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Syrian army retakes Homs; terrorists flee

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M

Mahonay

Banned
JJD said:
And why the hell do you suppose it's impossible to verify the amount of deaths? Because the Assad dictartoship won't allow it.

And it's funny how you quickly disregard the reports of civilian deaths but will take the government claim of 1500 security personal deaths at face value.
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It is pretty disgusting to see someone value trained government military forces over civilian lives.

Yes, it's terrible that people on both sides are dying. It it also completely unacceptable to be killing entire families of civilians. These are not combatants out in the street.

It's sadly a bit familiar to the way we have conducted ourselves in Iraq and Afghanistan.
 
S

Solid warrior

Banned
ClovingSteam said:
Do you accept that the regime has killed innocent Syrians? Do you accept that they are trying to shut up international journalists? Do you accept that due to the Syrian regime innocent journalists have been killed? Do you accept that Assad is a tyranical dictator like Qaddafi, Mubarak, and others?
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No, I don't accept it killing innocent ppl. So far, the Syrian army have entered the terrorists held areas.

The Syrian Gov claims that they've issued more than 200 licenses for journalists around the world. Your claim is false.
Meanwhile, Makdissi said that respecting Syrian laws would allow visiting journalists to get facilities and recommendations from the Information Ministry over the situation on the ground, adding that the ministry was exerting all-out efforts and had granted licenses to around 200 media delegations over the past two months.
Click to expand...
http://www.china.org.cn/world/2012-02/23/content_24714608.htm

The Syrian Gov blames the militants for causing the death of those "innocent" journalists. So, Which one to believe?

Also, Nobody remembers this poor French cameraman who was killed in Homs by militant groups. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_Jacquier

the AL mission confirms that he was killed by the militant group fire. even the French government has stopped pressuring the Syrian Gov after the AL mission report.
 
F

fanboi

Banned
Solid warrior said:
the recently added numbers can't be verified by the UN.

but, I previously said that even the 5300 death claims long time ago can't be verified, either.

because, they're simply baseless. Go find the UN report in PDF form, you'll find out that it's based on "witnesses" claims.
Click to expand...

So what should one base it upon instead of "witnesses" claims?
 
E

el retorno

Member
Solid warrior said:
No, I don't accept it killing innocent ppl. So far, the Syrian army have entered the terrorists held areas.

The Syrian Gov claims that they've issued more than 200 licenses for journalists around the world.

http://www.china.org.cn/world/2012-02/23/content_24714608.htm

The Syrian Gov blames the militants for causing the death of those "innocent" journalists. So, Which one to believe?

Also, Nobody remembers this poor French cameraman who was killed in Homs by militant groups. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_Jacquier

the AL mission confirms that he was killed by the militant group fire. even the French government has stopped pressuring the Syrian Gov after the AL mission report.
Click to expand...

You´re a joke. You have to be.
 
S

s7evn

Member
Boils down to the old idea that one sides freedom fighter is a terrorist to their opponent. Choose your side, choose your terminology.
 
R

rpg_poser

Member
Well, now that the "terrorists" have been driven out and peace can return, it'll be interesting to hear how Assad treats his citizens. I am sure he will treat those who think his heavy handed terrorist removal tactics were the acts of a despot with respect and dignity, not push them into a cell somewhere and throw away the key.
 
C

ClovingWestbrook

Banned
Solid warrior said:
No, I don't accept it killing innocent ppl. So far, the Syrian army have entered the terrorists held areas.

The Syrian Gov claims that they've issued more than 200 licenses for journalists around the world. Your claim is false.

http://www.china.org.cn/world/2012-02/23/content_24714608.htm

The Syrian Gov blames the militants for causing the death of those "innocent" journalists. So, Which one to believe?

Also, Nobody remembers this poor French cameraman who was killed in Homs by militant groups. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_Jacquier

the AL mission confirms that he was killed by the militant group fire. even the French government has stopped pressuring the Syrian Gov after the AL mission report.
Click to expand...

Wow, we have an Assad and Syrian regime shil on NeoGAF. Amazing.

and lol @ China.org as a source.
 
F

fanboi

Banned
Solid warrior said:
No, I don't accept it killing innocent ppl. So far, the Syrian army have entered the terrorists held areas.

The Syrian Gov claims that they've issued more than 200 licenses for journalists around the world. Your claim is false.

http://www.china.org.cn/world/2012-02/23/content_24714608.htm

The Syrian Gov blames the militants for causing the death of those "innocent" journalists. So, Which one to believe?

Also, Nobody remembers this poor French cameraman who was killed in Homs by militant groups. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_Jacquier

the AL mission confirms that he was killed by the militant group fire. even the French government has stopped pressuring the Syrian Gov after the AL mission report.
Click to expand...

Is that a China friendly site you are linking to?

The same country that vetoed? (Or was that in a different case?)
 
M

marrec

Banned
So we should talk about what the regime's retaking of this neighborhood means for the opposition and civilians rather than argue with a shill.
 
C

ClovingWestbrook

Banned
shinobi602 said:
You guys do know there's Al Qaeda and shit among these, rebels, right?
Click to expand...

There were Al Qaeda supporters in Libya, Egypt, etc. That doesn't change the fact that the people of Syria like Egypt, Tunisia, and Libya deserve to be free from the dictator of Assad and determine their own fate.
 
S

Solid warrior

Banned
JJD said:
And why the hell do you suppose it's impossible to verify the amount of deaths? Because the Assad dictartoship won't allow it.

And it's funny how you quickly disregard the reports of civilian deaths but will take the government claim of 1500 security personal deaths at face value.
Click to expand...
So If the dictatorship won't allow it, you'll basically rely on this loose data to use it as a pretext to invade another nation on the basis of supporting democracy and freedom.

RustyNails said:
Think about what you're saying for a moment. Stop and think.

Your government outlawed foreign press from it's country because they were reporting of atrocities being carried out by it.

In the absence of free press, the only way to know what's going on inside your country is to hear it from civilians, i.e, eye witnesses. We make an estimate based on eyewitness accounts. For example, 100 people say 6,000 people died. 100 other people say 8,000 people died. Based on that, the death toll is somewhere between 6,000 and 8,000 according to eye-witness reports. In that way, we covered the statistical bias with a big ass margin of error. Of course those accounts cannot be independently verified by the UN because your country banned free press.

Just shrugging off 8,000 civilian casualties give or take just because UN cannot verify it is a shameful way of copping out. Have some decency.
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How would you verify that the eye-witnesses are civilians without political agenda and/or not from the opposition?

Also, on the ban of free press, Gov claims otherwise.
Meanwhile, Makdissi said that respecting Syrian laws would allow visiting journalists to get facilities and recommendations from the Information Ministry over the situation on the ground, adding that the ministry was exerting all-out efforts and had granted licenses to around 200 media delegations over the past two months.
Click to expand...
http://www.china.org.cn/world/2012-02/23/content_24714608.htm

I don't dismiss the fact there are DEATHS in syria because of the recent events. but I'm dismissing all the numbers that has been claimed by the UN/activists AND the Government.
 
C

ClovingWestbrook

Banned
Azih said:
Why did you put innocent in quotes?
Click to expand...

Wow, I just realized that. The OP has to be trolling.

Solid warrior said:
So If the dictatorship won't allow it, you'll basically rely on this loose data to use it as a pretext to invade another nation on the basis of supporting democracy and freedom.


How would you verify that the eye-witnesses are civilians without political agenda and/or not from the opposition?

I don't dismiss the fact there are DEATHS in syria because of the recent events. but I'm dismissing all the numbers that has been claimed by the UN/activists AND the Government.
Click to expand...

LOL. Ok, OP is master troll.
 
S

shinobi602

Member
ClovingSteam said:
There were Al Qaeda supporters in Libya, Egypt, etc. That doesn't change the fact that the people of Syria like Egypt, Tunisia, and Libya deserve to be free from the dictator of Assad and determine their own fate.
Click to expand...

I'm just saying, they are not our friends. If and when they take over, they will not be any better to us than Assad probably. They're wahabi/salafi (similar to Saudi Arabia's, and even Taliban's ideologies) while Assad and a majority of the government that are Alawi (offshoot of Shia). It's turning to a big sectarian issue over there.
 
F

Fularu

Banned
At long last some good news.

And lol at the people believing those "peacefull protests/rebels" lies but whatever. One only needs to look at who's pushing for "regime change" in Syria within the Arab world to understand what it's all about.
 
A

Azih

Member
ClovingSteam said:
Wow, I just realized that. The OP has to be trolling.



LOL. Ok, OP is master troll.
Click to expand...

Wouldn't be so sure of that.

Washington Post reporter in Damascus:

“They want to take us back 100 years,” Maha Shujaa, a 38-year-old interior designer and Assad supporter, said of the protesters.

“Who is going to protect me when the president goes, those bearded guys? No thanks,” said Shujaa, who refused to divulge her religious identity, saying she is “a Syrian citizen.”
Click to expand...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...power-cuts/2012/02/28/gIQAS1FRgR_story_1.html

Once people pick a side they start rationalizing like crazy. It's insane to see.
 
A

Azih

Member
Solid Warrior, simple question did you think that the Bahraini security forces and Saudi military were right to do what they did in Bahrain?
 
T

thekad

Banned
DY_nasty said:
I honestly wanted a better understanding of this situation because, hell, MAYBE there was a new side to this. Instead, I see people proving each of his points wrong with legit sources a counter-argument to boot.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I'm surprised you lasted so long. He's literally parroting the same propaganda every dictatorial regime spews in revolutions.
 
S

Solid warrior

Banned
Azih said:
Why did you put innocent in quotes?
Click to expand...
It has been reported many times that foreign intelligence such as the CIA uses their agents as correspondents, journalists. I have my very own suspicion that they are agents since the Syrian Gov claims that they're still granting license/access for foreign journalists. Why would you access the country illegally, then? I can't accuse anyone of intelligence activities and I could be wrong.
 
C

ClovingWestbrook

Banned
Solid warrior said:
It has been reported many times that foreign intelligence such as the CIA uses their agents as correspondents, journalists. I have my very own suspicion that they are agents since the Syrian Gov claims that they're still granting license/access for foreign journalists. Why would you access the country illegally, then? I can't accuse anyone of intelligence activities and I could be wrong.
Click to expand...

lol masterful. wow.

TA called it from the get go.
 
F

fastford58

Member
OP needs to move to Homs now that the mighty Assad has "cleansed" it of the terrorists. How comfortable he must feel trolling from behind his keyboard.
 
A

Azih

Member
Solid warrior said:
It has been reported many times that foreign intelligence such as the CIA uses their agents as correspondents, journalists. I have my very own suspicion that they are agents since the Syrian Gov claims that they're still granting license/access for foreign journalists. Why would you access the country illegally, then? I can't accuse anyone of intelligence activities and I could be wrong.
Click to expand...

Alright, thanks for the response. It could be that the government is only letting in journalists that it can monitor the movements of and thus control maybe?

Second question if you could. Did you think that the Bahraini security forces and Saudi military were right to do what they did in Bahrain (and are doing in fact)?
 
M

Mahonay

Banned
Solid warrior said:
It has been reported many times that foreign intelligence such as the CIA uses their agents as correspondents, journalists. I have my very own suspicion that they are agents since the Syrian Gov claims that they're still granting license/access for foreign journalists. Why would you access the country illegally, then? I can't accuse anyone of intelligence activities and I could be wrong.
Click to expand...
Well looks like I'm done reading this thread.
 
F

fastford58

Member
Solid warrior said:
It has been reported many times that foreign intelligence such as the CIA uses their agents as correspondents, journalists. I have my very own suspicion that they are agents since the Syrian Gov claims that they're still granting license/access for foreign journalists. Why would you access the country illegally, then? I can't accuse anyone of intelligence activities and I could be wrong.
Click to expand...

Tin foil hat go. Aren't bullshit 911 conspiracies banned here? Maybe this BS should be as well.
 
J

joseph1594

Member
Solid warrior said:
No, I don't accept it killing innocent ppl. So far, the Syrian army have entered the terrorists held areas.

The Syrian Gov claims that they've issued more than 200 licenses for journalists around the world. Your claim is false.

http://www.china.org.cn/world/2012-02/23/content_24714608.htm

The Syrian Gov blames the militants for causing the death of those "innocent" journalists. So, Which one to believe?

Also, Nobody remembers this poor French cameraman who was killed in Homs by militant groups. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_Jacquier

the AL mission confirms that he was killed by the militant group fire. even the French government has stopped pressuring the Syrian Gov after the AL mission report.
Click to expand...

The Syrian government claims a lot of things, does that mean everything they say is true? Feel free to prove me wrong with a link, but I do not know of any mainstream media that is officially allowed in Syria and is given all of the correct paper work by the Syrian government. I have not see any reporters from CNN, BBC, Reuters, New York Times, etc, reporting from Syria in their offices in the country. By saying "innocent" journalists, are you insinuating that Marie Colvin and Rémi Ochlik deserved to die or their deaths was just? Also, I personally have longed known about the death of Giller Jacquier by the hands of opposition forces. Does a brutal act of violence by members of the opposition excuse the brutal acts committed by members of the Syrian government? You seriously need to educate yourself about logical fallacies.

So, you say the French government is no longer pressuring the Syrian government after the Arab League report?

Here is the Arab League report: http://www.columbia.edu/~hauben/Report_of_Arab_League_Observer_Mission.pdf

The date is set as January 27th, 2012.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57380157/britain-france-syrian-rebels-need-to-unite/
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/02/07/us-france-syria-idUSTRE8160YH20120207
http://www.france24.com/en/20120225-pressure-mounts-assad-help-reaches-homs

All of my links are within the past month and are after the Arab League fact finding mission. Are you serious? Do you always make claims without even doing the research?
 
S

Solid warrior

Banned
Azih said:
Alright, thanks for the response. It could be that the government is only letting in journalists that it can monitor the movements of and thus control maybe?

Second question if you could. Did you think that the Bahraini security forces and Saudi military were right to do what they did in Bahrain (and are doing in fact)?
Click to expand...
Or journalists that it can protect when its possible.

The Saudi invasion was wrong. the Bahraini issue is different since there was no "Free Bahrain Army" or terrorist groups. but, anyway, the US and EU approved of the Saudi Invasion and Hillary clinton sent her assistant to promote dialogue over there unlike the Syrian Situation.
 
S

SouthernDragon

Member
Solid warrior said:
Who killed these people? and How? the videos simply doesn't show that.
Click to expand...

If we provided you with 1080p video of Assad shooting civilians while he yelled "I am Assad and I love slaughtering innocent Muslim civilians" you would claim it was a set up or an impostor.

If there was a subsequent video with him at the UN saying the same while he held his birth certificate and DNA samples you'd claim they were forgery.

However, if a dirty napkin crossed the Syrian border with the claim of "1 million Syrian troops dead fighting terrorists in Homs" you would take that claim seriously.
 
X

Xcellere

Member
Solid warrior said:
It has been reported many times that foreign intelligence such as the CIA uses their agents as correspondents, journalists. I have my very own suspicion that they are agents since the Syrian Gov claims that they're still granting license/access for foreign journalists. Why would you access the country illegally, then? I can't accuse anyone of intelligence activities and I could be wrong.
Click to expand...

OpoQQ.jpg
 
M

mercenar1e

Member
the fighting needs to be put to an end.. glad Syria is finally in control of the situation & i wouldn't be surprised if Iran's Al Quds force had something to do with it
 
A

Azih

Member
Solid warrior said:
The Saudi invasion was wrong. the Bahraini issue is different since there was no "Free Bahrain Army" or terrorist groups.
Click to expand...
But both Saudi Arabian and Bahrain claim that it was Iranian terrorists that were causing the problems in Bahrain. Hezbollah linked.

And there was a Free Libya Army, does that mean the Gadafi should have crushed that as they were terrorists?
 
S

Solid warrior

Banned
joseph1594 said:
The Syrian government claims a lot of things, does that mean everything they say is true? Feel free to prove me wrong with a link, but I do not know of any mainstream media that is officially allowed in Syria and is given all of the correct paper work by the Syrian government. I have not see any reporters from CNN, BBC, Reuters, New York Times, etc, reporting from Syria in their offices in the country. By saying "innocent" journalists, are you insinuating that Marie Colvin and Rémi Ochlik deserved to die or their deaths was just? Also, I personally have longed known about the death of Giller Jacquier by the hands of opposition forces. Does a brutal act of violence by members of the opposition excuse the brutal acts committed by members of the Syrian government? You seriously need to educate yourself about logical fallacies.

So, you say the French government is no longer pressuring the Syrian government after the Arab League report?

Here is the Arab League report: http://www.columbia.edu/~hauben/Report_of_Arab_League_Observer_Mission.pdf

The date is set as January 27th, 2012.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57380157/britain-france-syrian-rebels-need-to-unite/
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/02/07/us-france-syria-idUSTRE8160YH20120207
http://www.france24.com/en/20120225-pressure-mounts-assad-help-reaches-homs

All of my links are within the past month and are after the Arab League fact finding mission. Are you serious? Do you always make claims without even doing the research?
Click to expand...
Sorry If I wasn't clear. They stopped pressuring the Syrian Gov on the cameraman death investigation.
 
S

Solid warrior

Banned
Azih said:
But both Saudi Arabian and Bahrain claim that it was Iranian terrorists that were causing the problems in Bahrain.
Click to expand...
They've failed to produce an evidence of terrorists in Bahrain.

Unlike the Syrian Gov claim of militants presence that was confirmed by 1) media reports 2) congressional hearings 3) AL monitors 4) Youtube 5) Head of the FSA showing up on TV claiming responsibilities 6) Al-Zawihiri of Al-Qaeda calling for his fighters to head to Syria.

and the US/France/Britain/GCC are looking for ways to send them more Arms. on record.
 
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