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Fucking Donkey Kong Country's Bonus Rooms are Bullshit

I

illadelph

Member
After completing DKC 2&3 and finding all of the bonus coins and DK coins, I decided to do something I have never done: complete a 100% (101%?) run of the first Donkey Kong Country.

I ordered the game off of EBay and went to work. I soon remembered why I never did this as a kid: other than the fact that there is no secret world or reward for getting everything like in the sequels, a lot of the bonus rooms are just complete bullshit.

The earliest example is this shit in Ropey Rampage. You're supposed to just blindly fall off of the tree without any indication that a barrel exists below. This is poor design and goes against everything you should be doing in a platformer.

The absolute worst is the first of five(!) in Orang-utan Gang. How in the fuck could anyone find this shit? You have to make it all the way to Expresso, then go ALL THE WAY BACK to the beginning of the level, and somehow know to jump off of that one fucking ledge, flapping as far left as you could go. This would be somewhat excusable if you could see the ledge at the beginning of the level; you would go through the stage wondering how you could possibly reach it. But there is absolutely no reason for you to backtrack at all.

I still love the core game of the first DKC, but the bonus shit is just so sloppily placed. It is amazing how the sequels turned finding hidden things into the strongest part of the game design.
 
T

TheDinoman

Member
DKC was obviously when Rare was figuring out the kinks of the series. It's a lot like Sonic 1 in that regard. Fun games, but they're tech demos in comparison to their successors.
 
Danny Dudekisser

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
Yeah, finding the bonus rooms is sloppy in the first game... but eh... I feel like they're meaningless enough in the first game, due to them not unlocking anything, that it's not thatbig of a deal.

Unless you're OCD about the 101%.
 
P

PSqueak

Banned
You're listing the bullshit bonus rooms in DKC and not even a single mention of the "Bonus room hidden on another bonus room"?
 
V

ViewtifulJC

Banned
whoever had the bright idea in DKC2 of "wait...maybe we should use the bananas to guide attentive players..."

Cuz DKC1 you out here lookin for random ass walls and bottomless pits like wtf. Plus no Lost World or DK Coins RIP. And the bonus rooms were more varied depending on the level.

Bonus Room music too OP tho, bless up David Wise da god
 
H

Het_Nkik

Member
I found them all as a kid. I had a lot of free time on my hands. Some took forever to find but thanks to the exclamation point at the end of a level system I at least knew which level had holes I should keep jumping down until I found something.

Yeah, a lot are bullshit to find. It was still cool finding one by accident though. Think you're going to die and end up in a barrel!
 
T

TheDinoman

Member
This thread really reminds me about how shockingly amateur the bonus rooms are in Tropical Freeze. It's all just "collect bananas in the same 10 repeating rooms".

They were like that in Returns, too, but it wasn't so bad because it was the first game in a new line of DKC games and like with Rare, Retro was just learning how to make these types of games. But no such excuse exist for Tropical Freeze's bonus rooms, especially since Retro vastly improved upon everything else from Returns. It's really a missed opportunity considering how much DKC2 improved the bonus rooms from DKC1.
 
S

SonicXtreme

Member
Valjean Lafitte said:
You know what's bullshit? Millennials whining about secrets that aren't obvious... because they're secrets.
Click to expand...

This, IMO half the fun is the allure of having secret rooms that you either
A) had to luck tf out to find
or
B) Hear through word of mouth and are like 'wtf no way there's anything there! You're trolling me dude!' then getting jaw dropped when it turned out they were telling the truth
 
L

LegendofLex

Member
TheDinoman said:
This thread really reminds me about how shockingly amateur the bonus rooms are in Tropical Freeze. It's all just "collect bananas in the same 10 repeating rooms".
Click to expand...

They're totally superfluous, too, when you consider that the temples you unlock by getting all the KONG letters are much better tests of the speed and precision of your reflexes and the efficiency of your strategies.
 
S

SirUltimos

Member
Het_Nkik said:
I found them all as a kid. I had a lot of free time on my hands. Some took forever to find but thanks to the exclamation point at the end of a level system I at least knew which level had holes I should keep jumping down until I found something.

Yeah, a lot are bullshit to find. It was still cool finding one by accident though. Think you're going to die and end up in a barrel!
Click to expand...

No way. The exclamation points tell you if you've found everything? It's been 20 years and I never knew this!
 
K

Kamek Koopa

Member
Like many other games from that time, DKC is not a game meant to achieve 100%. Bonus rooms are just that: a bonus, an useful reward for finding a secret path. That's why unlike in DKC2 and DKC3 (where the prize is a collectible) bonus room rewards in DKC are always lifes (or bananas, or a letter, or an animal token... which are used to get lifes) or shortcuts.

Having said that, I think that's the reason after the level design in the first DKC being much more direct and straightforward than in the sequels, something that makes the game much more frenetic and replayable.
 
D

Dad

Member
Orangutan Gang is a walk in the park compared to the utter bullshit that is Oil Drum Alley. A secret within a secret. And the only way to actually find it is to get the worst possible reward in a slots minigame that randomly turns into a barrel for you to break down the wall of the room. And it's not good enough to just walk the barrel to the other side like any other breakable wall in the game. You have to make a leap across the entire room making sure you don't hit specific, arbitrary parts of the floor or else you trigger the end of the bonus. Even with a guide it's a massive pain in the ass. Fuck Oil Drum Alley
 
R

Red Devil

Member
illadelph said:
After completing DKC 2&3 and finding all of the bonus coins and DK coins, I decided to do something I have never done: complete a 100% (101%?) run of the first Donkey Kong Country.

I ordered the game off of EBay and went to work. I soon remembered why I never did this as a kid: other than the fact that there is no secret world or reward for getting everything like in the sequels, a lot of the bonus rooms are just complete bullshit.

The earliest example is this shit in Ropey Rampage. You're supposed to just blindly fall off of the tree without any indication that a barrel exists below. This is poor design and goes against everything you should be doing in a platformer.

The absolute worst is the first of five(!) in Orang-utan Gang. How in the fuck could anyone find this shit? You have to make it all the way to Expresso, then go ALL THE WAY BACK to the beginning of the level, and somehow know to jump off of that one fucking ledge, flapping as far left as you could go. This would be somewhat excusable if you could see the ledge at the beginning of the level; you would go through the stage wondering how you could possibly reach it. But there is absolutely no reason for you to backtrack at all.

I still love the core game of the first DKC, but the bonus shit is just so sloppily placed. It is amazing how the sequels turned finding hidden things into the strongest part of the game design.
Click to expand...

Not sure I recall correctly but in the first DKC for 100% you don't need to beat them, just find them. Or am I remembering this wrong?
 
ReyVGM

ReyVGM

Member
illadelph said:
I ordered the game off of EBay and went to work. I soon remembered why I never did this as a kid: other than the fact that there is no secret world or reward for getting everything like in the sequels, a lot of the bonus rooms are just complete bullshit.
Click to expand...

You do get a reward. Cranky says you're almost as good as he was in the ending.
 
I

illadelph

Member
Dad said:
Orangutan Gang is a walk in the park compared to the utter bullshit that is Oil Drum Alley. A secret within a secret. And the only way to actually find it is to get the worst possible reward in a slots minigame that randomly turns into a barrel for you to break down the wall of the room. And it's not good enough to just walk the barrel to the other side like any other breakable wall in the game. You have to make a leap across the entire room making sure you don't hit specific, arbitrary parts of the floor or else you trigger the end of the bonus. Even with a guide it's a massive pain in the ass. Fuck Oil Drum Alley
Click to expand...
Holy fucking shit
 
G

greycolumbus

The success of others absolutely infuriates me.
Het_Nkik said:
I found them all as a kid. I had a lot of free time on my hands. Some took forever to find but thanks to the exclamation point at the end of a level system I at least knew which level had holes I should keep jumping down until I found something.

Yeah, a lot are bullshit to find. It was still cool finding one by accident though. Think you're going to die and end up in a barrel!
Click to expand...

I had a similar experience. When playing DKC is the only thing you do in your free time, taking Expresso back to the start of a level is just another way to tinker with the game. Never bothered to do extra stuff in the sequels though.
 
C

Crayolan

Member
Valjean Lafitte said:
You know what's bullshit? Millennials whining about secrets that aren't obvious... because they're secrets.
Click to expand...

Having secrets be something you're encouraged to find is better than having random rooms which serve little purpose scattered across the game, IMO.

Plus I prefer secrets being something I can realistically find if I search everywhere rather than something no one would ever find without a guide.
 
C

Cosmo Clock 21

Banned
Dad said:
Orangutan Gang is a walk in the park compared to the utter bullshit that is Oil Drum Alley. A secret within a secret. And the only way to actually find it is to get the worst possible reward in a slots minigame that randomly turns into a barrel for you to break down the wall of the room. And it's not good enough to just walk the barrel to the other side like any other breakable wall in the game. You have to make a leap across the entire room making sure you don't hit specific, arbitrary parts of the floor or else you trigger the end of the bonus. Even with a guide it's a massive pain in the ass. Fuck Oil Drum Alley
Click to expand...

tbf the fact that specific bonus room ends in a blank wall rather than an exit hole like every other bonus room in the game should clue you in to the fact that something isn't quite right with that bonus
 
R

Red Devil

Member
Crayolan said:
Having secrets be something you're encouraged to find is better than having random rooms which serve little purpose scattered across the game, IMO.

Plus I prefer secrets being something I can realistically find if I search everywhere rather than something no one would ever find without a guide.
Click to expand...

I guess DKC would've been better served by having a The Wizard like movie.
 
D

Dad

Member
Cosmo Clock 21 said:
tbf the fact that specific bonus room ends in a blank wall rather than an exit hole like every other bonus room in the game should clue you in to the fact that something isn't quite right with that bonus
Click to expand...

That's fair, but the trigger for ending the game shouldn't still be active after I've managed to piece it all together. That's just cruel
 
A

Ashby

Member
What about beating the secret boss in DKC3 and getting nothing but a DK Coin? What a let down. DKC2 did it best with beating the secret boss giving the real ending.
 
M

Mr-Joker

Banned
TheDinoman said:
This thread really reminds me about how shockingly amateur the bonus rooms are in Tropical Freeze. It's all just "collect bananas in the same 10 repeating rooms".

They were like that in Returns, too, but it wasn't so bad because it was the first game in a new line of DKC games and like with Rare, Retro was just learning how to make these types of games. But no such excuse exist for Tropical Freeze's bonus rooms, especially since Retro vastly improved upon everything else from Returns. It's really a missed opportunity considering how much DKC2 improved the bonus rooms from DKC1.
Click to expand...

You have to take into account that levels in Tropical Freeze are longer, so Retro Studio clearly put more effort in designing the levels, with the bonus stage being an after thought as the prize is the puzzle pieces.
 
woopWOOP

woopWOOP

Member
SonicXtreme said:
This, IMO half the fun is the allure of having secret rooms that you either
A) had to luck tf out to find
or
B) Hear through word of mouth and are like 'wtf no way there's anything there! You're trolling me dude!' then getting jaw dropped when it turned out they were telling the truth
Click to expand...
First time I heard about the Oil Drum Valley double bonus room, but option B here is why I think it's actually amazing instead of being annoyed about it, lol
 
D

Dad

Member
Ashby said:
What about beating the secret boss if DKC3 and getting nothing but a DK Coin? What a let down. DKC2 did it best with beating the secret boss giving the real ending.
Click to expand...

You need all the DK coins to get all the banana birds in order to see the "true ending" for DKC3. It's not as direct as in 2, but it's still the same thing more or less
 
A

Ashby

Member
Dad said:
You need all the DK coins to get all the banana birds in order to see the "true ending" for DKC3. It's not as direct as in 2, but it's still the same thing more or less
Click to expand...

I know but that's the point. It's a bummer to beat the end game boss and still be a position to hunt down a bunch of stuff. DKC2's way is a lot more satisfying.
 
stn

stn

Member
Although I know in my mind that DKC2 plays better and is more complete, DKC1 is still my favorite by a hair. I still remember playing it for the first time on Christmas morning when it released. Also: GOAT theme.
 
S

SoundPulse

Banned
For this reason, I never really bother. DKC2 and 3 I make more of an effort, but I like to play DKC by running through with Diddy as quickly as I can.
 
El Sabroso

El Sabroso

Member
finding those secrets without a guide was amazing, hell even fucking with the game secrets was amazing, in Orang-utan Gang i was shocked the first time I got Rambi on that stage
 
V

Valjean Lafitte

Banned
Crayolan said:
Having secrets be something you're encouraged to find is better than having random rooms which serve little purpose scattered across the game, IMO.
Click to expand...

The purpose the rooms serve and the source of encouragement to find them are the same: it's all about getting 100%.

Plus I prefer secrets being something I can realistically find if I search everywhere rather than something no one would ever find without a guide.
Click to expand...

Secrets you can realistically find, huh?

Let me tell you about the time I found one of the only secrets that isn't in Nintendo Power's DKC strategy guide. But first, I have to confess that if it wasn't for that strategy guide, I might not have known about some of the game's bonus stages. I'm sure I could have found some of the more difficult ones by accident. Many of them I discovered on my own. But I never would have got 101% as a kid if not for the guide.

There's a warp barrel hidden at the very start of Minecart Carnage. Take it and you'll be warped to the end of the stage.

fIW8B9k.png


Now, I don't know how common this knowledge is now in the internet era, but back then no one talked about this secret, although its existence was alluded to in the strategy guide:

ORoP7RB.png


The crazy thing is, I didn't even realize until just a few minutes ago that it was hinted at in the guide. The mention of a "deep, dark secret" wasn't what prompted a 13-year old me to search for it, it was the thrill of discovering something hidden in the game--and boy, was I pleased with myself when I discovered it!

But most of you guys in this thread would have probably put a banana there. You know, so the warp barrel wouldn't be unfairly and arbitrarily hidden (never mind that a well-placed secret is by definition one where you wouldn't expect to have to look for it!).

SonicXtreme said:
This, IMO half the fun is the allure of having secret rooms that you either
A) had to luck tf out to find
or
B) Hear through word of mouth and are like 'wtf no way there's anything there! You're trolling me dude!' then getting jaw dropped when it turned out they were telling the truth
Click to expand...
.
 
F

ffdgh

Member
None of them were too bad.

The "worst" one would probably be the bonus room WITHIN a bonus room in dkc1.
KuGsj.gif
 
G

Glowsquid

Member
Valjean Lafitte said:
But most of you guys in this thread would have probably put a banana there. You know, so the warp barrel wouldn't be unfairly and arbitrarily hidden (never mind that a well-placed secret is by definition one where you wouldn't expect to have to look for it!).
Click to expand...

I blame all those armchair "game design" videos and bloggers
 
G

Gamesadict

Member
Dad said:
Orangutan Gang is a walk in the park compared to the utter bullshit that is Oil Drum Alley. A secret within a secret. And the only way to actually find it is to get the worst possible reward in a slots minigame that randomly turns into a barrel for you to break down the wall of the room. And it's not good enough to just walk the barrel to the other side like any other breakable wall in the game. You have to make a leap across the entire room making sure you don't hit specific, arbitrary parts of the floor or else you trigger the end of the bonus. Even with a guide it's a massive pain in the ass. Fuck Oil Drum Alley
Click to expand...
I came to this thread to mention this one. Fucking insane. A Club Nintendo magazine that had a guide of the whole game was a godsend for me as a kid.

Like OP, DKC1 was my last game of that series to clear, even though it was the first one I played.

Edit:
Heh, that warp barrel in Mine Cart Carnage... Since we used to play on the SNES with the whole family back then, someone that was not that good at jumping horribly missed the barrel and ended up discovering it out of sheer luck. The reactions were insane when instead of losing a life the game dropped us somewhere further in the stage.
 
D

Deadpool_X

Banned
Don't forget the one toward the end of the game where you have to fail another bonus room to make a barrel drop down, then use that barrel in the bonus room to unlock another bonus room. Yeah...that one was bullshit.
 
C

Crayolan

Member
Valjean Lafitte said:
snip
Click to expand...

Those are all over the starting areas of DKC 2 and 3 too. I don't see those as secrets the average player is supposed to find.

I won't pretend like I know what the devs were thinking when they put in those skips, but to me they seem like a way to expedite getting to the more challenging levels on replays.
 
N

NathanS

Member
Part of it is despite keeping track of how many secrets you've found DKC is still in a lot of ways a pre-SMW platformer when it comes to secrets. They exits as a fun thing to find, a short cut through the level, a source of help through power-ups/coins/1-ups but not yet super essential to the experience.

World's attitude of "You're willing to spend the time investing every nook of the level and taking on the extra challenges to get to the secret areas in order to really engage with as much of the game as possible? Let's reward you with more game!" has become almost a norm for hop-and-bop platformers that going back to the older approach can be, strange for some especially since as noted DKC is already taking the first step of tracking how many secrets you've found.
 
L

L Thammy

Member
How do you fuck a room

But Rare couldn't have thought that people were going to find all the bonus rooms. At east, there's no way they could have without being crazy. At least their being so hidden makes it fun when you find one by accident.
 
J

Javier

Member
In addition to Oil Drum Alley, two other bonuses that took me forever to find were the one in Barrel Cannon Canyon where you have to purposely miss a barrel blast and you hit a breakable wall that reveals the bonus and the one in Forest Frenzy were you have to let go off the rope during an autoscroll segment with a barrage of Neckys flying at you. The former is entirely unintuitive, and the latter was almost impossible in an old CRT TV, since at least in my experience you couldn't even see the barrel at the bottom of the screen.
 
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