Franklinator
Member
#banmonsterfracas2012
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Halo |OT7| You may leave, Juices. And take Team Downer with you.
- Thread starter GhaleonEB
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xxjuicesxx
Member
Want to play Bioshock now lol.
Steelyuhas
Member
Exactly.
Where's that video MTW promised? I wanted to see that shotty and jetpack :'(... But this guys leaks are a lot better and more clear though... Keep 'em coming, juryben!
Also, it seems the laser is a 4-Shot deal like Reach. Mixed feelings.
That would disrupt the developer's vision.
Artistic integrity.
Immersion.
HiredN00bs
Member
The Halo games have always been limited in their UI and control options. It is reasonable to assume they were designed so purposefully to keep players on as even a playing field as possible.
User 73706
Banned
Some say the world will end in fire,
Some say in ice.
From what I've tasted of desire
I hold with those who favor fire.
But if it had to perish twice,
I think I know enough of hate
To say that for destruction ice
Is also great
And would suffice.
Well that even playing field went out the window a long time ago so give us more options.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
It sure sounds louder to me. A lot louder. I'm so happy about that.
Wat?
squidhands
Member
Yep, especially when running.
Spartan Laser sounds pretty sweet now. Too bad it's such a terrible weapon to keep around, especially when a real thing of finesse and beauty has been removed.
What a beautiful gun.
edit: Stream is up. Let me know if you guys have problems with the stream. I'm testing some stuff and just doubled the bitrate
http://www.twitch.tv/tashiii
edit: Stream is up. Let me know if you guys have problems with the stream. I'm testing some stuff and just doubled the bitrate
http://www.twitch.tv/tashiii
Natural Evolution.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
a zoojoo
Barrow Roll
Member
Exactly. I wouldn't walk up to a wall in Metroid Prime and say the game looks terrible. Now those are batshit expectations.
btw, i was half joking fracas, don't go all sensygaf on me pls
A Visceral Experience.
StalkerUKCG
Banned
Hitmonchan107
Member
Totally thought this was a kylej post. :lol
User 73706
Banned
Ordninance Derps.
Feels like Halo.
So.
Let's get technical for a moment.
Here is what I have gathered, given my experience with Halo engine and how much we know about the technical details of Reach's and Halo 4's engine.
No. Although the simulation is richer, that would not effect the renderer nearly as much as it would, say, networking.
The vast amount of engineering effort and research that goes into creating the Halo engine's deffered renderer would be wasted had they decided to target 60 FPS, which I doubt was seriously considered anytime after Halo Reach was planned out.
Bungie and 343 haven't put out any presentations with stats on their rendering pipeline directly, but other very similar games and engines have:
There are single parts in the deffered pipeline that cannot get much more parallelized which already take close to or more than the 16ms allotted to render your whole entire frame in a 60 FPS game.
As in, you haven't finished fully initializing all of the renderer and filling your g-buffers, let alone drawn a single final pixel into your framebuffer before COD is already putting their finished frame on screen.
A 60 FPS Halo game on 360 would not scale to 2x worse graphics, its not like you just cut the Texture resolution or the polygons in half and get 2x better performance.
It does not scale linearly, and so it will be quite a bit worse than even Halo 3.
Along with this, Deferred renderers make it much more straight forward to maintain and create complex graphical features and lets your artist have some breathing room.
You can have your team make a ton more content if you aren't so worried about making all your assets fit a stringent specification.
All this tech is not something you would abandon in exchange for the possibility to make a 60FPS game.
That's a bad idea because you would likely end up having to manage 2 different renderers and all the glitches and optimization that goes with them and create content for two different specifications.
So it would likely have to be 60 FPS across the whole game or 30 FPS.
and as I said earlier, they aren't going to throw away all the engine work they did and also make the most expensive sequel to a Halo game yet look worse for 60FPS. These decisions are made early.
Sadly this is also unlikely.
Twice as many mille seconds affords a disproportionately greater amount of graphical ability, which is a big part of the reason why it's chosen.
Also, it can make game development quite a bit easier which is a must for games with such a huge budget,
and hey, not all games or even genres need to be at 30 FPS.
Even FPSes, especially if they got great controlls and some way to perceptually make them feel smoother.
Also Carmack seems to think that developers and publishers won't find it as important.
so...
...Sadly, yes. Although not necessarily just because they want it to look prettier.
Bioshock was very different game and was also still targeted toward 30 fps. They allowed you to unlock the framerate with a stern warning of the risk of inconsistent framerates which is far worse, especially for multiplayer.
there is a good reason why this 'feature' is off by default.
-------------------------------------
BTW, If anyone has any corrections or comments to add, I would love to hear them.
Let's get technical for a moment.
Here is what I have gathered, given my experience with Halo engine and how much we know about the technical details of Reach's and Halo 4's engine.
No. Although the simulation is richer, that would not effect the renderer nearly as much as it would, say, networking.
The vast amount of engineering effort and research that goes into creating the Halo engine's deffered renderer would be wasted had they decided to target 60 FPS, which I doubt was seriously considered anytime after Halo Reach was planned out.
Bungie and 343 haven't put out any presentations with stats on their rendering pipeline directly, but other very similar games and engines have:
There are single parts in the deffered pipeline that cannot get much more parallelized which already take close to or more than the 16ms allotted to render your whole entire frame in a 60 FPS game.
As in, you haven't finished fully initializing all of the renderer and filling your g-buffers, let alone drawn a single final pixel into your framebuffer before COD is already putting their finished frame on screen.
A 60 FPS Halo game on 360 would not scale to 2x worse graphics, its not like you just cut the Texture resolution or the polygons in half and get 2x better performance.
It does not scale linearly, and so it will be quite a bit worse than even Halo 3.
Along with this, Deferred renderers make it much more straight forward to maintain and create complex graphical features and lets your artist have some breathing room.
You can have your team make a ton more content if you aren't so worried about making all your assets fit a stringent specification.
All this tech is not something you would abandon in exchange for the possibility to make a 60FPS game.
That's a bad idea because you would likely end up having to manage 2 different renderers and all the glitches and optimization that goes with them and create content for two different specifications.
So it would likely have to be 60 FPS across the whole game or 30 FPS.
and as I said earlier, they aren't going to throw away all the engine work they did and also make the most expensive sequel to a Halo game yet look worse for 60FPS. These decisions are made early.
Sadly this is also unlikely.
Twice as many mille seconds affords a disproportionately greater amount of graphical ability, which is a big part of the reason why it's chosen.
Also, it can make game development quite a bit easier which is a must for games with such a huge budget,
and hey, not all games or even genres need to be at 30 FPS.
Even FPSes, especially if they got great controlls and some way to perceptually make them feel smoother.
Also Carmack seems to think that developers and publishers won't find it as important.
so...
...Sadly, yes. Although not necessarily just because they want it to look prettier.
Bioshock was very different game and was also still targeted toward 30 fps. They allowed you to unlock the framerate with a stern warning of the risk of inconsistent framerates which is far worse, especially for multiplayer.
there is a good reason why this 'feature' is off by default.
-------------------------------------
BTW, If anyone has any corrections or comments to add, I would love to hear them.
Man, both of those weapons sound amazing to me, I love the sniper sound, though I seem to be in the minority...
Also, quit holding out hope that this game will some how magically have a better framerate than the past games. The only thing I hope for is that forge maps don't go down to single digits like Reach.
Also, quit holding out hope that this game will some how magically have a better framerate than the past games. The only thing I hope for is that forge maps don't go down to single digits like Reach.
Rand0m TAG
Member
That isn't a smart business decision
Bregmann Roche
Member
I liked the sound of the laser and the sniper, but I was listening with headphones, not laptop speakers.
I expected you would say that, but if you read the post, the point is not that it will just look worse, but it will also make development harder and be a waste of past investments.
And for what? As much as I want Halo at 60 FPS, it won't make that much of a difference to the majority of the customers. It's bad business.
Plus, I would argue that this 30 FPS series has done some very cool things in terms of controls and perceptually fooling your brain, with things like motion blur, into thinking the game is much smoother than most other 30 fps game.
Also, a lot of these thing I mentioned heavily factor into why forge is so limited, but that's a post for another day.
The point is it is not nearly as simple as most of HaloGAF makes it out to be.
I never said it was.
HigherLevel
Member
Love those weapon sounds. Sniper sounds insane.
Rand0m TAG
Member
Weapons sound good, I hate the clanking when they throw nades
one of the finest plays I've seen in Reach.Here's the overkill extermination to win the game that all you bastards missedlol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnTJQg8u0tU
not as good as the guy who quit during the assassination which would have been the game winning kill
edit: found it
http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Reach/FileDetails.aspx?fid=16845102&player=AnAverageGamer
Hydranockz
Member
Computron dropping knowledge bombs all up in this place. Appreciated.
I agree, their explosion also sounds kinda weak, audio level wise.
I'm gonna
Demoncarnotaur
Member
Meh.. Although I will say I hope Halo 4 has more planned with the MP, the new Infinity investment system is cool, but I also want to see the gameplay and modes have new offerings.
Now where is the Gamefuel?
Damn, that Laser sound is nice.. That thing seems freaking powerful. Too bad Im not a fan of the laser.. Anyways, anyone want to .gif that?
everyday math
Banned
Love how the Laser sounds. Pretty sweet.
_Computer_
Banned
Yeah, I noticed that too. I really like what they are doing with the beefy guns sounds, but that grenade seemed a bit subdued. Maybe it'll be better up close.
OdysseusVA
Banned
HiredN00bs
Member
How so?
MaximumFlipFlop
Banned
ViewtifulJC
Banned
for the love of god
PLEASE LET ME DO THIS
LITERALLY EVERY OTHER GAME THAT IS GOOD AND THAT I ENJOY LETS ME DO THIS
holy shit
pls
also internet at my new place is pretty awesome and i'm loving it !!!!
HiredN00bs
Member
We were talking specifically about movement/look/HUD.
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