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My idea for an MLB divisional realignment/exapansion

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E

EdReedFan20

Member
This is my fantastical idea for a divisional realignment. It would consist of four divisions, with four teams per division (a la NFL). To accomplish this I made two expansion teams (Richmond, VA and Portland, OR) and moved two teams (Colorado and Toronto- apologies if you have allegiances to either of those teams). Also, many of the teams remain in their current cities, but have been shuffled to different divisions. One primary goal was to make the teams in each division as geographically close to each other as possible. I also want to note this is sort of fantastical and probably not practical at the moment. Edit- Due to passionate feedback, I have returned the Blue Jays to Toronto and the Rockies to Colorado. Again, I want to reiterate this is not necessarily realistic or practical. And please, come up with your own ideas. I'd really like to see them, as there has already been some really intriguing, out side the box stuff.

This is the setup I came up with:

American League

American League East
  • Baltimore Orioles
  • Boston Red Sox
  • New York Yankees
  • Toronto Blue Jays
American League North (New Divsion)
  • Cleveland Indians (Formerly American League Central)
  • Detroit Tigers (Formerly American League Central)
  • Minnesota Twins (Formerly American League Cental)
  • Chicago White Sox (Formerly American League Central)
American League South (New Division)
  • Texas Rangers (Formerly American League West)
  • Houston Astros (Formerly American League West)
  • Kansas City Royals (Formerly American League Central)
  • New Orleans Crawdads (Formerly Tampa Bay Rays) (Formerly American League East)
American League West
  • Los Angeles Angels
  • Portland Sailors (Expansion Team)
  • Oakland Athletics
  • Seattle Mariners
National League

National League East
  • Indianapolis Racers (Expansion Team)
  • New York Mets
  • Philadelphia Phillies
  • Pittsburgh Pirates (Formerly National League Central)
National League North (New Division)
  • Chicago Cubs (Formerly National League Central)
  • Cincinnati Reds (Formerly National League Central)
  • Milwaukee Brewers (Formerly National League Central)
  • St. Louis Cardinals (Formerly National League Central)
National League South (New Division
  • Atlanta Braves (Formerly National League East)
  • Charlotte Sluggers (Formerly Arizona Diamondbacks) (Formerly National League West)
  • Miami Marlins (Formerly National League East)
  • Washington Nationals (Formerly National League East)
National League West
  • Colorado Rockies
  • Los Angeles Dodgers
  • San Diego Padres
  • San Francisco Giants

I'm not sold on the team names for Portland/Charlotte. However, I am satisfied with the names I came up with for Indianapolis/New Orleans.

Thoughts? Agree? Disagree? If not, how would you handle expansion/realignment, if at all?
 
K

Kuroyume

Banned
I like the idea of the Pirates being in the nl east again but I don't see the point of all this. What's wrong with the current set up?

What I would do is bring the Pirates to the east and relegate the Marlins to the minor leagues.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
Kuroyume said:
I like the idea of the Pirates being in the nl east again but I don't see the point of all this. What's wrong with the current set up?
Click to expand...

Nothing. This is just a fun little thought of mine. I do think there may come a day when expansion is legitimately brought up, though.
 
M

MechDX

Member
The Astros need to go back to the National League. You do not just throw away 50 years of history because the new owner is a cheapskate.
 
R

ryseing

Member
- Why does the Virginia/MD area need three teams?

- Colorado is 10th in attendance, and Toronto 17th. Why move them? TB seems like a much better choice.

- Geography really doesn't matter in the age of chartered planes.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
ryseing said:
- Why does the Virginia area need three teams?

- Colorado is 10th in attendance, and Toronto 17th. Why move them? TB seems like a much better choice.

- Geography really doesn't matter in the age of chartered planes.
Click to expand...

Again, this isn't exactly realistic right now. With Toronto, I just have a gut feeling in the next few decades when it comes time to need a new ball park the team could move (or at least threaten to). Also, having every team within the contiguous US would create less issues for some players. I remember a bizarre story where Adam Jones of the Orioles almost couldn't enter Canada to play the Blue Jays because customs thought he was Adam "Pac Man" Jones of the NFL, who has certainly had his fair share of legal issues. But, yeah as for Richmond, that city is probably too close to DC/Baltimore considering the O's (and Nat's too?) viewing rights extend all the way down to North Carolina. It's so bizarre whenever I've visited family down there to watch an O's game that far out of Baltimore without needing to use MLB.tv
 
H

Hazmat

Member
MechDX said:
The Astros need to go back to the National League. You do not just throw away 50 years of history because the new owner is a cheapskate.
Click to expand...

I don't blame the new owner, but the Astros move to the AL was such bullshit. If there are only two teams in all of Texas they need to be in different leagues.
 
R

ryseing

Member
EdReedFan20 said:
Again, this isn't exactly realistic right now. With Toronto, I just have a feeling in the next few decades when it comes time to need a new ball park the team could move (or at least threaten to). But, yeah as for Richmond, that city is probably too close to DC/Baltimore considering the O's (and Nat's too?) viewing rights extend all the way down to North Carolina. It's so bizarre whenever I've visited family down there to watch an O's game that far out of Baltimore without needed to use MLB.tv
Click to expand...

Apologies. Didn't mean to sound rude.

MLB isn't giving up the Toronto market any time soon, plus Rogers has more money than God. I don't think a new park will be an issue.

I'm from NC. You'd be shocked how many O's fans there are down here. Probably second or third to the Braves/Yanks. I think we get some Nats stuff yes. Where I grew up it was Braves primarily though.
 
S

smokeandmirrors

Banned
Actually this doesn't seem too bad. At least the moving Pittsburgh to the NL East thing. I really like that idea. Talk about a geographically small division.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
Corran Horn said:
Poor Canada
Click to expand...

I remember a few months ago hearing that Montreal could somehow get a new team. How and from where? I don't know. I see two options. Either a poor performing team (attendance or performance wise) would move there or there would be expansion. If they go the expansion route, I doubt they would add just one team. That would create schedule unbalance. You would have 15 teams in one league and 16 in another.

Edit- A quick search yielded me this: http://nesn.com/2013/04/montreal-could-get-mlb-team-if-city-approves-downtown-stadium-video/
 
Z

zychi

Banned
Give MTL a team back. Put them in the NL East
Put Miami in the AL East.
If Portland or another city can handle a team, put them in their respective AL division.

BTTF
Cubs beat Miami in WS.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
zychi said:
Give MTL a team back. Put them in the NL East
Put Miami in the AL East.
If Portland or another city can handle a team, put them in their respective AL division.

BTTF
Cubs beat Miami in WS.
Click to expand...

But.. but... It had to already have happened. Marty went to 2015. And where are Jaws 5-18. They have to hurry up before Jaws 19 releases later this year...

But, to what you are saying, maybe TB could go to MTL and, like you said, MIA goes to AL East to replace them. Still would like to see Indy and Portland get a team.
 
T

timetokill

Banned
Moving the Rockies makes no sense. They get good attendance and Denver is a sizable market.

I do like the idea of Portland getting a team, but I'm not sure how well it would work in practice.

Sailors, though? nah. Call 'em the Microbrewers. :p
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
timetokill said:
Moving the Rockies makes no sense. They get good attendance and Denver is a sizable market.

I do like the idea of Portland getting a team, but I'm not sure how well it would work in practice.

Sailors, though? nah. Call 'em the Microbrewers. :p
Click to expand...

I only moved them to keep to my geographic requirement.

Also, with that name, they might as well be the AAA affiliate for Milwaukee ;p
 
P

PROh1bited

Banned
EdReedFan20 said:
Again, this isn't exactly realistic right now.With Toronto, I just have a gut feeling in the next few decades when it comes time to need a new ball park the team could move (or at least threaten to). Also, having every team within the contiguous US would create less issues for some players. I remember a bizarre story where Adam Jones of the Orioles almost couldn't enter Canada to play the Blue Jays because customs thought he was Adam "Pac Man" Jones of the NFL, who has certainly had his fair share of legal issues. But, yeah as for Richmond, that city is probably too close to DC/Baltimore considering the O's (and Nat's too?) viewing rights extend all the way down to North Carolina. It's so bizarre whenever I've visited family down there to watch an O's game that far out of Baltimore without needing to use MLB.tv
Click to expand...

What!? Jeez. Man I guess we should all start listening to your gut feeling. You seem to be an expert on this stuff. Are you still mad when Cito didn't put in Mussina in the 93 All Star game?
 
A

alstein

Member
If you expand to 32, here's how I'd do it

4 leagues of 8

Play your own league 14 times
Play the other league 8 times (league you play rotates every year)

NL: Braves, Cubs, Pirates, Phillies, Dodgers, Giants, Reds, Cards
AL: Yankees, Red Sox, Orioles, Twins, Indians, A's, Tigers, White Sox
Federal League: Padres, D-Backs, Rockies, Astros, Nationals, Marlins, Mets , Carolina Bulls (Durham-expansion team)
Union League: Blue Jays, Brewers, Mariners, Angels, Rays, Rangers, Royals, Expos (Montreal-expansion team)

Geography weird but based on history: older/newer teams.

All-Star Game rosters are 10 position players each league, 5 pitchers. They're combined with the league you interleague with that year for the All-Star game

Playoffs - no more wild card teams, go straight to LCS/WS to cut down on postseason- you LCS with the team you played interleague that year

DH rule is implemented in all leagues, relievers have to finish a full inning or throw 30 pitches, whichever comes first unless injured. Failure to finish any inning makes you ineligible to pitch for 3 games.
 
H

hodayathink

Member
EdReedFan20 said:
Again, this isn't exactly realistic right now. With Toronto, I just have a gut feeling in the next few decades when it comes time to need a new ball park the team could move (or at least threaten to). Also, having every team within the contiguous US would create less issues for some players. I remember a bizarre story where Adam Jones of the Orioles almost couldn't enter Canada to play the Blue Jays because customs thought he was Adam "Pac Man" Jones of the NFL, who has certainly had his fair share of legal issues. But, yeah as for Richmond, that city is probably too close to DC/Baltimore considering the O's (and Nat's too?) viewing rights extend all the way down to North Carolina. It's so bizarre whenever I've visited family down there to watch an O's game that far out of Baltimore without needing to use MLB.tv
Click to expand...

Outside of your insistence that all the teams should be in the US, there's really no good reason not only to move Toronto to Indianapolis, but to move Cleveland to the AL East. Toronto is further east than Cleveland, and closer to New York and Boston.

Edit: And my actual issue with that is that you're breaking up a 100+ year old division rivalry for no real reason. Chicago, Cleveland and Detroit date back to the start of the American League (technically Minnesota does as well, but I'm not sure I want to count their Washington Senators days for this argument), and have a ton of history between them that it doesn't make sense to break up without a real reason to.
 
D

doctorcdcs

Member
EdReedFan20 said:
Again, this isn't exactly realistic right now. With Toronto, I just have a gut feeling in the next few decades when it comes time to need a new ball park the team could move (or at least threaten to).....
Click to expand...


haha. no..


no.


Maybe when interbrew owned the team, but not with Roger's Communications not only owning the team, but also the stadium and the multiple TV stations that broadcast pretty much every game across the country.
 
V

vas_a_morir

Banned
I know it would make geographic sense, but I would prefer the Pirates instead of the Brewers in the NL North simply because the teams within are ANCIENT. Cubs, Pirates, Cardinals, and Reds are some of the oldest teams in baseball. Brewers don't fit.

BTW, I've heard momentum over the years is growing for an Expos return as an expansion team. All they needed was a modern stadium. :( Fans would really come out and support the team now they've been deprived for 10 years.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
alstein said:
If you expand to 32, here's how I'd do it

4 leagues of 8

Play your own league 14 times
Play the other league 8 times (league you play rotates every year)

NL: Braves, Cubs, Pirates, Phillies, Dodgers, Giants, Reds, Cards
AL: Yankees, Red Sox, Orioles, Twins, Indians, A's, Tigers, White Sox
Federal League: Padres, D-Backs, Rockies, Astros, Nationals, Marlins, Mets , Carolina Bulls (Durham-expansion team)
Union League: Blue Jays, Brewers, Mariners, Angels, Rays, Rangers, Royals, Expos (Montreal-expansion team)

Geography weird but based on history: older/newer teams.

All-Star Game rosters are 10 position players each league, 5 pitchers. They're combined with the league you interleague with that year for the All-Star game

Playoffs - no more wild card teams, go straight to LCS/WS to cut down on postseason- you LCS with the team you played interleague that year

DH rule is implemented in all leagues, relievers have to finish a full inning or throw 30 pitches, whichever comes first unless injured. Failure to finish any inning makes you ineligible to pitch for 3 games.
Click to expand...

I really like that idea, but I do think there should still be two main leagues (say one has AL/NL divisions and the other has FL/UL divsions). I also think there would be push back on eliminating pitchers that hit. It's too ingrained into this history of the sport.

doctorcdcs said:
haha. no..


no.


Maybe when interbrew owned the team, but not with Roger's Communications not only owning the team, but also the stadium and the multiple TV stations that broadcast pretty much every game across the country.
Click to expand...

Has Rogers ever hinted at funding a new ballpark? I don't know much about them, but from what posters are saying here they are loaded with money. When the time does finally comes for a new ballpark, whenever that may be, they'll probably build one of the most state-of-the-art, amenity-filled ballparks ever built. Like Yankee Stadium level of features. I wonder though, if they would just opt for renovations like Dodgers Stadium did. If they did, I could see the roof being completely replaced by a more modern style retractable roof. I remember a few years ago, the roof needed to be closed when a rain storm came in. Unfortunately the roof got stuck and couldn't close fully. I can't remember if the rain was falling on the pitchers or between the pitchers and the batters, but either way it was a bizarre sight to see. If I remember correctly, I think it finally closed up between innings.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
Duane Cunningham said:
OP, as a Royals fan, I think those divisions sound GREAT!
Click to expand...

Yeah, that would be unfair to the competition, wouldn't it?

BigJonsson said:
Get rid of Toronto? Your baseball fantasy is a fantasy
Click to expand...

It is. And I wouldn't want it to happen in real life, since Toronto is one the better baseball cities. The only team I realistically see in danger of moving is Tampa Bay. They just don't have the attendance numbers or the long tradition. I do think that Indy deserves a team, though. I've always found it weird they don't have one. I guess they are too close to Chicago's two teams and Cincinnati. Portland actually was a finalist to get the Expos if I remember correctly.
 
A

alstein

Member
EdReedFan20 said:
I really like that idea, but I do think there should still be two main leagues (say one has AL/NL divisions and the other has FL/UL divsions). I also think there would be push back on eliminating pitchers that hit. It's too ingrained into this history of the sport.
Click to expand...

The way I look at it, folks want Interleague, but they also want fair scheduling. This provides both.

As for the DH, I used to think pitchers hitting adds to strategy, but I changed my mind 2 yrs ago because having pitchers hit leads to obvious pinch-hitting. The advantage of pitchers hitting is largely the need for more bench players., but I do think it disadvantages NL teams in the postseason (they usually don't have a good DH, AL DH's can usually play LF or 1B if they have to)

With the DH, pinch-hitting is a lot more situational/guesswork. I think it's better (and I say this as someone who follows a NL team)

Also, right now offense does need a boost, and the DH and pitcher rules I think would be sufficient.
 
D

doctorcdcs

Member
EdReedFan20 said:
Has Rogers ever hinted at funding a new ballpark? I don't know much about them, but from what posters are saying here they are loaded with money. When the time does finally comes for a new ballpark, whenever that may be, they'll probably build one of the most state-of-the-art, amenity-filled ballparks ever built. Like Yankee Stadium level of features. I wonder though, if they would just opt for renovations like Dodgers Stadium did. If they did, I could see the roof being completely replaced by a more modern style retractable roof.
Click to expand...

When Rogers bought the stadium, they did a renovation on it, so I don't see them announcing plans for a new stadium any time soon (that might change if Toronto gets a NFL team and rogers is involved in it somehow, and even then they probably won't move the Jays, unless they plan on demolishing the old stadium in order to put up a new one for whatever reason and the jays need somewhere else to play temporarily). Plus, they're planning on switching out the AstroTurf for actual grass in the next year or two. the only other major sports team that uses the stadium are the Toronto Argonauts (our CFL team), and they're supposed to be moving out in the next year or so, making it a dedicated baseball stadium (outside of any concerts or opening ceremonies (the Pan Am games for 2015 is in Toronto, and they're holding their opening and closing ceremonies at the stadium)) for the foreseeable future.

the Roof is already retractable (it was the first stadium in the world with a retractable roof)
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
doctorcdcs said:
When Rogers bought the stadium, they did a renovation on it, so I don't see them announcing plans for a new stadium any time soon (that might change if Toronto gets a NFL team and rogers is involved in it somehow). Plus, they're planning on switching out the AstroTurf for actual grass in the next year or two.

the Roof is already retractable (it was the first stadium in the world with a retractable roof)
Click to expand...

I know (well at least the first successful retractable roof- Olympic Stadium in Montreal tried and failed at it), but I was unsure if it was showing it's age or not. Like I said in another post, I remember a time when it got stuck during a rain storm creating a really bizarre, but cool effect where the rain was pouring in one area, but the entire rest of the field was dry. It was probably a freak glitch, but that was the first time I wondered when they would consider building a new ball park. I doubt it would be any time soon, considering it wasn't built all that long ago (1989). But then again, the Braves are building a new park, even though Turner Field opened for baseball in 1997 (1996 for the Olympics). It's not even 20 years old yet! From what I understand, Turner Field is not in a good location for people to get to, but to completely demolish a ball park that relatively new seems odd to me. Then again, I don't live in Atlanta and don't know the area around the ballpark.
 
N

Ninja Scooter

Member
Put the DH in both leagues already.

The play-in Wild Card games should be best 2 out of 3. Getting cities all excited over finally being "In the playoffs!!!" only to have them eliminated during a weekday afternoon game is lame.
 
Velcro Fly

Velcro Fly

Member
You can keep the Jays in Toronto and still have the AL North as it were.

Also bring back scheduled Double headers on Memorial Day, July 4th, and Labor Day weekend. And yeah just do DH in both leagues already.
 
D

devilhawk

Member
As a Royals fan, these divisions are awful. KC loses it's AL rivals, they are not joined with regional rivals in the NL despite the rockies moving, and instead get Tampa in their division.

OP needs to go back to the drawing board. You can't stick TB and KC in a division and call it a day.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
BigJonsson said:
#WeTheNorth
Click to expand...

It's great to see the passion for the Blue Jays. I love when people are that passionate about their teams. I'm sorry if my idea of moving them offended any of you. But, yeah keeping them as is would still keep the "AL North" in tact. If they did expand by two teams, creating a 32 team league, how would all of you align it. I think it's clear the "AL North" is pretty much set, as the is the "NL North". What two cities would deserve an expansion team? I really think Portland (Oregon), Indianapolis, Charlotte, and/or New Orleans would embrace one with open arms. I can't think of any other region that could support one (maybe OKC or Las Vegas?) or is too close to another team's market. I mean, look at the mess with the O's/Nats MASN rights stuff. I think it has the potential to get really nasty.
 
A Black Falcon

A Black Falcon

Member
... Indianapolis instead of Toronto? What? That makes no sense. Toronto is big and supports its team decently well.

Also, Montreal is the largest city in either the US or Canada that doesn't have a team. If anyone gets an expansion team, they should. And Richmond obviously isn't happening, that's very close to two major league teams and isn't nearly large enough a city. You question Portland, Oregon, but Portland Oregon is much larger than Richmond! Richmond currently has a AA team, not AAA. It's not a major league-class market in size, I think, and particularly not so close to two teams.

And last, if any city loses a team, the two Florida teams should be first because Florida has proven to not really care about baseball, their attendance numbers are terrible almost all of the time.
 
D

doctorcdcs

Member
EdReedFan20 said:
I know (well at least the first successful retractable roof), but I was unsure if it was showing it's age or not. Like I said in another post, I remember a time when it got stuck during a rain storm creating a really bizarre, but cool effect where the rain was pouring in one area, but the entire rest of the field was dry. It was probably a freak glitch, but that was the first time I wondered when they would consider building a new ball park. I doubt it would be any time soon, considering it wasn't built all that long ago (1989). But then again, the Braves are building a new park, even though Turner Field opened for baseball in 1997 (1996 for the Olympics). It's not even 20 years old yet! From what I understand, Turner Field is not in a good location for people to get to, but to completely demolish a ball park that relatively new seems odd to me. Then again, I don't live in Atlanta and don't know the area around the ballpark.
Click to expand...

http://www.thestar.com/sports/bluejays/2015/04/10/how-do-you-fix-the-rogers-centre.html

I googled "roger's centre roof problems" and came across this article. it makes for an interesting read.

yes, it still needs upgrades, but everyone (and even the article states this) in toronto knows that rogers centre is in a ideal part of the city. The roof issues I believe aren't a regular occurrence, and I would consider them to be a one-off problem (it's certainly not like in Montreal, where pieces of the stadium starting falling off at one point)

Man, back in the day, my family stayed at what used to be the Skydome hotel (its now a radisson I think) a couple of times, and it was AWESOME to sit on your balcony outside your room overlooking the whole stadium as the Jays played a home game.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
doctorcdcs said:
http://www.thestar.com/sports/bluejays/2015/04/10/how-do-you-fix-the-rogers-centre.html

I googled "roger's centre roof problems" and came across this article. it makes for an interesting read.

yes, it still needs upgrades, but everyone (and even the article states this) in toronto knows that rogers centre is in a ideal part of the city. The roof issues I believe aren't a regular occurrence, and I would consider them to be a one-off problem (it's certainly not like in Montreal, where pieces of the stadium starting falling off at one point)

Man, back in the day, my family stayed at what used to be the Skydome hotel (its now a radisson I think) a couple of times, and it was AWESOME to sit on your balcony outside your room overlooking the whole stadium as the Jays played a home game.
Click to expand...

Cool article. One part that stood out for me is that, even if they built a new park, they wouldn't want Rodgers Centre torn down due to it's youthfulness (and in my opinion, importance in history), which brings my back to an earlier post: if anyone has any insight, why is Turner Field being demolished after the Braves leave? I mean, surely there must be some use for the facilities after they leave.

Edit- Here is a video from MLB.com showing the MASN broadcast (the broadcast I watch), showing what I was talking about. http://m.mlb.com/news/article/37882170
 
Z

zer0das

Banned
I would probably expand to Austin or Nashville/Memphis (one or the other) before Charleston, Portland, or Richmond. Texas could probably support a 3rd team and geographically a team in Tennessee would cover a decent area where there aren't any teams. There's already a ton of east coast teams as is.

I doubt they'll ever shift to a 4 per league format though, the likely schedule imbalance that would follow would be obscene. Also your NL south has like the worst possible list of teams. It's the Braves, two expansion teams, and a Florida team. Yikes. Might as well rename it to Brave South because attendance numbers and W/L records would be brutal.
 
DiscoJer

DiscoJer

Member
I'd really like to see expansion to Montreal. They did support the team until the strike, which really screwed them over (as they were in 1st place).

And then in Charlotte or Raleigh.
 
F

Frosty Droid

Member
Beyond the Box Score started a study two years ago and came up with a list of the Top 10 cities for an MLB franchise.

10. Sacramento, California
9. Indianapolis, Indiana
8. Mexico City, Mexico
7. Riverside, California
6. Vancouver, B.C.
5. San Antonio, Texas
4. San Jose, California
3. Montreal, Quebec
2. Charlotte, North Carolina
1. Portland, Oregon
 
H

helloresolven

Member
My idea has always been:

1. Get rid of divisions entirely.
2. Make everyone in each league play an equal schedule (N times against everyone in their league, M times against everyone in the other league).
3. Top 5 make playoffs, with 4 & 5 playing 3 game series for right to play first place.

(2. I'd actually just eliminate interleague play.)
(3. I'd actually make it top 3 with 2/3 playing for the right to play in #1 in the LCS... but money. If you're first place after 162 games, you deserve to be on the brink of the World Series.)
 
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