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Learning Photography

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phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
There’s a lot of photography around on GAF: there’s the Camera Equipment Mega-thread, the quarterly photography threads, the sadly underused Photography Challenge threads (indexed here) and there's a short-but-interesting thread on post-processing here (some of the image links are dead, but still enough left to make it a worthwhile read).

And every page or two there’s somebody pops up to ask how to get into this stuff – how to learn it, and always there’s someone responds. Good old GAF. Trouble is, it is a bit hit and miss, it’s difficult to look back and find what other people suggested and it gets lost in the flood of other stuff going on. So I thought I’d have a try at pulling it all together with useful links and whatnot.

I’m a learner too – by no means any sort of expert. Best I can do is pull together what worked for me and whatever anyone else can come up with. I’ve reserved posts 2 and 3 for any extra links and stuff we might need for reference.

“Just get out there and shoot photos”

This is actually pretty good advice – from our own EviLore and from the arguably more famous Dan Heller - but it isn’t a whole load of use to those of us who don’t know their aperture from their ISO and don’t know where to start. Adn who don't know how to fix whatever-it-is that we don't like.

This thread is for plugging that hole.

“What Camera/Lens/other caboodle should I get?”

Don’t ask here, ask in the Camera Equipment Megathread.

But before you do that, check whether you’ve got a camera somewhere already, whether it is on a phone or whatever. Chances are you have. Use that one. You’ll know when you’ve reached the limits of what your camera can do for you (and you’ll learn soon enough what it is you like to shoot, which kind of influences what kit you get anyway).

The really basic tips for newbies

This is really stupid stuff I learned the hard slow way

1) Get enough light

If everything's all blurry, get more light on the subject. If you are shooting in some sort of auto mode usually the camera will sort its own settings out. The more light the better.

2) Look at what’s in the frame before you shoot

Two things here. First is looking at what it is you are shooting. Especially backgrounds - the stuff you don't normally pay attention to. Stops trees growing out of heads and that sort of thing. The other is to pay attention to whatever little numbers/dots/indicators are in the viewfinder. If you don't look at them you'll never learn anything - if you do it will sink in gradually.

3) Look at your photos after you shoot

Think about what you'd do different to make it better. There's nothing worse than shooting way too many pictures of something from different angles if what's wrong is the lighting, or shooting at different apertures if the focus is off.

And do it straight after you shoot so you have a chance to do it again before the subject runs away/sinks below the horizon/demands money.

BOOKS

All the time you’re reading you’re not taking photos – so go light on the books! There’s two I’d particularly recommend:

Understanding Exposure (3rd edn and onwards) by Bryan Peterson
http://www.amazon.com/dp/0817439390/?tag=neogaf0e-20
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0817439390/

this is kind of the essential starter book – covers all the basics of ISO/aperture/shutter speed/depth of field etc etc etc .

Light Science & Magic (4th edn) by Hunter, Biver & Fuqua
http://www.amazon.com/dp/0240812255/?tag=neogaf0e-20
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0240812255/

This one's more technical, more studio-based - but I found it tremendously useful in understanding what light is doing and how to look at it.

I've thrown out all my other books except these two.


ONLINE TUTORIALS

Same as with books there's a lot out there, some of it not very well organised - and a lot of it goes into way too much depth and detail and specialised stuff for raw beginners. Might want to try these though.

Cambridge in Colour

Digital Photography School (I've linked the beginners page here, the whole site is a bit big and messy)



NOTE:

There's a whole bunch of other suggestions in the Camera Equipment thread - I'll try and get the best of them into this OP over the next week or so.

Obviously this is a bit of a personal view at the moment, but do feel free to lob in further suggestions and links - I'd appreciate it if you can give a bit of explanation for why something is good rather than just a raw link though!

I think there's enough demand for this sort of thread - if it works it works.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
(If you're reading this, please pardon me - I'm kind of hoping that in-thread edits don't get bumped up to page 1 and the I can safely gather a few resources while nobody is looking!)

there's work in progress going on here for sure.
 
EviLore

EviLore

Expansive Ellipses
Staff Member
Good going. Everyone's a photographer these days, but there's a lot to learn once you're hitting the limits with your smartphone (where you have basic composition, focus, and flash on/off; little else).

I suggest taking a couple hours reading online (like at the digital photography school link in the OP here) about the basics of exposure: aperture, shutter speed, ISO. Then understand depth of field and focal length. Then learn how sensor sizes influence the aforementioned. After that, what camera equipment actually does for you beyond the smartphone/P&S segment will not be foreign to you.

I liked The Photographer's Eye for learning about compositional theory, but you should not jump right into that as a pure beginner.
 
K

krypt0nian

Banned
Subbed. This is a goal for the year for me. I've always had good compositional skills with zero actual knowledge. I'm changing that.

Anyone find any of the iTunes U content in photography to be useful?
 
3

345triangle

Member
EviLore said:
I liked The Photographer's Eye for learning about compositional theory, but you should not jump right into that as a pure beginner.
Click to expand...

i don't know about that. it's pretty accessible, and the principles it espouses are just as applicable to instagram as a 5D mark III. it's like learning a language — you should study its grammar before attempting to have a conversation.

it's also available as an excellent ipad app, if that's your thing, though i'm pretty sure i only paid about $5 rather than $25.

recommended to anyone either way.
 
O

orioto

Good Art™
Composition is simple

points-forts.png


Just care about that, it's magical :p
 
F

Forkball

Member
The macro setting on my Sony NEX-7 doesn't seem to work properly or I don't know how to configure it. It makes me mad. PEOPLE NEED TO SEE THE BEAUTY OF MY DINNER.
 
M

mrkgoo

Member
Ha, at one point a fair while ago, I wanted to make a learner's thread, with some basics and the idea of periodic 'lessons', guided by what people wanted to learn, but also presented by GAF's finest photographers (seriously, there's some amazing talent here).

I actually made up some slides and list of topics to cover, but never really pulled the trigger knowing I'd never really pull it off. Now with even less time on my hands, it's unlikely to ever happen.

What I did do though was turn those slides into a sort beginner's 'course' and presented it to some friends.

Anyway, I think the very first things people should understand is exposure - what it means, and how to control it for your photos. Understanding the basics of what what contributes to it (shutterspeed, aperture, and iso), how to control each, and the further effect each setting has other than exposure pretty much means you can make any photo. It begins with exposure.

Some other advice for getting better:
- Take lots of photos. Practice really does make perfect.
- Look at and critique lots of photos of others and your own. Learning and becoming aware what works for you and what doesn't will vastly improve what you shoot. This goes for looking at exposure, composition, timing, placing...everything. LOOK... and you will see.
 
I

Illithid Dude

Member
For me, once I learned how to use a camera, and understood basic compositional rules, I let myself off the book and just did my own thing. About a year ago, everything clicked and my photos almost overnight became drastically better. You just gotta keep practicing until your style suddenly emerges. But there isn't really a way to 'learn' photography, it's just something that innately happens.
 
M

mrkgoo

Member
Illithid Dude said:
For me, once I learned how to use a camera, and understood basic compositional rules, I let myself off the book and just did my own thing. About a year ago, everything clicked and my photos almost overnight became drastically better. You just gotta keep practicing until your style suddenly emerges. But there isn't really a way to 'learn' photography, it's just something that innately happens.
Click to expand...

I disagree somewhat.

You can learn it as much as you can learn anything else. But like anything else, it's true that you can just suddenly come to a point where everything 'clicks'.

It can depend on the person - You'll need both practical and theoretical, but some people need to have one before the other, or one more predominantly. Personally I need both, and whichever comes first is always tougher, and it doesn't click until I've had the other.
 
D

Danoss

Member
orioto said:
Composition is simple

points-forts.png


Just care about that, it's magical :p
Click to expand...

There is much more to it than that. Rule of thirds is just one of the many rules of composition. Others include the golden spiral/ratio, contrast, leading lines, framing, dynamic tension, patterns (and the interruption of) and the list goes on. Knowing what catches the attention of a viewer, for instance that the eye is drawn to the brightest subject in an image.

Once you know and understand composition rules and why they exist, you can break them with specific intent to create something interesting.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
HazardBob said:
Needs more on shutter time, aperture and ISO. Knowing how your camera works is half the battle.
Click to expand...

I'm very wary of making things too complicated for the beginner Bob, and I'm talking the really raw beginner here. Get what you're saying, but all the exposure triangle stuff, though essential, isn't necessarily the best place to start (or the easiest, hell my Dad explained all this to me 40 years back and I still don't entirely have the hang of it) . I've spent a bunch of time recently with people with phone cameras trying to improve their facebook shots and nearly always "more light" turns out to be a quick fix.

I'm hoping to get the OP better structured and focussed over the next few days given enough feedback (including this one), but I'm trying to avoid replicating stuff that is already out there and creating yet another photography resource! The stuff is out there somewhere, it just needs a helping hand in navigating it.
 
M

mrkgoo

Member
phisheep said:
I'm very wary of making things too complicated for the beginner Bob, and I'm talking the really raw beginner here. Get what you're saying, but all the exposure triangle stuff, though essential, isn't necessarily the best place to start (or the easiest, hell my Dad explained all this to me 40 years back and I still don't entirely have the hang of it) . I've spent a bunch of time recently with people with phone cameras trying to improve their facebook shots and nearly always "more light" turns out to be a quick fix.

I'm hoping to get the OP better structured and focussed over the next few days given enough feedback (including this one), but I'm trying to avoid replicating stuff that is already out there and creating yet another photography resource! The stuff is out there somewhere, it just needs a helping hand in navigating it.
Click to expand...

Exposure starts with making photos brighter or darker. Knowing that the three main factors you can control can each do it is a good starting place, I feel. Then you use that as a springboard to what ELSE they can control.
 
M

mrklaw

MrArseFace
Few tips that i found useful when starting out.

Indoors is almost certainly too dark. You can see clearly but your camera won't. Don't get frustrated if you keep needing to use flash or high ISO (and risk grainy photos). Get outside or near a window. You can ever have enough light


If you have a DSLR or compact system camera where you can play with aperture and shutter speed, play with it a lot. You'll learn more about aperture by just shooting a bunch of objects at different distances - fence posts or even cups on a table - at different aperture settings and seeing the results, compared to reading up and trying to understand the science. You can do that later if you like.


Slightly more advanced tip on exposure - cameras are stupid. They assume everything is average and grey. Take a photo of a grey bit of paper and it'll look grey - perfect. Now take a photo of a white piece of paper, it'll also look grey - oh :/ same with black. So when you get non-standard scenes with a lot of white/black in them, you'll need to use exposure compensation to get the photo to come out right. Experiment to find out what works best.
 
O

orioto

Good Art™
Danoss said:
There is much more to it than that. Rule of thirds is just one of the many rules of composition. Others include the golden spiral/ratio, contrast, leading lines, framing, dynamic tension, patterns (and the interruption of) and the list goes on. Knowing what catches the attention of a viewer, for instance that the eye is drawn to the brightest subject in an image.

Once you know and understand composition rules and why they exist, you can break them with specific intent to create something interesting.
Click to expand...

oh yeah sure, but i would begin to make that rule intuitive. It conveys a lot of others.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
mrklaw said:
Slightly more advanced tip on exposure - cameras are stupid. They assume everything is average and grey. Take a photo of a grey bit of paper and it'll look grey - perfect. Now take a photo of a white piece of paper, it'll also look grey - oh :/ same with black. So when you get non-standard scenes with a lot of white/black in them, you'll need to use exposure compensation to get the photo to come out right. Experiment to find out what works best.
Click to expand...

Yeah. Most I ever learned in one go was spending two hours getting lost in mist a couple of years ago. Mist is a bugger to expose right (and interesting to focus, because it looks way better if the focus is a bit off). The getting lost was a big bonus as I had nothing to do for two hours but try to get photos right!
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
mrkgoo said:
Ha, at one point a fair while ago, I wanted to make a learner's thread, with some basics and the idea of periodic 'lessons', guided by what people wanted to learn, but also presented by GAF's finest photographers (seriously, there's some amazing talent here).

I actually made up some slides and list of topics to cover, but never really pulled the trigger knowing I'd never really pull it off. Now with even less time on my hands, it's unlikely to ever happen.

What I did do though was turn those slides into a sort beginner's 'course' and presented it to some friends.
Click to expand...

Got a link to that? Sounds useful!
 
Porcile

Porcile

Member
I've been doing a ton of 35mm photography recently. I'm totally new to serious photography, so it's been challenging. I have a good artistic eye and seeing a lot of averages photos developed feels somewhat of a let down, but I continue to plug away. Thankfully developing remains reasonable cheap.

I suppose the one the thing I've learned is to only pick your absolute best. I mean, on a 36 exposure roll, just selecting 2 or 3 images takes a lot of self-discipline.

Is anyone on Photography GAF still shooting 35mm?

Thanks for the links anyway, it's all transferable skills :)
 
T

TokiDoki

Member
Subbed .

Still rocking a GF1 . It does shoot somewhat accurate colors but I'm not sure , I think that peoples love punchier colors (is high saturation the correct term?) . So I need to do some touch up on the colors with Photoshop everytime , not sure if this is ideal .
 
T

tino

Banned
Two comments from my experience:

* One time I shot with a film rangefinder with a broken exposure meter. I had to guess or use a P&S to measure the exposure. I learn more about the concept behind exposure in 2 roll of films than I learn from whatever in the previous few years.

First of all, there is no "correct" exposure, you can have quite a few different exposures for a "scene". And you don't have to exposure to how your eye sees it.

If its in the day time, you actually can set the setting to ISO 100, aperture f/8 as standard and guesstimate the shutter speed base on size of your iris. Your eyes are basically a pair of lens (with a piece of adjustable glass and the iris is your aperture) Film has larger tolerance so if your guess is 1-2 steps off, you can still get a good picture. If you want to try that and you don't have a film camera, you can use a P&S as a make do exposure meter.

* In the evening or indoor, there is really one Exposure Value (EV). You can totally go manual. If you are going to shoot everything outside or everything inside indoor, going manual actually give your more consistent and predictable photo. Camera's exposure meter is actually pretty dumb in the evening.

If you are going to use bounce flash anyway, in other words, introduce a light source the camera doesn't know about, don't expect the camera give you good exposure number. The camera doesn't know if you are on a tripod either.

It's like this, GPS map is good enough that you can rely on it vast majority of the time. However when I go hiking the more reliable map is still an actual trail map or an offline tracking app base on the image of the actual trail map. Shooting in low light situation is like hiking in the mountain that has very bad signal.

* As far as photography goes, never forget its an hobby. If you feel you have lost the passion, you should stop for a while. You should not do it if you are not having fun.

* But of course collecting camera gear can be another hobby, so see you in the other thread. :D
 
Porcile

Porcile

Member
Yeah, I feel like I need to practice getting good exposures without relying too much on the built-in light meter. Though I'm slowly getting there.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
Porcile said:
Yeah, I feel like I need to practice getting good exposures without relying too much on the built-in light meter. Though I'm slowly getting there.
Click to expand...

Know what you mean, but it's not like the light meter is cheating or anything! Way back when, everybody carried light meters around with them.

The meter's dead useful for getting there or thereabouts on the exposure and then working out from there. These days if I'm in a tricky position I typically lock the ISO (usually do that anyway, as I can only carry two variables in my head), get a metered exposure on shutter or aperture priority then switch to manual and adjust from there. Beats the hell out of fiddling with exposure compensation all the time which just confuses me (and I always forget to dial it back to zero afterwards - it's one of those irritating features that got added to cameras and should have got taken away soon after for being too hard).

Except for mist and suchlike of course.
 
O

orioto

Good Art™
Danoss said:
Would you be so kind as to list some? I can't think of any.
Click to expand...

What i mean is that this particular rule help someone to have a habit of composing intuitively. All the rules you named cannot be something you fill the head of learning photographer with. A photo isn't only a technical thing, it has to be intuitive at some point.
 
D

Danoss

Member
phisheep said:
Beats the hell out of fiddling with exposure compensation all the time which just confuses me (and I always forget to dial it back to zero afterwards - it's one of those irritating features that got added to cameras and should have got taken away soon after for being too hard).
Click to expand...

Look into it, it's dead simple. Instead of switching to Manual mode, just use exposure compensation; you can see the shutter value change as you adjust it (at least on my camera you can).

If you're familiar with 'stops' then you can use EC, as it works in the same way, adjusting the exposure by adjusting the shutter in 1/3 stop increments.

orioto said:
What i mean is that this particular rule help someone to have a habit of composing intuitively. All the rules you named cannot be something you fill the head of learning photographer with. A photo isn't only a technical thing, it has to be intuitive at some point.
Click to expand...

It only helps them compose using the rule of thirds, ignoring all other techniques. The golden spiral/ratio, as an example, would be missed entirely if the rule of thirds was consistently applied.

These rules come from many years of experimentation on what works and what doesn't. Once you understand what they are, beyond just one composition rule, then it can become more intuitive to a user as they understand what they're doing, why they're doing it and through repetition and practice.

I'm not saying, nor have I implied that someone starting out should learn all of them immediately. That would be ludicrous. But, to stop at the rule of thirds and think that's enough would be doing yourself a great disservice.
 
O

orioto

Good Art™
Danoss said:
It only helps them compose using the rule of thirds, ignoring all other techniques. The golden spiral/ratio, as an example, would be missed entirely if the rule of thirds was consistently applied.

These rules come from many years of experimentation on what works and what doesn't. Once you understand what they are, beyond just one composition rule, then it can become more intuitive to a user as they understand what they're doing, why they're doing it and through repetition and practice.

I'm not saying, nor have I implied that someone starting out should learn all of them immediately. That would be ludicrous. But, to stop at the rule of thirds and think that's enough would be doing yourself a great disservice.
Click to expand...

I'm confused by that statement cause to me, those two rules are linked. But i guess my interpretation of the rule of third is the golden spiral then..
 
DietRob

DietRob

i've been begging for over 5 years.
This thread interests me greatly. I've owned a T2i with a few lenses for about a year now. I did just get out there and shoot. I have about 69gb worth of photos on my drive. While I do feel like I'm making progress and in turn better photos I could certainly use the advice that is already in and bound to come to this thread.

Great start OP.
 
O

orioto

Good Art™
Crunched said:
Golden ratio is my favorite compositional tool. Rule of thirds is just one that's quick and easy.
Click to expand...

Yeah but there are the same to me as i'm using the rule of third in a flexible way. And there are different type of photography. When you're doing street photo, you have to make with what you have in front of you. This is about finding the right balance between the right moment, focusing on the interesting subject and composing those in a natural, not too perfect nor planned way.

But yeah basically i posted that picture of the rule of third but i was thinking a mix between that and the spiral cause i use the rule of third in a wrong way. To me it's more about having something in the corner at equal distance from each side, and when you try to balance that, you're into the golden ratio more or less. Those ratios are relative for me. They have to be adapted to the reality of your photo, or it would be boring.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
WhatRobEats said:
This thread interests me greatly. I've owned a T2i with a few lenses for about a year now. I did just get out there and shoot. I have about 69gb worth of photos on my drive. While I do feel like I'm making progress and in turn better photos I could certainly use the advice that is already in and bound to come to this thread.

Great start OP.
Click to expand...

I'm only about a year ahead of you on the DSLR stuff Rob. (And I shot way too much too early too!).

What most worked for me was restricting myself. Like I mentioned I did two hours in the mist and just did mist, but checked after every shot. Then I did city stuff in Cardiff, but I took a 50mm prime with me in the morning and a 55-250 zoom in the afternoon. I find changing lenses midstream is bad for the soul.
 
R

Red

Member
orioto said:
Yeah but there are the same to me as i'm using the rule of third in a flexible way. And there are different type of photography. When you're doing street photo, you have to make with what you have in front of you. This is about finding the right balance between the right moment, focusing on the interesting subject and composing those in a natural, not too perfect nor planned way.

But yeah basically i posted that picture of the rule of third but i was thinking a mix between that and the spiral.
Click to expand...
Rule of thirds is the popular one because of its flexibility. It allows spiral and triptych-esque compositions, among others, so I get what you're saying. But I think of it as playing fast and loose... It's easy to recognize and plan for, so it works well for spur-of-the-moment captures, but it's not a be-all, end-all in itself. Not that you were suggesting so.
 
O

orioto

Good Art™
Crunched said:
Rule of thirds is the popular one because of its flexibility. It allows spiral and triptych-esque compositions, among others, so I get what you're saying. But I think of it as playing fast and loose... It's easy to recognize and plan for, so it works well for spur-of-the-moment captures, but it's not a be-all, end-all in itself. Not that you were suggesting so.
Click to expand...

exactly.
In my case i use it in such a repetitive and obsessive way that it's actually a style, but i take most of my photo in 2 secondes with a moving subject
 
B

BlueTsunami

there is joy in sucking dick
Here's the breakdown of the way I shoot

*I pay very close attention to what is in the frame (obviously) but also the ends of the frame. Are things that are easily picked up by the eye touching the frame? Do I want this? If I do allow for things to break the frame they could extend the frame outwards beyond whats seen. If not, it creates a very enclosed feel that feels 'complete' within the frame.

*Lines and horizon. The subjects I shoot (lots of stills and architecture based stuff) lines that are, to my eye, correctly oriented is very important. Sometimes I'll use an off kilt angle but this is usually for more dynamic subjects.

*Light is everything. Even a nondescript wall can be transformed into something photographable with the right light. Get the light at the right angle, almost skimming the said wall and you'll see its texture, the way the wall has worn over the years. It could even glow if the sun is low enough. This applies to other worthwhile subjects. But don't think that direct light is the end all be all. Shoot some portraiture on a cloudy day under some trees or maybe of nature. The light is very even, sometimes too much so but it can be great for color.

*Shoot as often as you can but don't force yourself. If you've got the hunger for it you'll be shooting nearly everyday. Sometimes you'll have lulls where you won't shoot for a week or two but you'll always come back to it. Shooting as often as you can makes you familiar with the act of photographing, the basic knowledge needed and constantly seeing things and framing them even when you don't have your camera on you

*Composition up there with light. I balance my compositional preference between the rule of thirds and centered. Centered can be real fun for giving a single subject a lot of weight, if not all, in the frame. The rule of thirds is great to go to when you want to incorporate your subject into the environment surrounding it.
 
T

tino

Banned
Danoss said:
Look into it, it's dead simple. Instead of switching to Manual mode, just use exposure compensation; you can see the shutter value change as you adjust it (at least on my camera you can).

If you're familiar with 'stops' then you can use EC, as it works in the same way, adjusting the exposure by adjusting the shutter in 1/3 stop increments.

....
Click to expand...

Can you set the shutter speed to "no slower than 1/50 (or whatever)"? If you can, then yes you can use EC for everything.

I can't wait when somebody finally port android to a proper mirrorless or SLR.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
BlueTsunami said:
*Lines and horizon. The subjects I shoot (lots of stills and architecture based stuff) lines that are, to my eye, correctly oriented is very important. Sometimes I'll use an off kilt angle but this is usually for more dynamic subjects.
Click to expand...

Good to see you here BlueTsunami!

One thing I'll mention on this point (it's really stupid, but took me ages and ages to work out) - I used to have a load of trouble getting horizontal stuff horizontal, despite having spirit levels all over the place and suchlike. Gradually dawned on me that the focus points in the viewfinder are lined up in straight lines, so I get those aimed at a horizon or roofline or something and don't have a problem anymore.

Possibly nobody else is quite as thick as me, but I thought it worth mentioning ....
 
D

Danoss

Member
tino said:
Can you set the shutter speed to "no slower than 1/50 (or whatever)"? If you can, then yes you can use EC for everything.
Click to expand...

It's a manual adjustment that you can easily monitor as you use it, why would you need to have such a setting?
 
M

MRORANGE

Member
I found these resources useful online:

If you want to compare camera sizes for purchases:
http://camerasize.com/compare/

Camera Exposure: Aperture, ISO & Shutter Speed
http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/camera-exposure.htm

A quick guide on the type of long exposures you can carry out:
http://www.exposureguide.com/long-exposure-photography-tips.htm

DOF:
http://photo.tutsplus.com/articles/hardware/how-to-shoot-with-an-extremely-shallow-depth-of-field/

Bokeh Tutorial:
http://www.robertsdonovan.com/?p=702

There are probably better ones if you search more.
 
jchap

jchap

Member
Just wait until you get interested in astrophotography. If you want a complicated hobby where sometimes weeks of planning and execution are required to produce a single usable picture then look no further! That said the sense of satisfaction must be great when you produce something like this from your back yard:

4335131311_34e964a0eb_b.jpg
Click to expand...

Almost makes one forget the thousands of dollars in equipment required to execute such a shot.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
jchap said:
Just wait until you get interested in astrophotography. If you want a complicated hobby where sometimes weeks of planning and execution are required to produce a single usable picture then look no further! That said the sense of satisfaction must be great when you produce something like this from your back yard:



Almost makes one forget the thousands of dollars in equipment required to execute such a shot.
Click to expand...

That's nice jchap, but d'you want to try compressing that image a bit maybe? It is taking an age to load here and I really don't want this thread to bee slowed down too much.
 
N

NathanMcMahon

Banned
jchap said:
Just wait until you get interested in astrophotography. If you want a complicated hobby where sometimes weeks of planning and execution are required to produce a single usable picture then look no further! That said the sense of satisfaction must be great when you produce something like this from your back yard:



Almost makes one forget the thousands of dollars in equipment required to execute such a shot.
Click to expand...

hot fucking damn
 
M

Machspeed007

Member
I've started looking seriously into photography as a hobby maybe 6-7 years ago. I'm not at all in the posture to give advice but here are some observations I've come up with over these years:

- Fast Forward as quickly as you can over the technical bits. Is this lens the sharpest? Does this sensor have more red channel noise than the other? Does the shutter speed goes faster than 1/4000th of a second? You need to know about them of course but that's not what will lead you to good photography.
There are tons of books on technical aspects and the forums are filled with discussions and debates over noise and dynamic range. Don't linger too much with these if you like photography.

- Visual Languange and Composition. This was my 2nd step I was getting interested in (I'm an engineer so no artistic school to back me up). I've soon learned that again, there are a lot of books on composition but many of them just repeat the same rules without explaining what's going on with them.
If I were to start over, I would skip quickly through these books and get to the core of the problem: visual language. What you need to learn about is how to express yourself through the photographic language.
A very good book on this very topic is, I guess, Richard Zakia's "Perception and Imaging". What this book did was open my interest on the visual language and it's ties in with photography. There are a lot of good books on the visual language (Rudolf Arnheim, even Umberto Eco for example) that compensate greatly the mediocre photography books on the subject. You'll learn more from these books, even getting interested in painters will help more than reading your average "photographic composition" book.

- Reading about photography. I'm not talking about books on how someone used a super-angular to get an outstanding landscape photo. I'm talking about books that speak about what photography and photographing is, and what it means. Roland Barthes' "Camera Lucida" is a very good read and you can make some interesting connections with Richard Zakia's book (good photographs stir memories for example).
Also, reading about other famous photographs is important because helps put things into context. "The ongoing moment" by Geoff Dyer is a very good read on the subject and why it is important.

- Perhaps the most important thing: look at good photographs, daily if you can. It helps a lot on deciding when your own photographs are worth it or not. Coupled with what you read in the other books you'll begin to see why do they work and why they are considered good.

That's all and I'm enjoying it this way.
 
D

Damaged

Member
Porcile said:
I've been doing a ton of 35mm photography recently. I'm totally new to serious photography, so it's been challenging. I have a good artistic eye and seeing a lot of averages photos developed feels somewhat of a let down, but I continue to plug away. Thankfully developing remains reasonable cheap.

I suppose the one the thing I've learned is to only pick your absolute best. I mean, on a 36 exposure roll, just selecting 2 or 3 images takes a lot of self-discipline.

Is anyone on Photography GAF still shooting 35mm?

Thanks for the links anyway, it's all transferable skills :)
Click to expand...

I started on 35mm twenty years ago and I swear its a great way to learn, stick with a prime 50mm lens and think about every shot. Having to walk about rather than just zoom in and out with a telephoto made me think so much more about framing images and looking at where my light was coming from.

Still shoot film now but alongside my DSLR.
 
J

JORMBO

Darkness no more
Few things I've learned:
-The two books mentioned in the OP are great and should be read by every photographer starting out. I remember being really frustrated when first starting out because the auto modes don't really produce images I like. It took a little bit of time, but eventually I learned to get the exposures I wanted using manual mode after reading those books.

-It is also good to find a few photographers that have styles you like. Every time I come across an image I like online I save it. I have stacks of books from photographers I like. Usually a few times a week I will go through things and pick out what made me want to save that image.

-Get some retouching software and learn how to use it. Even if only basic corrections are learned (saturation/exposure/color adjustments) they can really help out a photo and don't take much time.

-Don't get too caught up in gear. It's nice if you can afford it but don't worry too much if you can't. There are plenty of people taking amazing photos with cheap gear and plenty of people taking horrible photos with top of the line gear.

-As more stuff is learned a lot of photographers start to lean more towards one area. When I started shooting models I had to learn artificial lighting, networking and just dealing with models. That is a whole different set of topics to learn :)

-Experiment a lot, try now things even if a bunch of your photos end up being shitty. Art and Fear is a good book for the general art making & learning process: http://www.amazon.com/dp/0961454733/?tag=neogaf0e-20

8113443292_63c5c57087_z.jpg
 
R

Red

Member
jchap said:
Just wait until you get interested in astrophotography. If you want a complicated hobby where sometimes weeks of planning and execution are required to produce a single usable picture then look no further! That said the sense of satisfaction must be great when you produce something like this from your back yard:



Almost makes one forget the thousands of dollars in equipment required to execute such a shot.
Click to expand...
i would love to get into this

But $$$$$
 
A

Always-honest

Banned
Shoot in manual mode as early on as you can. It will be a bumpy ride in the beginning. But you'll end up a true photograph god. Knowing how to play with apperture and shutterspeed is essential.
 
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