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Crossing Eden · Nov 16, 2015

This just hit me after seeing this gif:

compared to this:

The next big step in crafting believable open worlds could be seasonal changes, I feel like it's incredibly rare for open world games to do so, (honestly curious about which open world game has done it since AC3 and it's a huge missed opportunity since Syndicate takes place over a single year ._.). At most, it seems like big location changes result in the player seeing different cultures ala Witcher 3, but imagine if each culture reacted to different seasonal changes throughout the game. Any thoughts?

Creaking · Nov 16, 2015

Although getting around in the snow was a (realistic) slog, it was one of the things that I did like in Assassin's Creed 3. I think the issue is that a lot of open world games take place over an indeterminate time-frame dictated by how long the player spends goofing around between missions. Even with the accelerated Day/Night cycles you get in games, covering a whole season would take quite some time, let alone a whole year.

More often you just see different biomes that represent different seasons.

Crossing Eden · Nov 16, 2015

Creaking said:
Although getting around in the snow was a (realistic) slog, it was one of the things that I did like in Assassin's Creed 3. I think the issue is that a lot of open world games take place over an indeterminate time-frame dictated by how long the player spends goofing around between missions. Even with the accelerated Day/Night cycles you get in games, covering a whole season would take quite some time, let alone a whole year.

I mean having certain sections of the game take place over different seasons depending on story progression. Both that or literally having time progress over different seasons like Don't Starve seem like huge undertakings for an open world game like the ones you see nowadays, but i'm curious to see someone attempt it.

Spring-Loaded · Nov 16, 2015

Of course. Zelda U looks beautiful and I thought the same thing when I saw that gif. Have it scripted and tied to the story to really drive home that sense of progression.

Mass Effect · Nov 16, 2015

YES. It does get quite droll when most open world games seems to take place in the spring or summer with the occasional shower/thunderstorm.

I loved that R* did the snow event last year for GTA V for example.

ComputerBlue · Nov 16, 2015

It would be really nice especially since right now it seems like the focus is on Autumn to add color and variety to trees, but a dynamic weather system along with seasonal changes would be really great.

Something I really loved about AC3. It was amazing how you could hack the animus post game and switch instantly, it made exploring the whole world a new adventure. What I didn't like though is that NPCs didn't react, they still worked in their gardens, walked around in short sleeve shirts and barefoot, but I guess this was some years ago and hardware limitations may have played a role in that. Regardless, it does it best in my opinion.

Loved it in Mafia 2, and I think the traction on the roads was different as well when it was winter if I remember correctly.

Nanashrew · Nov 16, 2015

I'm all for it! Having season changes could be so cool to the overall dynamic of a game.

BennyBlanco · Nov 16, 2015

Was pretty cool in TLOU

waitwhat42 · Nov 16, 2015

There was a Halloween celebration in Diamond City in Fallout 4 which I though was pretty cool.

leng jai · Nov 16, 2015

Yes, and better implementation of dynamic weather.

OverdriveOtaku · Nov 16, 2015

I love when games have dynamic weather, so for those games to have seasons would be a big expansion on that feature. I would love it.

DOWN · Nov 16, 2015

Fable series did this right?

Crossing Eden · Nov 16, 2015

leng jai said:
Yes, and better implementation of dynamic weather.

How so?

DOWN said:
Fable series did this right?

Fable 2 had these thing called weather totems.

Prompto · Nov 16, 2015

waitwhat42 said:
There was a Halloween celebration in Diamond City in Fallout 4 which I though was pretty cool.

Yeah that was a really neat touch.

Gsnap · Nov 16, 2015

Would be really cool. Lots of ways to do it too. It could either be done like a day/night cycle, just taking place over a long period of time. Or based on story progression. Or player controlled like the oracle zeldas.

-Silver- · Nov 16, 2015

It would be great if they did it well. Pokemon black and white changed seasons every month so other games an do something similar like every 10 days (real world) before a few days of transitional period.

10k · Nov 16, 2015

If the game story takes place over seasonal time periods than sure.

It's a cool mechanic.

Crossing Eden · Nov 16, 2015

-Silver- said:
It would be great if they did it well. Pokemon black and white changed seasons every month so other games an do something similar like every 10 days (real world) before a few days of transitional period.

Wait every month in the real world?

Zareka · Nov 16, 2015

Crossing Eden said:
Wait every month in the real world?

Yeah. Every really world month it'd cycle to the next season. Visually it only effected one area though, I think.

Nanashrew · Nov 16, 2015

Crossing Eden said:
Wait every month in the real world?

Yeah. When the month would change in real world time, the game would switch to the next season. It was pretty pretty cool.

Elitist1945 · Nov 16, 2015

Yes. I hope The Division tackles this because having the game in a permanent winter season would feel weird to me.

RobotHaus · Nov 16, 2015

It seems like a hell of a lot of extra work to be added to a game, but it would definitely make it more immersive if executed properly.

The only issue I can see with a design like this would be how to incoporate it to the narrative of the game. Weather can often times help set the mood and tone of a scene. So either the devs can select the tone and build a great scene with it, or they can try to make a more generic tone that is adaptive to the weather of the scene.

Crossing Eden · Nov 16, 2015

Zareka said:
Yeah. Every really world month it'd cycle to the next season. Visually it only effected one area though, I think.

That is an awesome feature even if it only affects if area.

KyanMehwulfe · Nov 16, 2015

I like when seasons or weather are more than just a visual thing.... small things like how you had to equip Furs as an accessory in the PSX RPG Tales of Destiny to stay warm (in practice, it was an accessory that avoided your car getting hurt by the cold in the snow area of the game).

In Dragon Age INQ, I always changed my armor for different climates... I'd use Bear Fur in the snow areas, and armor that had a lot of leather and fur. But in the desert areas, maybe more cloth and more exposed skin. No gameplay purpose... sometimes it would even inadvertently result in lower stats. But I like that sort of thing. Weather, seasons, and gameplay utility and character visual appearance related to it.

notaskwid · Nov 16, 2015

I hope Final Fantasy XV will feature this to some degree.

ghibli99 · Nov 16, 2015

I don't know... cycles are cool for general gameplay, but they're pretty annoying IMO when you're going for 100% in open-world games due to time-specific events and NPCs. Seasons would make it even more complex/aggravating unless there was a quick way to fast-foward time. I'm sure games like this already exist.

Bornstellar · Nov 16, 2015

Mod in development for Skyrim to do this IIRC.

KyanMehwulfe · Nov 16, 2015

ghibli99 said:
I don't know... cycles are cool for general gameplay, but they're pretty annoying IMO when you're going for 100% in open-world games due to time-specific events and NPCs. Seasons would make it even more complex/aggravating unless there was a quick way to fast-foward time. I'm sure games like this already exist.

i know some folks are into trophies and such so i'm not saying it's bad

but i hate the idea that a game dev would not design their game a certain way because it would be too inefficient to 100%

Past · Nov 16, 2015

I love the seasonal changes in Bully. The game had Halloween decorations when it was Fall, Christmas decorations when it was Winter and specific missions on each season.

5taquitos · Nov 16, 2015

Mass Effect said:
YES. It does get quite droll when most open world games seems to take place in the spring or summer with the occasional shower/thunderstorm.

I loved that R* did the snow event last year for GTA V for example.

That's not what "droll" means.

OT: Seasons would be great, but obviously require more development resources. I can't think of a way that seasons wouldn't add to the experience.

GoldStarz · Nov 16, 2015

Crossing Eden said:
That is an awesome feature even if it only affects if area.

Visually it affected every area, mechanically it only affected a few areas (ie: snow mounds form in winter allowing access to some areas but melt in the spring). The seasons were set depending on what month it was.

Instead they got rid of it in X/Y and just had the region areas transition through them (you the first 2 badges are in a Spring setting, the next two are in Summer, the fifth is in unaffiliated because it's in the center of the region (the region is an unconnected circle), sixth is in Autumn, and the last two are in Winter. At least they had sporadic weather, so that's something, but I preferred Gen V's Seasons :\

Crossing Eden · Nov 16, 2015

ghibli99 said:
I don't know... cycles are cool for general gameplay, but they're pretty annoying IMO when you're going for 100% in open-world games due to time-specific events and NPCs. Seasons would make it even more complex/aggravating unless there was a quick way to fast-foward time. I'm sure games like this already exist.

The few games that do have this usually let the players advance through time in some way.

Tigress · Nov 16, 2015

waitwhat42 said:
There was a Halloween celebration in Diamond City in Fallout 4 which I though was pretty cool.

What?! I also heard they did Christmas decorations in it. Now I'm going to have to visit it for every holiday. I think I already missed Halloween.

Madness · Nov 16, 2015

If it's cost feasible without impacting visual fidelity sure. I mean Ocarina of Time and it's night and day was amazing.

Then again seasonal changes are tough, because how are you going to show going from summer to winter playing in gta v? And if it's based on real time, what a waste of time and resources if you release your game in March, and have developed tons of winter assets and whatnot and yet 1/10th the player base is all that's left to see it. Day and night, weather effects, that's pretty much good and well. Who knows, maybe one day.

hao chi · Nov 16, 2015

I've never really thought about this, but this interests me much more than the idea of open worlds being 3x (or whatever) bigger than the last game in the series.

More_Badass · Nov 16, 2015

Didn't Mafia 2 do this? I recall it becoming winter during a section of the game

KyanMehwulfe · Nov 16, 2015

hao chi said:
I've never really thought about this, but this interests me much more than the idea of open worlds being 3x (or whatever) bigger than the last game in the series.

Yean definitely. I'd rather have a genuine sandbox game (as in, a sandbox like Minecraft... not a theme park like MGS or GTA) that had full seasonal changes, world deformation, construction, etc that was significantly smaller than a much larger static theme park.

My dream open world game is essentially a sandbox MMO sort of inspired by the best parts of Ultima Online and SWG with maybe either Shadowbane or DAOC. And the game being basically a living world where you have mercenary forts, guild towns, etc, and everything is slowed down and boring as eff =p Or a SP game that basically does the same thing but you're not a position of power (just as like in a MMO), and you log in and you just.... scavenge, get buy, do randomly generated jobs... travel in the spring, fight for armies in the summer, become a fur trapper in the winter once you get snowed into a mountain forest station, etc.

Every time I hear 'oh this game is X times bigger than these games' I basically think to myself, ok so another game where nothing is actually revolutionary... it may be awesome but likely just evolutionary. Reminds me of that Warren Spector quote or the Shenmue/open world topic where, instead of trying to make everything bigger, I rather try to see it made smaller but more dynamic.

xglaurungx88 · Nov 16, 2015

Arkham City's Calendar Man always had a seasonal quip if you visited him in his cell. Not really what OP's question focused on, but I still found it charming.

-Horizon- · Nov 16, 2015

Yes, they should. Add that to the weather effects and oh lawdy.

bounchfx · Nov 16, 2015

on one hand it should be dictated by the game design

on the other, I feel that shit like this should be the standard these days.

Jibbajabbawockky · Nov 16, 2015

I imagine it would be dependent on how it was handled. If it was just part of some internal clock in game, I don't know how you'd necessarily tune that to have it feel natural. Especially with story heavy games, I'd think that might feel off. If you moved through the story in acts or through some passage of time, I guess it might make more sense.

I always fondly remember the one level in Banjo-Kazooie where it went through the 4 different seasons and that opened up different parts to it. Always thought that was neat.

Dynamic weather and day/night cycles should be pretty much standard in most open world games though. Obviously it would be dependent on the game's design but I feel it almost always adds so much immersion and atmosphere to games. The day/night cycles and weather in The Witcher is so awesome compared to something like the static and unchanging levels in Dragon Age: Inquisition.

KaoteK · Nov 16, 2015

I was thinking about this very topic last night, it'd go a long way to making the worlds more believable, and introduces a nice bit of variety in games like Assassins Creed 3 and TLOU.

MattyG · Nov 16, 2015

waitwhat42 said:
There was a Halloween celebration in Diamond City in Fallout 4 which I though was pretty cool.

On real world Halloween or in-game Halloween?

Aaronrules380 · Nov 16, 2015

Now I'm thinking about how cool it would be if something like the rod of seasons returned in Zelda U

UnluckyKate · Nov 16, 2015

we need more snow. Snow in GTA Online really changed everything

Mass Effect · Nov 16, 2015

5taquitos said:
That's not what "droll" means.

OT: Seasons would be great, but obviously require more development resources. I can't think of a way that seasons wouldn't add to the experience.

I meant dull.

Arulan · Nov 16, 2015

Most game simulations still pale in comparison to Ultima VII in handling a day/night cycle. I'm skeptical they can accomplish something like this, unless it's nothing more than a visual change.

KTO · Nov 16, 2015

UnluckyKate said:
we need more snow. Snow in GTA Online really changed everything

Let's add seasons to the real LA

xglaurungx88 · Nov 16, 2015

Arulan said:
Most game simulations still pale in comparison to Ultima VII in handling a day/night cycle. I'm skeptical they can accomplish something like this, unless it's nothing more than a visual change.

Dragon's Dogma did a stellar job with the day/night cycle as well.

utena · Nov 16, 2015

That would be fantastic - eventually. But at the moment I think the time/money/effort put into coding and implementing seasonal changes, would be better spent developing more unique content to fill the open-world.

I guess another way to say that would be: seasonal changes would be great, but are lower priority than filling out the world itself with interesting scenarios and encounters. So given the option to allocate resources into either of those two, I would always prefer a developer focus on the latter.

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