not integral to the medium and that emulation is not a key way for many of us to achieve that goal.

Nuu · Mar 6, 2017

SarusGray said:
Um, cause they are the ones making the games for us to enjoy and if we stop buying it they'll stop making it lol. (this lowkey applies to sony and nintendo only)

You are correct. Used games, unpaid online, mods, emulation. These are allnew concepts that have never existed before that the industry can't coexist with.

HowZatOZ · Mar 6, 2017

Iron Badger said:
Not our faults that Nintendo refuses to develop for PC

Haha what the fuck. Sure, I'd love to have Horizon on PC as it would look bloody gorgeous, but that doesn't mean it's okay to pirate a game because I don't want to play it on its exclusive platform. That's some backwards logic.

MUnited83 · Mar 6, 2017

subtlesaysigh said:
This is an impressive feat, to be sure, but anyone expecting this to be "the definitive version" inside of a year is delusional. You will at best be able to complete the game with a higher resolution, without major crashes, quite a few graphical and audio glitches, and at 10-30fps. I can only laugh at the 4K+60fps comments...

Hint: that's not how emulation generally works, unless you really want to break things.

*goes back to playing BotW instead of wishing it could be even better*

Seems you are not really very familiar with CEMU's progress. I'm pretty sure it will ne very near perfect in way less than a year easily. I can already play several Wii U exclusives at 4k60fps perfectly or very near perfect right now. Most of those were barely running one year ago! That Zelda footage is already more stable and playable than the games that are perfect now were one year ago!

Avallon said:
Unauthorized distribution of copyrighted code remains illegal, according to both country-specific copyright and international copyright law under the Berne Convention. Unless you're ripping these discs yourself, you are breaking the law.

You might need to get some law classes. Or some reading ones even. If you download a rom, you are absolutely not breaking that law. The uploader is. Learn to read pls

SarusGray · Mar 6, 2017

Nuu said:
You are correct. Used games, unpaid online, mods, emulation. These are allnew concepts that have never existed before that the industry can't coexist with.

I said if we stopped buying games. Never said protesting their silly online rules etc was wrong

joecanada · Mar 6, 2017

lastendconductor said:
No one can say with a straight face that this announcement is not going to impact sales. My friends are already saying they will download it and that the Switch is useless if you can play its only game on PC for free.
They really should've waited, I don't see harm in emulation later, but so soon? Anouncement and video on launch weekend?? This has been done to do harm on purpose.
I hope Nintendo finds a way to C&D them.

If the bolded is true Nintendo has a lot bigger problems than CEMU

Budi · Mar 6, 2017

HowZatOZ said:
Haha what the fuck. Sure, I'd love to have Horizon on PC as it would look bloody gorgeous, but that doesn't mean it's okay to pirate a game because I don't want to play it on its exclusive platform. That's some backwards logic.

Yup, I'd prefer Sony games coming to PC if I've had to choose between Nintendo and Playstation games. Nintendo already does more 60 fps games on consoles, while Playstation games push the graphics. I'd see bigger benefit on playing Playstation games on a PC. And Nintendo offers more interesting and affordable hardware to play on.

On the emulation itself, is it legal to emulate these games on PC if I buy the Wii U game but don't own the console itself? Would love to play Bayonetta 2 for example.

SpiceMelange · Mar 6, 2017

gngf123 said:
Console modding, CFW, and things like that are absolutely not illegal. They are against EULA sure, but EULA's are not legally binding.

Dumping games might be illegal in countries that prohibit format shifting, but in most countries creating personal backups of things you own should be fine.

Backing up by itself is not illegal in the USA but playing Wii U games on an emulator involves decrypting the ISO. That decryption is illegal because it's circumventing the medium's drm. You need permission from the copyright holder to circumvent DRM in US laws.

MUnited83 · Mar 6, 2017

Sn4ke_911 said:
I'm looking forward to a picture of the copy of the game you own in the emulation thread.

Would you accept a photo where I hold a Zelda copy with a note saying "Sn4ke_911 is a dumbass" next to it when my copy arrives?

btrboyev said:
Emulating a game will never ever lead to a definitive edition. There will always be inaccuracies and things that are not correct.

Nah. Having played 3D World and Mario Kart 8 at 4K60fps, I can tell you that they are absolutely the definitive edition.

Chesskid1 said:
i remember growing up i always thought emulators were allowed by companies because they were free, no one was making money off it, it was done by fans.

now cemu is making like 100k a year off patreon. i was looking at the ps3 emulato'rs patreon and one of their stretch goals is another dev starts working on it full time.

that's pretty crazy to be making a ton of money emulating nintendo stuff. what if they start making 500k a year? what if they start charging for the software, a one time fee thing? i wonder what it would take for nintendo to step in.

anyways, really looking forward the progress cemu will make for zelda.

Nintendo cannot step in. Emulation is legal. As long as they are not using Nintendo code they are completely in the clear.

You can already find paid emulators right now that have no legal issues whatsoever. Drastic is a Nintendo DS emulator on Android. It's the best DS emulator there is, and it's paid, and it's on the Google Play Store.

shandy706 · Mar 7, 2017

From someone that is going to eventually play the Wii U build on CEMU now that this has happened....these two things just came in!!!

Holy crap did my Famitsu copy get here fast from Japan!

Schopenhauerian · Mar 7, 2017

SarusGray said:
...To chime in, you can't stop emulators or piracy, so just keep buying video games and supporting them. If you're playing on emulators and buying the game, I have no problem with you at all!

subtlesaysigh said:
...I think the difference for me is about the intention when it comes to hardware and software that's still available at retail. If you are seeing something like this and saying "Fuck yeah, now I don't have to buy Nintendo's hardware," that's getting into an uncouth area. If you are seeing something like this and saying "Well since I already own this stuff, it's better that I get to play it where and how I want," no problem at all. Run free with it.

Gotdatmoney said:
...The general populace is not going to make WiiU emulation so huge that Zelda and Nintendo are going to tank. Like come on.

Myriadis said:
...It will take time anyway before it's properly playable, and most sales are done within the first weeks.

lastendconductor said:
No one can say with a straight face that this announcement is not going to impact sales. My friends are already saying they will download it and that the Switch is useless if you can play its only game on PC for free. They really should've waited, I don't see harm in emulation later, but so soon? Announcement and video on launch weekend?? This has been done to do harm on purpose....

To lastendconductor's last point: clearly this announcement/video was NOT intended by the CEMU devs to inflict harm.

However, the decision to do an announcement/video around the launch weekend of the Switch will nonetheless cause some considerable amount of harm: at the very least, we have good reason to expect that given the unique character of present circumstances (right around launch of the Switch), the precise amount of harm that will occur as a result of this particular announcement/video is likely to be unprecedented (in the merely technical sense of being without precedent) in the history of emulation.

As Guess Who suggested, this is a reality that is, perhaps, at least worth grappling with:

Guess Who said:
I'm personally a huge proponent of emulation, and think they're essential for game preservation. I think a Wii U emulator has every right to exist. If you own a copy of the game, and you want to play it in CEMU so you can use your choice of controller or run it at higher fidelity, I am all for that.

Still, I think it's pretty disingenuous to turn a blind eye to the fact that there will almost certainly be a significant amount of people using CEMU to pirate the game. Not that Wii U piracy is difficult these days even without CEMU, but CEMU makes it accessible to those without a Wii U at all. It's a truth universally acknowledged among the emulation scene that the number of people making their own game rips is absolutely tiny compared to the number of people downloading said rips from the internet. I still think emulators have a right to exist in spite of that, but it's a reality you have to grapple with.

Of course, it's a lot easier to see these things in black and white - either "emulation has nothing to do with piracy!" or "emulation is nothing but a tool for pirates!" - and GAF threads often reflect this. See also: "does a pirated copy = 1 lost sale or 0 lost sales? It couldn't possibly be more complex than that" or "is the Switch a home console or a portable? It can't possibly be something in the middle."

la_briola · Mar 7, 2017

bone_and_sinew said:
Point I was making is there's precedence for a console maker in making their games available on other platforms through a business model.

You are correct.

Schnozberry said:
Purchasing the game isn't a license to do whatever you want with it. That's not how copyright law works.

CEMU the emulator is perfectly legal. Dumping games, however, is not. You have to mod the console in order to dump the games, and that's illegal even in places where DRM can be legally cracked.

Wrong.

This

gngf123 said:
Console modding, CFW, and things like that are absolutely not illegal. They are against EULA sure, but EULA's are not legally binding.

Dumping games might be illegal in countries that prohibit format shifting, but in most countries creating personal backups of things you own should be fine.

is correct.

Crossing Eden · Mar 7, 2017

shandy706 said:
From someone that is going to eventually play the Wii U build on CEMU now that this has happened....these two things just came in!!!

Holy crap did my Famitsu copy get here fast from Japan!

The fact that they drew classic Link with the art style of the first Zelda is amazing.

R_thanatos · Mar 7, 2017

Referring to post #412
The narrative that this "annoncement" was done to do harm is bollocks.

When asked a question , an answer was given . That is all.

If you're concerned about zelda sales , don't be .. it's already selling very well according to gamestop.

Let's end this train of conspiracy that this was done to hurt or that it will hurt because zelda , as a powerhouse as it is , is doing well. And CEMU won't change that , as it's not intended to do so.

Also , you all realise that this emulation is dropping more frames than the game , without sounds/music , without proper physics not proper collisions so you can't even progress the game.. I mean how is that supposed to hurt ? That game is already on course to break records.

Laughing Banana · Mar 7, 2017

CHC said:
God..... goddammit. What is it with these threads?

What, is that statement not true?

Anth0ny · Mar 7, 2017

shandy706 said:
From someone that is going to eventually play the Wii U build on CEMU now that this has happened....these two things just came in!!!

Holy crap did my Famitsu copy get here fast from Japan!

where did you order the famitsu from? I neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeds it

lvl99 Pixel · Mar 7, 2017

Oxn said:
People using dolphin will tell you, you are wrong.

Dolphin is the only way to play Melee online, and im pretty sure everyone who plays that game owns at least one physical copy.

DooMAGE · Mar 7, 2017

This emulator is on its infancy, can't run most games accurately.

Acuracy is really important on emulation, using software emulation when potential quirks of the target console are unemulated or improperly emulated and could result in unwanted behavior.

J@hranimo · Mar 7, 2017

This is fine I suppose. Wii U is dead and if those people don't want a Switch, cool.

TLZ · Mar 7, 2017

Kingpin Rogers said:
It's disappointing to think that the majority of people who do this will have not bought the game and are essentially stealing. 5 years of development and so many people involved for it become easily accessible and playable for free in just a few months after release. :/

Get out.

Zemm · Mar 7, 2017

Sn4ke_911 said:
I mean i remember there was once a rule on GAF, that you are only allowed to talk about this unreleased game if you can proof to a mod (especially bish was very strict) that you actually own the game. And yeah it was like that, post a picture of your copy with your GAF name on it.

What happened to that?

Edit: I'm talking about games that broke the street date.

It was Watchdogs on PC iirc. It got leaked to torrent sites like 3 weeks early and all of a sudden a lot of people in the performance thread were talking about getting the game from their 'mom and pop' store. Bish asked for proof, lots of people got banned.

TLZ · Mar 7, 2017

This thread went to shit quick. Modbot please close.

Sizzel · Mar 7, 2017

Great news for Zelda. Most rabid fans have already purchased the game. I will get a chance to see it shine at technically (hopefully) it's highest spec. Game is a blast, but it is bottlenecked by it's hardware.

For the all emulation is bad crowd... a non-zero number of us (this also applies to pc port beggars) aren't;t looking for a free copy of the game or a way around buying the console it is released on. We simply want to play the game at the highest possible technical spec. I own all the consoles sans Switch and the pro and a gaming PC.

If I had to pay 299 and magically get PS4 games on my PC and still pay 60 a year for online and 60 for a new release game... I would do it over buying a PS4. CEMU plus BotW is a blessing. Hopefully, a great game gets the technical TLC it deserves.

J@hranimo · Mar 7, 2017

Sizzel said:
Great news for Zelda. Most rabid fans have already purchased the game. I will get a chance to see it shine at technically (hopefully) it's highest spec. Game is a blast, but it is bottlenecked by it's hardware.

For the all emulation is bad crowd... a non-zero number of us (this also applies to pc port beggars) aren't;t looking for a free copy of the game or a way around buying the console it is released on. We simply want to play the game at the highest possible technical spec. I own all the consoles sans Switch and the pro and a gaming PC.

If I had to pay 299 and magically get PS4 games on my PC and still pay 60 a year for online and 60 for a new release game... I would do it over buying a PS4. CEMU plus BotW is a blessing. Hopefully, a great game gets the technical TLC it deserves.

I agree with all of this. If I had a PC capable of playing some of these games at better performance I'd probably do the same.

Deleted member 325805 · Mar 7, 2017

Wireframe said:
I'm not against emulation, I mean dolphin is one of the best things out there. But c'mon guys, the game has been out a couple days! There really should be a grace period before working on this kind of stuff.

2-4 months is a grace period.

unbiasedgamer · Mar 7, 2017

J@hranimo said:
I agree with all of this. If I had a PC capable of playing some of these games at better performance I'd probably do the same.

I have the game, and i think its plays and looks great. You guys can say that all you want is to play the game at the highest spec possible. But a majority of people will just pirate the game.

Peterthumpa · Mar 7, 2017

TLZ said:
Get out.

He's right though. You can't be that naive to think that the number of people that legally own the game surpasses the number of people who do not and want to play it on CEMU essentially for free as soon as it becomes remotely playable from start-finish.

Usobuko · Mar 7, 2017

I'm actually glad for game preservation because I almost bought another wiiu without knowing this emulator exist.

Gaf is an enthusiasm community, concerned trolling don't really work here because vast majority actually buy their games. Hang around here for a while and you can kinda tell who are these enthusiasts.

NipplesAndToes23 · Mar 7, 2017

Is CEMU already available?

pcostabel · Mar 7, 2017

Helacious said:
Backing up by itself is not illegal in the USA but playing Wii U games on an emulator involves decrypting the ISO. That decryption is illegal because it's circumventing the medium's drm. You need permission from the copyright holder to circumvent DRM in US laws.

Almost. There is a specific exception for obsolete hardware:

Computer programs and video games distributed in formats that have become obsolete and that require the original media or hardware as a condition of access, when circumvention is accomplished for the purpose of preservation or archival reproduction of published digital works by a library or archive. A format shall be considered obsolete if the machine or system necessary to render perceptible a work stored in that format is no longer manufactured or is no longer reasonably available in the commercial marketplace.

AzaK · Mar 7, 2017

#sorrynotsorry said:
I get that pirates are mostly teens and college students, but I never saw the appeal. There's no way this could possibly be worth it. I'd rather buy a Switch.

Let's assume they get it running great. It will then potentially run better than switch, potentially at a higher resolution, with additional graphics packs making it look even better. What's not to like?

Usobuko · Mar 7, 2017

And if Nintendo went dreamcast'd, that's entirely on them.

I am already supporting so many niche games along with majority of Nintendo franchises, it's their fault for not aligning themselves with the market wishes.

shandy706 · Mar 7, 2017

Anth0ny said:
where did you order the famitsu from? I neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeds it

You can get it shipped from Japan to the US in just a few days on Amazon Japan. I think I paid $13 total

ModBot · Mar 7, 2017

Maybe we can try this thread again later without the ridiculous detour into general emulation anger.

Support NeoGAF

Video of Zelda BOTW running on CEMU, devs:"should be fully playable in 2-4 months"

Member

Member

Banned

Banned

For you.

Member

Member

Member

Member

For you.

Member

Member

Member

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!

Member

Weeping Pickle

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Banned

Member

Banned

Member

Banned

Deleted member 325805

Unconfirmed Member

Neo Member

Member

Banned

Member

Gold Member

Member

Banned

Member

Not a mod, just a bot.

Similar threads