So you only like 1? ;_;I like the looks of DDP when it's not animu moe school girls
That sounds goofy. Might as well say you don't like the art style then, because those things are part of it.You don't get what he's saying? He just means he'd prefer they apply the art style -- as in the cel-shading, the shininess, the color palette, etc -- to other subject matter, involving other fashion sensibilities, etc.
No, you shouldn't be. Suda has changed since NMH. Hell, he hasn't really done a Suda-esque Suda game since Killer7(and I loved NMH).
Those things are the subject matter. The character design, the world design. The art style is the manner in which they're rendered. In this case, high-contrast cel-shading with bold colors, shininess and lots of definition. The art style in this game could be applied to many different things -- just like how black and white is used in movies with stories spanning all time periods.That sounds goofy. Might as well say you don't like the art style then, because those things are part of it.
I wish this would go up on Amazon.com so I can place a prime order before my subscription lapses.
No, art style includes all of those things. You're basically reducing art style to nothing but vague technical qualities with your definition. I mean, "shininess", "lots of definition"? Seriously?Those things are the subject matter. The character design, the world design. The art style is the manner in which they're rendered. In this case, high-contrast cel-shading with bold colors, shininess and lots of definition. The art style in this game could be applied to many different things -- just like how black and white is used in movies with stories spanning all time periods.
∀ Narayan;46535911 said:Has there been any word on who's doing the soundtrack?
Obviously, Akira Yamaoka will have some part in it.
Obviously, Akira Yamaoka will have some part in it.
Yes, black and white is absolutely part of a film's aesthetic, and thus art style. Choosing to set it in the 1930s with all the fashion that entails is not. That's the world design and subject matter. You are literally the first person I've seen suggest otherwise, in anything ever. People don't look at The Wind Waker and decide the ocean setting is part of its art style. They see the cel-shading technique, and when other games with similar cel-shading but no ocean whatsoever appear, they don't hesitate to liken it to TWW. So it's no wonder you were confused by him doing what anyone would do, namely, singling out the cel-shading and rendering style here, the aesthetic style, the art style, and why you were confused how he could find it workable on something with... different fashion sensibilities. You've just always had a different idea and probably would think A Scanner Darkly requires a Keanu Reeves lookalike as part of its "art style," too.No, art style includes all of those things. You're basically reducing art style to nothing but vague technical qualities with your definition. I mean, "shininess", "lots of definition"? Seriously?
Also, black and white film is not an "artstyle." There are many different styles of film shot in black and white.
Am I the only one who is more or less annoyed by characters like this? With this pose? It just seems incredibly unappealing.
How is the setting and fashion not part of a film's aesthetic? It is part of how the film looks; what is filmed and depicted. If I'm the first person you've seen suggest otherwise, you must not venture outside of videogame forums or something.Yes, black and white is absolutely part of a film's aesthetic, and thus art style. Choosing to set it in the 1930s with all the fashion that entails is not. That's the world design and subject matter. You are literally the first person I've seen suggest otherwise, in anything ever.
Uh, yes they do. I've even seen it in threads about Wind Waker.People don't look at The Wind Waker and decide the ocean setting is part of its art style. They see the cel-shading technique, and when other games with similar cel-shading but no ocean whatsoever appear, they don't hesitate to liken it to TWW.
This is still nonsensical.So it's no wonder you were confused by him doing what anyone would do, namely, singling out the cel-shading and rendering style here, the aesthetic style, the art style, and why you were confused how he could find it workable on something with... different fashion sensibilities.
This pose, especially the both feet turned in part, signifies submission. You will rarely come across image of a Japanese man in this submissive pose. I personally find it a bit despicable that this depiction of submissive female characters is still so prevalent in various media hailing from contemporary Japan.
This pose, especially the both feet turned in part, signifies submission. You will rarely come across image of a Japanese man in this submissive pose. I personally find it a bit despicable that this depiction of submissive female characters is still so prevalent in various media hailing from contemporary Japan.
In critical analysis of the visual arts, the style of a work of art is often treated as distinct from its iconography, which covers the subject and the content of the work.
Did you even read the thing you linked? We are talking about a game in this topic. If we were to properly apply that definition of style to games, we would be talking about the mechanics. The "iconography" would be the content, visuals, etc. However, it's a term for the visual arts, so I think we should avoid mixing terms. I am sure better game specific terms exist.Hey Pizzaroll, here's a breakdown of art style -- what you've been describing is "iconography," separate from art style.
Pizzaroll, you just need to learn to admit when you're wrong sometimes. We're talking about the visuals of this game. That article I linked is about what constitutes art style. It's applicable to anything and everything with aesthetics -- which games have, since games have visuals. And that's how this whole conversation started -- you saying that the woman's manner of dress was part of the game's art style. It's not. The dress is part of the game's iconography. Art style, in games and movies and comic books and classical paintings -- is defined in a critical capacity as outlined at the link. Basic art history classes teach this in college.Did you even read the thing you linked? We are talking about a game in this topic. If we were to properly apply that definition of style to games, we would be talking about the mechanics. The "iconography" would be the content, visuals, etc.
I use art style as a colloquial when in conversation about games (and games only, which is why I put quotations around art style when talking about black and white in my first reply to you) for convenience.
This pose, especially the both feet turned in part, signifies submission. You will rarely come across image of a Japanese man in this submissive pose. I personally find it a bit despicable that this depiction of submissive female characters is still so prevalent in various media hailing from contemporary Japan.
It's hard to say whether he's changed or not when he hasn't been actively involved in day to day game development since NMH.
Well, I guess you could say he's changed in the sense that he's more a producer now that has his name slapped on any game to come out of Grasshopper.
I genuinely don't think that definition is applicable to games because so much of a game's "style" aside from color is done through pre-made rendering techniques and filters and dependent on it's "iconography."Pizzaroll, you just need to learn to admit when you're wrong sometimes. We're talking about the visuals of this game. That article I linked is about what constitutes art style. It's applicable to anything and everything with aesthetics -- which games have, since games have visuals. And that's how this whole conversation started -- you saying that the woman's manner of dress was part of the game's art style. It's not. The dress is part of the game's iconography. Art style, in games and movies and comic books and classical paintings -- is defined in a critical capacity as outlined at the link. Basic art history classes teach this in college.
Grasshopper got back to me about the character designer.
https://twitter.com/Grasshopper_EN/status/291739101911207936
Probably is Kozaki Yusuke so they can hype up the fact of Suda and Kozaki teaming up once again.
I disagree. There are producers out there who actually contribute significantly to their games, Kojima and Suda are good examples, Miyamoto is a bad example.
Don't be ridiculous -- the end result is what you SEE. It could be rendered in pixels, paint, crayon, charcoal, graphite, stained glass, marble, clay, mud -- the medium used doesn't change the fact that at the end of the day, however it's rendered, what you -see- has its art style critically classified NOT in terms of its iconography, or subject matter (which the girl's outfit would be), but rather elements of composition, texture, lighting, color, perspective, etc, all of which operate outside the bounds of content and constitute art style in the visual arts. And if you follow the link in that article for "visual arts," its defintion includes video media, as well (but that should be obvious -- you see video, after all, and video is made of images in sequence).I genuinely don't think that definition is applicable to games because so much of a game's "style" is done through pre-made rendering techniques and filters.
Perhaps it's an issue with the way I'm approaching it -- should I see an engine programmer as I would a painter?
I genuinely don't think that definition is applicable to games because so much of a game's "style" aside from color is done through pre-made rendering techniques and filters and dependent on it's "iconography."
Perhaps it's an issue with the way I'm approaching it -- should I see an engine programmer as I would a painter?
From your link:Don't be ridiculous -- the end result is what you SEE. It could be rendered in pixels, paint, crayon, charcoal, graphite, stained glass, marble, clay, mud -- the medium used doesn't change the fact that at the end of the day, however it's rendered, what you -see- has its art style critically classified NOT in terms of its iconography, or subject matter (which the girl's outfit would be), but rather elements of composition, texture, lighting, color, perspective, etc, all of which operate outside the bounds of content and constitute art style in the visual arts. And if you follow the link in that article for "visual arts," its defintion includes video media, as well (but that should be obvious -- you see video, after all, and video is made of images in sequence).
How many "rules" of style are established by the programmer(s) of the renderer, collaborating with the texture artists, model artists, and the concept artists? Are they artists under this definition too? There's nothing wrong with it I guess, it just sounds... odd.By changing the way they paint, apply colour, texture, perspective, or the way they see shapes and ideas, the artist establishes a certain set of "rules"
Yah and it's ridiculous how her outfit is predominantly pink. I mean, pink? Really now? Pink is color that is chiefly ascribed to females and seeing this character decorated in the color only signifies that we as a society have not yet transcended fitting gender to color.
It's all sexist and it's just sickening. She should be wearing blue.
Yeah, well, i think its HOT yeeeeeaahhhh.jpg
Where are you bringing programming into this? We're talking about what you SEE. And how you classify what you see. You can make visual media with computer code, or paint, or crayons, or whatever. Hell, you could shape it out of feces. Art is art. And art style is NOT defined by its iconography a.k.a. content, not in any critical capacity under the sun. Style is defined by colors, lighting, shading, perspective, proportions, textures, etc. Not how the subject matter is dressed.From your link:
How many "rules" of style are established by the programmer of the renderer, collaborating with the texture artists, model artists, and the concept artists? Are they artists under this definition too? There's nothing wrong with it I guess, it just sounds... odd.