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Dictator93 · Dec 30, 2015

So do you guys think we will get some updates on Star Marine soon enough? That imo should be a pretty big priority since it would mean necessary animation work for SQ42 (re-adding in jukes, re-adding in animation transitions, etc.).

epmode · Dec 30, 2015

I have a feeling that Star Marine was scrapped.

KKRT00 · Dec 30, 2015

Dictator93 said:
So do you guys think we will get some updates on Star Marine soon enough? That imo should be a pretty big priority since it would mean necessary animation work for SQ42 (re-adding in jukes, re-adding in animation transitions, etc.).

I dont think we dont get anything concrete at all till end of second week of January.
Its generally very slow time in offices around the world ;p Lot of vacations, hangovers etc.

Dictator93 · Dec 30, 2015

epmode said:
I have a feeling that Star Marine was scrapped.

What makes you think that?

KKRT00 said:
I dont think we dont get anything concrete at all till end of second week of January.
Its generally very slow time in offices around the world ;p Lot of vacations, hangovers etc.

Yeah, I do not expect it till at least something in the coming monthly report maybe.
Roberts has mentioned it on occasion though as of late. During the last live stream for example.

epmode · Dec 30, 2015

Dictator93 said:
What makes you think that?

I guess I haven't watched official videos in a while. It just seemed that way when they dumped Illfonic and released the persistent universe ahead of schedule.

I suppose they still need the Star Marine framework for matchmaking and other MP related stuff so it's probably still coming. Feels like they tossed most of Illfonic's work though.

KKRT00 · Dec 30, 2015

epmode said:
I guess I haven't watched official videos in a while. It just seemed that way when they dumped Illfonic and released the persistent universe ahead of schedule.

I suppose they still need the Star Marine framework for matchmaking and other MP related stuff so it's probably still coming. Feels like they tossed most of Illfonic's work though.

Nah, weapons, all their effects, sounds, levels they've done, documentation on experimentation with animations etc its all worth the Illfonic time.
Generally what Illfonic has failed is animation system and netcode.

artsi · Dec 30, 2015

I'm already addicted to the game despite the lack of content at this stage.

The experience of walking to my ship, admiring all the details, opening and closing the cargo ramp, and sitting in the pilot's chair before takeoff is already worth the price I paid for my Avenger.

viveks86 · Dec 31, 2015

artsi said:
The experience of walking to my ship, admiring all the details, opening and closing the cargo ramp, and sitting in the pilot's chair before takeoff is already worth the price I paid for my Avenger.

abuC · Dec 31, 2015

artsi said:
I'm already addicted to the game despite the lack of content at this stage.

The experience of walking to my ship, admiring all the details, opening and closing the cargo ramp, and sitting in the pilot's chair before takeoff is already worth the price I paid for my Avenger.

Same here, just being able to walk around outside your ship is amazing. I can't even imagine how incredible the experience will be when you can take off from a port, land on a planet and just walk around.

tuxfool · Dec 31, 2015

Personally, I can't wait until they get the Jump mechanics into the game.

Shy · Dec 31, 2015

tuxfool said:
Personally, I can't wait until they get the Jump mechanics into the game.

Yeah, it's going to awesome sauce.

Starviper · Dec 31, 2015

tuxfool said:
Personally, I can't wait until they get the Jump mechanics into the game.

Jump mechanics? You mean like jetpacks / zero-g or like ship jumping / warp? Because the latter is already in there.

Shy · Dec 31, 2015

Starviper said:
Jump mechanics? You mean like jetpacks / zero-g or like ship jumping / warp? Because the latter is already in there.

There are two type of FTL travel, the one in the game is for short jumps.
The Second one hasn't been put into the game yet.

tuxfool · Dec 31, 2015

Shy said:
There are two type of FTL travel, the one in the game is for short jumps.
The Second one hasn't been put into the game yet.

Well, Quantum isn't really FTL...

Starviper said:
like ship jumping / warp?

Talking about Jump Points between star systems.

see this. The first part is the Jump points previz and at the end it has plain old Quantum.

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/8Bw4Q

Shy · Dec 31, 2015

tuxfool said:
Well, Quantum isn't really FTL...

My mistake. But you get the gist of what i was saying.

Felix Lighter · Dec 31, 2015

Ha ha, I got stuck in my bed at a Comm Relay and while I was trying to figure out if I could get out, someone stole my ship. At that moment I came out of bed but when I walked to the cockpit, I clipped through the ship and was left stranded in space. At least he's fighting some pirates, giving me a little light show.

I found his ship. I was moments from entering and another player blew it up in front of me. Ha this is so great. What a crazy series of events. I'm going to wait here a minute and see if I can steal a ship of my own.

Effect · Dec 31, 2015

golem said:
From what I've heard its going to be sometime in January when the packages will split (Jan 31st?)

Im sure they'll have a sale and make a big deal out of it..

Tomorrow is the last day for the old prices for customers that use the Euro

Thanks. I have some extra money from the holidays so I figure I might buy back in if I can still get both as part of the package on the off chance this manages to actually come out. My reservations from before are still there but rather hedge my bets in case I get proven wrong. Rather not pay extra if I don't have to.

MikeDown · Dec 31, 2015

Trace said:
GAF needs some sort of "you can only post about game development if you have any clue what you're talking about" rule. Do you think that the engine came from nothing? That they had hundreds of staff day one and were in full swing in 2012? The actual full asset creation time has not been very long, and for a game of this size they've been moving along at a fine pace. The problem if anything is that they're being TOO transparent, and so people think that everything in the alpha is everything they have completed for the game.

And how about the game industry has a "you need to know about game development before attempting to make a game". Because you cannot make this stuff up. Oh course the engine didn't come from nothing Crytek put alot of work into it to get it where it is at. The stuff it is able to do and render really is quite amazing an very impressive. I think everyone here understand that game development is quite intensive and can be very time consuming. I can't speak for recent updates and changes as I got my refund (thankyou paypal), but even in 2.0 the ship handling is still a clunky mess. Even if they get the bugs sorted out for me it has turned into something that isn't very fun to play. And in that respect that is my opinion, and if you like it that is great. Don't get me wrong some of their transparency is really great, but the problem is, especially in arena commander it has been presented as that distinct section of the game is finished while they work on everything else. The whole project has been mismanaged.

Akronis said:
Do you have any idea what they had to do? They had to basically re-tool huge parts of the engine to make this work.

This is a tech-heavy gaming forum. To come here and rant and rave about how they have nothing to show in 3 years is fucking disrespectful and ignorant.

I'm not here to shit on the developers and programmers trying to make this game. Building a game is time consuming and labor intensive. And to their credit they have managed to pull off some impressive things, like the recent station in 2.0 and the procedural generated planets. A lot of those things are technical feats though. Arena commander has pretty much been in the same buggy & clunky state it has been since launch. Most of the issues boil down to management, where they are assigning people, where they are putting their funds etc.

Raticus79 · Dec 31, 2015

MikeDown said:
(arena commander stuff)

Any interest in the Squadron 42 campaign or were you mainly hoping for more enhancements in the AC PVP modes (for example)?

KKRT00 · Dec 31, 2015

MikeDown said:
And how about the game industry has a "you need to know about game development before attempting to make a game". Because you cannot make this stuff up.

Its very early alpha of the systems that have never been done before, of course it will break thousands times.
I work in software development and what they've achieved and how they are handling so many studios in different timezone is ultra amazing for me.
Calling it mismanaged is an insult to the whole CIG, because what they've done and how they handled it is truly spectacular.
Having to build somehow stable version next to normal development branch is huge burden, making monthly reports, and talking in weekly shows from some departments that have like 2-3 people at most, is huge burden for them. I know, because in our company we hardly have time for required documentation, not even mention to additional documentation or some presentations to other people.
You remember all those posts from developers that said what Chris doing is not possible and never will be done? Yeah, exactly. People, from game industry, did not believe that what he is doing is possible and yet it is slowly coming to live, i 3 years from the development company that did not existed 3 years ago.

You dont enjoy gameplay, You wanted to get refund fine, its Your decision and Your money, but please do not insult them in the process when You have no knowledge to do so.

AngerdX · Dec 31, 2015

MikeDown said:
And how about the game industry ....

Never seen anyone talk this much out of his ass for something you clearly don´t care for.

We get it, you don´t like it and got your refund then why not move on, seems i gotta learn to use that ignore button.

tuxfool · Dec 31, 2015

AngerdX said:
Never seen anyone talk this much out of his ass for something you clearly don´t care for.

We get it, you don´t like it and got your refund then why not move on, seems i gotta learn to use that ignore button.

In this case it is easy to see how somebody earns a junioring.

Daedardus · Dec 31, 2015

epmode said:
I have a feeling that Star Marine was scrapped.

I wouldn't care if they did, to be honest. FPS arena wasn't the reason I backed this game.

MikeDown · Dec 31, 2015

Raticus79 said:
Any interest in the Squadron 42 campaign or were you mainly hoping for more enhancements in the AC PVP modes (for example)?

At the moment my interest n AC has been squashed by the current limitations in gameplay and by some of the advantages some players have over others. Squadron 42 I am still interested in and will probably back it again once more is shown.

KKRT00 said:
Snip.

Like I said before, I think all of us here understand the struggles in game development. And what I said is not intended to be directed at CIG as a whole, I don't work there, but if it is like traditional business the management and department leads are responsible for what and when the team puts their time and energy into, where they put their focus.

AngerdX said:
Never seen anyone talk this much out of his ass for something you clearly don´t care for.

We get it, you don´t like it and got your refund then why not move on, seems i gotta learn to use that ignore button.

At one point I did, enough to gamble a decent amount of money on it. Would still like to see CIG be able to pull through and make a great game.

Zalusithix · Dec 31, 2015

The "just using CryEngine" argument is so silly. There's been so many modifications to the engine to make it do what it does today that you'd have to be willfully ignorant to assume that CIG hasn't done any engine work and it's all Crytek's achievement. They have hired ex-Crytek people for crying out loud. (Hint: they're not working on ship sales.) And before we go down the "make their own engine" path, going with an existing proven engine and modifying it to suit their needs was the right choice given the initial budget and the lack of initially having talent in that area. Had they started out with $100 million in funding, it'd be a different case, but given the starting point it makes total sense.

Also, not every bug in AC/SC that remains for lengths of time is necessarily something they're just ignoring. Since things are in development, certain systems are subject to be tossed and replaced completely. Fixing the legacy code when it's just going to be trashed in the future doesn't make a whole lot of sense from a time perspective. They're not supporting a previous version of some production software. Arena Commander was never some finished product. It was just "good enough" while they worked on other things. Flight models, balancing, larger maps, etc were all targeted to be integrated into it in the future when they were finished. Nothing in SC is finished.

As for mismanagement.... Frankly your opinion on that means little given your lack of understanding on other things.

tuxfool · Dec 31, 2015

MikeDown said:
Like I said before, I think all of us here understand the struggles in game development. And what I said is not intended to be directed at CIG as a whole, I don't work there.

We do, you clearly don't. Given the amount of bullshit you've pulled out of your ass in an attempt to sound informed, makes this even worse.

Daedardus · Dec 31, 2015

You ever been at a bank where they develop the system software for example? It's full of people who are paid 70k a year and who actually have no idea how programming even works. It takes them at least a year to develop a simple tool and once it is out they have to scrap it because the government changed some laws. Yet the CEO is swimming in a pool of money.

Zalusithix · Dec 31, 2015

Daedardus said:
You ever been at a bank where they develop the system software for example? It's full of people who are paid 70k a year and who actually have no idea how programming even works. It takes them at least a year to develop a simple tool and once it is out they have to scrap it because the government changed some laws. Yet the CEO is swimming in a pool of money.

Enterprise level software is the fucking worst. Bugs, ancient dependencies, etc. I mean shit. We had a warning the other week about how some aspect of the software we use still doesn't support IE11. We don't use that part of it, but just seeing a warning like that makes my blood boil. Then there's the aspects like programming it in Java, yet being Windows only and interfacing with the OS using old ass libraries. Support USB? Nah, serial will do. Just use the serial emulation driver for the USB device! Meanwhile the CEO is one of the highest paid in the nation (was actually the highest paid a few years back).

Of course comparing mismanagement of a project to anything enterprise is disingenuous. Those disasters are special cases that typically only work due to their size and monopolistic tendencies.

Dreams-Visions · Dec 31, 2015

Zalusithix said:
Enterprise level software is the fucking worst. Bugs, ancient dependencies, etc. I mean shit. We had a warning the other week about how some aspect of the software we use still doesn't support IE11. We don't use that part of it, but just seeing a warning like that makes my blood boil. Then there's the aspects like programming it in Java, yet being Windows only and interfacing with the OS using old ass libraries. Support USB? Nah, serial will do. Just use the serial emulation driver for the USB device! Meanwhile the CEO is one of the highest paid in the nation (was actually the highest paid a few years back).

Of course comparing mismanagement of a project to anything enterprise is disingenuous. Those disasters are special cases that typically only work due to their size and monopolistic tendencies.

I knew of some banks still running on Fortran.

If it ain't broke, they don't want it fixed.

Daedardus · Dec 31, 2015

Zalusithix said:
Enterprise level software is the fucking worst. Bugs, ancient dependencies, etc. I mean shit. We had a warning the other week about how some aspect of the software we use still doesn't support IE11. We don't use that part of it, but just seeing a warning like that makes my blood boil. Then there's the aspects like programming it in Java, yet being Windows only and interfacing with the OS using old ass libraries. Support USB? Nah, serial will do. Just use the serial emulation driver for the USB device! Meanwhile the CEO is one of the highest paid in the nation (was actually the highest paid a few years back).

Of course comparing mismanagement of a project to anything enterprise is disingenuous. Those disasters are special cases that typically only work due to their size and monopolistic tendencies.

Hey, it actually gets programmed in Java. Most banks still use COBOL. Many people shit on Microsoft, Google, Apple... but at least they know how to run a company and produce decent code. I've seen some code from small start ups and most of it is really bad and wonky. I'm in power engineering but I can write better code in C++ than them. So people complaining about software projects: wait till you've seen the worst.

Zabojnik · Dec 31, 2015

Everything is going to be daijoubu.

Zalusithix · Dec 31, 2015

Dreams-Visions said:
I knew of some banks still running on Fortran.

If it ain't broke, they don't want it fixed.

Daedardus said:
Hey, it actually gets programmed in Java. Most banks still use COBOL. Many people shit on Microsoft, Google, Apple... but at least they know how to run a company and produce decent code. I've seen some code from small start ups and most of it is really bad and wonky. I'm in power engineering but I can write better code in C++ than them. So people complaining about software projects: wait till you've seen the worst.

The use of Fortran and COBOL can at least be attributed to age. The Java with Windows dependencies and old 3rd party interface code doesn't get that excuse. That's just shit design from the get go. (Or being so cheap that they only hired Java devs straight out of college with an associates degree in CS.) We're talking a national company that creates software for other businesses to use, not some internal project created by a few devs.

Google, MS, Apple and other companies that at least produce some products intended for consumers tend to have much better software. They wouldn't be able to get away peddling shit in a market that tends to have more competition and much larger blowback from failures.

Alas, this is getting off topic, so to pull things back on topic: Zab, fill out your data in the roster you lazy bum!

Akronis · Dec 31, 2015

Zalusithix said:
The use of Fortran and COBOL can at least be attributed to age. The Java with Windows dependencies and old 3rd party interface code doesn't get that excuse. That's just shit design from the get go. (Or being so cheap that they only hired Java devs straight out of college with an associates degree in CS.) We're talking a national company that creates software for other businesses to use, not some internal project created by a few devs.

Google, MS, Apple and other companies that at least produce some products intended for consumers tend to have much better software. They wouldn't be able to get away peddling shit in a market that tends to have more competition and much larger blowback from failures.

Alas, this is getting off topic, so to pull things back on topic: Zab, fill out your data in the roster you lazy bum!

Software companies in general will have more competent programmers.

Enterprise level software is terrible generally because no one gives IT any money or time to do it properly. Or other departments just hire $300/hr contractors to create some jank piece of shit that works in 2 weeks and then dumps it on IT to support without telling anyone.

We have a whole host of .NET applications here and they are amateurish at best. Because no one actually cares enough to make them better and no one has time to spend 500+ hours to rewrite them.

BritBloke916 · Dec 31, 2015

OK, I've decided to jump in. I don't have a PC that can handle it just yet but I'm planning on building a capable rig for Oculus, and I love all the video coverage I've seen so far. I'll definitely be picking it up at some point so I'll grab an Avenger package now before they split out the game downloads.

Any chance that someone would please PM me a referral code? I'll add myself to the GAF roster but only when I'm in a position to actually play!

tuxfool · Dec 31, 2015

BritBloke916 said:
OK, I've decided to jump in. I don't have a PC that can handle it just yet but I'm planning on building a capable rig for Oculus, and I love all the video coverage I've seen so far. I'll definitely be picking it up at some point so I'll grab an Avenger package now before they split out the game downloads.

Any chance that someone would please PM me a referral code? I'll add myself to the GAF roster but only when I'm in a position to actually play!

You can add yourself even if you're not in a position to play. All you need is to have an account at RSI.

Aztechnology · Dec 31, 2015

BritBloke916 said:
OK, I've decided to jump in. I don't have a PC that can handle it just yet but I'm planning on building a capable rig for Oculus, and I love all the video coverage I've seen so far. I'll definitely be picking it up at some point so I'll grab an Avenger package now before they split out the game downloads.

Any chance that someone would please PM me a referral code? I'll add myself to the GAF roster but only when I'm in a position to actually play!

I sent you my referral code. If someone already sent you one I'd recommend you let us know though as I imagine quite a few people will send you theirs and it may become an annoyance.

Xplatformer · Dec 31, 2015

Daedardus said:
I wouldn't care if they did, to be honest. FPS arena wasn't the reason I backed this game.

You only wanted Squadron 42?

Zalusithix · Dec 31, 2015

Xplatformer said:
You only wanted Squadron 42?

I believe he doesn't care about a separate module focused only on that ala AC. That's not to say he doesn't want the shooting mechanics in general required for SC.

BritBloke916 · Dec 31, 2015

OK, I'm all set for a referral code. Thanks to everyone who sent me one, I'll go with the first I received (tuxfool) but I really appreciate the support. Can't wait to get myself into a position where I can be contributing back to the GAF fleet!

Xplatformer · Dec 31, 2015

Zalusithix said:
I believe he doesn't care about a separate module focused only on that ala AC. That's not to say he doesn't want the shooting mechanics in general required for SC.

Oh...that i agree with.

But in the PU I very much envision having fps combat with the Vanduul. Hopefully on a planet and not just in a Vanduul ship we raid.

Those are "my" expectations and why I'll continue to contribute to this project.

staticneuron · Jan 1, 2016

Zalusithix said:
I believe he doesn't care about a separate module focused only on that ala AC. That's not to say he doesn't want the shooting mechanics in general required for SC.

If it means more resources can be put towards PU or S42, I don't mind them scrapping that idea.

SRTtoZ · Jan 1, 2016

I couldn't be happier with the way my Freelancer ended up looking. I always thought it should have been bigger, and the inside was always very bare bones with some of the designs making little sense but they really did a great job with the redesign. I adore this thing so much now <3

patchday · Jan 1, 2016

Tried watching a youtube vid but it wasted my time.

Not clear on insurance. Wanted to buy a Merlin to get started but I see it has 3 month insurance or something like that. So does that mean after 3 months if it gets blown up (and I forget to re-insure) its gone? Surely ships purchased with real monies dont go away like that

Rephin · Jan 1, 2016

patchday said:
Tried watching a youtube vid but it wasted my time.

Not clear on insurance. Wanted to buy a Merlin to get started but I see it has 3 month insurance or something like that. So does that mean after 3 months if it gets blown up (and I forget to re-insure) its gone? Surely ships purchased with real monies dont go away like that

They do, in fact, go away if you forget to insure it. This shouldn't be a problem though, because
- the game will probably remind you that you're going out with an uninsured ship
- the insurance is supposedly easy to earn / not expensive
- even if you lose your last ship there are plenty of ways to earn money without owning a ship, such as being a crew member on someone else's ship (and trust me, that won't be a problem if you happen to join the GAF Org and its multitude of multi-crew ships)

Also, you need to buy a game package if you're looking to play. The Merlin is a standalone ship that has no game included (and is handicapped in the travel department as it can't even do a Quantum Jump). The cheapest packages are the Mustang Alpha and Aurora MR for $45 and will get you access to the game and Squadron 42 (for now).

patchday · Jan 1, 2016

Thanks a lot!

So if I lose my last ship-- it sounds like I can earn ingame money to buy it back? Thanks that resolves my concern. But sounds like its pretty hard to lose it. Was just afraid I might stop playing and come back forgetting to reinsure the ship

Rephin · Jan 1, 2016

patchday said:
Thanks a lot!

So if I lose my last ship-- it sounds like I can earn ingame money to buy it back? Thanks that resolves my concern. But sounds like its pretty hard to lose it. Was just afraid I might stop playing and come back forgetting to reinsure the ship

Yeah. You can technically buy any ship currently being sold for cash with in-game credits once the game is finalized and released, so your first ship is a jumping off point. You may not even need to use it depending on how often you decide to help with multi-crew tasks, and you can save money that way and buy something better in the future. Three months insurance is a lot of time and unless you really didn't do anything in the game there's no reason you won't be able to pay insurance or even upgrade to something cooler.

masterkajo · Jan 1, 2016

patchday said:
Thanks a lot!

So if I lose my last ship-- it sounds like I can earn ingame money to buy it back? Thanks that resolves my concern. But sounds like its pretty hard to lose it. Was just afraid I might stop playing and come back forgetting to reinsure the ship

And apparently 3 months insurance is not 3 months in real time but rather means that for each day you log in in the game one day of the insurance will be deducted. So if you log in each day consecutively in 3 months the insurance lasts you exactly 3 months. But if you only log in during the weekends, your insurance covers you for quite some time.

Shy · Jan 1, 2016

HAPPY NEW CITIZENS <3

staticneuron · Jan 1, 2016

Happy New Years!!

Shy · Jan 1, 2016

staticneuron said:
Happy New Years!!

You too.

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