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Customers Called 'Fat' on Restaurant Bill
- Thread starter Bel Marduk
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I agree - being a fat-arse is very low on the scale. If you're fat, you can more than likely change, or just accept it - whatever. Not the same as being LBGT or a different colour skin.
You're just Ramblin.
Indeed I am. I've tried to avoid this thread because it's a lost cause. Young dudes don't have weight problems, even if they were fat once, even if it was the hardest thing they've ever done and continue to do, they did it and that means you can too. But only if you're smart and have discipline. If you don't that means you're not really a human being, you're just a fat zombie chasing them.
Shouta
Member
You are accountable for your own words. Now, if you never apologize to anyone for unintentionally hurting them, at the very least you're being consistent. You may be seen as jerk but at least you're a jerk to everyone. If you've ever apologized for hurting with misspoken words but yet refuse so in certain circumstances, there simply is no excuse. You have to own up to it. Otherwise, you look like a worse person for it.
I will agree with you in that the root of why racially charged words are considered distasteful is that they denote something beyond that basic signification. However, going even more basic than that, those are words that used to separate one group from another. They're used to say that you don't belong and aren't the same as us thus you don't deserve the same treatment.
The word fat is an adjective and it can be used in a simple, descriptive manner. However, with certain attitudes, intents and situations, it can be used to diminish someone. In the case of the response to the news story, folks are saying "It's the truth." What point does saying that serve? They were insulted and the response to it is, "It's a fact." That doesn't do anything to plainly state the situation, it's a comment that diminishes them further because it says that their anger isn't justified. There are certainly situations where the comment is appropriate but in this case, it only serves to make them feel like they weren't being treated like they deserve to be, as human beings.
And that's why many people make the parallel to racially-charged terms. It's not about whether you are born with it or it's a choice or whatever other circumstances are involved. It's about being treated just like everyone else. There is no reason to treat anyone differently except in specific circumstances, like being a jerk to you or a criminal.
Treating people that better is a certainly a fine position. What I, and many others, have a problem with is treating people as less equal. It makes you look like a worse person because you lack any sort of compassion for people, which, as Opiate says, is probably the only true failing.
In fact, the attitude I'm prescribing is how you encourage people to get better and be better. You lose ground with someone if you treat them as less and praise the ones that change because it generates a negative view of their existence. But if you treat someone as equal and praise them for being even better, then they'll feel good about themselves and will enact changes far more easily. As many people say, positive reinforcement is far better than negative reinforcement and treating everyone equally is a part of it.
Devolution
Member
This is a great point.
So rather than ban people, mods here will just compliment them on the goods posts they've made?
I was joking, but it's good to hear anyway.
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
God damn, first Evilore endorses misogynistic slurs and rape jokes, now fat phobia. I'm done with this forum.
Oh no
With reactions like these, I wonder how some gaffers survive day to day life.
Count Dookkake
Member
Please, it's lardophobia.
Devolution
Member
I'd honestly love to see some of the shit gaffers say said out loud in real life.
Escape Goat
Member
Ban trans fat. I find the term offensive towards LGBT individuals.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Since being overweight is one of the most visibly obvious physical attributes of a person, and with humans being visually-based creatures, it gets a disproportionate amount of scorn.
It's too bad that oftentimes we all need to remember to treat our fellow citizens with more respect than we might initially give.
It seems like the same basic arguments are being repeated over and over again. Yes, you should try to strive to not be overweight, but no, that doesn't mean others have carte blanche to dehumanize you, etc.
Uh no. You may want to try again at interpreting the situation.
It's too bad that oftentimes we all need to remember to treat our fellow citizens with more respect than we might initially give.
It seems like the same basic arguments are being repeated over and over again. Yes, you should try to strive to not be overweight, but no, that doesn't mean others have carte blanche to dehumanize you, etc.
Uh no. You may want to try again at interpreting the situation.
Like the overreactions about morbidly obese women being called fat (not even directly, either)? If so I agree.
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Typical GAF would be like, we should learn to appreciate women of thickness than stick model thin models...quite honestly surprised there isn't more of a defense force here
Have you ever seen a model struggle to breath while just standing around doing nothing? I haven't.
By ignoring mean people. If I think a person or group of people are cruel or mean spirited, I simply dismiss them and do not talk to them. They are beneath me and I do not need them, as I have plenty of friends as is. This is essentially what that poster is suggesting he'll do to NeoGAF. If he thinks it's a mean spirited place, his reaction is exactly the correct one; ignore NeoGAF.
Keep in mind that I'm not saying that I personally believe NeoGAF is a mean place; I'm saying that leaving GAF is the reasonable, adult approach if you think the place is mean spirited and cruel.
I would urge caution here: if you reach the conclusion that the problem isn't that you're mean, it's that everyone else around you is just too sensitive, you are quite likely to being mean and/or unfair. It isn't a guarantee, but it's certainly a red flag that makes me pause and consider whether I'm being reasonable and compassionate.
It's much like going down a street where you can't see the speed limit, but you're going much faster than everyone else -- it's possible that everyone else is going too slowly, and you're doing it just right, but it's more likely that you're the one that's going the wrong speed, not everyone else.
speculawyer
Member
Attitudes generally don't cause diabetes and heart disease.
Shouta
Member
But attitudes cause bullying, eating disorders, and suicides (or self-esteem issues that may lead to it).
Devolution
Member
No, the type of posts where people reveal their ugly opinions about various groups that they wouldn't dare utter elsewhere.
But they do cause depression, anxiety, sadness, violence, and anger, among many other things.
In short: being a jerk is much worse than being fat.
Shouta said:
And these.
That's what I'd like to know, honestly.
Lol, what does my participation in this discussion has to do with anything?
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Yep. We need to keep sociological and psychological damage in mind as well as the physical damage.
Based on your posts, I wouldn't say fit EvilLore is a hundred times the person fat EvilLore was, in fact, quite the opposite. Seems to me that whilst fit EvilLore looks better, his personally is less admirable, ie he's less tolerant, more judgemental, more insensitive and more shallow to boot, at least when it comes to the issue of weight.
I'm not an advocate of not discussing fat reducing solutions with those closest to you, at least in a polite way, but to complete strangers? No. They don't need to hear my shit and I don't need to be outwardly judgemental. For all I know they might be happier being fat (especially if food is one of their main loves), save for having to deal with insensitive and judgemental idiots, mocking, asserting or bullying them by pretending to highlight their fatness (under the false guise of helping or combating the issue), as if they weren't already aware of it.
I've met thousands of fat people in my life, and I wouldn't say they've been any less of a person than those that I've met that haven't been fat, in fact, where it most counts, in personality, often times I'd say largely the opposite. Anecdotal mind you.
I'm glad these people exist or else I may have not had the motivation to drop from obese to a healthy weight. Isolated from the opinions of others, I would have been perfectly happy with my horrible diet and lack of physical activity.
I just want to make sure you're aware that you are essentially endorsing mean spirited peer pressure and ridicule because it could possibly motivate someone to improve themselves. If I went around telling most of the people I meet that they are stupid and ignorant, and this happens to motivate someone in some small part to go back to school and get more educated, does that suggest that what I did was good?
Of course not, unless you are absolutely Machiavellian.
As a completely separate and equally valid argument, it has generally been shown that positive reinforcement is more effective at motivating people than negative reinforcement. Instead of using the whip, we could use the carrot. So if simply motivating people is our only goal, being mean is not only mean (by definition), it's likely to be less effective.
In my experience as a gay man, "just accepting it" was precisely the ticket to being able to escape my depression and begin to establish some semblance of self-esteem. I can't speak of any personal experiences with weight, but I know some overweight people - some on this forum - for whom learning to accept their weight that they are at after trying and failing to lose and keep it off - has been similarly important to them.
So isolated from others you would have been happy with your horrible diet and physical activity? Then who would have cared? Be happy.
Well, those people very likely added many years to my life so I'm not going to be against them.
By the way, what is positive reinforcement considering there seems to be no gentle way to tell someone they're overweight.
You should become a good samaritan and tell little kids they are fat. If you start shaming them young, they won't have to go through the pain and embarrassment of going through puberty as obese and avoid bullying. Of course, this is not going far enough. You need to inform their parents how terrible they are and if they are also overweight, which the odds are they are, do not refrain from letting them know how fat they are.
You'll receive accolades for your community service. Post pictures of your medals for us to see.
les papillons sexuels
Banned
i just dont know what elese you would call them.
Yes, fat is the only conceivable word. We need to limit our vocabulary to words 4 letters in length or less.
Yes, so you are indeed endorsing absolute Machiavellian-ism. That isn't a judgement; I just want to clearly define your position. Cruelty and meanness are okayif they happen to help you lose weight, get educated, etc.. I do not agree but that isn't an illogical position.
Reminding people of the benefits of fitness rather than the downsides of obesity. Making people feel good about themselves and any positive progress they make, rather than making them feel bad and ridiculing them when they pig out, etc.
les papillons sexuels
Banned
well "latino"? maybe "italian?" would've been racists, "girls/ladies" would've been sexist. We could say portly or chubby, and sure, but that's the same thing. If someone gave me a ticket that said "fags at table 1", I'd laugh and draw a picture of a dick on the back of the reciept. People need thicker skin.
Devolution
Member
Right, calling someone ladies is totally and completely sexist and we would have torn anyone calling them that a new asshole. Fat is clearly a kind, respectable thing to call someone. Like if I met your mother and just said "Hello fat woman", I would be seen as a gentleman.
"Table # 42" would have worked just fine. "Three women" if you absolutely insist on a descriptive title. You could also simply not label the chit at all. Those are just off the top of my head, of course: I'm sure I could come up with more innocuous examples if needed.
You are insinuating that their IQ is well below average. Fat is the perfect and completely acceptable answer. :/
les papillons sexuels
Banned
well, at least he didn't call them lady chinky eyes. That article made me laugh pretty hard. Sure, that's probably the appriate thing to do, but really, it's 3 letters, does it really offend people that much to be called names?
Come to the US and call a black person a NAGGER. Make sure you say it fast. Go ahead.
Gentleman Jack
Member
Getting a judgmental note on a bill is insulting. "Pay up fat girls." Get it through your head.
Parents with obese kids should be called out on it. I may be a shitty person but nobody in my life is going to raise kids on soda, happy meals, and candy bars without me making it known I disapprove.
Post the medals you receive for your community service. If you make sure you tell every parent of an obese child just what you think of them and their little darlings, you will soon be raking in the cash with all the offers for motivational speaking tours, television interviews, self-help books and seminars. I see a bright future ahead. Just be sure to be aggressive about it.
Gentleman Jack
Member
Seems like only 20 posts ago that someone mentioned how ineffective negative reinforcement is as a tool to achieve positive results.
Devolution
Member
Facts are for fatties and fat sympathizers.
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